Dog Training - Dog Body Language

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Dog Training – Dog Body Language




What is my dog saying?

Dog training   dog body language



My Dog Buddy

Most dog bites are avoidable. In fact most dog altercations are avoidable. Dogs communicate their state of mind, but we as humans often don't know how to read them. We speak different languages. Humans have words to communicate what we think or feel. I've yet to have such a conversation with a dog (one that I will admit to anyway). But a dog has it's own way of communicating. Learning how to read & understand them will make whatever exposure you have to dogs, that much better. If you have a fear of them, it can be tremendously helpful. Above is my dog Buddy. He is an American Staffordshire Terrier, which is considered one of the "Pit Bull" breeds. I will try to use him in the photos & videos that I can so that you see the same behavior, in the same dog.

Doggie posture - what is the dog saying?

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Playful Dog



Dogs are inherently very space conscious. So are human beings. If you were in a crowded elevator with someone standing very close to you it would be ok in your mind, because it is not unusual considering the situation. However, if you were in the same elevator, with only two people, the same person, in the same space, would set off alarm bells in your head. Something is not right & you would act accordingly. In fact, if you thought you were in serious danger you would attempt to do the same thing all animals do, "fight or flight." Being an animal, a dog will have the same response. However, it will also almost always warn you before it gets to that point, you just missed the signs. Dog's communicate a lot to each other with body language. They will do the same for you! Hopefully this article will shed some light on what a dog is telling you with it's body language and you can avoid any altercations. This is not an "all encompassing" dictionary of dbl (dog body language). If you have any questions, we'll see if we can help.


We'll start off with a very simple one and hopefully the one you run into most often. It's called the "play bow" (pictured above). It's the dog's way of saying he wants to play, an invitation to partake in a game of chase, fetch or whatever that particular dog likes to do. You will often see it displayed by two friendly dogs at play. The downward action is usually quick, & the dog may immediately take off, or stay in that position & really pile on the suspense. But if a dog is displaying these signs toward you, the most likely danger you are in is that of being jumped on by an excited dog.


Dominant Dog

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Dog Dominant Posture



This is the dominant forward position. See how the dog is standing tall, leaning forward, weight over his front feet and tail up and tense. The dog is essentially "puffing" himself up, look as large as possible. He is in "establishing mode", unafraid of whatever he is looking at. Feeling very confident. If you could see his face the corners of his mouth would be pulled forward (the corners of a dog's mouth are called "commissures" and they indicate a lot) and his gaze would be assertive and unafraid. If a dog is afraid it will shrink lower, put it's weight over it's back legs and stretch it's head forward to see what it wants to see. Basically they are showing you which way they are inclined to move (forward or back) should anything go down. This dog is ready to go forward. This dog is not necessarily going to hurt you, but whatever it sees, it wants it to know that he is there.


NOTE: When dogs play it is often a back and forth with displays of dominance. All of these signs we are discussing need to be put into context. Two dogs playing might growl and wrestle. Within the context of “play,” this means nothing. It’s just the dogs having fun…pretending.

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When introducing dogs who are hopefully to become friends, you will often see the white dog pictured above on both dogs. Tails like flagstaffs, forward posture, blocking, trying to put one’s head above the other. This is not to be ignored, the dogs are not “acquainted” yet, & both, at least at a distance, are saying, "I'm not afraid of you." I have dogs take as much as an hour to get this first part over with. But it’s ok, it’s all part of establishing the relationship. Growls, hard wrestling, pinning, it’s all fine so long as the dogs are not full on biting one another. 99% of the time it’s just noise, them establishing who is going to be who in this relationship. Not a death match. So try to pay attention to the actual signs, and not your fears. If you are just too afraid, let the dogs meet through a fence, while you & the owners talk casually, with relaxed body language. Buddy made friends with an intense Jack Russel named Todd (Todd the dog) this way. Todd was too intense for Buddy up close. Me & the owner chatted while they chased each other back & forth through the fence. Once I saw both dogs doing the play bow, we let them in together & they had a grand old time.

