First Organic Grow Plans

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Onetwothree

Onetwothree

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Hello fellow farmers! I am in the planning stages of my first organic grow, and I wanted to run some things by you fine folks who have a ton more experience than me. I want to start with a nicely amended soil that will help feed my ladies throughout their life, and feed only with ACT's or nutrient teas.

I found a fairly simple soil and tea recipe, and added some flair to it here and there, so let me know what you think.
I'll start my seedlings off in Happy Frog, but once they are ready to be re-potted I will move them up to the soil mix below:

6 parts Fox Farm Ocean Forest
2 parts perlite
2 parts earthworm castings

Amendments per gallon of above mix:
2 TBS gypsum
1 TBS bone meal
2 TBS Azomite
2 TBS Humic Acid

Is that a solid recipe? Am I too heavy or light anywhere? I was thinking I could add some guano, but as you'll see below that is what I'll be making teas with, and I don't want to start with a ton of N as you can always add more but never take away!

As far as the Tea goes....I found this on icmag, this is the recipe unchanged...although I would probably occasionally add some alfalfa during flower, as well as some epsom salt every now and then...(perhaps 1 TBS per gallon of water for the epsom??) perhaps do one or two feedings with bone meal for a calcium boost during veg? I know the soil might be heavy on the ca already, but I had a calcium defiency on my first grow in 2/4 plants and it bummed me out because I couldn't correct it/didn't know what it was until too late. So maybe I'm going to heavy there?

Veg mix-

1/3 cup Peruvian Seabird Guano (PSG)
1/3 cup High N Bat Guano (Mexican)
1/3 cup Earth Worm Castings (EWC)

(That makes the "dry mix". You can make all you want and save it to use later.)

Mix with water @ 1 cup of dry mix into 5 gallons of water to make the tea.

To that 5 gallons of tea add:
5 tbs. Maxicrop or Neptune's Harvest liquid seaweed.
5 tsp. Black Strap Molasses

Use it to water with every 3rd watering.

Flowering nute tea mix:

2/3 cup Peruvian Seabird Guano
2/3 cup Earth Worm Castings
2/3 cup High P Guano (Indonesian or Jamaican)

(That makes the "dry mix". You can make all you want and save it to use later.)

Mix with water @ 2 cups of dry mix into 5 gallons of water to make the tea.

To that 5 gallons of tea add:
5 tbs. Neptune's Harvest liquid seaweed.
5 tsp. Black Strap Molasses
Use it to water with EVERY watering.

Here, I don't know if I would go with every watering during flower...what do you guys think? Also, is 5TBS of the liquid seaweed overkill? Seems like A LOT! As always I appreciate any and all feedback from you fine folks!
 
blu3kush

blu3kush

220
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I just got into organics my self I also seen those recipes and want to try them my next grow. You should also check out the og biowar root pack link below I've heard amazing things about it
 
OrganicBandt

OrganicBandt

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Image


Here is a Jack Herer about 3/4 of the way through flower using the same mix that you're about to use. I recommend letting it cook for maybe 2 weeks or so. It works, but from my experience running a modified coots mix or another simple hand mixed recipe does better.

Good luck! I came from Deep Water Culture (4 years) to organic soil and haven't looked back.
 
Onetwothree

Onetwothree

386
93
View attachment 562219

Here is a Jack Herer about 3/4 of the way through flower using the same mix that you're about to use. I recommend letting it cook for maybe 2 weeks or so. It works, but from my experience running a modified coots mix or another simple hand mixed recipe does better.

She's a beauty! Pardon my ignorance, but what do you mean by "modified coots mix?"
 
OrganicBandt

OrganicBandt

89
33
She's a beauty! Pardon my ignorance, but what do you mean by "modified coots mix?"

Thanks! The bag appeal was great but I wasn't a fan of the smoke
Some added ingredients into his mix, I've had a few plants in my line up that blow through the soil and want more
So I add a few things like bio char, Gro-Kashi, alfalfa, and a little more than the recommended use of his base ingredients
Helps me keep it closer to water only but that's my experience
I'm fairly new to organic gardening, and there's a lot to learn!
 
Onetwothree

Onetwothree

386
93
Thanks! The bag appeal was great but I wasn't a fan of the smoke
Some added ingredients into his mix, I've had a few plants in my line up that blow through the soil and want more
So I add a few things like bio char, Gro-Kashi, alfalfa, and a little more than the recommended use of his base ingredients
Helps me keep it closer to water only but that's my experience
I'm fairly new to organic gardening, and there's a lot to learn!

