UCRoots - come on guys really?

[Dizzy Weasel]

I would like to add I have never used the shock tho but was told it leaves buildup like bleach by a friend who is addicted to buying high dollar shit... I am going to get a bag tommoro and mix a batch and see for my self... Quite possibly could have had not been shock and swim as leadsled suggested and not calcium hypochlorite based...

 

[Texas Kid]

Everything and everyone copies in one form or another in every industry..thats how the world works..all I'm saying is quit belly aching about it all the time..its like hating on everyone in the world that uses an assembly line because they copied Henry Ford..who cares..thats all Im saying..and as it relates to UC's, I have ran them, still run them, exactly as the come out of the box and have none of the issues you claim are the shortfalls...none..bigger pumps, smaller pumps, same size pumps, makes absolutly no difference..the product works day in day out with no issues..if anything they are getting way more user friendly right out of the box and their customer support is unmatched by any company slingin their gear in the industry.It really makes your critisizms come off like a bitter little old lady upset that someone doesn't see how much smarter you are than them because you want to do things differently..now it is that they use Hyporclourus acid as a root sterilizing agent and that is available elsewhere..ok..again..so what, is that supposed to mean anything at all...maybe we should all down "shock and swim" because they copied "shock it" jeez do you see how silly that is

 

[Blinky]

I am always looking to save some $, thanks for the info good sir.

On a side note, out of all the people in the industry I have met over the years, Dan is by far one of the coolest.

 

[Papa]

'just to be clear for those who may not look closely, UC Roots uses hypochlorous acid (HOCl), and bleach uses sodium hypochlorite (NaClO).

 

[sedate]

'just to be clear for those who may not look closely, UC Roots uses hypochlorous acid (HOCl), and bleach uses sodium hypochlorite (NaClO).

Just to be clear, these compounds are interchangeable for our purposes.

Sodium hypochlorite becomes hypocholorous acid when it comes into contact with water.
Sodium Hypochlorite is a salt of hypochlorous acid.

With both Clorox Bleach and UCRoots the ingredient - BEFORE it goes into water - is sodium hypochlorite.

Something like this (for simplicities sake I'm ignoring anions and free hydrogens and shit):

NaClO + H20 =(2) HOCl + Na2O

EDIT: Fucking stoichiometry takes too much algebra after bong hits.

This is correct: (I think, but happy hour is getting close someone else check me ;))

NaClO + H20 -> HOCl + NaOH

See that Na20 NaOH? That's sodium oxide hydroxide, it's what is left of the reaction after ccH2o puts sodium hypochlorite into the water - and that's where that last percentage of product (the last .018% , the active and inactive ingredient %'s do not add up on the bottle) is made up of.
UCRoots is a few mg of sodium hypochlorite mixed with water.

UCRoots/CurrentCulture is just saving you that step for a small ($248/gallon) fee.

...that is all....

 

[jcom]

I use the pool shock in my Turbo Kloner at 1 tsp per gallon of RO water. I put 30 ml of this mix in the cloner every 5 days. Works like a charm.

I do not use it in my RDWC system as I don't want to kill of the beneficials in my hydrocorn media or in the root mass. I have used Botanicare Aqua Shield (formerly Hydroguard) for the last 10 years with great success. I have never had root rot.

 

[Capulator]

Bleach in your reservoirs:

0.5ml/gallon at each reservoir change and about a teaspoon per 25 gallons every 2-3 days after that.

CC is a great company and if you own a business you know how hard it is to make a profit and continue growth. I think their nute line is killer. Don't have much experience with UCroots because I run a live res . I like to live on the edge.

 

[sedate]

CC is a great company and if you own a business you know how hard it is to make a profit and continue growth.

Cap. Jeeze. For a guy who actually sells an awesome product at a fair price I'm mortified you would even come rhetorically close to defending this profiteering bullshit product.

I get what you guys at OGBiowar are doing. Methinks you have mighty high hopes. Maybe the premier myco providers in this industry?

But in the meantime CCh20 is way past you folks in the fuck-you-i-want-money-profiteering-department, They are trolling for cash with a shitty mineral based nute line that about stacks up to GH's 3-part.



I would love to break down the relative economics as to how cch20 competes - but it is not on quality of product offerings - it is on the backs of stupid, gullible growers.

Um - if I may -

Don't have much experience with UCroots because I run a live res .

Well then. You don't need 'experience' - you just need chem101.

 

[Texas Kid]

Guess I'm stupid and gullible.....what a joke

 

[sedate]

Guess I'm stupid and gullible.....what a joke

Well shit TK. If you do not like my ideas or comments, please tell me. I will address your concerns immediately with the most thoughtful analysis I can generate.

Are you attempting to wipe my ideas away with a smarmy comment? "what a joke" -well then - please - what is the joke?

 

[Capulator]

Cap. Jeeze. For a guy who actually sells an awesome product at a fair price I'm mortified you would even come rhetorically close to defending this profiteering bullshit product.

I get what you guys at OGBiowar are doing. Methinks you have mighty high hopes. Maybe the premier myco providers in this industry?

