Drooping Dying Plant Help Me Diagnose Please.

[Monster762]

Or I can get ladybugs for like $5 per 2000.

But they’ll be in the house for sure. Unless I seal up til it’s over. And got to shut exhaust cause they’ll all go out the window.

 

[crimsonecho]

The predator mites would be better imo. Ladybugs, inside could be hard to manage and don’t really know if they target broad mites.

 

[Monster762]

The predator mites would be better imo. Ladybugs, inside could be hard to manage and don’t really know if they target broad mites.

Ok and what about green cleaner. I’ve heard a lot of people reccomend it for bug issues. It says til day of harvest and supposedly “exterminates” broad and russet mites. I saw foggers too. Specifically for gardens. $50 each. I’m gonna look into em all.

 

[crimsonecho]

Well i don’t use anything other than NeemAzal T/S and a preventative spray with potassium salts. All in veg. So i cannot say for sure. But i wouldn’t go by what people thinks.
Search for active ingredients and the researches done on it. Whats the active ingredient by the way?

 

[Monster762]

This sounds good but what has been tried in flower of a weed plant and didn’t effect the bud? That’s why I’m asking here. Google don’t know our plants. 2 different products both say same thing good til day of harvest they say to actually spray on fruits you eat on day of harvest n be ok

 

[crimsonecho]

This sounds good but what has been tried in flower of a weed plant and didn’t effect the bud? That’s why I’m asking here. Google don’t know our plants. 2 different products both say same thing good til day of harvest they say to actually spray on fruits you eat on day of harvest n be ok View attachment 847503View attachment 847504

Yeah insecticidal soap or anything at this point will probably burn the pistils but as i said pyrethrin is not toxic, not at small doses. Pistils will return.
Goggle knows everything and farm has plethora of info. Both on pyrethrin and broad mites.

 

[newh]

get the predator mites for your flower room ,a thousand probably isnt enough. in your veg strip everything to bare bones and use the chemical you feel best about.predators in your veg wouldnt hurt either after your cycle of chemicals is done.im not sure what predators you should get theres a few different ones depending on what your up against but dont get ladybugs they shit too much and they get stuck in your flowers

 

[Monster762]

Ok I took the 3 worse looking leaves from flower.off different plants. I see nothing. No movement. Hoping it stays that way.

 

[Monster762]

 

[crimsonecho]

I amputated my girl. Took the 2 branches with irregularities. No bugs detected under microscope so it was some genetic fuck up probably.

Now you alreay hit them with couple of products. If you do a pyrethrin bomb they will probably stay dead. You don’t need to do both pyrethrin and predators imo.

If they don’t find anything to eat they’ll die. So either get the predators or look into pyrehtrin. The thing about mites and they’re destined to fail indoors, imo, because they need a thriving prey population, so they can eat and breed and stay alive at healthy counts to actuall fend off another infestation.

Hope they stay clean.

 

[Monster762]

I amputated my girl. Took the 2 branches with irregularities. No bugs detected under microscope so it was some genetic fuck up probably.

Now you alreay hit them with couple of products. If you do a pyrethrin bomb they will probably stay dead. You don’t need to do both pyrethrin and predators imo.

If they don’t find anything to eat they’ll die. So either get the predators or look into pyrehtrin. The thing about mites and they’re destined to fail indoors, imo, because they need a thriving prey population, so they can eat and breed and stay alive at healthy counts to actuall fend off another infestation.

Hope they stay clean.

Thanks. I like the sounds of that insecticidal soap with pyrethrum and not crazy expensive considering it’s 32 oz.

trifecta a 4 oz cost the same as that 32 oz

I’m spraying nothing in flower. Just neem on floors not plants. Veg been sprayed so I’ll probably grab that soap. Use that too it’ll take 2 days to get here be about right on time for another blast at em.

Now if I see one in flower box I think predators come in deep there. I’ve heard of them leaving a mess all over buds though. Ladybugs too. But I guess it’s still best option in this situation. Then I can try h202 rinse. People claim there’s crazy dirt comes off buds n that they rinse. They rinse em soon as they chop n supposedly done right don’t effect trichs just cleans everything. And kills any fungi.

