Transitioning From Soil To Hydro

I've been doing dwc for 6 or so years and the major plus with hydro is massive and more rapid plant and root growth in veg with hydro. If your girls take 10 weeks to flower in soil, they'll take 10 weeks in hydro. I've found grams per watt to be more strain dependent than growing method. You're not gonna get a gram per watt growing cookies no matter what. The downside is that hydro is more labor intensive with collecting reverse osmosis water to monitoring and correcting your ph and ec.

jammie said:

I've been doing dwc for 6 or so years and the major plus with hydro is massive and more rapid plant and root growth in veg with hydro. If your girls take 10 weeks to flower in soil, they'll take 10 weeks in hydro. I've found grams per watt to be more strain dependent than growing method. You're not gonna get a gram per watt growing cookies no matter what. The downside is that hydro is more labor intensive with collecting reverse osmosis water to monitoring and correcting your ph and ec.

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Thank you very much for the info I like the more mass and faster root growth :) that sounds amazing!!! Cool I wasnt 100% sure if grow times with differ from soil or hydro def good to know. Thats what i figured on the gram a watt thats its more plant genetic base then growing. Now i know for sure ^^ . I dont mind a some extra work if It offers me more return those ladies can have my whole day if they want!

plants are about 6 weeks from planting seeds

That looks amazing!!! Here's a curve ball Would i see a better return vegging for 2 months and flowering for 1? Or is that based on plant genetics ?

Sybn said:

That looks amazing!!! Here's a curve ball Would i see a better return vegging for 2 months and flowering for 1? Or is that based on plant genetics ?

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You would have a better return since the plants would be much bigger with an extra month of veg. But, you still have to flower for 2ish months to get the best yield, regardless.

Canndidly said:

You would have a better return since the plants would be much bigger with an extra month of veg. But, you still have to flower for 2ish months to get the best yield, regardless.

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thank you makes sense ^^

most all plants take 50-70 days to completely flower once you switch lights to 12 on/12 off. how long you veg is determined by the size of your room or tent and how strong a light you use. most plants double in size in the first 3 weeks of flower. light from a 1000 watt hps will provide light penetration 3 ft from the bulb. 600 w and 400 w significantly less. so if you want big plants use big containers for root growth, a ceiling 8 ft high and use a 1k hps light. some super lemon haze at 5 weeks

not meaning to hijack your thread but i have some other pics of my current grow here https://www.thcfarmer.com/community/threads/jammie-17-the-fallout-shelter-grow.86137/

Canndidly said:

You would have a better return since the plants would be much bigger with an extra month of veg. But, you still have to flower for 2ish months to get the best yield, regardless.

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Sybn said:

That looks amazing!!! Here's a curve ball Would i see a better return vegging for 2 months and flowering for 1? Or is that based on plant genetics ?

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Adding to Canndidly's reply, remember to be conscious of multiple dimensions at once. Yield is first about optimizing ALL the factors that go into plant growth, right? First be sure you're optimizing (not necessarily maximizing) everything together and in accordance with your medium. Light (calculate and max your LUMENS and LIGHT DISTRIBUTION-- i leave bulb and spectrum to you), nutrient levels and ratios for veg and flower, root space, water, temp, humidity, and pH--and read up on some pinching/pruning tips. It is only when you have all these factors tight and right that you can accurately decide on the best balance of veg time to rotations per year. For example, a 1000watt hung too high is actually worse than a 600 positioned for maximum plant coverage and minimum stretch. Give yourself some time to find the best balance between veg time and number of rotations. But never skimp on flowering time. The girls will tell you what they want if you tune into them--and of course different strains want to be treated differently. Hell, you know women--each plant wants you to listen to her. But you know all that :)

Sybn said:

I"ve been growing in soil for 4 years now never had any real issues other then a random herm here and there. Id really like to switch up to hydro maybe dwc set up. Is dwc the same as a flood and drain technique ? What are my pros/cons in hydro to soil?

More yeild ?
Less stress?
Faster nut intake ?
More efficient?