But in the meantime CCh20 is way past you folks in the fuck-you-i-want-money-profiteering-department, They are trolling for cash with a shitty mineral based nute line that about stacks up to GH's 3-part.



I would love to break down the relative economics as to how cch20 competes - but it is not on quality of product offerings - it is on the backs of stupid, gullible growers.

Um - if I may -



Well then. You don't need 'experience' - you just need chem101.

All I can say is I have actually used the nute line in a RDWC system and I had a really great run with it. No deficiencies, no toxicities. I can't say any more than that. There is always a cheaper way, but more people like the easy way for many reasons... Sometimes it's ignorance and sometimes convenience. I think most people don't mind paying the high price for some of these products because they aren't growing lettuce and the bottom line is not affected very much by the variable cost of nutrients or sterilizing agents.

I think as TK said a big part of what you are paying for when you buy cc products is the guarantee and the customer service, which goes a long way especially with novice growers who need hand holding. As paying customers we have the right to choose, and we don't have to buy what we don't want to buy. CC makes it easy selling a compatible nute line with their system. If you get down to is sedate, all nutes are "overpriced"... just raw salts and water. It's cheap as fuck to make... but people are still buying it out of convenience or ignorance... or both. :)

Oh and as far as chem 101 I get that trust me, but how much is UCroots anyway? I mean, what is the cost for an average grower to do a full run with it? Is it worth it? That's a question only the savvy grower can answer.

Also, and I am pretty sure you know this, but labels in the fertilizer/bottling industry don't mean shit. GA's can be manipulated, and things can be left out. There is a very real possibility that there is more to the bottle than what the label states.... which may justify the higher price?

 

[Papa]

'just to be clear for those who may not look closely . . . .

sedate, this was obviously not directed at you. at least i thought it was obvious.

after years of reading your posts i'm well aware that little gets past you.

 

[Wavegem]

Guess I'm stupid and gullible.....what a joke

This whole thread is a joke.... We all get it pool shock is the same as uc roots. Use it and be done
Uc roots is 100 a gal

 

[Dizzy Weasel]

Bleach in your reservoirs:

0.5ml/gallon at each reservoir change and about a teaspoon per 25 gallons every 2-3 days after that.

Is this dilution rate for the new concentrated bleach?

 

[Texas Kid]

Implying that you must have to be stupid or gullible to use UC nutes or products is what I have a problem with...that basically covers every product and nute company in the industry provided they are in it to make money...the exact same can be said for GH 3 part, GH is the hands down king of profiteering in the hobby size grow product arena yet those are the guys you champion...I have literally ran 95% of every product line and manufacturer out there, its all the same, NPK's, just some come from different source materials, its price point and customer support that set each apart...as far as UC goes I have ran here products over the years with great success, no issues, I ran with bigger pumps, smaller pumps, hell, no pumps just as stand alone DWC's in series, still worked great and before those cats put their product in the game it wasn't commercially available out of the box..period..now in an effort to be an one stop shop for hardware and nutes somehow that diminishes their integrity or something and that people who endorse their product are somehow stupid and or gullible..that is a joke to me and most others that read it....bust out a thread of your homemade ground breaking innovative grow setup and your unique base salt mixes to prove your not just another one of us stupid gullible sheep....I love CAP , his support, and his products. I have used his products with great success but after a few rounds of a couple hundred bucks for a kilo of what you would basically call talcum powder and a pile of spores I simply couldn't afford to use it any more at the scale I need it in but I sure didn't throw him under the bus, it just wasn't something that was suitable for my needs..still a great product and it still works great..if you don't like UC products or services, Don't use them, pretty damn simple..and if that somehow makes you smarter than the rest of us, have fun patting yourself on the back telling yourself how smart you are.."check out the big brain on Brad"...lol

 

[Capulator]

I can get discount pricing for you if you buy in bulk @Texas Kid and if you make the tea it goes a long way! PM me if you want to hook back up.

 

[Dizzy Weasel]

I ghess my questions to cap are invisible:photogenic:, anyone know an alternative to ogbio as I will no longer purchase his products, and go back to my corporate benis for the time being :cigar: What I got will last till the sun comes out then I will need a crap load:cool:

 

[Chronic Monster]

a post from cap, 2 years ago on bleach...

Here are all the notes I took on fatmans take regarding using chlorox (bleach) as a disinfectant. Lots of succ farmers essful using bleach as a sterilizer, and running it in low doses throughout the grow.


"Like I said. The MDS said 5 to 10% Sodium Hypochlorite. Maybe I just got the bad luck of their worse posted MSDS. The calculations are based upon your saying 5.75%. And I calculated based upon 5.75% sodium hypochlorite as chlorox bleach is made with sodium hypochlorite. The calculations merely show that if it is 5.75% sodium chlorite then only 3.9% is actually available as chlorine. I can go to probably 10 differnt sites and be told 10 different amounts in various term as to how much chlorine is in house hold Chlorox Bleach. What I see most often is the number 5.25% on sites that say how to mix chlorox for restaurant surface disinfection. Honestly I don't think Chlorox runs a tight control on the chlorine content of most of their products. As long as they provide the minimum of what they advertise they just plug away with mixing and bottling their at least 50 different products containing sodium hypochlorite. Considering that the caactual material cost of producing their products is their smallest expense I do not think they care a lot.