 

[ethcan]

hi there heres a picture of russet mites it may help you ,,macView attachment 847450 View attachment 847450

Man, I kinda wish I got to this thread sooner.


I feel bad for ya, there was a lot of bad information brought forward.

My experience with broad and russet mites is extensive and I have done enough research on them for a lifetime.


First off. The photo that I quoted above, are NOT russet mites.

Hemp russet mites appear like microscopic maggots, as shown.

They are absolutely vile creatures. The damage is very obvious and specific if you know what you are looking for. They eat the freshest youngest most vigorous growth from the growing tips, and absolutely swarm pistils. They are so small and reproduce so quickly that (get ready for this) the areas they are concentrated turn yellow and sticky, as shown. The yellow is a pile of russet mites hundreds of thousands high. Absolutely disgusting and at this point, beating russets in a large scale grow is nearly impossible without losses.

Now, as for the suggestion of using neem to combat the broad mites you may or may not have.

Unfortunately I will strongly disagree with that one. Broad mites (as well as hemp russet mites, and cyclamen mites) find neem relatively benign. You may knock down populations slightly.

However, along with pyrethrins, without having a translaminar effect (able to travel through the leaf tissue, not to be confused with systemic) they are simply not effective against broads/HRM/cylamen. These mites are simply too small, and repeatedly hitting the colony with a mild pesticide which only kills a small portion of the adults, and NONE of the eggs, is FAR from ideal.
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26084090]

And unfortunately, as you have already sprayed neem, you will not be able to spray micronized sulfur, which has been recognized by many (large body of anecdotal references) to be THE treatment for broad/HRM. In the future, I recommend Safer brand wettable sulfur, 2tbsp/gal sprayed weekly for IPM, or every other day for 2 weeks if an outbreak occurs.

In a commercial setting where it is impossible to simply eliminate all biomatter and sanitize, I highly recommend doing a short rotation of spiromesifen (Forbid 4F) and abamectin (Avid) before starting sulfur, on vegetative plants only.

As for the predator mites, they lose effectiveness as soon as the resin begins to build. Around week 4 they are no longer financially viable.

A much better option for broad/russet mite treatment in flower is Nuke Em and Green Cleaner, rotated, being sprayed every other day to catch subsequent egg hatchings.




Anyways, onto your situation. I wouldn't rule out broad mites yet. You've come forward with some pretty classical signs of broad mites. I would keep scoping, primarily your tops. Can we see some close up photos of your tops? They seem a bit yellow. Also, do you spray your neem oil while the lights are on?

If you've got mites, your pistils will be constantly being eaten, and your new growth will be deformed.



Another observation I'm going to make is that all of your tops generally seem lighter, with purple stems. Have you checked your runoff to ensure that
A) you are not underfeeding
B) your plants are not locked out from the pH being off, or salt build up?

 

[Monster762]

Man, I kinda wish I got to this thread sooner.


I feel bad for ya, there was a lot of bad information brought forward.

My experience with broad and russet mites is extensive and I have done enough research on them for a lifetime.


First off. The photo that I quoted above, are NOT russet mites.

Hemp russet mites appear like microscopic maggots, as shown.
View attachment 847702

They are absolutely vile creatures. The damage is very obvious and specific if you know what you are looking for. They eat the freshest youngest most vigorous growth from the growing tips, and absolutely swarm pistils. They are so small and reproduce so quickly that (get ready for this) the areas they are concentrated turn yellow and sticky, as shown. The yellow is a pile of russet mites hundreds of thousands high. Absolutely disgusting and at this point, beating russets in a large scale grow is nearly impossible without losses.
View attachment 847705
View attachment 847704



Now, as for the suggestion of using neem to combat the broad mites you may or may not have.

Unfortunately I will strongly disagree with that one. Broad mites (as well as hemp russet mites, and cyclamen mites) find neem relatively benign. You may knock down populations slightly.

