Im Sticking To Hps For The Win, Not Mars Led

[Jmaes Mabley]

Weed likes AIR when lights are OUT. A fresh air supply IMHO is essential.

Ive used plenty of CO2 in 40+ years, and never got better yield than when running straight fresh air.

Were getting around 1.6g per watt in a 6 x 5 with a DE Gavita. But we use up to 3 of them, and fresh air only. And in the Fall/Winter. Temps inside are 78-82.

 

[UncleRomulus]

Nothing wrong with HID, I still use my gavita for a couple months in the winter for that very reason when we are running the wood burner:)

I love it man. Wood heats the good shit. Electic or gas makes me feel stuffy but that sweet ass wood heat man You live in the boonies?

 

[UncleRomulus]

Weed likes AIR when lights are OUT. A fresh air supply IMHO is essential.

Ive used plenty of CO2 in 40+ years, and never got better yield than when running straight fresh air.

Were getting around 1.6g per watt in a 6 x 5 with a DE Gavita. But we use up to 3 of them, and fresh air only. And in the Fall/Winter. Temps inside are 78-82.

I started having fans blastin at night same as lights on for my little ones few weeks back and they love it. I’ve done a few homemade gallon milk jug co2 ghetto units but never got seriously into the tanks and that. Question in my mind is it worth it unless your sealed up tight. You figure on a decent sized scale that blasting mad fresh air nonstop could trump co2?

 

[Jmaes Mabley]

If you can supply CO2, and still have exchange then I think CO2 wins. But if everythings not airtight. IMHO its not worth it.

Also CO2 allows for a hotter grow temp.

Im not trying to beat nature though. If I can get a steady fresh air supply, im good to go with that.
Nature is 400 PPM.

 

[Rootbound]

Weed likes AIR when lights are OUT. A fresh air supply IMHO is essential.

Ive used plenty of CO2 in 40+ years, and never got better yield than when running straight fresh air.

Were getting around 1.6g per watt in a 6 x 5 with a DE Gavita. But we use up to 3 of them, and fresh air only. And in the Fall/Winter. Temps inside are 78-82.

You said earlier you are pulling 4.5 lbs under the 5x6. Thats only .92 grams per watt with 2 gavitas pulling 2200 watts at the wall, and you said sometimes you have 3 gavitas going, thats only .61 grams per watt. Unless I missed something.

 

[Rootbound]

I completely disagree about he CO2. Fresh air even if it exchanged as fast as it comes in will only be what? 300-500 ppm co2? Supplement co2 will be 1200-1500 whatever you choose. And the room doesn’t have to be sealed 100% but you will be wasting co2. But if the controller is set to 1500 it’s gonna keep it 1500 ppm. Just dep nds how much co2 you’re going to need to use to keep it there. The plants definitely use that extra 1000 ppm.
Also there is no reason to exchange the air. It’s a myth. If the co2 levels are kept up and the environment is dialed you don’t ever have to exchange air. Most people just don’t have a dialed in grow and they add co2 thinking it will get them big yields and all it does magnify they existing problems they haven’t addressed

I fully agree, lots of canna myths out there.

 

[Rootbound]

I love it man. Wood heats the good shit. Electic or gas makes me feel stuffy but that sweet ass wood heat man You live in the boonies?

Kind of, we call it the sticks instead of boonies....

 

[1diesel1]

 

[jumpincactus]

You said earlier you are pulling 4.5 lbs under the 5x6. Thats only .92 grams per watt with 2 gavitas pulling 2200 watts at the wall, and you said sometimes you have 3 gavitas going, thats only .61 grams per watt. Unless I missed something.

I would have to see this to believe it myself.

 

[Jmaes Mabley]

You said earlier you are pulling 4.5 lbs under the 5x6. Thats only .92 grams per watt with 2 gavitas pulling 2200 watts at the wall, and you said sometimes you have 3 gavitas going, thats only .61 grams per watt. Unless I missed something.

