Fermented Plant Extracts and making your own nutrient line

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Funkadelic

Funkadelic

808
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@Seamaiden and I have had a long (series of?) discussion(s) RE: fish/coral waste, algae from sw aquarium skimmers in our application.

I'm new to FPE and SST, though I use pond barley concentrate.

My only caution with this would be please do not consider gathering anything from the Oregon coast without a very good Geiger counter. I wish I was joking. Fukushima is a very real problem. I positively love the Oregon coast but would never consider using *ANY* material from there in any application for human consumption. Hard radiation is no joke and that reactor water is still being dumped directly across and carrying. Its evil.
 
Seamaiden

Seamaiden

Living dead girl
23,596
638
I think the pond concentrate (which didn't work for me in my pond, while the straw absolutely does) is different, especially if it's been made from the barley straw. Straw is dead, all the N has been moved out of it, no enzymes for sprouting and growing like you would get with the seeds *as* they're sprouting.
 
Funkadelic

Funkadelic

808
93
I think the pond concentrate (which didn't work for me in my pond, while the straw absolutely does) is different, especially if it's been made from the barley straw. Straw is dead, all the N has been moved out of it, no enzymes for sprouting and growing like you would get with the seeds *as* they're sprouting.
What do you most recommend sprouting?
 
Seamaiden

Seamaiden

Living dead girl
23,596
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Whatever you have on hand that'll sprout. All seeds need particular enzymes and to have that packet of nutrition to start. Some are certainly better than others, barley is a standard go-to not just for SSTs but for foddering (you grow it in what are basically rain gutters, water only, as fresh forage for your farm animules), and we are all familiar with its use for starting that oh-so-essential wort.

However, fenugreek is the fastest sprouting thing I've ever grown, I'd be willing to try that. Anything that sprouts well I'd be willing to try.
 
D

darfkader

4
3
This is one thing i should have mentioned. Using oxygen makes it an AACt not a FPE. The problem is we need the fermentation process due to alcohol and pH to change. This is what breaks down the insoluble nutrients. Granted thats a good AACt you can do wtihout the GH Florablend as excess sugars create bacterial blooms which is uncessary and can be a problem due to the population of bacteria intaking most or in the worst case all of the dissolved o2. As long as you have food sources for the fungi the life cycle will occur and different microorganisms will be produced over time.

I'll go over AACT a different time. This thread is all about Fermentation.

I will help you break the habit if interested so you can make your own liquid karma. I'll post that thread here next which is on Ascophyllum Nodosum. With few organic ingredients you can make a something that covers all the basics just like LK.
Since your interested i'll tell you how i make my AN FPE without LB. i only do this because at the time i didnt realize there was a water soluble powder already available. This way you'll get an idea how to make it though.

Ascophyllum Nodosum Extract

1. Take about a cup per gallon of powdered Ascophyllum Nodosum and molasses, in this case the bacterial bloom is beneficial since were trying to remove the o2 to create a fermentation.
2. Put powder in bottle and mix with water. Shake until mixed well. Leave cap loose and place somewhere you'll see it
3. Everyday shake/stir it as much as you can and than keep lid loose again.(Remember to tighten the lid if your gonna shake it!!)
4. Do this for 2-4 weeks you'll notice a creamy head layer to the solution when shaken. It will also be a nice light brown color and should smell sweet.
5. Once you can see that the life has ceased inside the solution(Lack of bubbles at top) you filter the solution so the original food source is drained.
6. You can put this in a bottle and store it up to a year, dilute it as necessary. I can't guarantee a nutritional analysis, but YOU CAN BURN PLANTS WITH THESE, so start low and work your way up. Maybe try it on some garden plants before you try your valuable crop. That is how FPE differ from AACT, they are nutrient extracts not microbial extracts.

Fish Fermentation- This is a FPE but is another fermented product. I think its the best you can get and works much better with Lactobacillus because i hate the smell while fermenting and lactobacillus takes good care of the smell. I'd suggest using papaya if you cant find LB, because it has enzymes that help break down the matter. It works well for FPE or Fish Hydroslate.

