Dark Green, Clawing leaves, bone dry soil

[Ind]

These plants are about a month old or so (I haven't really been keeping track). I transplanted them two weeks ago. The soil is a mixture of buffered coco coir, ocean forest, perlite, worm castings, and Down To Earth's 4-4-4 dry amendment. There's also some Recharge in there. I watered them 1 week ago with a relatively small amount, didn't even drip out of the bottom. The water was PHed to 6.1, added some cal/mag and silica to the water as well as a drop of Molasses. PPM was less than 200. I'm guessing it's nitrogen toxicity, or nute lock out or something. But I know the usual answer will be overwatering. They feel bone dry to me, super light, bottoms are dry, and top inch of soil is dry. Wondering if I should flush them and see what the PPM meter says of the run off, or keep letting them dry out even more. There is new growth since I topped, but as you can see even the new growth looks droopy.

 

[Moshmen]

Learn to water correctly is the first step https://www.thcfarmer.com/threads/how-to-water-coco-for-best-results.122334/page-63#post-2894485

 

[TSD]

If the soil is bone dry, why aren't you watering?

 

[Moshmen]

If the soil is bone dry, why aren't you watering?

He’s in a coco mix so it’s even worse! Never let coco dry out toxic for sure

 

[Ind]

If the soil is bone dry, why aren't you watering?

Because I'm used to making that mistake, overwatering when something is wrong. But I forgot about coco coir needing to be watered more often.

 

[Ind]

He’s in a coco mix so it’s even worse! Never let coco dry out toxic for sure

How is it "toxic" to let coco coir dry out?

 

[PipeCarver]

These plants are about a month old or so (I haven't really been keeping track). I transplanted them two weeks ago. The soil is a mixture of buffered coco coir, ocean forest, perlite, worm castings, and Down To Earth's 4-4-4 dry amendment. There's also some Recharge in there. I watered them 1 week ago with a relatively small amount, didn't even drip out of the bottom. The water was PHed to 6.1, added some cal/mag and silica to the water as well as a drop of Molasses. PPM was less than 200. I'm guessing it's nitrogen toxicity, or nute lock out or something. But I know the usual answer will be overwatering. They feel bone dry to me, super light, bottoms are dry, and top inch of soil is dry. Wondering if I should flush them and see what the PPM meter says of the run off, or keep letting them dry out even more. There is new growth since I topped, but as you can see even the new growth looks droopy.


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Hey, watering practices are a common problem....Letting those small plants sit in a 100 gallon pot of water for 10 minutes then removing and let dry wouldn't be over watering but 1/4 cup a day is.....


OOOps Coco...just forget I spoke I use a peat soil

 

[Ind]

Hey, watering practices are a common problem....Letting those small plants sit in a 100 gallon pot of water for 10 minutes then removing and let dry wouldn't be over watering but 1/4 cup a day is.....


OOOps Coco...just forget I spoke I use a peat soil

I don't understand what you said about 100 gallon pot and 1/4 cup a day. What?

 

[Ind]

I just ran some 6.0 water through one of them and measured the PPM run off. It is 1200+. Is that bad? Normal?

 

[Moshmen]

How is it "toxic" to let coco coir dry out?

All the salt build up next time you water will be releasesesd always water to run off at least once a day right now if it starts to dry go to twice a day - don’t worry about overwatering coco it’s hard to do

 

[PipeCarver]

I just ran some 6.0 water through one of them and measured the PPM run off. It is 1200+. Is that bad? Normal?

I was trying to say a lot of water all at once is not over watering.....watering a small bit a day is....but Coco needs to be damp all the time and I do not use it I use a peat based soil called Promix ............Its all I know well, Coco has different needs.

 

[Moshmen]

I don't understand what you said about 100 gallon pot and 1/4 cup a day. What?

He was referring to soil

 

[TSD]

I don't understand what you said about 100 gallon pot and 1/4 cup a day. What?

Overwatering is usually watering too frequently, not watering too much. Coco is a different animal though.