I do feel confident with my grow skill to partake this on but i would really like any other input.
Ill be running 3 1000w, roughly 15-20 plants, big bud(fem) from sensi seed, 1 month veg/ 2 months flower.

p.s. Ive been growing under 600w hps and can pull close to a lb per lamp which i was told is pretty good.
Should i expect to meet a 1.5 to 2lb return on a 1000w lamp?
How likely is it to get the full gram per watt on 1000's?

Thanks for any info or tell me i said something wrong anything will help :)

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ALMOST FORGOT--hydro leaves much less room for mistakes than soil. Remember you have no soil to retain water. The lack of water from power outages or equipment malfunctions will hit you fast and hard. As long as they are checked in on a couple of times a day, and you are willing to deal with constant calibration of the multiple aspects of hydroponic delivery of water with heavy soluble loads through structures that aerate enough but not too much, etc. etc.--then you'll be amazed at what they'll do for you.

Sybn said:

I"ve been growing in soil for 4 years now never had any real issues other then a random herm here and there. Id really like to switch up to hydro maybe dwc set up. Is dwc the same as a flood and drain technique ? What are my pros/cons in hydro to soil?

More yeild ?
Less stress?
Faster nut intake ?
More efficient?

I do feel confident with my grow skill to partake this on but i would really like any other input.
Ill be running 3 1000w, roughly 15-20 plants, big bud(fem) from sensi seed, 1 month veg/ 2 months flower.

p.s. Ive been growing under 600w hps and can pull close to a lb per lamp which i was told is pretty good.
Should i expect to meet a 1.5 to 2lb return on a 1000w lamp?
How likely is it to get the full gram per watt on 1000's?

Thanks for any info or tell me i said something wrong anything will help :)

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More yield? Yes
Less Stress? Depends. Personally, I find it less stressful. Just make sure you are leak proof. I only have to check on the setup every few days. I find it much easier to dial in the recipe for the plant. Soil is slow, I don't like the bugs.
Faster nut intake? Depends on your current nut intake. But yes, faster nute uptake.
More efficient? I think it's easier. You need to have the space to set up for it, and it can't matter if that space floods, which restricts you to basements or warehouses a lot.

My last flower run which was RDWC in 5 gallon buckets and 3 1k lights, 16 plants, I broke 9 lbs. That's using the Hortilux Blue Bulb during veg, the first two weeks of flower, and the last two weeks, and Co2 at 1200ppm during lights on. With those plants, you should be able to break 2 lb per.

If it's your first hydro, I would advise, be prepared for the speed. It's crazy fast. So, you have to flip early, because when it hits it's stride in flower, it will often triple in size.

The major mistake I, and most first timers make, is waiting too long to flip. But until you have seen the speed of RDWC, you simply aren't expecting it. I'll top 2, maybe 3 times, let it establish a rhythm and flip. The plant will fill out whatever space you give it, so flip it asap.

SinCity said:

ALMOST FORGOT--hydro leaves much less room for mistakes than soil. Remember you have no soil to retain water. The lack of water from power outages or equipment malfunctions will hit you fast and hard. As long as they are checked in on a couple of times a day, and you are willing to deal with constant calibration of the multiple aspects of hydroponic delivery of water with heavy soluble loads through structures that aerate enough but not too much, etc. etc.--then you'll be amazed at what they'll do for you.

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Sybn said:

I"ve been growing in soil for 4 years now never had any real issues other then a random herm here and there. Id really like to switch up to hydro maybe dwc set up. Is dwc the same as a flood and drain technique ? What are my pros/cons in hydro to soil?

More yeild ?
Less stress?
Faster nut intake ?
More efficient?

I do feel confident with my grow skill to partake this on but i would really like any other input.
Ill be running 3 1000w, roughly 15-20 plants, big bud(fem) from sensi seed, 1 month veg/ 2 months flower.

p.s. Ive been growing under 600w hps and can pull close to a lb per lamp which i was told is pretty good.
Should i expect to meet a 1.5 to 2lb return on a 1000w lamp?
How likely is it to get the full gram per watt on 1000's?

