Defoliation Side By Side - Bushy Plants

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MIMedGrower

MIMedGrower

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In general.
It means the flush is working. If things are going deficient it means they’re running low.
Too early yes I agree. Like I said I would have been feeding at least another week from now then starting a flush. All pistils are still bright white.


I do not agree that stopping nutrients during ripening is helpful in any way.

Feeding what the plants ask for to the end is best in my opinion from many tests.

Only reason to leach pots is if overfed consistantly.
 
Monster762

Monster762

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I do not agree that stopping nutrients during ripening is helpful in any way.

Feeding what the plants ask for to the end is best in my opinion from many tests.

Only reason to leach pots is if overfed consistantly.
I agree that you didn’t read a word I said in my post n just jumped all over the flush part.
 
Monster762

Monster762

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Did i mis understand what you meant by the flush is working?
Yeah I think so but it’s all good. What I meant is the flush is flushing. Not that I think it should have been done this early. But like you said the flush is why there’s deficiencies. That means the flush actually flushed. But I agree and I definately would have fed longer before starting a flush.
 
FatManatee

FatManatee

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The deficiency is because you stopped feeding weeks early. Even if you are foing to “flush” wait until the bud stops growing and begins to ripen. Those are in peak bloom.
By this logic, all plants should be suffering the same deficiency. Only two plants suffer the deficiency. Not to mention, this started long before the flush. I have never experienced this problem before, even with a 3 week flush.

I haven't done EC readings on the soil yet, however they should still be quite high >1.5. Nutrients don't leech out of the soil in 4 days, with two flushes...
 
Monster762

Monster762

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By this logic, all plants should be suffering the same deficiency. Only two plants suffer the deficiency. Not to mention, this started long before the flush. I have never experienced this problem before, even with a 3 week flush.

I haven't done EC readings on the soil yet, however they should still be quite high >1.5. Nutrients don't leech out of the soil in 4 days, with two flushes...
Yeah I’m not seeing anything to worry about. Rock em. I like seeing some loss of color around now too. I’m right on schedule with you. I was holding but I think I’ll be starting flush in couple days.
I can usually leach my soil n force a fade in 2-3 days. I usually put flawless in heavy n let it sit a day then flush flush. Then clean water. They fade to purples n all in a few days. But being I pushed full course meals daily I’m afraid flush gonna take longer. I got pistils turned n slowing uptake already so a little worried. I’m at day 48 and chop these at 55 usually. I’m pushing it. I’ll prob start 2 week flush real soon. N hope my trichs don’t amber n collapse in the process.
 
FatManatee

FatManatee

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I can usually leach my soil n force a fade in 2-3 days. I usually put flawless in heavy n let it sit a day then flush flush. Then clean water.

I never want to flush with too much runoff, as this flushes all the beneficial bacteria and fungi away from the soil, I have been so hard on adding there in the 1st place. I flush with minimal runoff, at the last week I will hose them down with gallons of runoff per pot, just to make sure everything is flushed out :)
 
FatManatee

FatManatee

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Update, week 6, day 40!

Okay guys, you are in for a treat! My new lens arrived and I got some fantastic pictures to share with you. The girls are getting pretty frosty too, and the best trichome production weeks are still up ahead! :D

I also (maybe) figured out why the two plants at the rear are showing deficiencies. As I have tilted the feeding tray to allow the water to drain to the front of the tent for easier collection, the pots at the back have been affected by this the most, leading into uneven watering as the water wants to drain away from the back of the pot. Most likely resulting in the pot drying out unevenly... Definitely need to make some adjustments for the next grow.
 
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FatManatee

FatManatee

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Mini Update, end of week 7
Not much has changed, however there has been a little bulking. 20% of trichomas are milky, most are clear and there's no amber trichs yet.

Attached picture has a side by side comparison with a 400ml bottle.
 
Huuuu
FatManatee

FatManatee

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Update, week 8, day 50

We're finally approaching harvest, as this is my last week before the chop! I'm eagerly awaiting harvest, and the results of this experiment. So far it really does look like the pruned side is gonna win and take the cake home.