Gotcha. Yea the original recipe didn't call for azomite or humic acid and I've been reading a lot about the benefits of those lately. Also, it called for dolomite lime which I'm replacing with gypsum after SeaMaiden recommended it. The bonemeal is a new addition to the recipe as well. I do have a 5lb bag of alfalfa, so I could add that to the mix too. Just not sure when it becomes overkill of amendments.
 
Dabominable

Dabominable

255
63
Teas are feeding the microbes and other life forms in the soil itself. I usually mix both N and P guano in my plants that i switch to flower. Since you're using teas pretty regularly, you can rely on the microbes to let the plant uptake what it wants, when it wants. Also, you can do 5oz/to 5 gallon bucket of liquid humic/ful-power in your tea, pre-brew. Hope this helps some. Also you can put some kelp meal in your soil, and then not have to make teas with kelp nearly at all, other then more kelp meal...
 
ArcticOrange

ArcticOrange

2,518
263
I also agree put the kelp in the soil not in the tea, it can actually inhibit microbial growth if you put it in excess, i mix very little into my teas. I use virtually the same tea recipes as that one but never add the maxicrop or neptunes harvest. Just use the dry mix, I add a little molasses and a little recharge to innoculate it let it bubble 24-48 hours and apply.

Proofs in the pudding, 7 week from seed nl5xhaze. Sitting in 7 gallon pots of my flower mix now.
20160108 142138
 
Onetwothree

Onetwothree

386
93
Teas are feeding the microbes and other life forms in the soil itself. I usually mix both N and P guano in my plants that i switch to flower. Since you're using teas pretty regularly, you can rely on the microbes to let the plant uptake what it wants, when it wants. Also, you can do 5oz/to 5 gallon bucket of liquid humic/ful-power in your tea, pre-brew. Hope this helps some. Also you can put some kelp meal in your soil, and then not have to make teas with kelp nearly at all, other then more kelp meal...

Hey thanks for the info and input!! After doing research on ACTs for the last month it seems crazy to feed with bottled nutes. I love the idea that the plant is doing its own thing, taking what it needs, when it needs it.

Yea the liquid kelp seemed like overkill, especially at 5tbs every watering during flower. I'll grab some kelp meal and add that to my soul mix. Is 2tbs/gallon a good starting point?

I also agree put the kelp in the soil not in the tea, it can actually inhibit microbial growth if you put it in excess, i mix very little into my teas. I use virtually the same tea recipes as that one but never add the maxicrop or neptunes harvest. Just use the dry mix, I add a little molasses and a little recharge to innoculate it let it bubble 24-48 hours and apply.

Proofs in the pudding, 7 week from seed nl5xhaze. Sitting in 7 gallon pots of my flower mix now.
View attachment 562270

Looking good! Thanks for backing up the info on the liquid kelp. I love the wealth of knowledge everyone is willing to share. I can't wait to be able to reciprocate to some new farmers.

What's "recharge?" I'm unfamiliar with that.
 
ArcticOrange

ArcticOrange

2,518
263
Recharge is an innoculant that i purchase, im hoping to be culturing my own microbes soon so i dont need an innoculant. It also contains humic and fulvic acid which are essentially amino acids.
 
Onetwothree

Onetwothree

386
93
@Onetwothree

The things I would add to your mix is Oyster Shell Flour and Crab Meal or Insect Frass and Basalt.

Much obliged! I was wary of oyster shell flour as I thought that would lower the ph of the soil, does the oyster shell provide anything besides ca? Hadn't thought of crab meal, sounds interesting! what does that add?
 
S

slap14

403
143
Much obliged! I was wary of oyster shell flour as I thought that would lower the ph of the soil, does the oyster shell provide anything besides ca? Hadn't thought of crab meal, sounds interesting! what does that add?


Crab or Crustacean meal is a good source of Nitrogen, Phosphorous, Calcium, and Magnesium. It 's also a great source of Chitin that will help the plant fend off mold, mildew and pests. Strengthens the plants immune response.

Oyster Shell Flower will raise or stabilize your PH. It also has a great ratio of calcium to magnesium (very important).

The Insect Frass is cheap and works great as a tea, good for feeding the fungi. It's also a light NPK 2-2-2 pick me up that can be used into the 3rd week of flower along with adding Chitin.