Thanks for any info or tell me i said something wrong anything will help :)

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And Junk brings the runner home! Huge point. I agree with him that DWC is way way way better--Recirculating if at all possible. As you can tell from my last reply, I'm still traumatized from walking in on a stopped ebb and flow system 25 years ago! I'd suggest investing in the Current Culture Under Current system--don't mess around. It will pay for itself in the first rotation. Don't be terrorized by tiny water lines. I'd love to hear Junk's thoughts on container size trade-offs...but I'd get the 13 gallon buckets. Here's why--you're already doing more rotations than in any other growing system, so whether you're sprouting or cloning, you want to max each rotation. Think about it. Your mothers will deplete sooner, your seed supply will dwindle sooner. The time you put in to switching them out will burn you out if you do it too much. And the girls want to show off for you--they'll start to get pissed at you if you don't let them strut. Most of all, larger containers because the roots absolutely explode--and explode fast--and not giving them the root space underutilizes all of the time and resources and love going in to them. Plus, larger containers mean more stable temperatures, which is key to oxygenation. WOULD LOVE OTHERS' EXPERIENCE WITH THIS!

SinCity said:

I'd love to hear Junk's thoughts on container size trade-offs...but I'd get the 13 gallon buckets.

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Growth below the "soil" = growth above the soil. Because hydro is so fast, sometimes you have to base it on the space you have. E.g. I'm in a basement with 7' ceilings, so, 5 gallons are plenty for me....i'll be hitting the lights in no time.

The 5 gallons though are tall. I you have wider, shorter, buckets, you can get away with more.

So if I was in a room with taller ceilings, I'd do larger buckets. Oh, how I would love to.

Hydro is super fast. But to make full use of a 13 gallon bucket, you would need to veg a little longer. Then when you flip, they explode. But with all that room below, the growth above will be massive as well. So, if your ceilings are low, I think it's overkill. If I had 10' ceilings, I'd be in larger buckets.

I would also do UC if I could afford it. I find the setup to be about the same. But just be prepared for huge plants.

I'm in the middle of my first major foray into DWC and RDWC. I started with clones from a friend that were all a mixture of different mediums from cocoa, soil to rock wool. All of them, I needed to strip off the old medium, bringing it down to bare roots which then got planted into the net pots. I'll never do it this way again. You'll be way better off starting from a clone or seeds with roots only than stripping it down. I only really lost one plant - even that one I was able to clone and re-grow - but every single one of them ended up losing a chunk of the root mass in the process. Most of them didn't go into shock, but it was a good week - 2 weeks before the roots came back and made it out of the net pots which equates to a lot squandered resources. Then I also battled root rot from the old, dead roots. If you ARE going with DWC - I would definitely start with a plant that isn't in any medium at all.

FennarioMike said:

I'm in the middle of my first major foray into DWC and RDWC. I started with clones from a friend that were all a mixture of different mediums from cocoa, soil to rock wool. All of them, I needed to strip off the old medium, bringing it down to bare roots which then got planted into the net pots. I'll never do it this way again. You'll be way better off starting from a clone or seeds with roots only than stripping it down. I only really lost one plant - even that one I was able to clone and re-grow - but every single one of them ended up losing a chunk of the root mass in the process. Most of them didn't go into shock, but it was a good week - 2 weeks before the roots came back and made it out of the net pots which equates to a lot squandered resources. Then I also battled root rot from the old, dead roots. If you ARE going with DWC - I would definitely start with a plant that isn't in any medium at all.

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Well, it's easier imo if it's in something that you can just transfer over, like root riot or rock wool. Usually if you plan to use hydro, you will grow out a plant in soil (the mom) to take cuts, to root in a medium, that you can just transfer and set in hydraton like Root Riot cubes or rock wool.

If some were in Rockwool, you don't have to take it out, you can set that right in the net pot/hydraton.

I use root riot cubes personally, but only for cloning. And once you have roots showing, just pop it in the hydraton.

I transferred my clones from coco pots to DWC buckets with hydroton. I just scooped the plants out (they had small rootball) and shook off as much coco as I could. Then placed it on top of a single layer of hydroton in the netpot. Some coco pieces fell thu the first couple days, but nothing major. It was clear after first bucket change

Junk said:

Well, it's easier imo if it's in something that you can just transfer over, like root riot or rock wool. Usually if you plan to use hydro, you will grow out a plant in soil (the mom) to take cuts, to root in a medium, that you can just transfer and set in hydraton like Root Riot cubes or rock wool.