1. Grind down left fish you may have, the oilier the fish the better(salmon, mackerel, tuna; if they have bones in them thats even better). Grind this in a blender with until its a paste to make sure to speed up the process.
2. In a bucket fill with a carbon source half full such as sawdust. Mix water fish, molasses and humic acid.
3. Let this rot for a couple of weeks and stir as much as possible(once a day) until it has rotted.
4. You can add this straight to your compost/soil mix which is what i do. It adds pretty much all the good things you can imagine. Vitamins, Omega Acids, Proteins, Macro nutrients, Micro nutrients and Humic/Fulvic Acids.

Fish plus seaweed Ascophyllum Nodosum in general provides everything that liquid karma does. Granted LK smells a lot better and can be used as a foliar feed. I think the fish hydroslate is a great thing when "cooking" your soil though since it brings many microbes to the mix.

TCM- i'm glad you liked my idea on Ascophyllum Nodosum. Right now i'm to the point where since i use cloning powder i simply mix 50powder/50AN.
My favorite is to soak the clones in the solution of AN and humic acid directly after being cut to make sure theres a minimal chance of o2 from entering the wound. 15-30mins later I dip in the 50/50 powder and plant directly in jiffy cubes with some mychrozzial in the hole.
Its worked well for me, with the exception of finding the right clone mix and the move. Just make sure not to let a cut sit out of water for to long after being snipped, thats probably the biggest killer IMO.


Thank you so much for all this very valuable information!
I was just curious what kind of results you would get if you used charcoal as your carbon source for the fish fermentation?
 
HorseBadortiz

HorseBadortiz

71
53
@Seamaiden I saw your posts on another board about making a camellia flower extract. We have one that has finally started blooming, so I wanted give it a shot as an FPE. The thing is, the buds and blooms have some of that brownish, blighty stuff.

I put a bag of them in the freezer, but now I'm wondering if they'll be any good as an extract. What do you think?
 
Seamaiden

Seamaiden

Living dead girl
23,596
638
@Seamaiden I saw your posts on another board about making a camellia flower extract. We have one that has finally started blooming, so I wanted give it a shot as an FPE. The thing is, the buds and blooms have some of that brownish, blighty stuff.

I put a bag of them in the freezer, but now I'm wondering if they'll be any good as an extract. What do you think?
I would still use them. I can't recall what causes that in Camellia, IIRC it's Fe, but don't hold me to that.
 
HorseBadortiz

HorseBadortiz

71
53
I would still use them. I can't recall what causes that in Camellia, IIRC it's Fe, but don't hold me to that.

From what I've read, I was thinking it was from some sort of spore. I've had the brown problem ever since I've had this camellia. I saw folks saying to put a couple of inches of compost out to the drip line...I did that last season and had all perfect blooms. I used a pine needle/leaf mulch this year, and just have a little bit of browning... next year I might try white paint!

Thanks for the reply, though, I'll give it a shot... I have a nice rhododendron to try it on!
 
J

jonhova

1
1
I would still use them. I can't recall what causes that in Camellia, IIRC it's Fe, but don't hold me to that.

This thread is pretty awesome.

Getting back to the OP's title..... I want to make a 3 part line to increase veg, bloom and rooting.

This chick seemed to have had great success with dandelions using the leaf for veg, flower for bloom and roots for seedling/transplant shock reduction.

It is hard to say whether the FPE worked as she was adding in her homemade fish emulsion and home made cal mag phos.......

I see tons of dandelions around my house i can use for FREE. This leads to wanting to take advantage of this wonderful dynamic accumulator.

Is the standard 1:1 ratio of plant material/brown sugar recipe in a bucket for 2 weeks sufficient?

Another question is on kelp.
If i was to ferment it in brown sugar will that raise the NPK values to something like a green liquid fertilizer i can use from veg to flower?