The ppm concentration is 39675 ppm if the Chlorox was 5.75% sodium hypochlorite. If it was 5.75% aviailble Chlorine then it is 57500 ppm. You want 1 ppm.

That means the Chlorox straight from the bottle will treat either 39675 gallons or 57500 gallons. There are 3785 ml to a gallon. So a ml from the bottle will treat either: (39675/3785) = 10.48 gallons or (57500/3785)= 15.19 gallons As 2 ppm is the maximum allowed residual level of chlorine and the residual is how much is left over after all organics are oxidized that means those water treatment plants started out with adding about 4 ppm. Yes there are that much crap still in our water after water treatment plants are through with it. When who look at a treatment report and it gives a list of things like Bromodichloromethane, Chlorodibromomethane, Chloroform, and Trihalonethanes the ose are all compounds formed by chlorine oxidizing organic compounds in the water.

Many people have used chlororinated tap water on their plants for decades without killing their plants. Chlorine harm to plants iis grossly exaggerated. The commercial green house industry has been using chlorine at the residual 0.5 ppm to 1 ppm rate for decades with the food they grow that we eat. Obviously it is not killing the plants or us. They inject chlorine by auto control to keep the residual level between 0.5 ppm and 1 ppm continously. they do not wait for a problem to arrive first, the use those levels as a preventative against Pythh. So whether 10.48 or 15.19 is the proper number does not matter much as Pythh is easily killed by chlorine at levels as low as 0.2 ppm at tempertures of 75 degrees F. It is even more effective at higher temps but the chlorine out gasses quicker as the temperture increases so it must be added more often.

Personally I would use the 1 ml per 10 gallon number. That means a teaspoon of chlorox straight from the bottle is good for 50 gallons of nutrient water.

The use of bleach is the cheapest aspect of my growing. Thats why I find the cost of retail products sucha s Pythoff so AN ish. Flairform charges something like $10 for a 1 quart bottle of RO water with a few cents of Chlorox added to it sold as Pythoff. Reminds me so much of Advanced Nutrients prices.


I am saying that in reality everyone should shock treat their water with at least a 2 ppm dosage of chlorine before its usage rather than trusting that your water was fully disinfected by the water treatment plant. Water treatment plants disinfect with chlorine at levels need to kill the majority of a ceratin type of intestinal bacteria found in animal and human feces (E Coli), not all other bacteria's or fungi etc. Researchers have found that to kill all Pyth it requires a "residual" doasage of at least 2 ppp be maintained for at least 20 or 30 minutes. Water treatment plants are only reqi uired to treat witha chlorine residual dosage of 0.4 ppm for 20 minutes. They typically only ink ject 2 ppm and almost 75 % of that is used up oxidizing organics in the water. This happens immeditattely upon inject. ie your water arrives with some live Pyth in it usually. Low levels of chloro ine will keep it in small numbers unlees your roots start dying due to low DO and then the low levels ofchlorine are not adequate to keep the low levels of Pyth in check beacuse the low levels are readily used up in oxidizing the dead roots. Therefore you should kill all pyth by adding 2 ppm of chloirine or more say 3 ppm 24 hours before using the water. 30 minutes after adding the chlorine use a small pump in the water or an airstone so the remaining Chlorine will dissipate M Now add 0.5 to 1 ppm of chlorine every two days at least. If yo at any time notice dieing brown roots kick in a single doase at 2 pp. and then go back to the 0.5 to 1 ppm doses. Ant newater you add shouldbe treated with chlorine befiore use. Pyth is not harmful to people so waste water treatment palnts do not disinefct at levels needed to kill Pyth. Pyth is about everywhere there is organic matter, it can also be airborne.


If you have a shallow well you likely will need up to 16 to 20 drops per gallon just to kill the pyth in the water. Then you have to oxidize the dead roots and still have enough remaining ck hlot rine left in thw water to be equivalent to 16 drops per gallon. Without a test kit it would be hard to actually judge the amount required. It will sem like a pain in the ass solution but the best results without a test kit would come from drawing into a seperate container the amount of water your reservoir holds and add 16 drops per gallon to the water. Drain your existing reservoir and add water and 16 drops of chlorine per gallon of water. After this water has run through your system for 30 minutes or so. Drain it and replace with the wother clorinated water. Let it run a half an hour or more before adding your nutrients. Every day for two days after that replace half the water with new water that has has 16 drops per gallon of chlorine added. After that add 8 drops per gallon every other day"

​

 

[Capulator]

I ghess my questions to cap are invisible:photogenic:, anyone know an alternative to ogbio as I will no longer purchase his products, and go back to my corporate benis for the time being :cigar: What I got will last till the sun comes out then I will need a crap load:cool:

What question homie? I didn't see one...

 

[Texas Kid]

I'll holler at ya CAP..workin on a vortex brewer or two right now..want to skew one for veg and one for flower...will have almost 700 lights in flower in the real short term so my use has been ramping up with the quickness as of late...gotta love Colorado