Organic A-Dub Killer
Adub6


Good luck

Slap
 
Onetwothree

Onetwothree

386
93
Crab or Crustacean meal is a good source of Nitrogen, Phosphorous, Calcium, and Magnesium. It 's also a great source of Chitin that will help the plant fend off mold, mildew and pests. Strengthens the plants immune response.

Oyster Shell Flower will raise or stabilize your PH. It also has a great ratio of calcium to magnesium (very important).

The Insect Frass is cheap and works great as a tea, good for feeding the fungi. It's also a light NPK 2-2-2 pick me up that can be used into the 3rd week of flower along with adding Chitin.

Organic A-Dub Killer
View attachment 562287

Good luck

Slap

So much to learn!! Thanks man, I am loving all this new information I'm getting on this thread. You guys all rock.

I thought I heard perlite was bad for microbes?

Rut roh. Anyone else on this?
 
Seamaiden

Seamaiden

Living dead girl
23,596
638
Hey @Onetwothree -- I'm skipping through your thread because I saw you mention using alfalfa during flower. My experience with it during flower has been bad IF too much is used too late in flower. You can cause some really larfy buds as the plant takes that 'information' and N and says, "Oh! I'm gonna make new LEAVES with this!" Yes, I ruined one girl pretty badly with it.

I LOVE alfalfa in veg, and I do put hay deep into my raised beds. I get sweepings for free from my local feed store. No, I don't know if it's non-GMO, I'm, sure the majority of it is not organically grown, but I prefer to pick my battles in that regard. Outside the issue mentioned above I've experienced no others.

I've never heard perlite was bad for microbes, but it IS unsustainable and it floats, so I personally made the switch to rice hulls years ago. Purchased from the same feed shop, it's a fraction of the cost of perlite. It is not, however, inert as perlite is, watch for rising pH in slurry tests (in other words, in this lady's opinion, you're missing the boat with organic if you're ignoring pH or believe that everything adjusts itself. Yeah, in a perfect world it does, but that takes some work to get right). Rice hulls take about two to three years to decompose.
 
Onetwothree

Onetwothree

386
93
Hey @Onetwothree -- I'm skipping through your thread because I saw you mention using alfalfa during flower. My experience with it during flower has been bad IF too much is used too late in flower. You can cause some really larfy buds as the plant takes that 'information' and N and says, "Oh! I'm gonna make new LEAVES with this!" Yes, I ruined one girl pretty badly with it.

I LOVE alfalfa in veg, and I do put hay deep into my raised beds. I get sweepings for free from my local feed store. No, I don't know if it's non-GMO, I'm, sure the majority of it is not organically grown, but I prefer to pick my battles in that regard. Outside the issue mentioned above I've experienced no others.

I've never heard perlite was bad for microbes, but it IS unsustainable and it floats, so I personally made the switch to rice hulls years ago. Purchased from the same feed shop, it's a fraction of the cost of perlite. It is not, however, inert as perlite is, watch for rising pH in slurry tests (in other words, in this lady's opinion, you're missing the boat with organic if you're ignoring pH or believe that everything adjusts itself. Yeah, in a perfect world it does, but that takes some work to get right). Rice hulls take about two to three years to decompose.

Thanks Sea. Yea, I never quite bought the "you don't have to worry about ph in organics"...just doesn't seem very scientific, although I'm guessing it might be less of an issue than when using salt based fertilizers. I'll remember that about the alfalfa, the dude who recommended it to me said just to feed in a tea once during flower, and not too late. I'll mix some into my soil mix.
 
ArcticOrange

ArcticOrange

2,518
263
Thanks Sea. Yea, I never quite bought the "you don't have to worry about ph in organics"...just doesn't seem very scientific, although I'm guessing it might be less of an issue than when using salt based fertilizers. I'll remember that about the alfalfa, the dude who recommended it to me said just to feed in a tea once during flower, and not too late. I'll mix some into my soil mix.
http://www.nature.com/scitable/knowledge/library/the-rhizosphere-roots-soil-and-67500617

This is a good paper on the rhizosphere and the science behind why PH is less of a big deal in organic/biodynamic soils. If youre in a hurry read the part about Root Exudates and Mineral Nutrition.

Thats not to say that if a very large portion if your soil (in this case rice hulls) is slowly breaking down and raising PH that the microbes and your plants will be able to buffer this conpletely, however it will certainly help smaller ph swings. And as Sea suggested, we are rarely operating in a perfect world.
 

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