The next "BIG" thing? Humic and fulvic acids

[Herb Forester]

What about a fulvic acid powder?

Ferti organic makes one derived from peat instead of shale. It's very hydrophilic so store airtight away from humidity.

 

[GoldiNugs]

Worms produce humic acid, which is one reason castings are so good.

 

[TricKy DicK]

ful power by bioag 30 ml/gallon...in coco... most important part of my girls diet next to my myco/endo regime. been using it for years. cant say enough positive stuff about it.

 

[Fire Bean]

Both humic and fulvic acids have been demonstrated to increase plants growth, but like everything else, there's a case of 'too much', so less is often more.

 

[seaslug]

This FAQ answered some of my questions:

 

[seaslug]

ful power by bioag 30 ml/gallon...in coco... most important part of my girls diet next to my myco/endo regime. been using it for years. cant say enough positive stuff about it.

I wonder if Ful-Power would work OK with Blumats. Bioag cautions that their solid product has 10% insolubles but it sounds like Ful-Power would be good, I'd probably go 10ml/gal at most.

2012 thread: https://www.thcfarmer.com/community/threads/humic-fulvic-or-both.38145/

 

[william76]

It's a liquid that I use,i knew it helped with nute uptake and lots of other benefits,i. Feed it once weekly and it is noticeable,the effect,but I seen another article not long ago,that said it mat be beneficial for flushing,but it never stated why,anyone know?thanks,76

 

[seaslug]

I dunno, 76, but Bioag says use it for flush:

 

[Seamaiden]

Thank you @Canappa. Let me ask you, do you typically go with the recommended full strength or back it of a bit like a lot of folks do?


Nice, thank you so much SM. You amaze me at times with your level of knowledge and or places to look to find something. Props ++++ Now you are starting to date yourself gurl. You used the word that the "Cats" that made it.

That is an ole school term. I promise I wont ask your age. I know better :cool:

Thanks again for all you do here at the Farm and in general being a good human....

:eek: Shit! I say that all the time! LMAO! My pleasure, just trying to do what was asked of me, and hoping to help others as I've been helped. :)

I'm cheap, I tend to ratchet dosing rates back when and where I can. I don't do that so much with MicroHume because it doesn't shift pH and it's a good bit cheaper than Humax (especially for shipping). Sensational Solutions also has a micronized product, I'll have to look it up but they're around more and more Bay area hydro shops and online. I mention it because it's made for all kinds of applications, including fertigation and the samples I've been given have been pretty easy to get into and keep in suspension. Those cats at SS are pretty cool, man!

4-5 years ago I read that OMRI charges 5$ per label per bottle.....


Take this with a grain of salt , I'm pretty sure dry source of humic is better in my opinion then derived from leonardite....dry humic, to the best of knowledge, is derived from extremely decomposed compost (I use decomposed seaweed 98% humic) ....liquid humic derived from leonardite is extracted via intense ass chemical which I will not attempt to understand just know it affects the efficacy.....maybe a chemist can help explain ....and if @squiggly shows up maybe he would also help explain how much is unknown about humates, for instance I'm under the impression fulvic and humic are the exact same thing just at different age I believe humic is older.....just thinking out loud

Ps that was my winded version of I'm a BIG fan of dry humic I use commercial grade Earth Magic from Soil Secrets......

I thought fulvic was one of the components of what are called 'humic acids' and that humus is... fresh. From the wormy squee-squee. Anyway, I thought that the reason why fulvic acid is 'an' acid is because it's one... molecule? Chain? And it's lighter, kinda like how you get gasoline and kerosene and all kinds of other products when you distill or extract or what you will from petroleum. But! I could be wrong!

 

[seaslug]

"1. What is the difference between humic acid and fulvic acid?

Fulvic acid is the lowest molecular weight portion of humic substances. By definition it will be golden in color where humic acid will be brown to black. Because of its small molecular size, fulvic acid is able to penetrate the leaf and even the mitochondria of a cell which makes it great for foliar sprays and root drenches. By comparison humic acid is a fantastic soil conditioner and better for dry broad cast and soil/soil-less application. Typically each manufacturer will provide a product analysis differentiating the fulvic from the humic; however some states do not accept fulvic acid analysis and will refer to all substances as humic acids. To further confuse things, a standardized industry method for analyzing humic substances does not exist. This creates a wide range of concentrations and analysis for humic products. At the end of the day it is best to conduct bioassays and test the products yourself to see which one will perform best."

"5. Why are humic substances sometimes called Leonardite?

True Leonardite comes from the hills of the Dakotas and was discovered by Dr. Leonard. Over time the name became confused with all humic substances, and lack of standardization has continued the misnomer. The humic substances found in this area are low in fulvic acid (the lowest molecular weight) but high in humic acid content. The low fulvic portion is because of the geological uplift and cracking which allowed the material to become weathered, literally rinsing out the fulvic portion. (akin to leaving your compost in the rain for thousands of years). Additionally, the source material for this humic substance was formed in the presence of salt water marshes. While it will provide benefits to the soil, we [BIOAG] prefer a source that is high in humic and fulvic acid. This means the source has not been leached or weathered and was made in the presence of fresh water where cycads and other leafy greens were growing. We [BIOAG] have searched the world over, tested substances from many continents and found that one of the highest sources is in the American Southwest. However, even in New Mexico there are variances in the quality of humic substances. Our source is a younger source, formed in fresh water, and protected by a thick layer of sandstone for millions of years. It comes from the basin where it was protected and not the rim where it is cracked open."