I took a picture and counted all the top nodes, control group has 54 main shoots, whilst the pruned side has a total of 72 top nodes, that's a whopping total of 33% increase!! Not to mention that there's a lot healthier small shoots within the lower areas of the foliage :)

So far this experiment has proven, that pruning the fan leaves will result in the lower shoots to stretch out to the top and reach for the light. I would still not call the winner though, as the buds on the control group are quite a lot bigger.

Upload 2019 1 28 21 49 30


Resin production has been ramping up wildly in the past couple of days, I'm now flushing with cold water (5 degrees Celsius), I also added 150 watts of hyper blue LED's, and decreased temperatures by 5*C for both day and night in the hopes of increasing resin production. It seems to be working really well, and I have some candy pictures for you :)

Upload 2019 1 28 21 55 52


Upload 2019 1 28 21 56 9


Right now Amber trichs are about 10-20% depending on the plant, and the weirdest thing is happening! I still have only 20% cloudy trichomes, whilst most of em' are clear. Seems like the plants are skipping straight to amber.... Weird!

Before the chop, I'm planning on keeping the girls in the dark for 48-72 hours and simulate a drought. Should force the plants to use whatever last bits of stored energy they have to give for a smooth smoke. I've also decided to give the girls a dry trim, as I was convinced by a couple of guys that it will give a superior smoke, even though I hear it's a pain in the ass and will give me a lot more work... I'm already cringing thinking about that... :D

Thanks for all the support I've got from you guys! This is a fantastic forum, and I'm so happy that I joined and decided to share this experience with you. I will surely be making much more side by sides in the future. It's nice to feel welcome and have a sense of belonging, especially when growing and cannabis use is not very welcome (or legal for that matter) in the country where I live...

Next full update will be the results and my final thoughts on this experiment.

Oh yeah, and here's a pic of the plants without all the scribbling. Hopefully @MIMedGrower will not be too terrified of the yellowing caused by the 3 week flush... Remember to breathe man, it's all cool ;)
 
ALL
MIMedGrower

MIMedGrower

17,190
438
Update, week 8, day 50

We're finally approaching harvest, as this is my last week before the chop! I'm eagerly awaiting harvest, and the results of this experiment. So far it really does look like the pruned side is gonna win and take the cake home.

I took a picture and counted all the top nodes, control group has 54 main shoots, whilst the pruned side has a total of 72 top nodes, that's a whopping total of 33% increase!! Not to mention that there's a lot healthier small shoots within the lower areas of the foliage :)

So far this experiment has proven, that pruning the fan leaves will result in the lower shoots to stretch out to the top and reach for the light. I would still not call the winner though, as the buds on the control group are quite a lot bigger.

View attachment 854063

Resin production has been ramping up wildly in the past couple of days, I'm now flushing with cold water (5 degrees Celsius), I also added 150 watts of hyper blue LED's, and decreased temperatures by 5*C for both day and night in the hopes of increasing resin production. It seems to be working really well, and I have some candy pictures for you :)

View attachment 854064

View attachment 854065

Right now Amber trichs are about 10-20% depending on the plant, and the weirdest thing is happening! I still have only 20% cloudy trichomes, whilst most of em' are clear. Seems like the plants are skipping straight to amber.... Weird!

Before the chop, I'm planning on keeping the girls in the dark for 48-72 hours and simulate a drought. Should force the plants to use whatever last bits of stored energy they have to give for a smooth smoke. I've also decided to give the girls a dry trim, as I was convinced by a couple of guys that it will give a superior smoke, even though I hear it's a pain in the ass and will give me a lot more work... I'm already cringing thinking about that... :D

Thanks for all the support I've got from you guys! This is a fantastic forum, and I'm so happy that I joined and decided to share this experience with you. I will surely be making much more side by sides in the future. It's nice to feel welcome and have a sense of belonging, especially when growing and cannabis use is not very welcome (or legal for that matter) in the country where I live...

Next full update will be the results and my final thoughts on this experiment.

Oh yeah, and here's a pic of the plants without all the scribbling. Hopefully @MIMedGrower will not be too terrified of the yellowing caused by the 3 week flush... Remember to breathe man, it's all cool ;)


Lol. I gave my opinion based on the results of many tests. I dont think others should automatically do it my way. Many methods work well.

