Dewaxed Co2 Oil Without Winterization?

[1craighender]

So i've been working with a Apeks 5000 20L. If i do my first run as low psi as possible on the extractor i get an oily substance coming out that looks like sludge. a light brown to a dark brown color. anything higher i start getting a mix of this and the crumbly waxy stuff. yesterday i had the first run sent to the lab for a terpene analysis as it's much more fragrant than the higher pressure stuff. how do i refine this first pull stuff? i'm going to try winterizing it and then using the rotovap once i get my cold trap setup as i've noticed i'm losing terpenes when i reclaim my ethanol.

Try doing a really short run, less than 30 minutes, at around 1100-1200psi, and 70-80F. I believe this will pull a nice terpene fraction that you can harvest, then after harvesting the terpenes, put your collection cup back onto the machine, and finish out a complete run at higher pressures and temps just to speed things up. Then, winterize your oil, and after winterizing, you can re-introduce your terpenes back into your oil. The terpene fraction may have some water, and lipids etc. in it, you will need a separatory funnel and maybe a small syringe to remove the water and lipids. I hope this helps a little!

 

[Machine54321]

Subcritical...oil in one separator...dry wax/crumble in the other. But it's gonna depend on the CO2 system, not all systems are designed the same.

please tell me you got this yield on a apeks 2000 5l........please. i get about half of that and i think I'm rocking it but if i could get that.....those chunks are huge i can't imagine those forming in a 5l but if they did i probably won't sleep until i figure it out.

 

[HealthWeed]

I am getting a lot of dry ice buildup on my collection vessel (custom CO2 extractor). What is the fastest way to melt it away? I have a vacuum over but don't know what settings to use.

 

[EugeneOregon]

Has anyone seen this being advertised? I have seen subcritical extracted CO2, which doesn't have waxes to begin with, but who has seen people able to separate waxes during the extraction? I know Graywolf has that waters machine, and can do it easy, but I wonder if other people understand how. I have also seen EVOlabs using chromatography to remove plant material. Ethanol dewaxing on a large scale is unrealistic. I know how...if anyone wants to discuss it I would love to.

This is the most complete method of dewaxing and cleaning up extract available without a bunch of spendy gear. It is based on Dry Column Vacuum Chromatography but is deployed in a reverse phase configuration. I USE WATER TO DEWAX! lol

By far the least expensive and conplete method to dewax without winterizing is by use of chromatography techniques. Fractional distillation is WAY out of reach of the vast manority of users, but anyone with a decent vacuum pump and some cheap gear from Amazon can dewax (and in fact fraction the product VERY easily with experience and a bit more effort than just the simple process shown.

 

[RochesterCo2]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned using a heated centrifuge. With one there's no need to winterize at all and it helps preserve the terpenes because they're not becoming separated and dissolved in the ethanol or any other solvent.

Running subcritical is my preferred method of extraction. I'm using an Apeks 5LD 2000 series. Sub may take longer but it helps preserve the terpenes and is higher quality. The high temperature and pressure of supercritical tends to disintegrate the more volatile oils and is more saturated with fats and waxes.

Some examples of my previous extracts: (Non-Winterized)

 

[progeny-prodigy]

This is the most complete method of dewaxing and cleaning up extract available without a bunch of spendy gear. It is based on Dry Column Vacuum Chromatography but is deployed in a reverse phase configuration. I USE WATER TO DEWAX! lol

By far the least expensive and conplete method to dewax without winterizing is by use of chromatography techniques. Fractional distillation is WAY out of reach of the vast manority of users, but anyone with a decent vacuum pump and some cheap gear from Amazon can dewax (and in fact fraction the product VERY easily with experience and a bit more effort than just the simple process shown.

I totally agree this guy is an amazing source of info and is the best i have seen in this area hands down. i hav seen patents that describe using alumina in this method of reverse phase chormo, in situ using co2 as the solvent and am very interested in experimenting with this and other ideas

 

[progeny-prodigy]

im running an open loop co2 system with a max psi of 2500 and my (single) separation column at 500 psi. i heat my mat column to 115f and im curious as to what u guys with experience would say about what temp i should run my sep column at. im just venting to atm so no need to take special precautions for recirculation.

