5'x5' RDWC, 6 vs 9 plants

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Medigrow

Medigrow

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hey all! :)

How many plants would you put in a 5'x5' space? 6 or 9 plants? Going with 9 plants, it would be even from each side but... Can I get enough veg time to fully get the potential of indica strain?
Is 6 plants, having a little bit more veg time is more "mature"? I guess I would get bigger buds going with 9 plants vs 6 in scrog. They won't divide as much...

Any thoughts? Anyone tested it? What was your result?

Thank you!
 
Anthem

Anthem

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hey all! :)

How many plants would you put in a 5'x5' space? 6 or 9 plants? Going with 9 plants, it would be even from each side but... Can I get enough veg time to fully get the potential of indica strain?
Is 6 plants, having a little bit more veg time is more "mature"? I guess I would get bigger buds going with 9 plants vs 6 in scrog. They won't divide as much...

Any thoughts? Anyone tested it? What was your result?

Thank you!
I do not run RDWC but those are too high of plant counts for that size with that growing method. Maybe something like 4 or 5 tops
 
Moe.Red

Moe.Red

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With RDWC and a good farmer, you can grow trees. Like 3"+ diameter stalks.

Using the same system, you can grow many small plants.

So the farmer, the time to flip (assuming photos) the strains, it's all in your hands to decide.

Here's my question tho, if this is R-DWC - what size are your return lines? I use 3" PVC in 13 gal square buckets - all that design and hard stuff means you need to have the plant count worked out and build for that. In that case, 6 plants would be better IMO.

I run a few 4x8s and I can pull 4 pounds out of any tent at any time, but only if I let them get big. Sometimes I don't. It really does depend on what your goals are.

If you are just starting out, I would also recommend all the same strain on the first grow - makes it much easier to tune things. If you go this route actual plant count is sorta irrelevant - it just becomes a question of how large a harvest do you want and how fast do you want it?
 
Moe.Red

Moe.Red

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I do not run RDWC but those are too high of plant counts for that size with that growing method. Maybe something like 4 or 5 tops
It depends on the system. If this is basically a Kratky system, 9 plants (3x3) and an early flip would be fine.

If it is a proper RDWC, with 9 sites the roots would just about be getting wet and you would be forced to flip to flower for size reasons, negating any benefit you get from RDWC.
 
Medigrow

Medigrow

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With RDWC and a good farmer, you can grow trees. Like 3"+ diameter stalks.

Using the same system, you can grow many small plants.

So the farmer, the time to flip (assuming photos) the strains, it's all in your hands to decide.

Here's my question tho, if this is R-DWC - what size are your return lines? I use 3" PVC in 13 gal square buckets - all that design and hard stuff means you need to have the plant count worked out and build for that. In that case, 6 plants would be better IMO.

I run a few 4x8s and I can pull 4 pounds out of any tent at any time, but only if I let them get big. Sometimes I don't. It really does depend on what your goals are.

If you are just starting out, I would also recommend all the same strain on the first grow - makes it much easier to tune things. If you go this route actual plant count is sorta irrelevant - it just becomes a question of how large a harvest do you want and how fast do you want it?

I am already running a 6 sites rdwc... Thing is, they become too big because of the veg time to cover the 5x5... even if I scrog properly.. So I was wondering if I could achieve an easier cycle going with 9 plants. a.k.a LESS work :D And less trim work at the end if bigger buds.
I'm using 2" pipe... I had 1.5" on my first setup and it was clogging like hell so I rebuilt everything to 2" and it's fine since. With 3".. WOW! That should be amazing to see! 13 gal, how long is the veg?

So it's not a "how fast and how much" I want.. It's more a... What would be the more efficient... Easier to work with. They seems to do smaller bud if we split like hell to cover the scrog vs fewer branches... I know the first week is basically stalled plants... They seem to do their root system then they took off... Maybe my starts are bad... Who knows?

It's a pain in the ass to redo the system so I wanted to get some feedback on this before going further :D
 
Moe.Red

Moe.Red

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I am already running a 6 sites rdwc... Thing is, they become too big... even if I scrog properly.. So I was wondering if I could achieve an easier cycle going with 9 plants. a.k.a LESS work :D
I'm using 2" pipe... I had 1.5" on my first setup and it was clogging like hell so I rebuilt everything to 2" and it's fine since. With 3".. WOW! That should be amazing to see! 13 gal, how long is the veg?

So it's not a "how fast and how much" I want.. It's more a... What would be the more efficient... Easier to work with. They seems to do smaller bud if we split like hell to cover the scrog vs fewer branches... I know the first week is basically stalled plants... They seem to do their root system then they took off... Maybe my starts are bad... Who knows?

