Advantage of using old-school HPS/MH over LED

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Buzzzz

Buzzzz

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I run my veg tent 24/0 and that particular led puts out a lot of heat, so I’ll exhaust from my veg tent into my flower tent to keep the temps up over winter (at least that’s my plan lol)
I do that too,i have the thermostat in the flowering room to turn the fan on.
 
Mikedin

Mikedin

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I do that too,i have the thermostat in the flowering room to turn the fan on.
I run my fans on all the time I’ll have to increase airflow into the tent though because I have a SF 6” exhaust in the flower tent and a SF 4” in the veg tent and I’ll have to push air about 15’ from the veg to flower tent, all ready to set it up when needed
 
Buzzzz

Buzzzz

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I run my fans on all the time I’ll have to increase airflow into the tent though because I have a SF 6” exhaust in the flower tent and a SF 4” in the veg tent and I’ll have to push air about 15’ from the veg to flower tent, all ready to set it up when needed
You might be able to make up the hole size with foam and tape. I veg 20/4 and flower at night, I put one of those portable oil filled heaters in the room too,along with the ballasts ,we get cold windy winters in the country and I have an old house but I can't make the plants suffer,the way I judge it is if it's uncomfortable to me,it is to them too.
 
Mikedin

Mikedin

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You might be able to make up the hole size with foam and tape. I veg 20/4 and flower at night, I put one of those portable oil filled heaters in the room too,along with the ballasts ,we get cold windy winters in the country and I have an old house but I can't make the plants suffer,the way I judge it is if it's uncomfortable to me,it is to them too.
Lol yep I have a log home and we heat with 2 wood stoves in the winter but we don’t run the basement one at night, too much for my wife to keep up with alone when I’m working midnights, plus the upstairs one will keep the main floor at about 80f with 2x logs every 3 hours or so but we let the basement one go out at night so the basement gets pretty cold at night (55-65f) I sleep in a spare bedroom down there so I can get some sleep with the kids running around all day and the veg tent is in that room so it’s always warm haha, then right on the other side of the wall is the flower tent, I already have the 4” hole through one of the floor joists so I can jump from one room to the next, I’m gunna do aluminum ductwork instead of flex pipe though to go between tents then air exhausted from the flower tent will go into my crawl space that runs under all the bedrooms lol so free extra heat.

We do have a brand new furnace just had it installed, but why pay for heat when I can burn wood I have out back anyways.

I could also throw the dehumidifier in there for extra heat if I need to get the RH down it’s a 50 pint dehu and it puts out a fair amount of warm air
 
Mikedin

Mikedin

624
143
You might be able to make up the hole size with foam and tape. I veg 20/4 and flower at night, I put one of those portable oil filled heaters in the room too,along with the ballasts ,we get cold windy winters in the country and I have an old house but I can't make the plants suffer,the way I judge it is if it's uncomfortable to me,it is to them too.
I’ll tell ya this stove, if I want, will get the whole main floor of the house get up to 87f when it’s 0f outside with about 4 good logs lol
 
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Buzzzz

Buzzzz

1,135
163
Lol yep I have a log home and we heat with 2 wood stoves in the winter but we don’t run the basement one at night, too much for my wife to keep up with alone when I’m working midnights, plus the upstairs one will keep the main floor at about 80f with 2x logs every 3 hours or so but we let the basement one go out at night so the basement gets pretty cold at night (55-65f) I sleep in a spare bedroom down there so I can get some sleep with the kids running around all day and the veg tent is in that room so it’s always warm haha, then right on the other side of the wall is the flower tent, I already have the 4” hole through one of the floor joists so I can jump from one room to the next, I’m gunna do aluminum ductwork instead of flex pipe though to go between tents then air exhausted from the flower tent will go into my crawl space that runs under all the bedrooms lol so free extra heat.

We do have a brand new furnace just had it installed, but why pay for heat when I can burn wood I have out back anyways.

I could also throw the dehumidifier in there for extra heat if I need to get the RH down it’s a 50 pint dehu and it puts out a fair amount of warm air
It's well worth it when your all set up,never have to buy weed again or worry about someone putting insectide on it or hit and miss when you buy.
 