However, along with pyrethrins, without having a translaminar effect (able to travel through the leaf tissue, not to be confused with systemic) they are simply not effective against broads/HRM/cylamen. These mites are simply too small, and repeatedly hitting the colony with a mild pesticide which only kills a small portion of the adults, and NONE of the eggs, is FAR from ideal.
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26084090]

And unfortunately, as you have already sprayed neem, you will not be able to spray micronized sulfur, which has been recognized by many (large body of anecdotal references) to be THE treatment for broad/HRM. In the future, I recommend Safer brand wettable sulfur, 2tbsp/gal sprayed weekly for IPM, or every other day for 2 weeks if an outbreak occurs.

In a commercial setting where it is impossible to simply eliminate all biomatter and sanitize, I highly recommend doing a short rotation of spiromesifen (Forbid 4F) and abamectin (Avid) before starting sulfur, on vegetative plants only.

As for the predator mites, they lose effectiveness as soon as the resin begins to build. Around week 4 they are no longer financially viable.

A much better option for broad/russet mite treatment in flower is Nuke Em and Green Cleaner, rotated, being sprayed every other day to catch subsequent egg hatchings.




Anyways, onto your situation. I wouldn't rule out broad mites yet. You've come forward with some pretty classical signs of broad mites. I would keep scoping, primarily your tops. Can we see some close up photos of your tops? They seem a bit yellow. Also, do you spray your neem oil while the lights are on?

If you've got mites, your pistils will be constantly being eaten, and your new growth will be deformed.



Another observation I'm going to make is that all of your tops generally seem lighter, with purple stems. Have you checked your runoff to ensure that
A) you are not underfeeding
B) your plants are not locked out from the pH being off, or salt build up?

Ok first thanks for taking the time. I think I killed em. I did a complete hose down and root drench with spinosaid. Under every leaf. I let that soak in for couple hours n did it again. Then I sprayed everything with gardensafe fungicide3. I left in low lighted area but not dark for a day. So no light burn with all the moisture on foliage.
I need to check my runoff.

 

[Monster762]

Man, I kinda wish I got to this thread sooner.


I feel bad for ya, there was a lot of bad information brought forward.

My experience with broad and russet mites is extensive and I have done enough research on them for a lifetime.


First off. The photo that I quoted above, are NOT russet mites.

Hemp russet mites appear like microscopic maggots, as shown.
View attachment 847702

They are absolutely vile creatures. The damage is very obvious and specific if you know what you are looking for. They eat the freshest youngest most vigorous growth from the growing tips, and absolutely swarm pistils. They are so small and reproduce so quickly that (get ready for this) the areas they are concentrated turn yellow and sticky, as shown. The yellow is a pile of russet mites hundreds of thousands high. Absolutely disgusting and at this point, beating russets in a large scale grow is nearly impossible without losses.
View attachment 847705
View attachment 847704



Now, as for the suggestion of using neem to combat the broad mites you may or may not have.

Unfortunately I will strongly disagree with that one. Broad mites (as well as hemp russet mites, and cyclamen mites) find neem relatively benign. You may knock down populations slightly.

However, along with pyrethrins, without having a translaminar effect (able to travel through the leaf tissue, not to be confused with systemic) they are simply not effective against broads/HRM/cylamen. These mites are simply too small, and repeatedly hitting the colony with a mild pesticide which only kills a small portion of the adults, and NONE of the eggs, is FAR from ideal.
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26084090]

And unfortunately, as you have already sprayed neem, you will not be able to spray micronized sulfur, which has been recognized by many (large body of anecdotal references) to be THE treatment for broad/HRM. In the future, I recommend Safer brand wettable sulfur, 2tbsp/gal sprayed weekly for IPM, or every other day for 2 weeks if an outbreak occurs.

In a commercial setting where it is impossible to simply eliminate all biomatter and sanitize, I highly recommend doing a short rotation of spiromesifen (Forbid 4F) and abamectin (Avid) before starting sulfur, on vegetative plants only.

As for the predator mites, they lose effectiveness as soon as the resin begins to build. Around week 4 they are no longer financially viable.