This dog above is being extremely dominant. Standing tall, putting his head over the other dog, commissures pulled forward. Remember dogs are very space conscious. Another dog putting it's head in YOUR space, is a seriously dominant move. Were the other dog in this photo, not so "go with the flow" there would be a definite scuffle. If I had to guess I would say that is the boxer's yard, the other guy is just there for a visit, & Mr. Bulldog is blocking the entrance to the house. However, if you have two dogs behaving like that bulldog mix, there is going to be a scuffle. I will get back to that in a second. As a side note, it is nearly impossible to accurately guess what is in a mixed breed. So I will refer to most of these dogs as what they look like to me. I have no idea what they ACTUALLY are unless it's a dog I know. I can post some fun tests later & you can see just how difficult it is. I've given the test to a lot of people. I notice that people with animal experience get more correct, but it's still nowhere near accurate. This is the problem with the CDC study that says 15 people die from "Pit Bull type dog" attacks each year. Incidentally, 3x that die by getting struck by lightning but I've yet to hear about the lightning epidemic. Thousands (3,315 I think) of kids die in their own pools each year by a parent who is not watching them. But a pit bull killing is national news. Many of these dogs submitted in the CDC study were exhumed & DNA tested. They were found to have no "pit" blood in them, whatsoever. But it looked like one, so the news called it one. That was the criteria for the CDC study, the news had to report it was a "pit bull." Well, most weren't. Mix a boxer with many dogs that are the same size & the result is often mistaken for a "pit." The CDC has yet to print any retractions. (steps down off soap box).

The few things about this photo that are good: First, the wrinkles on the dog's forehead. When a dog is ready to bite/attack. Those forehead wrinkles go away. This is true with humans too. (no, our wrinkles don't go away if we bite) The thing is, if you don't know the dog, those wrinkles can disappear quickly.
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See how the wrinkles move from the forehead to the mouth. Those commissures pulled forward. That's a dog that is ready to take it to the next level.

Two, the dog's tail appears to be lowering to a more neutral position. Depending on the dog, anywhere from a flat tail to completely relaxed (no tension) is neutral. Three, the other dog is giving the bigger guy his rear while he exits the space the Bulldog wants to own. To a dog, that is how you say hello & meet a person, You sniff each other's bums. It will form kind of a Ying-Yang circle as each dog follows the others butt around.

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It's amazing that this practice has died out with humans. Bar stools would be much higher so that all the men who walked in could smell all the delicious bums of all the females in the bar. But this is why dogs often smell your crotch or occasionally your backside. It's where we humans put out the most scent.
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Back to the pic with the red Bulldog, if you look at the body language on the little guy, he is fairly relaxed given the situation. See those commissures pulled back? He is not terribly tense. This is sending out signals to the other dog, & probably the reason his tail is lowering. If you are still unsure of what commissures are, have you ever seen a dog that appears to be smiling at you? Tongue hanging out, & you would swear it is smiling? Those are the commissures pulled completely back. That's why you think he is smiling. When we smile, we pull our "commissures" back. When a dog displays the same behavior, we interpret it as smiling. When they are pulled forward it can mean a few different things. When they are pulled back, it usually means a sense of ease.

Anyway, the little guy is content for now to be a visitor, & let the bigger dog have his way. That's submission.

Nose to Nose Greeting

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I'm adding this one last minute. This is not the proper way for dogs to meet. It CAN be a predictor for a scuffle. It might look cute in the photo, but notice those commissures are forward. I don't see the makings of any wrinkles. This is usually a milder display of dominance than a full on "blocking." But if they don't move passed this stage, & onto the bum sniffing pretty quickly, this will usually turn out to be a doggie argument. Don't be in dread of running into this situation, but proceed with caution.