Lastly looking at biobizz grow it states on their website they use Dutch organic sugar beet extract. I have read a lot of great stories using their products and im thinking if i could get a hold of some Dutch beets we could replicate what they are making for pennies on the dollar.
 
E

ebssco

2
1
hello everyone, i'm an active organic gardener and hate paying for nutrients unless their RAW INGREDIENTS. i think this is what makes organics great, the ability to use the natural sources from around us such as rocks, river silt, weeds, flowers and left over food. After learning from fellow members at ICmag i have become literally obssesed with different ways of making nutrients and supplements for your plants.

As some of you may know there is a such thing known as AACT or Actively Aerated Compost Tea. This is a way to encourage microlife to grow and take on your medium to encourage the break down of insoluble nutrients. Available nutrients are what are always listed on the label of nutrients so well take a look at sea kelp. Some people rate dry sea kelp as 0-0-2. However it has insoluble nutrients of about 3-6-6. In order to break down these water insoluble nutrients we need the microlife to consume them, like the phrase "feed the soil, not the plant". Now the reason i state this is because what we are making is NOT a compost tea. Dont call it one, because it is very incorrect.

Feremented Plant Extracts are easily made using lactobacillius cultures and help break down the plant extract with a lot less smell. For those of you who dont know Lactobacillus is great stuff for those stinky mixtures, not to mention just great for your organic medium in the first place. The reason FPE are different than AACT is that these plant extract are meant to make those insoluble nutrients into available nutrients via fermentation. You can store these FPE after being strained which can be held up to about a year i believe. You can use FPE instead of buying all these organic based not true organic line ups. By making certain types of FPE you are able to make a completle fertilizer regimine. All that is necessary for a good organic grow nutrient wise is fish and seaweed since they have such high inavailable nutrients.

Another way to make a FPE is just by putting your dry ingredients a water container shaking/stirring it up as often as you can for 2-4weeks than strain. This is how i make my Ascophyllum Nodosum liquid fertilizer and i think it works well. Making your own liquid fish is a great thing also and can be much better than storr bought fish emulsion. You gain the fat, proteins, vitamins, omega acids and calcium(if fish bones are included).

I'm not going to put any recipes on here until i see that there is an interest in doing so. If there is also an interest i will put up a thread about ascophyllum nodosum.

I'm sorry its very early in the morning and i have chronic back pain and had a terrible night. I wanted to finally get onto writing this just to see if theres an interest in this. Have a good morning everyone.

BTW- I am also known as Big ballin 88 on Icmag if i know any of you from there. Well see how this forum works out for me.
 
Jabsaw

Jabsaw

101
28
Anyone have luck, using agave nectar in place of molasses in their ferments ?
 
lino

lino

2,637
263
I list on additive here:
My nute regime is a animal & plant super stacker for increased lean muscle mass and larger yield and vigor with a 100% plant endurance increase. I consume every nute that goes into my plant water/nutes and root mediums for maximum health for animals & plants.

Liver and callus repair - also used to flush plants metal build up and animal gallbladder blasts. This concoction has remedied Dr prescribed gallbladder removals and solved plant deficiencies.

Doses;
Humans (animals) not for children under 18 yo. Male and female regime @ half to 1 tbl spoon per glass w/upto 1 oz apple vinegar. Can be used to adjust urine to perfect levels.
Plants (cannabis) - Given to plants 2 wk before budding. at 4 wks of flower and 2 wks - 10days before harvest. Add up to 2 oz per gal. Only small amounts of apple vinegar to adjust PH.

Here are the ingredients but not the recipe for my Gallbladder Blast and Anabolic Plant Support supplement.

Small sample of Our ferments;
Sillybum marianum (from seed)
Cynara scolymus
Indonesian Cinnomomum bernamannil (bark)
Curcuma longa (rhizome)
Beta vulgaris (root)
fermented in a unique probotic culture that allows rapid oral deliverry and quick plant uptake with superior bioenergetic properties for measured plant endurance and proven gallbladder support.