It's a pain in the ass to redo the system so I wanted to get some feedback on this before going further :D
Yeah man, I hear you. I have some experience to share, but I'm out the door atm so I'll get back to you later tonight.

short version is yes if you want less work more smaller plants is the answer, but then why RDWC? Might as well go with soil in 9 pots.
 
Medigrow

Medigrow

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Yeah man, I hear you. I have some experience to share, but I'm out the door atm so I'll get back to you later tonight.

short version is yes if you want less work more smaller plants is the answer, but then why RDWC? Might as well go with soil in 9 pots.
I hate dirt like hell! RDWC is clean, fast, superb growth! :)
 
Medigrow

Medigrow

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Yes, but where it shines is on trees. So my recommendation is fewer, larger plants with aggressive training.
Yeah trees.. but light doesn't go down that deep. That's why I'm wondering about 9 plants and shorter veg time to get a not so deep canopy. Yeah i know, could flip sooner... But the 5x6 and 6 plants sucks with even space... 😂 Or maybe I have a mental disorder... 😂😂
 
Moe.Red

Moe.Red

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Yeah trees.. but light doesn't go down that deep. That's why I'm wondering about 9 plants and shorter veg time to get a not so deep canopy. Yeah i know, could flip sooner... But the 5x6 and 6 plants sucks with even space... 😂 Or maybe I have a mental disorder... 😂😂
Have you tried any training techniques? I know you said less work but you also want a perfect canopy, soooo...

High PPFD is a requirement to get the benefits of RDWC. Training and the right lights is what you seem to really want.

4 seems like a solid number, and since you have to rebuild I recommend to go with the square buckets and 3" return. I routinely get roots all the way in the res over 6 feet long when in king kong grow mode. 2" will clog if you ever want to push the limits on what your tent will produce.

Gary at PA Hydro sells all the parts.

What lights you running? CO2? AC? Dehuey? Sterile res? Also, what is your tent height? All of these need to be speced to work together. I guess to get on my soap box, unless you intend to push the plants, RDWC is not the best route to go for things like terpenes and some would say end product. You just get so much extra you win via poundage.
 
Medigrow

Medigrow

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Have you tried any training techniques? I know you said less work but you also want a perfect canopy, soooo...

High PPFD is a requirement to get the benefits of RDWC. Training and the right lights is what you seem to really want.

4 seems like a solid number, and since you have to rebuild I recommend to go with the square buckets and 3" return. I routinely get roots all the way in the res over 6 feet long when in king kong grow mode. 2" will clog if you ever want to push the limits on what your tent will produce.

Gary at PA Hydro sells all the parts.

What lights you running? CO2? AC? Dehuey? Sterile res? Also, what is your tent height? All of these need to be speced to work together. I guess to get on my soap box, unless you intend to push the plants, RDWC is not the best route to go for things like terpenes and some would say end product. You just get so much extra you win via poundage.

I am currently doing scrog... I want less trim work (more bigger buds) vs too many mid/small... That's why I was wondering if going with 9 plants vs 6 (less division) would give me a bigger bud size overall so less work to trim. I'm lazy but will have to do what's required ;) I just tend to automate everything...

As for PPFD, I'm all good on this part. DiY leds, 12 strips + 660/730 strips... Yes co2. Yes sterile. Tent height is 10' (space is not an issue)
Dehu, I can control my humidity over all the stages. I'm giving them ~3 to 4 weeks of veg, depending on the strain. 4 gals buckets and the roots at the end are perfect, no clogging, yes they go in the water line but no clogging with the 2".

To clog a 3" return, your veg must be in the 5-6 weeks ?
 
Moe.Red

Moe.Red

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I am currently doing scrog... I want less trim work (more bigger buds) vs too many mid/small... That's why I was wondering if going with 9 plants vs 6 (less division) would give me a bigger bud size overall so less work to trim. I'm lazy but will have to do what's required ;) I just tend to automate everything...

I think it is a pay me now or pay me later proposition. If you trim up the bottoms and end up with just colas (my preferred technique) you are still trimming, just live plant. I have not found a way to automate that, but I do everything that is possible to automate.

I just shot a video of the before and after my first trim 1 week into 12:12 and pulled up the buckets so you can see the roots. I'll upload later.

I am at less than 1 month under lights and my plants are chest high. So a couple days under 3 weeks veg and right at a month total including this stretch phase. I'm pheno hunting unstable genetics, so no idea what to expect from plant size.

As for PPFD, I'm all good on this part. DiY leds, 12 strips + 660/730 strips... Yes co2. Yes sterile. Tent height is 10' (space is not an issue)
Dehu, I can control my humidity over all the stages. I'm giving them ~3 to 4 weeks of veg, depending on the strain. 4 gals buckets and the roots at the end are perfect, no clogging, yes they go in the water line but no clogging with the 2".