Play Dominance/Submission

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A good indicator that the dogs are “ok” with each other is when BOTH dogs take turns being in the submissive position. Initially, if you have two dominant dogs, neither is willing to put themselves in the submissive position. They are vulnerable there. They don’t trust the other dog yet. Break the dogs up periodically, talk to the other owners like everything is ok, separate the dogs when they get too rowdy and say that is enough. Almost always, as the dogs tire, one dog will put itself in the submissive position. That is a good sign. However it is not until BOTH dogs allow themselves to be in that vulnerable position that they are probably ok. Now both dogs are demonstrating trust in each other. It's a large trust for a dog. He is saying "We can play, & I trust you not to kill me." That's pretty big in doggy land. Continue to watch them, but they are probably ok now. And once they know each other, they usually don't forget. Though there is often a brief period of "verification." The more “friends” a dog has, and sees on a regular basis the better. The mini Dob/Manchester Terrier in the first pic might not seem to be playing, & perhaps not. But the other dog would not be letter him do that if he didn't trust him. Remember, dogs are extremely spatially aware. That bottom dog knows he the Dob is there, he just doesn't care.



Dog Blocking

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Dog Dominant Behavior

Dominance again, standing over the other dog, weight over the front quarters. If this dog was serious, the tail would be up. But this is the best pic I could find of the behavior. The other dog is also showing all signs of submission so probably won't be a problem here, but this is typical behavior we call "blocking." The dog displaying dominance with stand in a "T" formation blocking the other dog from moving forward. Usually with his head hanging over the other dog. Remember how we said dogs are very space conscious creatures. By one dog controlling the other dogs movement or space he is trying to show he is the boss. This is very dominant behavior. If two dogs are displaying it, there will often be a scuffle. Many people are under the misconception that these "shouting matches" are to be avoided at all costs. You are doing your dog a disservice by not socializing it for fear of an outburst. The outbursts are usually not actually violent. It looks & sounds to us like it is, but fact is, it usually is not. It's like if you met someone & they said "hey fart-face, yeah, I'm gonna call you fart-face from now on." Unless you want to be "fart-face" for the rest of your life with this person, you have to correct it now. That's all the dog is doing.


If a dog is doing this to you, one might think "Oh, the dog wants to be patted" Maybe not, he might be trying to show you who is boss. Interestingly, this is the same behavior we use to control dogs. You stand up & physically block them out of the space you want to control. This is how dogs "get it."



Dog Anxiety
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Anxious Dog

This is a nervous, anxious and scared dog. He is very unsure of whatever is going on around him and doesn't know what direction to go...and while for the moment he is shrinking back he could snap at any moment. This is one of the most dangerous states a dog can be in, & should be left alone. Dogs have two survival modes, fight or flight. Every dog will have a tendency towards one or the other, whichever one past experience has taught them to be the most effective. But as soon as they feel their learned coping method is not working, they will switch to the other one. Since they have already tried to diffuse the situation and it didn't work (because you didn't see it), when they attack they do it with more intensity. A couple other things about this dog, his commissures are pulled forward (which can mean alertness/concentration or ready to attack) and the wrinkles in his fore head are almost gone. Wrinkles in a dogs fore head mean many things, almost all good, but lack of them usually means either ready to strike or total submission. The key with this dog is the low posture (he is afraid), the lifted paw (he is unsure), the weight towards the back (again, unsure/afraid), the commissures & lack of wrinkles (he is tense & could bite). What happens is people see a dog like this, & they feel bad for it. "Oh, look, he's scared," & they go to pat him. Remember a dog's space! If you invade this dog's space right now, a bite is probable.

This dog is worried and unsure, but trying to make it clear he is not a threat by lowering himself. Trying to make himself look as small as possible. I've seen dogs that have been severely abused that will actually crawl from place to place. They don't want to give off ANY signs that they are dominant.

