Orbad's DIY SCR/SOG under current knock off

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ttystikk

ttystikk

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I've read lot of horror stories about under current style systems and living organisms. Seems they like to get out of control. Do you have any recommendations to what I should be adding?

Cap's bennies are an excellent choice, but really use several- plus a handful of earthworm castings. No, wait. You have no place to put them in your rdwc, so brew aerated compost tea, add castings, in it, and then dilute 10:1 before pouring a cup or so over your hydroton in each site. Repeat regularly.
 
orbad

orbad

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Sunday update:

Plants could be happier, but roots are just starting to poke out of the netpots. So I'm expecting to start seeing growth in the next couple days.

I had to add a humidifier to keep from having to spray them with water every couple hours like I did the first night. They are much happier now though with the extra humidity.

2013 03 17 170831


2013 03 17 170840


.7 EC / 5.4 PH / 67° F
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

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Do you have airstones in your growing sites? They make a huge difference at this stage. The only buckets that need aeration are those with plants in them; aerating the epicenter is silly, since more actual aeration comes from the water falling in from the pump return than the bubbler!

How many gallons of fresh nutrient solution goes into your system each time? How many gallons of topoff water do you add between changeouts, and how long does that period last?

When you ran your RDWC system and checked the temperature, did you have the flowering bulb in place and operating? The pump generally adds little to the water temp, unless as you just found out, it has excess resistance it's working against. The bulbs are the source of radiant heart and the water will absorb it. This is the reason you'll need a chiller.

Finally, a food for thought question; if you don't continually water the net pots the plans grow in, what happens to the roots and other life in them?
 
orbad

orbad

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Do you have airstones in your growing sites?

Yes. And an 8" disc in the epi/ Res.

They make a huge difference at this stage. The only buckets that need aeration are those with plants in them; aerating the epicenter is silly, since more actual aeration comes from the water falling in from the pump return than the bubbler!

How many gallons of fresh nutrient solution goes into your system each time?

It holds about 50 US Gallons.

How many gallons of topoff water do you add between changeouts, and how long does that period last?

I have not run a (R)DWC before. I did weekly changouts in my DWC bubble buckets.

When you ran your RDWC system and checked the temperature, did you have the flowering bulb in place and operating? The pump generally adds little to the water temp, unless as you just found out, it has excess resistance it's working against. The bulbs are the source of radiant heart and the water will absorb it. This is the reason you'll need a chiller.

I did test with the light on and off additionally. I'm currently able to keep the temps in check with 2.5 gal frozen jugs. Once every 12 hours with the lights on 18/6. I'm planning on getting a 1/10th HP chiller. I'm just having a hard time finding a good deal on one

Finally, a food for thought question; if you don't continually water the net pots the plans grow in, what happens to the roots and other life in them?

For now the bubbles from the airstones keep them plenty moist. They have a plastic cover over the 3.5" netpots filled with expanded clay.

Response in the middle of quoted text. I'd bold it if I wasn't typing from my phone.

Thanks,
Orbad
 
UCMENOW

UCMENOW

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You're getting alot of avant guard advice. You seem to be pretty savy so you'd do better trusting your instincts than following the recommendations I've read so far.

With all due respect, one of your most enthusiastic advisors is offering much difinitive advice, but has no history of successfully growing rdwc. Sometimes those who say the most don't always speak from experience, but more so creative interpretation.

Also, mag pumps don't deplete your iron, wives tail. Really, change outs twice a week? Discontinue undermining this nice person with B team advice. IMO, he seems to know more than anyone offering advice so far. Maybe we should all just watch and learn.
 
Capulator

Capulator

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Everything looks good to me so far. No need to go above 1.0 EC with the jacks (trust me). Next time you may want to try your hand with a home made EZ cloner so you can go directly to the hydroton you are using without having an RR plug. Either that or switch your media to a mix of coco and hydroton or coco/perlite 50/50. This has worked really well for me. RR's hold a lot of water and you are risking stem rot by mixing the RR and hydroton IMHO...

Adding the humidifier was a great call. try to keep it around 50-60RH if possible.

Be careful on your flip height. You have a lot of plants in that little space and the last thing you want to do is overgrow. When everything is on par in these systems you will have extraordinary growth rates. I woudl flip those at 10-12" max and as soon as you get signs of nice new growth and you can "feel" the good vibe of healthy plants.