A much better option for broad/russet mite treatment in flower is Nuke Em and Green Cleaner, rotated, being sprayed every other day to catch subsequent egg hatchings.




Anyways, onto your situation. I wouldn't rule out broad mites yet. You've come forward with some pretty classical signs of broad mites. I would keep scoping, primarily your tops. Can we see some close up photos of your tops? They seem a bit yellow. Also, do you spray your neem oil while the lights are on?

If you've got mites, your pistils will be constantly being eaten, and your new growth will be deformed.



Another observation I'm going to make is that all of your tops generally seem lighter, with purple stems. Have you checked your runoff to ensure that
A) you are not underfeeding
B) your plants are not locked out from the pH being off, or salt build up?

I spray nothing in flower. Neem on walls n floors with a rag. I spray in veg lights on or off t5 so I don’t really run into burn in there. They are broads there. The second pic is veg box. Now flower scope came back clean n I scoped good. 6 of the worse leaves n not a trace. No egg or bug. Lot of hairs though. I used a scope on phone with burst if needed for fast bugs. But nothing moved at all in flower. I am making sure I’m 100% clean n changed between boxes. Luckily they’re on opposite ends of house.

 

[Monster762]

Man, I kinda wish I got to this thread sooner.


I feel bad for ya, there was a lot of bad information brought forward.

My experience with broad and russet mites is extensive and I have done enough research on them for a lifetime.


First off. The photo that I quoted above, are NOT russet mites.

Hemp russet mites appear like microscopic maggots, as shown.
View attachment 847702

They are absolutely vile creatures. The damage is very obvious and specific if you know what you are looking for. They eat the freshest youngest most vigorous growth from the growing tips, and absolutely swarm pistils. They are so small and reproduce so quickly that (get ready for this) the areas they are concentrated turn yellow and sticky, as shown. The yellow is a pile of russet mites hundreds of thousands high. Absolutely disgusting and at this point, beating russets in a large scale grow is nearly impossible without losses.
View attachment 847705
View attachment 847704



Now, as for the suggestion of using neem to combat the broad mites you may or may not have.

Unfortunately I will strongly disagree with that one. Broad mites (as well as hemp russet mites, and cyclamen mites) find neem relatively benign. You may knock down populations slightly.

However, along with pyrethrins, without having a translaminar effect (able to travel through the leaf tissue, not to be confused with systemic) they are simply not effective against broads/HRM/cylamen. These mites are simply too small, and repeatedly hitting the colony with a mild pesticide which only kills a small portion of the adults, and NONE of the eggs, is FAR from ideal.
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26084090]

And unfortunately, as you have already sprayed neem, you will not be able to spray micronized sulfur, which has been recognized by many (large body of anecdotal references) to be THE treatment for broad/HRM. In the future, I recommend Safer brand wettable sulfur, 2tbsp/gal sprayed weekly for IPM, or every other day for 2 weeks if an outbreak occurs.

In a commercial setting where it is impossible to simply eliminate all biomatter and sanitize, I highly recommend doing a short rotation of spiromesifen (Forbid 4F) and abamectin (Avid) before starting sulfur, on vegetative plants only.

As for the predator mites, they lose effectiveness as soon as the resin begins to build. Around week 4 they are no longer financially viable.

A much better option for broad/russet mite treatment in flower is Nuke Em and Green Cleaner, rotated, being sprayed every other day to catch subsequent egg hatchings.




Anyways, onto your situation. I wouldn't rule out broad mites yet. You've come forward with some pretty classical signs of broad mites. I would keep scoping, primarily your tops. Can we see some close up photos of your tops? They seem a bit yellow. Also, do you spray your neem oil while the lights are on?

If you've got mites, your pistils will be constantly being eaten, and your new growth will be deformed.



Another observation I'm going to make is that all of your tops generally seem lighter, with purple stems. Have you checked your runoff to ensure that
A) you are not underfeeding
B) your plants are not locked out from the pH being off, or salt build up?