Humans interacting the way we do might try to put the dog at ease by approaching it and saying "it's alright." Wrong. The best thing to do would be just to avoid this dog altogether or if you must, let him approach you, at his own pace. Do not touch him. His face without wrinkles and those commisures are pulled forward which means he is ready to bite if necessary. We don't know if he will, as the rest of his posture gives conflicting signs. But it is the facial position of a dog before it snaps. Or his unwrinkled face could just demonstrate his general state of worry. I would just keep an eye on him. In general, a dog's progress, whether forward, backward, or stopped altogether is all indicative of something. Let him choose it in a setting like this.

Calm Dog

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This is a neutral dog. Weight evenly distributed, ears and tail relaxed. Commissures pulled back. He is looking at something but is totally at ease. Wrinkles on the head mean he is not worried or nervous....quite the opposite of humans.

Relaxed Dog

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It doesn't get any more relaxed than this. A dog showing you it's belly is usually a sign of submission & trust (or an invitation to scratch my belly). Proceed with caution, but a dog will usually not give it's belly to someone it doesn't trust.


What is the Significance of the Lifted Paw

Unsure Dog

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Here is another dog that is unsure, & the main reason we can tell is that lifted paw. Pointers lift there front paw when they have found what they are looking for. Almost any other dog though, that lifted front paw, or paused paw is a sign of uncertainty. He is unsure of something, whether it be where the scent went, the direction he is headed, another dog in the distance. It's pretty clear really, the dog doesn't know what to do next, & therefore, hasn't decided where to put that paw down.

You might see this lifted paw though in many different states. The dog could be chasing something and it lost it. The lifted paw is just a sign of paused movement while I figure this out. If you couple the lifted paw with a dog that is in a dominant state, staring you down, you know this dog is not afraid to engage you, is in fact challenging you, and the lifted paw means he is unsure of what he is going to do next. He is waiting on you. Not a good situation to be in. The best thing to do in such a situation is to look away, and walk, don't run away. Dogs inherently chase things. Unless the situation has escalated to an altercation, running is usually the wrong idea. Often, if you are correcting a behavior, the lifted paw is a perfect time to give that verbal correction. Snap him out of that state of uncertainty quickly.

Dog Whale Eye
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What Does the Dog Whale Eye Mean

Here is a very bad sign. It's called "whale eye" The whites of the dog's eyes are very visible. Here we have a smaller dog so it's a little less threatening but it's a perfect example of this signal. The dog is not looking at you head on. He has already given you the signal he does not want to engage you, he is looking away. But he is keeping his eye on you because he does not trust you AT ALL! The only wrinkles in the forehead are caused by the lifted eye lids. Commissures are forward. This is not the time to invade this dog's space.

This dog is a very good demonstration of how before a bite the face loses tension. The wrinkles flatten out both on the forehead and the cheeks and the ears go back. Those commissures are again pulled forward, the tail is usually tense. If you send a dog in this state the wrong signal it will almost always mean a bite. If he were inclined to flee or in a position to flee, he probably would not be in the position that he is in, so an attack is very likely. His next step would be violence. To make any advancement of space on any dog like this is asking for it. This is where humans make the mistake. The dog has told us, in several different ways, "I do not trust you right now." If you go forward, invading his space, you are really the one who started it.

Another Example of Dog Whale Eye

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This here, this is very, very bad. In fact, this is the most dangerous dog to a human we have discussed. See if you can guess why? (You should have learned a few of them by now)



Again, the dog is not looking at you head on. He is avoiding you, & expects you will do the same for him. The only wrinkles are again from the eyes which are fixated on you, & will be until he feels like you are not going to invade his space. The mouth is pulled forward, ears are pulled back. This dog is EXTREMELY volatile right now. Were you to approach him, he may run. But if he is not a "flight" dog, he is ready to throw down.