Install your support system now. Dont wait on that. Simple PVC frame and a net will be fine place 18" - 2' above where they are now.

Once you have a good root system in the water you can kill any watering from above. The roots wick water the same as well... a wick system.. :)

If you want to go live res, use the bennies at 1 cup of tea per 5 gallons of solution every week. Otherwise you can use bleach, zone, UC roots, etc.. Bleach actually works really well as a sterilizer. I can post up here the amount to use when I get back to my notes.

Nice job Orbad. I love home made shit. I hope you crush it.

-Cap
 
Capulator

Capulator

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Oh yeah, it wouldn't hurt to bring the pH up a bit. Don't go and add pH up now... just let the pH get up to around 6.3/6.4 before adjusting back down to around 5.5. Monitor your pH, water levels, and EC daily. I noticed using tap water that my EC did not go down drastically like it did when I used RO. As long as the plants are drinking, they are fine. This means don't auto top. If you are gonna be in there to add water to the humidifier and shit, top the res off manually. This way you know what they are drinking. I guess you coudl auto top if it were from a marked tank that also does not get auto topped... but its easy enough to fill er up daily.
 
orbad

orbad

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Quick update: Root Porn!

I've got some roots shooting out of the netpots so I figured I'd shoot you all some pics. These were transplanted 3 days ago.

2013 03 19 181548


2013 03 19 181538


2013 03 19 181502


.7/5.5/67°
 
orbad

orbad

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You're getting alot of avant guard advice. You seem to be pretty savy so you'd do better trusting your instincts than following the recommendations I've read so far.

With all due respect, one of your most enthusiastic advisors is offering much difinitive advice, but has no history of successfully growing rdwc. Sometimes those who say the most don't always speak from experience, but more so creative interpretation.

Also, mag pumps don't deplete your iron, wives tail. Really, change outs twice a week? Discontinue undermining this nice person with B team advice. IMO, he seems to know more than anyone offering advice so far. Maybe we should all just watch and learn.

Thanks UCMENOW. I take everything with a grain of salt. Hoping I can put together a nice show for you all. I've got a local hater if hydro I'd like to silence too. So this ones for all the water farmers out there.


Everything looks good to me so far. No need to go above 1.0 EC with the jacks (trust me). Next time you may want to try your hand with a home made EZ cloner so you can go directly to the hydroton you are using without having an RR plug. Either that or switch your media to a mix of coco and hydroton or coco/perlite 50/50. This has worked really well for me. RR's hold a lot of water and you are risking stem rot by mixing the RR and hydroton IMHO...

Adding the humidifier was a great call. try to keep it around 50-60RH if possible.

Be careful on your flip height. You have a lot of plants in that little space and the last thing you want to do is overgrow. When everything is on par in these systems you will have extraordinary growth rates. I woudl flip those at 10-12" max and as soon as you get signs of nice new growth and you can "feel" the good vibe of healthy plants.

Install your support system now. Dont wait on that. Simple PVC frame and a net will be fine place 18" - 2' above where they are now.

Once you have a good root system in the water you can kill any watering from above. The roots wick water the same as well... a wick system.. :)

If you want to go live res, use the bennies at 1 cup of tea per 5 gallons of solution every week. Otherwise you can use bleach, zone, UC roots, etc.. Bleach actually works really well as a sterilizer. I can post up here the amount to use when I get back to my notes.

Nice job Orbad. I love home made shit. I hope you crush it.

-Cap

I tried a DIY Aero cloner, I don't think I paid enough attention to root temperature or something. Ran that thing for months with happy plants but no roots even after 4 weeks. I would like to get one up and running though.

I tried coco in the net pots once but it brought me fucking gnats. Now I stay away from coco.

RH is staying above 50%. Most of the time its right around there. These poor hints would have died without that humidifier.

I'm planning on flipping them right about that size, 10 or so inches tall. Or when. I start to see rapid growth.

I'm thinking of dropping the light soon. Its currently about 42" above the plants at least. I think in another day or two they will be able to handle it.

I'd love the know how much bleach to use as a sterilizing agent. I know plants need chlorine anyways.


Oh yeah, it wouldn't hurt to bring the pH up a bit. Don't go and add pH up now... just let the pH get up to around 6.3/6.4 before adjusting back down to around 5.5. Monitor your pH, water levels, and EC daily. I noticed using tap water that my EC did not go down drastically like it did when I used RO. As long as the plants are drinking, they are fine. This means don't auto top. If you are gonna be in there to add water to the humidifier and shit, top the res off manually. This way you know what they are drinking. I guess you coudl auto top if it were from a marked tank that also does not get auto topped... but its easy enough to fill er up daily.