 

[canadaseed]

I've been looking into humic and fulvic acid.. check out this product guys it's spring water with trace Fulvic Acid.. the water is black!! i've drank it before sooo good. Can i put it in my DWC setup.

http://getblk.com/#

 

[shaggyballs]

I've been looking into humic and fulvic acid.. check out this product guys it's spring water with trace Fulvic Acid.. the water is black!! i've drank it before sooo good. Can i put it in my DWC setup.

http://getblk.com/#

Ya you could, but it is gonna get real expensive real fast.
Looks like a healthy drink....how much fulvic is in it?

 

[seaslug]

FedEx dropped off a gallon of Ful-Power on my porch today. I put 60ml in an existing reservoir with about 6 gallons of nute solution for my Blumat system. Looks like no problem with regards to clogging or pH or EC shift. I hope it's not just diluted snake oil. :)

"Is Ful-Power compatible with my system? Ful-Power works in harmony with all types of systems. Because it’s purified by a biodigestion it will not stain, clog, gel, gum up, or clump. It can be used in soil, hydroponic, aqua-culture, large scale farm, irrigation, horticulture, sand beds, drip systems, precision jet systems, remediation, compost tea...let’s just say we have not found a system where it’s not compatible.

Does Ful-Power effect my pH? Because it is not chemically extracted, Ful-Power fulvic acid has little to no effect on your nutrient pH when diluted. In fact, it acts as a pH buffer and will not effect pH negatively.

Does Ful-Power effect my ppm? Because it is not chemically extracted, Ful-Power will not effect ppm in any noticeable way. This means you do not need to compensate for unwanted nutrient value and the product can be integrated into your existing program with ease."

 

[DO IT]

Been using the stuff since it came out on the market over 1o years ago in my hydro grows, I have not done a side by side comparison but, once I did grow without it and it just was not the same IMO. It seems to work well in the plants structure, Is it a miracle additive? NO. To me its just one of those nutes that will not kill you, if you have it or not but, I never grow without it dont want to take no chances.
View attachment 437973

Yup what he said

 

[Seamaiden]

FedEx dropped off a gallon of Ful-Power on my porch today. I put 60ml in an existing reservoir with about 6 gallons of nute solution for my Blumat system. Looks like no problem with regards to clogging or pH or EC shift. I hope it's not just diluted snake oil. :)

While I have not used that exact product, my own experience when adding humic acids for the first time was that the plants became overfed, in fairly quick order. I had to ratchet back their feeding strength, I want to say by about another quarter to a third more from my usual feeding at that time (using Floranova Bloom and Fox Farms Big Bloom in coir).

Again, a different product, I used Humax, but I saw those signs of overfeeding fairly quickly. IIRC, Fnb already has some humic in it, too, so I may have been doubling up in that area. It's been a few years since I've run Fnb and FF BB, so I'm going by recollection.

 

[seaslug]

Thanks for the tip, Sm. A few days ago, my EC crept up to 1.8mS and I started getting tip burn. I've lowered it to 1.7mS but I think I'll dilute down to 1.6mS. (Cantaloupe Skunk in coco with Blumats.)

 

[KiLoEleMeNt]

Hey everyone I have had a bit of experience with humic/folvic acids and like some others have said I can see a difference but i have never done a side by side with them but I have seen what happens when I don't have it or forget it I particularly use it for increased uptake as I go very high ppms at times I would also like to say that I am starting up some new hydro buckets they are diy standalone water farms and would be perfect for the test I will do two nutrient lines and four buckets all same strain one line will be soul synthetics and the other black label here is a picture of what I have now for acids tell me what you would like to see in the black label as soul synthetics already has both in the line

 

[seaslug]

Update to #36: 1.6mS seemed like too much so yesterday I went to 1.5mS total. (MaxiBloom, Drip Clean, Pro-Tekt, 10ml/Gal of Ful-Power, 0.2mS tap).

Three weeks of 12/12hr.

 

[Seamaiden]

Yep, looks like you're almost pushing too much still. Like I said, it really helps lower overall fertilizer use.

 

[Pimples]

For a leonardite based humic fulvic...Europnic Fossil Fuel is one of the most concentrated brands. Its both humic and fulvic acid. For pure fulvic. (The light brown yellow colored stuff derived from peat - not lignite coal) you could use BioAg Ful- Power. Fulvic being way more absorbable than humic - which is more of a substrate conditioner. A cheaper and last forever alternative is RAW Ful Up dry concentrated powder. A little goes a long way. Just as good as the liquid fulvic from BioAg. Basically you want the humic in your feed tanks along with your base feeds and the fulvic with a kelp extract, hydrolysate amino acid, and yucca saponin as a weekly foliar spray in veg and early flower for the ultimate additive. It chelates iron especially and the aminos chelate other hard to move around minerals like calcium. After my supply of Nitrozime Fossil Fuel and BioAg runs out iam buying the RAW Solubels from NPK industries. Not exactly ag farmer salt price cheap but WAY cheaper than the rest of the hobby store bottle gear. Lasts forever with how little you use.