Mikedin

Mikedin

624
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It's well worth it when your all set up,never have to buy weed again or worry about someone putting insectide on it or hit and miss when you buy.
Yep now I’m just hunting the genetics I want lol just dropped a Barney’s farm cookies kush fem, gunna veg her out a but and then takes clones off her for the next run, the 6 autos in my tent now I figure have another 60 days judging off the last run same strains except one that I added I’m hoping g to have some clones rooted before they finish but have never started from a mother before so timeline wise I’m lost, how long from seed to being able to take clones then root then veg till flower lol got a lot of learning to do
 
Buzzzz

Buzzzz

1,135
163
Yep now I’m just hunting the genetics I want lol just dropped a Barney’s farm cookies kush fem, gunna veg her out a but and then takes clones off her for the next run, the 6 autos in my tent now I figure have another 60 days judging off the last run same strains except one that I added I’m hoping g to have some clones rooted before they finish but have never started from a mother before so timeline wise I’m lost, how long from seed to being able to take clones then root then veg till flower lol got a lot of learning to do
Well i wait till the mother shows her sex and goes into alternate phylotaxy,around 3 months depending on the strain and growing conditions.
 
Mikedin

Mikedin

624
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Well i wait till the mother shows her sex and goes into alternate phylotaxy,around 3 months depending on the strain and growing conditions.
I can work with that, I have a few clones started in the veg tent if they root (my first time) if they do I’ll have 6x photos to run there a Congo strain my brother in law got his hands on I nabbed a few clones of it , Cinderella 99 from his clone buddy and a few other unknown strains I only can only judge off his outdoor plants (he knows they are popular strains but can’t remember which is which lol) that look pretty damn good already but are monsters, I’ll probably do multiple toppings and possibly build a scrog setup
 
Buzzzz

Buzzzz

1,135
163
I can work with that, I have a few clones started in the veg tent if they root (my first time) if they do I’ll have 6x photos to run there a Congo strain my brother in law got his hands on I nabbed a few clones of it , Cinderella 99 from his clone buddy and a few other unknown strains I only can only judge off his outdoor plants (he knows they are popular strains but can’t remember which is which lol) that look pretty damn good already but are monsters, I’ll probably do multiple toppings and possibly build a scrog setup
Nice,make sure you check them for mites before bringing them in or better yet,treat them.
 
Mikedin

Mikedin

624
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Nice,make sure you check them for mites before bringing them in or better yet,treat them.
Oh yeah I went over them with the microscope and they are currently in the veg tent for the past 2 weeks and no signs of any bugs, they’ll be in the veg tent for at least another month to 2 months so I’ll keep an eye on them I have captain jacks dead bug if needed I’m making an attempt at living soil so trying to be careful what I use trying to stay organic but I’m willing to do whats needed if needed along the run. If I can stay organic and get good results I’m happy, Once I upgrade from tent to room and add co2 etc I’m more than happy with where I’m currently at
 
RootsRuler

RootsRuler

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LEDs can perform as well or better than HPS. But just about every large operation you see is going to have 1000 watt double ended HPS. Why? It is really two or three different things.
#1 the person running the grows (AKA) master grower is scared to death of LEDS, because of the additional nutrient requirements of LEDs. Remember if the plants look like shit the master grower looks like shit. So LEDS suck is going to be his comment
#2. If the boss forces the change to LEDS the master grower and his crew will be working their asses off defoliating the plants because you have to be more diligent with this under LEDS.
#3. The Master Grower is going to bitch like an old lady about the work until the boss fires him or goes back to HPS
#4. HPS penetrates further into the canopy and allows for less work by the grow team
#5. Let’s say the boss goes ahead and changes to LEDS, plants start getting sick. Master Grower blames it on a bad batch of nutrients. Nutrient sales rep gets called in. He would also pop pop LEDS.

Having ran both HPS and LEDS. LEDS are harder to manage. HPS you can just run basic nutrients and that is that.
IIRC, last year Cali required all commercial growers to use ONLY LED lights. They also have banned most outdoor commercial grows unless it is in a secured greenhouse.
 
