Calmag deficiency? Or nutrient burn?

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Fro5ty

Fro5ty

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It’s hydroponics. Day 33 of flower. pH dropped the last 24h with 0.1 to 5.7. EC was stable at 0.8 for whole 5 days since last water change. I laid down on nutrients because I thought I had nutrient burn. But it has gotten worse and keeps getting worse by the day.

I’m at a loss here. I do have N tox. So I gave less calmag last water change (has N in it) and laid down on N in the main nutrients too. (GHE tripart grow:micro:bloom at 0.7:1:3 + 0.7 part calmag)

000F215B 588C 4CCB 97FE B5C52F6D98BB
6A6B09C3 25C1 47BF B11E EB02EC1D8D13

CB166BBE 2875 438C 833F 4F8E752300CC
A8611D7E 2A7E 4F2D 89CE D2AC1A758794
679EBBB4 95B6 412E ACCB 0907214D93AF
 
T

TryingToGrow

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What is pH and e.c. of medium? What nutes? what growing medium? How did you figure out you have N tox?

If pH and e.c. was off prior and you just fixed, it will take the plants some time to recover since it seems the problem has been going on for some while, judging by the looks of the plants. pH rising or dropping out of range is not good
 
Fro5ty

Fro5ty

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What is pH and e.c. of medium? What nutes? what growing medium? How did you figure out you have N tox?

If pH and e.c. was off prior and you just fixed, it will take the plants some time to recover since it seems the problem has been going on for some while, judging by the looks of the plants. pH rising or dropping out of range is not good
I just recalibrated my pH and EC pen. It was off by 0.5(!) pH. I kept it at 6.0. So it was really 5.5. It increased to 5.7 in the last 3 days. The tank that feeds the RdWC around 25L a day is at 6.0pH and 0.6EC. EC in RDWC decreased from 0.8 to 0.7 and is now back at 0.8.

nutrients are GH tripart. The waterchange before I left calmag out for once because I had a different problem on the lower leafs that didn’t improve by adding calmag. And because of the N tox, I chose to leave the calmag out for once. This last waterchange I added it back but the rust and burning keeps spreading.

i know I have N tox because of the dark green color of the leafs and some are very slim.

first time grower. But the last weeks I was able to keep pH stable. I now just leave my watertank as full as possible. Add new water everyday. So when there is a waterchange, most water has already settled.

the last waterchange I gave GH tripart (grow:micro:bloom) at 0:1:3 and 0,7 part calmag at 0.8EC. My watertank of 260L only had 50L left and then I added new water and added new nutes now with 0.7:1:3 and again 0.7calmag. Also added Hydroguard and pro-bloom. Roots look fine. I have some curling on some leafs too.

i’m going to change the water tomorrow.
 
T

TryingToGrow

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I just recalibrated my pH and EC pen. It was off by 0.5(!) pH. I kept it at 6.0. So it was really 5.5. It increased to 5.7 in the last 3 days. The tank that feeds the RdWC around 25L a day is at 6.0pH and 0.6EC. EC in RDWC decreased from 0.8 to 0.7 and is now back at 0.8.

nutrients are GH tripart. The waterchange before I left calmag out for once because I had a different problem on the lower leafs that didn’t improve by adding calmag. And because of the N tox, I chose to leave the calmag out for once. This last waterchange I added it back but the rust and burning keeps spreading.

i know I have N tox because of the dark green color of the leafs and some are very slim.

first time grower. But the last weeks I was able to keep pH stable. I now just leave my watertank as full as possible. Add new water everyday. So when there is a waterchange, most water has already settled.

the last waterchange I gave GH tripart (grow:micro:bloom) at 0:1:3 and 0,7 part calmag at 0.8EC. My watertank of 260L only had 50L left and then I added new water and added new nutes now with 0.7:1:3 and again 0.7calmag. Also added Hydroguard and pro-bloom. Roots look fine. I have some curling on some leafs too.

i’m going to change the water tomorrow.
Sounds like you got it figured out, that's great.

Enjoy the trees
 
Fro5ty

Fro5ty

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Sounds like you got it figured out, that's great.

Enjoy the trees
When I say “just calibrated” I really mean 3 days ago. And the problem kept worsening. Some stems got red from stress to. Overall the plants look good. But I still have 4-5 weeks to go and am afraid it will get worse.
 
T

TryingToGrow

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When I say “just calibrated” I really mean 3 days ago. And the problem kept worsening. Some stems got red from stress to. Overall the plants look good. But I still have 4-5 weeks to go and am afraid it will get worse.

For sure, it takes a while to stop getting worse and then start growing again. Sometime they never really come back and looking at your plants, they are nearly at that point. I think you may have caught it just in time, if you did catch it just in time.

I've just tossed many plants at earlier stages when I messed up pH bad enough because they never really grow nearly as well as they could have and sometimes they just die anyways, not worth the effort.

Some say just the act of moving the pH of the medium to much in a short period of time is enough to 'stress' the plant. Whatever that means or does, I have no idea.

I and some others have diagnosed this as Nitrogen Toxicity.

I would guess if an excess of N only because pH is locking out other nutes that will allow the plant to grow properly. I think you need to send it to a lab to actually be able to 'see' what is going in in the plant tissue. Maybe they have home test kits by now. I think with any decently balanced nutes for cannabis and pH good, it would be difficult to have excess or deficiency.
 
Fro5ty

Fro5ty

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Whe
For sure, it takes a while to stop getting worse and then start growing again. Sometime they never really come back and looking at your plants, they are nearly at that point. I think you may have caught it just in time, if you did catch it just in time.