1000w Gavita by 1600+ grams is around 1.6+gs a watt, and we use 3 lights which equals up to 13+lbs if the temps are right. Cant always run 3 lights, and don't always hit 1.6gs either. Optimally they will.

Many using CO2, and strict atmospheric control can easily beat these numbers.
The key is in our situation is keeping everything cool, and airflow.

We don't have elaborate atmospheric control, as we are in an outlaw state, and electricity ect is limited as to not draw attention. Even have to watch buying Promix BX.

 

[Rootbound]

I would have to see this to believe it myself.

I agree.

 

[UncleRomulus]

Kind of, we call it the sticks instead of boonies....

All I know is if your road ain’t shit it’s not legit lol.

 

[Thejoeybrown]

View attachment 828289 We Bend, and Train our plants to grow Horizontally so all of the secondary shoots grow Vertically, become mains, and Height becomes much less of an issue, though we can get some plants 7+ feet long. Especially if you mercilessly bombard them with light, and a ton of medium from the start.

Main reason Im against Topping is that it gets rid of the Main Meristem, and for every couple inches ect, I keep getting 2 brand new Mains/Internodes. When you cut the tip, this is gone. If can be made up for, but you have to Veg Longer, which violates Rule #1.

I can also manipulate the crap out of the growing tip, and all but stop the vertical growth, but you have to mess with it 3-4 times a day, everyday for a week, or so, but it does the same thing as topping, but still allows for the growing tip.

We also Shake, and bend the branches of each plant, and have several fans going 24/7 even when Lights Out. Theres always a breeze, and fresh air exchange. Always.
Main thing is you have to use a strain that has strong side branching from the start, and we also prefer plants that stretch like a MoFo when flipped. 2x-5x
Our first rule is that when 1st tested, a single plant has to be able to produce 1lb+ in 20 gallons soil within 120 days from seed, with with No Training, and if it cant, we cant use it.

Heres a photo of a Kosher Kush Secondary that was 53 grams trimmed/dried. This is 1 of many from a single plant. This 1 plant got 24oz. Its on my guitar case so its fairly long, but not above average. Buddy also gave me this, and kept the bigger stuff. I gave him the seeds.
Im in fucked up state, and Ive also been had for 1000 clones/feds before-97-2009 worth...., so I possess nothing, but do some collusion.:opps:

1000w Gavita by 1600+ grams is around 1.6+gs a watt, and we use 3 lights which equals up to 13+lbs if the temps are right. Cant always run 3 lights, and don't always hit 1.6gs either. Optimally they will.

Many using CO2, and strict atmospheric control can easily beat these numbers.
The key is in our situation is keeping everything cool, and airflow.

We don't have elaborate atmospheric control, as we are in an outlaw state, and electricity ect is limited as to not draw attention. Even have to watch buying Promix BX.

I’m just not getting it. 4.5# in a 5x6 under one gavita would be extremely impressive. Just not fathomable. When you post pics like this and claim those numbers it just doesn’t make sense. Normally I don’t really care what people say but there’s new dudes taking those words and gonna try to follow You and this is what they’ll end up with. You would have to fill that 5x6 with trash bags full of these nugs for it to get anywhere near 4.5#.
Not to mention GPW means nothing. If you’re vegging 2 months what does GPW really mean when you’ve spent 2 months of electric on that gpw.

 

[Thejoeybrown]

This is exactly a 5x6 footprint under 1k gavita with co2 1500 ppm high yielding strain (banner glue) and if I hit 3# I would be ecstatic probably more like 2.5 but we’ll see. This still has 3.5 weeks to harvest.
Show me how with those buds you posted you are going to almost double that with the same exact footprint?