Your garden looks fantastic! But i want to ask. Are you viewing trichomes on the calyx or bud leaves?

Those flowers are still growing. Only half the pistils have matured so far. Weird to have much amber yet.

Really great job man!
 
FatManatee

FatManatee

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Lol. I gave my opinion based on the results of many tests. I dont think others should automatically do it my way. Many methods work well.

Your garden looks fantastic! But i want to ask. Are you viewing trichomes on the calyx or bud leaves?

Those flowers are still growing. Only half the pistils have matured so far. Weird to have much amber yet.

Really great job man!

I'm just pulling your leg man :p
Jokes aside, I'm looking at the trichomes on the calyx's, heard that you should just ignore what's happening to the ones on the sugar leaves, what do you think?

And thanks for the kind words :)
 
MIMedGrower

MIMedGrower

17,190
438
I'm just pulling your leg man :p
Jokes aside, I'm looking at the trichomes on the calyx's, heard that you should just ignore what's happening to the ones on the sugar leaves, what do you think?

And thanks for the kind words :)


Yeah look to the calyx. The bud leaves trichs can mature faster sometimes.
 
FatManatee

FatManatee

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Mini-update

Looks like I'm gonna have to extend flowering time, as the plants did not ripen as fast as I was expecting.
I also realized that I could just tape my loupe to my phone to get more detailed pictures.

What do you guys think, one more week?
 
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bongstar

bongstar

238
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Nice grow, and good work. Defoliation is definitely the way to go if done right at the right time. Old leaves block light air and besides that they are horrible calcium theifs.
 
FatManatee

FatManatee

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THE RESULTS ARE IN!!

This is the time you all have been waiting for, the product has been dried and has started the curing process. Overall I would say the test is a success, and I think I've done a good job at keeping all things equal. However, the results were not what I expected.

And the winner is.... Control group! (no defoliation)

Control group:
Plant 1: 142.5g
Plant 2: 148.0g
Plant 3: 133.0g
Total: 423.5g

Defoliation group:
Plant A: 137.5g
Plant B: 116.5g
Plant C: 130.0g
Total: 384.5g

Total yield 808 grams, 1.56g/w (average power draw during flowering)

Control group also had bigger flowers, less larfy shit, so it was easier to trim and has a better bag appeal.
My conclusion is, pruning plants for increased light penetration (during week 2 flowering) decreases yield. Mind you, this doesn't prove that pruning doesn't work to increase yields, and needs further studying and testing done using different techniques.

Next time I will be conducting a test of the lollipop technique.

Overall, I'm really happy with this grow, I smashed my goal of achieving 1 gram / watt, using my new "quantum board" lights, and I highly recommend these lights to anyone else.

Discuss, argue, point to me what I did wrong, so I can make better testing in the future.
Thanks for sticking with the ride! :)
 
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MeanGreen420

MeanGreen420

628
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THE RESULTS ARE IN!!

This is the time you all have been waiting for, the product has been dried and has started the curing process. Overall I would say the test is a success, and I think I've done a good job at keeping all things equal. However, the results were not what I expected.

And the winner is.... Control group! (no defoliation)

Control group:
Plant 1: 142.5g
Plant 2: 148.0g
Plant 3: 133.0g
Total: 423.5g

Defoliation group:
Plant A: 137.5g
Plant B: 116.5g
Plant C: 130.0g
Total: 384.5g

Total yield 808 grams, 1.56g/w (average power draw during flowering)

Control group also had bigger flowers, less larfy shit, so it was easier to trim and has a better bag appeal.
My conclusion is, pruning plants for increased light penetration (during week 2 flowering) decreases yield. Mind you, this doesn't prove that pruning doesn't work to increase yields, and needs further studying and testing done using different techniques.

Next time I will be conducting a test of the lollipop technique.

Overall, I'm really happy with this grow, I smashed my goal of achieving 1 gram / watt, using my new "quantum board" lights, and I highly recommend these lights to anyone else.

Discuss, argue, point to me what I did wrong, so I can make better testing in the future.
Thanks for sticking with the ride! :)
Awesome job bubba! Get them next ones going!!!
 
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