I used a larger Res/ epi to help reduce the amount of top offs required. I plan to do it manually for a while. As you clould expect I haven't topped off yet. Little girls are having trouble denting the 50 gal water supply.

The Ph is climbing. Slowly. Thanks for the reassurance, I went a little farther down than I anticipated but that was my first time ph'ing that much water at once. I had planned to ride it to at least 6.2.

I figure after I learn the ropes of the system I can start automating it more.
 
orbad

orbad

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One more thought. I'm so glad at this moment that I painted the buckets blue first. The insides look so CLEAN! Yes for foresight.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

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313
I run 50/50 chowmix in my net pots and I top drip RDWC water throughout flowering until right near the very end. I believe this contributes to plant health and vitality by providing a beneficial rhizospheric environment for both roots and bennies. Some of these beneficials get rinsed down into the RDWC water, where they maintain water quality, provide enzymes and importantly, inhibit the growth of pathogens.

As if these benefits weren't enough, running RDWC water through the net pots helps keep pH and EC more stable, reducing the need for interventions. If I didn't think it was helping so much, I wouldn't do it. Some people who think they are the be-all, end-all authorities may know their stuff within the sandbox of their own experience, but attack ideas from outside of it just because of their unfamiliarity.

I'm not one of those, and I suggest that in order to avoid falling into that trap, the reader will endeavor to gain a more full and complete understanding of just what is happening in various places within the growing environment. I didn't have a bolt from the blue epiphany about watering my net pots, I thought long and hard about the advantages of organics and soil and how I might be able to bring them to an RDWC environment.

It works for me, and I save a lot of time, money and brain damage by setting my systems up to take advantage of natural processes instead of trying to fight them. Sterility in a growing environment? In a well funded research lab, maybe- but I know for a fact that most of us are far from that well heeled.
 
orbad

orbad

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Update: New Growth Starting

So I've got some new growth starting to form. The new leaves look pretty good in general. The old leaves don't looks so hot though. They did get dried out pretty good a couple times during the first night (really droopy, not crispy). I also spilled .7 EC nutrient solution on this one while top feeding them the first night, but they were sprayed numerous times with water.

Do you guys think I should be concerned with the old cut leaves from the clone stage or just worry about the new growth?

2013 03 20 175214


2013 03 20 175137


2013 03 20 175145


2013 03 20 175159


.7/5.4/68°
 
squiggly

squiggly

3,277
263
Always worry about new growth first as it is usually the best indicator of problems/solutions (especially in young plants).

Older growth becomes a better indicator later in the vegetative and flowering stages. I agree with the others, bump the pH up a bit (though I include the caveat that I am inexperienced with hydro).
 
We Solidarity

We Solidarity

1,610
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Always worry about new growth first as it is usually the best indicator of problems/solutions (especially in young plants).

Older growth becomes a better indicator later in the vegetative and flowering stages. I agree with the others, bump the pH up a bit (though I include the caveat that I am inexperienced with hydro).

yep on younger plants I usually focus on new growth not old - if the plant's stressed I expect it to ditch it's cut leaves from the cloner. The most important thing for the babies is that they are growing and their new growth is healthy- everything else you can fix later, but first get them mature and ready.
 
orbad

orbad

262
43
Got my chiller up and running! No more swapping out frozen water jugs for me! :ripsjoint: and that means I can now leave the grow room for more than 12 hours at a time. Whooohoo.

2013 03 22 161457
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

6,892
313
I run my EC a lot higher than .7- in fact, 8 regularly run it as high as 1.7 in peak bloom and generally never les than 1.2. No leaf burn. My humidity is higher than most, certainly more than most in arid Colorado! I run it between 55% and 75%.
 
orbad

orbad

262
43
I'm going to bump them up from .7 to. 8 or 9 tomorrow. They are looking a little yellow for my taste. One looks really out of whack, but I'm not sure what her deal is. Roots are long, but the new growth is unhappy. The rest are much healthier.

2013 03 22 165700
 
squiggly

squiggly

3,277
263
The new growth doesn't look all that terrible.

I do see it twisting. I usually interpret this as a problem with pH an or a transpiration problem.

What is your pH again and your VPD?
 
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