 

[Ind]

Thanks for the help everyone. Do you think I should water with cal/mag + silica + molasses + hydroguard? I have those on hand.....or should I just use regular pHed water? As I said before, I do have 4-4-4 dry amendments in there already......I know its weird, because when I strated this particular grow I wanted to follow Dr. Coco's strategy but then realized half way into it I would be using liquid nutrients which I absolutely hate dealing with. My plan is to move them all outside into the ground once the weather is warm enough because all my plants do very well outdoors and it's so much less stressful for me. pHing water and nutes and all that makes me want to pull my hair out. So, by adding Ocean Forest, worm castings and Recharge and 4-4-4, I was trying to create a soil involving coco coir rather than relying on just coco coir and liquid nutes.

 

[TSD]

Thanks for the help everyone. Do you think I should water with cal/mag + silica + molasses + hydroguard? I have those on hand.....or should I just use regular pHed water? As I said before, I do have 4-4-4 dry amendments in there already......I know its weird, because when I strated this particular grow I wanted to follow Dr. Coco's strategy but then realized half way into it I would be using liquid nutrients which I absolutely hate dealing with. My plan is to move them all outside into the ground once the weather is warm enough because all my plants do very well outdoors and it's so much less stressful for me. pHing water and nutes and all that makes me want to pull my hair out. So, by adding Ocean Forest, worm castings and Recharge and 4-4-4, I was trying to create a soil involving coco coir rather than relying on just coco coir and liquid nutes.

Yeah outdoor is my jam too... you might have made it more difficult by trying to mix methods. I know some people do it... what percentage would you say is coco... you might need to treat it more like soil depends on the ratio.

 

[N1ghtL1ght]

To handwater a cocosmix will also impose much more work than soil, in my opinion cocos is perfect for automated water systems. I'm not familiar with Down to earth but your plants need Ca & Mg as well as NPK so you gotta take care that this is the case. Usually when making a mix onyour own, you'd be well advised to care about this beforeahead and esp. check the substrates pH and use a calcium carbonate lime to set it right (if too acidic). You also need to weigh any fertilizer ammendments carefully to not overstep a certain salinity. There's methods, like the 1:5 method that you can perform at home using RO water that will give you a bit of an idea how sharp your mix is. Drain EC can be imprecise given the amount of water can dillute what the numbers show and after all, you gotta know what the root encounters within the substrate.

 

[Ind]

Yeah outdoor is my jam too... you might have made it more difficult by trying to mix methods. I know some people do it... what percentage would you say is coco... you might need to treat it more like soil depends on the ratio.

I think it's about 40% buffered coco coir and perlite, 40% Ocean Forest, and 10% worm castings. Something like that.

 

[Ind]

To handwater a cocosmix will also impose much more work than soil, in my opinion cocos is perfect for automated water systems. I'm not familiar with Down to earth but your plants need Ca & Mg as well as NPK so you gotta take care that this is the case. Usually when making a mix onyour own, you'd be well advised to care about this beforeahead and esp. check the substrates pH and use a calcium carbonate lime to set it right (if too acidic). You also need to weigh any fertilizer ammendments carefully to not overstep a certain salinity. There's methods, like the 1:5 method that you can perform at home using RO water that will give you a bit of an idea how sharp your mix is. Drain EC can be difficult given the amount of water can dillute what the numbers show and after all, you gotta know what the root encounters within the substrate

That's very complex for a newb like me. Not sure what to do with that information. Obviously it's too late to change what they're already growing in. It sounds like you would advise adding cal/mag etc. to my water before watering. Because the "soil" I made already has 4-4-4 in it, I don't want to add too much nutes for fear of burning them.

 

[TSD]

That's very complex for a newb like me. Not sure what to do with that information. Obviously it's too late to change what they're already growing in. It sounds like you would advise adding cal/mag etc. to my water before watering. Because the "soil" I made already has 4-4-4 in it, I don't want to add too much nutes for fear of burning them.

Coco is complex lol... soil is a little easier... at about half and half soil/coco... I honestly don't know how I would treat it watering and nute wise, my gut says more like soil? Are you transplanting again before you go outside?

 

[N1ghtL1ght]

Ok, the Down to earth has Ca & Mg in it, so you should use only soft water EC 0-0,2 (for now). And maybe watch your plants when they ask for water, it's the lower leaves that first start becoming droopy upon reaching the wiltpoint.