 

[SoLowDolo]

I’m just not getting it. 4.5# in a 5x6 under one gavita would be extremely impressive. Just not fathomable. When you post pics like this and claim those numbers it just doesn’t make sense. Normally I don’t really care what people say but there’s new dudes taking those words and gonna try to follow You and this is what they’ll end up with. You would have to fill that 5x6 with trash bags full of these nugs for it to get anywhere near 4.5#.
Not to mention GPW means nothing. If you’re vegging 2 months what does GPW really mean when you’ve spent 2 months of electric on that gpw.

I have always agreed gpw doesn't mean much. We need a better measure of success. I always liked the grams per kwh idea or something like that.

 

[Buzzer777]

Something is missing on your post. (nothing in that post)

 

[Jimster]

The number one fallacy about CO2 is that the higher the PPM, the better, especially at night. In the absence of sunlight/light, plants use Oxygen, good ol' 02 for growth. They don't use nearly as much as they produce during lighted times, but they do not produce CO2, nor need it, during dark periods. During active photosynthesis, they utilize CO2 and produce 02, but it is the opposite at night. Save your gas for the daylight!
This isn't bullshit, seriously.

 

[Jmaes Mabley]

Plants Transpire when Lights on.

Plants Respire when Lights Out.

 

[FarmerDaniel]

Grams per watt is just a benchmark that people try to measure themselves against; it's useful in certain terms. However, it doesn't account for a lot of variables that contribute significantly to yield such as veg time, PAR and Daily Light Integral, growing type, training, etc...

For instance, you could be running the exact same light as someone else with the exact same plants and exact same veg time and end up with different yields because one light is closer than the other therefore delivering more PAR. Or you veg one plant a week longer than another. Not to mention getting the nutrient profile right can go a long way in increasing your yield and your "grams per watt". So, experienced growers know it's just a number people throw around to try and prove a point like "HPS is better than LED". LED is way more efficient at delivering PAR than HPS or MH but people still stick to those because when your growing setup works most people just want to let it run and not mess with it because they aren't comfortable making changes; it just doesn't seem worth it (or they get some shitty LEDs trying to save a buck). So they keep talking about GPW on HPS fixtures and "penetration" like they know what they are talking about because they want to support their own opinion that what they have is the best, or at the very least good enough. But most of those people also probably never even touched a PAR meter. PAR is PAR. It doesn't matter if it's delivered with HPS, MH, Fluorescent, LED, the sun itself, or whatever else. LED may be more money upfront but the reduced cost in electricity makes up for itself in a very short time compared to the life of the fixtures. Furthermore, these days there are LEDs with spectrum curves that are more preferable to HPS and MH. More and more commercial grows are waking up to this fact every day.

Also, are you considering the environment? You enjoy throwing all those bulbs away? You know they are hazardous waste right? Are you disposing of them properly or just throwing them in the trash like many people are? Oh it's just one or two bulbs per year you say? I'm being a snowflake? The city of Boulder recently passed an ordinance against the use of HPS and MH bulbs because their dumpsters were getting full constantly...of this hazardous waste disposed of improperly...LEDs contain no dangerous substances so they can be disposed of by simple trashing them though you should still recycle them at your nearest hardware store.

There are just too many arguments for LED technology as a better option. It's more efficient. It's more cost effective considering the reduced heat and therefore the reduced A/C load, and also delivers more PAR per watt by far. They are way better for the environment and you can get better coverage and more even PAR distribution for a more even canopy and easier management (less man hours). Your "GPW" will be much higher because you're getting the same PAR for less wattage. It's just a matter of when everyone finally comes around and stops being stubborn...

 

[FarmerDaniel]

To clarify about my statement "PAR is PAR".

Spectrum can greatly affect the growth of any plant. More blue, more red, etc...what I meant was that you can get LEDs that compare to MH spectrums and you can get LEDs that compare to HPS spectrums and they will deliver more of that PAR for the same watts. PAR is growing power. Spectrum is the type of growing power. Comparing similar spectrum was an assumption of my statement. Hope that makes sense...