If some were in Rockwool, you don't have to take it out, you can set that right in the net pot/hydraton.

I use root riot cubes personally, but only for cloning. And once you have roots showing, just pop it in the hydraton.

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Yeah, one of the plants I lost, I had put the rock wool too deep and didn't realize that it was keeping the main stem soaked and killed the plant. I had thought it was transplant shock. Yeah, if using rock wool, keep it high in the Hydroton so it doesn't stay soaked.

DWC is also know as Death Without Cause. When I put a plant into flower in soil. It is not going to die because the pumps went down or pH went crazy. Why switch? Spend the money on another light. All you gain is faster veg. Look at all the problems people have hydro.

This post may sound like I'm being a dickhead...I'm not. I'm genuinely just pointing some things out, bc, imo, people are way too afraid of hydro.

jaybodankly said:

DWC is also know as Death Without Cause.

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There is no such thing. Something caused it. If they died, something killed them. Negligence is a cause. Also, DWC and RDWC aren't the same. If you have a single (or singular) DWC buckets, there is no water pump. Just an air pump. And the plant will last a while w/out the air pump. You have to fill the bucket every few days at least, so, you'll notice if the air pump died.

jaybodankly said:

or pH went crazy.

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I have never had my ph go crazy. It's something I always read about, but ime, it only goes crazy when something else is not right. Root rot will cause that (among other things I avoid) but again, that's negligence, or poor planning...whatever. RO water, nutes, mix, PH, and it's done. Water needs to stay 68-70F. But that isn't difficult.

jaybodankly said:

Why switch?

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Faster runs, higher yields, and it's pretty straight forward. Any way is fine...but there are benefits to hydro. For me, it's cheaper. There are also benefits to soil...all soil product I get tastes a little better imo. My product is a lil more potent.

jaybodankly said:

All you gain is faster veg.

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That isn't true, but even if it was, that's significant. I think what you are getting at is that it will veg faster, so the only benefit is being 10-14 days quicker. I get that. But there is a piece of the puzzle you missing.

The plant is vegging faster, because the metabolism is rocking. Now, you are right, it doesn't shorten the flower run, because genetically, you just can't. But that metabolism is hauling during the entire run. So, during flower, the plant is significantly larger and heavier, than a soil version of the same cut. In Hydro, THC on average is higher than soil. In soil, Terpenes on average are higher than hydro.

jaybodankly said:

Look at all the problems people have hydro.

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I think this just a mindset. I could just as well say, "Look at all the people using hydro with no problems." If they can do it, I can do it. Overall, my problems with soil have been greater than my issues with hydro. My biggest problem with hydro was getting used to how fast it is. But I'll take that.

jaybodankly said:

Spend the money on another light.

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You're making the assumption that people aren't already maxed out on light, or their light bill, or space.

In the end, it's like saying which is better, Rap, or Rock. There is no "better." It's just preference. It may not suit your situation, or it may not be your style. But I don't think people should be afraid of it. A single DWC setup is like $50, so, it's not terribly hard to try it.

I don't do it for the plant size or speed or THC. I do it, simply because I find it easier. No mixing soil, no hauling water around (or watering it all). Every few days I just mix up a new batch of nutes. Flushing is very easy too, with no waste of nutes. I find it very easy to dial in the nute recipe, because the reactions are so fast.

I do RDWC, so, I could have 4 plants, or 24. When they need water, I turn on the hose, fill the res and mix the nutes. The only part left is what I consider the fun part...plant training etc. Everything else is done for me, mechanically.

Bottom line, it's just preference. There are benefits to both, but we all value those benefits differently. But saying not to do it because of power outages is silly. If your power is out, your lights aren't on. The plant will be perfectly fine sitting in water for the average power outage. It will be fine for days. The major problems a power outage will cause are your environment and lights. Both of which are a problem no matter which method you use.

Or not to do hydro because of PH. The ph is not difficult to control. Or water temps....also not hard to control. Hydro does rely on more electrical components.

But people talk about the electric as if in soil, when your electric goes out, your lights, fans, heat or AC et al stay on. If your electric is out, you have problems either way.