Do not use on if pregnant or pollinated plants.
 
Aces

Aces

4
1
hello everyone, i'm an active organic gardener and hate paying for nutrients unless their RAW INGREDIENTS. i think this is what makes organics great, the ability to use the natural sources from around us such as rocks, river silt, weeds, flowers and left over food. After learning from fellow members at ICmag i have become literally obssesed with different ways of making nutrients and supplements for your plants.

As some of you may know there is a such thing known as AACT or Actively Aerated Compost Tea. This is a way to encourage microlife to grow and take on your medium to encourage the break down of insoluble nutrients. Available nutrients are what are always listed on the label of nutrients so well take a look at sea kelp. Some people rate dry sea kelp as 0-0-2. However it has insoluble nutrients of about 3-6-6. In order to break down these water insoluble nutrients we need the microlife to consume them, like the phrase "feed the soil, not the plant". Now the reason i state this is because what we are making is NOT a compost tea. Dont call it one, because it is very incorrect.

Feremented Plant Extracts are easily made using lactobacillius cultures and help break down the plant extract with a lot less smell. For those of you who dont know Lactobacillus is great stuff for those stinky mixtures, not to mention just great for your organic medium in the first place. The reason FPE are different than AACT is that these plant extract are meant to make those insoluble nutrients into available nutrients via fermentation. You can store these FPE after being strained which can be held up to about a year i believe. You can use FPE instead of buying all these organic based not true organic line ups. By making certain types of FPE you are able to make a completle fertilizer regimine. All that is necessary for a good organic grow nutrient wise is fish and seaweed since they have such high inavailable nutrients.

Another way to make a FPE is just by putting your dry ingredients a water container shaking/stirring it up as often as you can for 2-4weeks than strain. This is how i make my Ascophyllum Nodosum liquid fertilizer and i think it works well. Making your own liquid fish is a great thing also and can be much better than storr bought fish emulsion. You gain the fat, proteins, vitamins, omega acids and calcium(if fish bones are included).

I'm not going to put any recipes on here until i see that there is an interest in doing so. If there is also an interest i will put up a thread about ascophyllum nodosum.

I'm sorry its very early in the morning and i have chronic back pain and had a terrible night. I wanted to finally get onto writing this just to see if theres an interest in this. Have a good morning everyone.

BTW- I am also known as Big ballin 88 on Icmag if i know any of you from there. Well see how this forum works out for me.
I would love the recipe kind sir?
 
G

Godfthrfarm

64
18
When you harvest your plant the roots are left in the soil. i look at these an organic matter which is a good source of food for the micros and broken down nutrients. I love using left over soil which is the basis for recycling. After each grow pull out the old soil and put it in a big container or compost pile if you'd like. Your simply going to amend by what you would is necessary after each grow. This is usually not a whole lot because if you miss anything you can feed with fish&seaweed. This soil is full of microlife and if using all organic techniques should be humus rich and an ideal living medium that a plant can sustain itself if necessary. Soil building is like making a soup you mix the ingredients until everything taste just right. After you get down how to make your base you can start experimenting. Organic matter is always going to have to be put back after a grow my favorite sources are compost, EWC or aged pine bark fines.

Thank you, the reason i've come here is in hope of inspiring others to take on a fully organic approach instead of being contempt with a nutrient regiment. I grow many plants with cannabis being a one. People at my old board didnt care for anyones thought because its not what they wanted to hear. I just want to help people get the best from their surroundings. Weeds are your best source of plant fertilizers i feel, you never really realize the benefits since we're raise to hate them. in my yard 80% of the weeds are edible and members of the lettuce family. I would've never known that if i didn't get into what my weeds can do for me.
I e been wanting 2 learn how 2 make my own nuts for sometime now so thank u ....I wish I had your phn number lol I'd be hitting your line up non stop for recipes thank u for sharing the info..
 

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