I've just tossed many plants at earlier stages when I messed up pH bad enough because they never really grow nearly as well as they could have and sometimes they just die anyways, not worth the effort.

Some say just the act of moving the pH of the medium to much in a short period of time is enough to 'stress' the plant. Whatever that means or does, I have no idea.



I would guess if an excess of N only because pH is locking out other nutes that will allow the plant to grow properly. I think you need to send it to a lab to actually be able to 'see' what is going in in the plant tissue. Maybe they have home test kits by now. I think with any decently balanced nutes for cannabis and pH good, it would be difficult to have excess or deficiency.
When you say “not comming back”, do you mean it will get worse and I will spoil this harvest? I’m letting settle the new water at 0.9EC and getting the pH down to 5.7 (will see when it has settled tomorrow). I added 170L of new water in the tank in the last couple of days so I added 100ml of calmag(6%N, 5%Cal, 12Mag), 50ml of micro (5-0-1), 30ml of grow (3-1-6) and 100ml of bloom (0-5-4). I’m changing the water tomorrow.

I assume more is at hand then pH. The bottom leafs and N tox are a problem since week 2 of grow. The rust spots are a new problem. And it indeed looks like K deficiency like someone else suggested.
 
jguit

jguit

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It does look a bit like a Calcium issue but it's hard to say from the pics. Are you seeing those brown rust color spots only on the top leaves closest to the light? If this is the case and you're using LEDs, back you light off a little bit. If this is not the case, ignore my message.

What they meant by 'not coming back' is that the leaves that are damaged will not repair themselves. If you get a handle on the problem, you'll be fine.
 
mysticepipedon

mysticepipedon

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Those few downward curling leaves may be from a little too much N, but this is not a pervasive condition all over the plant (or plants).

As with other symptoms, the leaves never uncurl. You know it's no longer a problem when normal, uncurled leaves grow above the curled ones.

Phosphorus can interfere with both Ca and K, so if there's recently been a boost, in P, that might be part of the problem.
 
Fro5ty

Fro5ty

161
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It does look a bit like a Calcium issue but it's hard to say from the pics. Are you seeing those brown rust color spots only on the top leaves closest to the light? If this is the case and you're using LEDs, back you light off a little bit. If this is not the case, ignore my message.

What they meant by 'not coming back' is that the leaves that are damaged will not repair themselves. If you get a handle on the problem, you'll be fine.

I was told N was mobile and the dark complexion should improve on the existing leafs. I'm well in to flower. I think they don't make any more new leafs.
 
Fro5ty

Fro5ty

161
43
Those few downward curling leaves may be from a little too much N, but this is not a pervasive condition all over the plant (or plants).

As with other symptoms, the leaves never uncurl. You know it's no longer a problem when normal, uncurled leaves grow above the curled ones.

Phosphorus can interfere with both Ca and K, so if there's recently been a boost, in P, that might be part of the problem.
I don’t think they are making new leafs now. They just focus on the buds, which I see grow day by day. I just hope they all get dense. It's day 33 and I was hoping on bigger kolas already.
 
mysticepipedon

mysticepipedon

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The leaves that stick out of the buds/colas will react to too much N by curling, too.
 
jguit

jguit

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What kind of light are you using and how close is it to the canopy? Also, is it dimmed or full blast? I'm assuming you're using LED lighting. All sorts of funky nutritional problems can be caused by too much light. With LEDs sometimes a little bit less is more, especially if you dont have a PAR meter to take a light reading. A lot of my issues when first using LEDs was using way too much light. Dimmers can be a blessing and a curse.
 
Moshmen

Moshmen

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I was told N was mobile and the dark complexion should improve on the existing leafs. I'm well in to flower. I think they don't make any more new leafs.
They will produce new foliage look at some of the guys who defoliate at flip and mid flower - they def will produce leaf
 
Fro5ty

Fro5ty

161
43
It does look a bit like a Calcium issue but it's hard to say from the pics. Are you seeing those brown rust color spots only on the top leaves closest to the light? If this is the case and you're using LEDs, back you light off a little bit. If this is not the case, ignore my message.

What they meant by 'not coming back' is that the leaves that are damaged will not repair themselves. If you get a handle on the problem, you'll be fine.
The leafs with the brown spots of the first photo's are only on one of the top branches. The branch in question isn't the one that's closest to the light. There are others that are closer. The closest is like 3-4 inches from the light, but she doesn't seem to mind it. Here is a video of the closest one. Video is like a week old now.

https://invalid.com/a/e4IlzgP

Its the second video.
 
Fro5ty

Fro5ty

161
43
What kind of light are you using and how close is it to the canopy? Also, is it dimmed or full blast? I'm assuming you're using LED lighting. All sorts of funky nutritional problems can be caused by too much light. With LEDs sometimes a little bit less is more, especially if you dont have a PAR meter to take a light reading. A lot of my issues when first using LEDs was using way too much light. Dimmers can be a blessing and a curse.

The branches that show N tox aren't yhe ones closest to the light. Some of the leafs that show N tox aren't even at the top. It looks to be just here and there. I would say that I have 10 branches that are like 4-5 inches from the light. Lights are on full blast since 1 week after flipping them. And again, I had N tox since week 2 of the grow. I started to think I was over feeding them, so i dropped EC down. Now EC doesn't go higher then 0.9 (which is pretty low for this stafe if you ask me)

https://invalid.com/a/e4IlzgP
 
Fro5ty

Fro5ty

161
43
Apparently the website doesn't let me post links. Here it is again. You'll have to delete the space tho

https://img ur.com/a/e4IlzgP
 

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