H

hydrodreams

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[.....]
#2. If the boss forces the change to LEDS the master grower and his crew will be working their asses off defoliating the plants because you have to be more diligent with this under LEDS.
[.....]
#4. HPS penetrates further into the canopy and allows for less work by the grow team
[.....]
Is it known which exact technical detail causes LED not to have the same penetration like HPS? How likely is it that the manufacturers will be able to overcome this?
 
strider26554

strider26554

166
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LEDs can perform as well or better than HPS. But just about every large operation you see is going to have 1000 watt double ended HPS. Why? It is really two or three different things.
#1 the person running the grows (AKA) master grower is scared to death of LEDS, because of the additional nutrient requirements of LEDs. Remember if the plants look like shit the master grower looks like shit. So LEDS suck is going to be his comment
#2. If the boss forces the change to LEDS the master grower and his crew will be working their asses off defoliating the plants because you have to be more diligent with this under LEDS.
#3. The Master Grower is going to bitch like an old lady about the work until the boss fires him or goes back to HPS
#4. HPS penetrates further into the canopy and allows for less work by the grow team
#5. Let’s say the boss goes ahead and changes to LEDS, plants start getting sick. Master Grower blames it on a bad batch of nutrients. Nutrient sales rep gets called in. He would also pop pop LEDS.

Having ran both HPS and LEDS. LEDS are harder to manage. HPS you can just run basic nutrients and that is that.
Im going to have to disagree with the concept that led lighting requires a more advance knowledge of the nutrient needs of marijuana plants or that led lights require more work for the growers and tenders, there are some advantages to both systems and they are vastly different in terms of light colors heat signature and light output, but just growers have to adapt to the weather when growing outdoors in many different climates the difference between the two lighting systems is minimal in comparison. I think the reason many growers shy away from led is simply nostalgia and habits, we are creatures of habit by design, if something isn't broken why fix it? the big led light industry would like for everyone to believe that more is possible under their grow lights and in some cases may be correct but as a blanket statement that simply isnt true. and I have grown small private grows using both systems and there is a difference, but nothing a competent grower cant over come. The big picture of lighting comes more into focus when one attempts to grow say a cantalope to fully ripe under either system, the leds just dont do it. its is the abundance of light that come from the cmh and hps lighting systems that make them preferable, yes you can grow weed in the shade, but it takes longer you'll have more problems and is more expensive in the long run. growers not just master growers but growers overall would prefer to remain comfortably in the chair they have chosen,,rather than get up walk around and attempt to find a comfortable chair. it is just in our nature to be this way.
 
Anthem

Anthem

3,820
263
Im going to have to disagree with the concept that led lighting requires a more advance knowledge of the nutrient needs of marijuana plants or that led lights require more work for the growers and tenders, there are some advantages to both systems and they are vastly different in terms of light colors heat signature and light output, but just growers have to adapt to the weather when growing outdoors in many different climates the difference between the two lighting systems is minimal in comparison. I think the reason many growers shy away from led is simply nostalgia and habits, we are creatures of habit by design, if something isn't broken why fix it? the big led light industry would like for everyone to believe that more is possible under their grow lights and in some cases may be correct but as a blanket statement that simply isnt true. and I have grown small private grows using both systems and there is a difference, but nothing a competent grower cant over come. The big picture of lighting comes more into focus when one attempts to grow say a cantalope to fully ripe under either system, the leds just dont do it. its is the abundance of light that come from the cmh and hps lighting systems that make them preferable, yes you can grow weed in the shade, but it takes longer you'll have more problems and is more expensive in the long run. growers not just master growers but growers overall would prefer to remain comfortably in the chair they have chosen,,rather than get up walk around and attempt to find a comfortable chair. it is just in our nature to be this way.
Sorry but your last couple of sentences pretty much sum out why most of these rec places are using HPS. Comfort level. And while I have grown under both LED and HPS. I completely disagree. Nearly every nutrient company has designed their formulas for use under HPS. You cannot take those nutrient schedules and apply them to the Commercial LED lights and expect the same results.
 
Anthem

Anthem

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263
IIRC, last year Cali required all commercial growers to use ONLY LED lights. They also have banned most outdoor commercial grows unless it is in a secured greenhouse.
Cali is still draft such mandates. It is not in effect as of today. Cali cannot just banned outdoor grows a good percentage of the licenses on record are outdoor grows. Just not sure how many are using them these days
 
Habosabin

Habosabin

953
143
I guess it can be familiarity, but i'm seeing new growers starting off with HID, and I don't get it. Seems too many pros with LEDs, lower initial cost, efficiency, lower heat, longer life time.
I'm a new grower and didn't once consider using HID. Just curious why new people start with it.
If watts weren't an issue I'd love to try cmh. Spectrum supposed to be as close to sun than other lights.
 
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