Man, with all that and 4 gal buckets? It's like putting a Corvette engine in a Chevette. You will not get proper roots or flow with 4 gals. Its the equivalent of being root bound in dirt.

Also don't recommend sterile.

To clog a 3" return, your veg must be in the 5-6 weeks ?

No way man. 3 weeks max, but flower for up to 16 depending. If you take off the bridal and put in some proper plumbing, 6 weeks of veg on most strains will put you flowering into your 10' ceiling.

Here's some photos I just took until I can get the vid loaded up. These plants will put on a couple feet of colas by the time they are done and I will be looking up at the buds.

IMG 2978
IMG 2979
IMG 2981
IMG 2982
 
Medigrow

Medigrow

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I think it is a pay me now or pay me later proposition. If you trim up the bottoms and end up with just colas (my preferred technique) you are still trimming, just live plant. I have not found a way to automate that, but I do everything that is possible to automate.

I just shot a video of the before and after my first trim 1 week into 12:12 and pulled up the buckets so you can see the roots. I'll upload later.

I am at less than 1 month under lights and my plants are chest high. So a couple days under 3 weeks veg and right at a month total including this stretch phase. I'm pheno hunting unstable genetics, so no idea what to expect from plant size.



Man, with all that and 4 gal buckets? It's like putting a Corvette engine in a Chevette. You will not get proper roots or flow with 4 gals. Its the equivalent of being root bound in dirt.

Also don't recommend sterile.



No way man. 3 weeks max, but flower for up to 16 depending. If you take off the bridal and put in some proper plumbing, 6 weeks of veg on most strains will put you flowering into your 10' ceiling.

Here's some photos I just took until I can get the vid loaded up. These plants will put on a couple feet of colas by the time they are done and I will be looking up at the buds.

View attachment 1169208 View attachment 1169209 View attachment 1169210 View attachment 1169211
nice and clean setup! :)

I found that with the 4 gals, they are doing fine... I never tried bigger buckets though but yeah, at the end, I get some nice root ball in there but I don't feel like I am limiting their growth/fruits size.

Really nice plumbing, with the waterfall type. I'm passing through the bucket for water cycling... I guess it's more "gentle" on the roots your way, with a 3" pipe, gentle flow plus the air pump.
As for the yield, I really can't complain... And the Corvette in the chevette, I like it! insurances are less expensive! :DDD But seems if I pass the 950-1000 PAR, I get a lot of foxtails, so i'm unsure if it's because of high PPFD or too much nitrogen... Co2 at 1400-1500. Temp 84, Humidity 55%... I will raise my temp next run, bumping it 2-3F higher and see how it goes.

I could try bigger bucket on 2 plants and see how they react vs the 4 gals... Or change everything... 9 vs 6 vs 6 and bigger pipe/buckets....

Anxious to see the video! :)

I'm not in the US so... PA hydroponics would be a killer price to go that way.
 
Moe.Red

Moe.Red

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nice and clean setup! :)

I found that with the 4 gals, they are doing fine... I never tried bigger buckets though but yeah, at the end, I get some nice root ball in there but I don't feel like I am limiting their growth/fruits size.

Really nice plumbing, with the waterfall type. I'm passing through the bucket for water cycling... I guess it's more "gentle" on the roots your way, with a 3" pipe, gentle flow plus the air pump.
As for the yield, I really can't complain... And the Corvette in the chevette, I like it! insurances are less expensive! :DDD But seems if I pass the 950-1000 PAR, I get a lot of foxtails, so i'm unsure if it's because of high PPFD or too much nitrogen... Co2 at 1400-1500. Temp 84, Humidity 55%... I will raise my temp next run, bumping it 2-3F higher and see how it goes.

I could try bigger bucket on 2 plants and see how they react vs the 4 gals... Or change everything... 9 vs 6 vs 6 and bigger pipe/buckets....

Anxious to see the video! :)

I'm not in the US so... PA hydroponics would be a killer price to go that way.
Sorry I need to get that video up for you, I promise I'll make it a point this weekend.

As far as the 4 gallon pots, from where I stand that is what stands between you and achieving the next level. I would recommend that if you can you try at least one bigger bucket to try it. Here in the US they sell kitty litter and foodstuffs in the 13 gal square pails, maybe you have something similar? Square sure makes the plumbing easier and more reliable.

Screen Shot 2021 09 17 at 31553 PM


As far as foxtails go, that can be a lot of things. How did you measure PPFD on your DIY lights?
 

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