 

[progeny-prodigy]

 

[progeny-prodigy]

im running an open loop co2 system with a max psi of

60F is probably too cold, depending on what your separator pressure is... If you would like to run at 60F, you will need to lower your separator pressure, which can be achieved by changing your orifice to something smaller. The reason I say you need to lower separator pressure is because if you looked at a phase diagram, you'll see that the reason you created a puck of dry ice, is because you were more than likely creating solid, and/or liquid CO2 in your separators.
Or... if you would like to maintain high flow rates and not put a smaller orifice in your separator, you can just raise extractor temp up to 70-75F, this will maintain a good, high separator pressures which means high flow rates, and you'll still be able to get THCA build up on the walls of your separator. This THCA buildup is what is used for making glass like shatter. Keep in mind, if your plant material is not fresh, or has been decarbed you will NOT be able to make good glass like shatter. Shatter becomes hard, or crystalline, because of THCA's ability to crystallize, whereas THC will not crystallize. I would be happy to speak with you, or anyone else on the phone about this, and we can go into more depth. Feel free to text or call me, 812-697-4317, or you can email me at [email protected]

is this offer limited to people who own apeks machines? lol cause i dont. but use to work for a company that has one and used it many times and its a very nice machine

 

[GrassFedLabs]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned using a heated centrifuge. With one there's no need to winterize at all and it helps preserve the terpenes because they're not becoming separated and dissolved in the ethanol or any other solvent.

I have been searching for info on this method for the past few weeks and this is the first MJ related reference I could find for centrifugal separation. Are you using this method? Any chance you can share what centrifuge you're utilizing?

We are getting the new Apeks 20Lx2 duplex system very soon and I'm looking at any other dewaxing methods I can find. Thanks!

 

[Shamus]

I love all of this

 

[EugeneOregon]

I have been searching for info on this method for the past few weeks and this is the first MJ related reference I could find for centrifugal separation. Are you using this method? Any chance you can share what centrifuge you're utilizing?

We are getting the new Apeks 20Lx2 duplex system very soon and I'm looking at any other dewaxing methods I can find. Thanks!

I have posted one mehod of dewaxing that avoids winterization. It is shown above but basically when you disolve extract in any alcohol then pull it through alumina after the proteins denature at room temp (gooey looking white strands clumped up) then you can get a very thorough dewaxing of the product.

However for even better refinement using the same filter funnel and same aluminum oxide (alumina) you can also pull out considerable chlorophylls too. I find chlorophyl in every extract I purchase. Removing it if you are set up for dewaxing is actually easy.

I use rubbing alcohol which is iso and water. When you boil rubbing alcohol the alcohol will not all boil away but it will reduce in its ratio to the water. Disolve your extract in rubbing alcohol then boil to reduce until the extract begins to drop out of solution. Stop the boil and cool to room temp. Then filter through the alumina as shown in the vid about dewaxing. Vacuum pulls it through the alumina.

You will see immediately that all the chlorophyls have been swollen greatly via hydrolysis and the chrolophylls are trapped on top of the alumina along with the waxes when you pull it through but the medicine passes without any problem. It is green and gunky on top and it is funny to see because often that green gunk comes out of damn good looking shatter I never guessed had so much in it. It swells a lot so a little looks like a lot I guess.

I do this now to every batch and it removes significant contaminates but the boiling temp never goes over 100C which I think is important to help preserve potency.

I have also used a centrifuge too for cleanup which was the wuestion but it is not nearly as complete. However if you do want to use one here is a tip: disolve the extract in a minimum amount of solvent. Then into each centrifuge tube put a pinch of aluminum oxide and then shake of stir it in well. Sand or dust works to but I have alumina around so used that when I still ran my 4000 rpm centrifuge.

The dust or alumina will give the waxes something to form on out of the solution. Otherwise they are really too miscible in the rest of the compound to seperate well. Adding water also can help seperate via centrifuge because thc and water are only slightly miscible. Waxes often form their own layer when spun up this way. I have seen nice seperations with the water but also at times it just didn't work either so there is something to that art I am not sure of. Plus I HATE purging water from extract lolz.