These are top right now. 2 minutes ago. They’re tied in net n the combo of light in there casts purple n yellow but when I block the lights off with hand the pistils white

 

[Monster762]

Now this plant is a beast in the back this one worry’s me but I scope 2 worse leaves on it. Nothing. All tied in net so it’s stressful. I can’t really block the purple led from that one. I got 2 4000k QBs 4 2700k 24true watt led floods for weak spots with diffusers popped so. They’re bright. 1 6500k led corn bulb. And 600w purple for a center to add more colors so it’s a mess to cut individual lights. All synced. Over 4x4 net. I litterally can’t get to the back at all I have to climb under the net to water. And it figures the one in back is the one looks bad.

 

[Bulldog420]

Those guys drink spinosad for breakfast. Really......

When I had Russets, I would dip a branch in strait Neem or Spinosad and others to test effectiveness. They seemed to thrive in neem and spinosad.

I have a full proof plan to hold russets or broads at bay, but you are too late for that. The only products I would use in flower are far and few between. If I were you, I would.......

One round of Grandevo (read instructions) with heavy application
Second day, One round of Venerate (read Instructions) with heavy application
Fourth day, Grandevo
6th day Venerate

Then a daily hit with essential oils. I really like Pure Brand organic essential oils. Tea Tree oil does the best at killing bugs, however it smells. I would hit with Tea Tree oil first, then mix up to the citrus oils next. 10-30 drops per gallon of water, and use some yucca for a spreader. Your infestation I would hit them with 30 drops per gallon right off the bat.


Next year think predator bugs. You now have these guys, they will continue to show up crop after crop.

 

[Bulldog420]

O yea, Dont spray the oils with temps over 80 degrees. It will cook the plants. Better to treat the essential oils like neem and don't spray during lights on.

 

[Monster762]

Those guys drink spinosad for breakfast. Really......

When I had Russets, I would dip a branch in strait Neem or Spinosad and others to test effectiveness. They seemed to thrive in neem and spinosad.

I have a full proof plan to hold russets or broads at bay, but you are too late for that. The only products I would use in flower are far and few between. If I were you, I would.......

One round of Grandevo (read instructions) with heavy application
Second day, One round of Venerate (read Instructions) with heavy application
Fourth day, Grandevo
6th day Venerate

Then a daily hit with essential oils. I really like Pure Brand organic essential oils. Tea Tree oil does the best at killing bugs, however it smells. I would hit with Tea Tree oil first, then mix up to the citrus oils next. 10-30 drops per gallon of water, and use some yucca for a spreader. Your infestation I would hit them with 30 drops per gallon right off the bat.


Next year think predator bugs. You now have these guys, they will continue to show up crop after crop.

They are broad mites. 100% sure. Not sure how different but they are labeled on the bottle. I’m ordering the insecticidal soap with pyrethrum. I also hit em with fungicide3 and 70% neem oil.

Flower box looks ok. I saw none. It’s on other side of house. Predators are my choice if I see one there. Ton of predators n seal the box.

 

[Monster762]

Those guys drink spinosad for breakfast. Really......

When I had Russets, I would dip a branch in strait Neem or Spinosad and others to test effectiveness. They seemed to thrive in neem and spinosad.

I have a full proof plan to hold russets or broads at bay, but you are too late for that. The only products I would use in flower are far and few between. If I were you, I would.......

One round of Grandevo (read instructions) with heavy application
Second day, One round of Venerate (read Instructions) with heavy application
Fourth day, Grandevo
6th day Venerate

Then a daily hit with essential oils. I really like Pure Brand organic essential oils. Tea Tree oil does the best at killing bugs, however it smells. I would hit with Tea Tree oil first, then mix up to the citrus oils next. 10-30 drops per gallon of water, and use some yucca for a spreader. Your infestation I would hit them with 30 drops per gallon right off the bat.


Next year think predator bugs. You now have these guys, they will continue to show up crop after crop.

True bugs hate tea tree n I got that too. The flower leaves what you think? I scoped no bugs there. N cleaned scope between boxes too. My flower been looking dry up top. I water heavy twice a day now with full strength nutes in one and sugars in the other. I’m already on the predators. Any recommendations on them. Which ones? Inside in tent.