What makes this so dangerous is that to the untrained eye, he looks cute. "Aw, look at those sweet little eyes, you look sad? Are you sad boy....SNAP!" This dog wants NOTHING to do with you. Leave it alone. And for God's sake don't let your kids near it. This dog is extremely tense & suspicious. The best thing you could do (if you have to be in the room with it) is to be calm, & ignore it completely. Talk to the owner in a happy, relaxed voice. Stay out of the dog's space.

Dog Bites Child, Probably....

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Just to give you a more concrete example of whale eye. It's pretty perceivable that this dog is very uncomfortable with his space right now. You can see he has even pulled his head back towards his body to try to stop the advancement. Those commissures pulled forward again, the lack of any wrinkles on the brow or face. I can guarantee you this didn't end well. The dog is just starting the motion to show teeth.

This is a perfect example of what I mean when the dogs are speaking to us but we aren't listening. Not out of disregard for the dogs we just don't "hear" them. Now a dog like this who bites the kid might be put down when it's clear he made real efforts to diffuse the situation. The real problem here was the parent and dog owner for leaving them alone, or not paying attention. It should not have escalated to this level. Never leave a dog and children alone, and with your new found knowledge of dog body language always be watching your dog to see how he is feeling about his space, the people around him etc. If you perceive he is uncomfortable fix the situation and slowly work on it with your dog. You want the dog to be socialized but you have to know it's limits. And he will show them to you, all you have to do is watch.

What to Look for in a Dog

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Some of the main things to look for is the dogs tail position. Straight up means he is tense, or trying to establish dominance. Tucked downward as most people know means he is scared, but either one of those depending on what they are coupled with could mean a bad outcome for whoever is not responding correctly to the dog's signals. But some dogs have a tail that is naturally up all the time.

The dog's body position. Is he happily closing the spacial gap between you and him with a happy go lucky jaunt with mouth open head all wrinkled, he is probably fine. Has he paused at the sight of you ears up, eyes on you, one foot lifted. He has noticed you, but unsure of what to think or do yet but closing the gap yourself is a decision you will want to consider carefully. Remember to take into account his face.

The face and mouth are very telling, especially in closer quarters. A relaxed dog will have the corners of his mouth pulled back and wrinkles in his forehead and face. Ears will usually be pulled back when totally relaxed and comfortable. Unlike humans when a dog tenses up, the wrinkles go away, and the commissures will be pulled forward. But a dog's ears will also be back when they are ready to bite. All the signs have to be put together to get a clear picture

Put all the signs together and make an assessment of what this dog is trying to tell you. Does he want you to keep your distance? Does he just want to check you out further before closing the gap, let him decide. Is he more than happy for you to come play? It will all be displayed by the dog and hopefully now you are better equipped to assess it. Most importantly base your assessment on the whole picture and err on the side of caution. Most dogs will do all they can to avoid an altercation, we can do the same.

 
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Seamaiden

Seamaiden

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This is some excellent dog fu you're laying down on us here!

I have had a big problem with people misunderstanding my dog, and she's a big girl, powerful. That one dog that's showing strong dominance (to the point that if another tries to up the game they're gonna fight), and it's something my girl does a LOT. I also look closely at her belly because her breathing changes significantly. When I see her make one long, steady breath out, I know she's a hair from throwing it down. Almost happened this last weekend, too, she tried to put her teeth on another dog who was ignoring her for the stick. I'd been watching her very closely and saw right when she was gonna try that shit, caught her with her mouth agape, should have seen her face when I "bit" her first! She practically pissed herself right there. I have to ride her ass constantly, and I've actually lost at least one friendship for it.

Long story behind that one, the lady who got so mad at me actually has had to put down pretty much every dog she's owned, for aggression. On humans. What's that tell ya?
 
Junk

Junk

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This is some excellent dog fu you're laying down on us here!

Thank you. There is much more (as you know) but a lot of it is either dog dependent (it differs from breed to breed) or you need have spent a lot of time with many dogs to understand it (b/c it differs from dog to dog!) Plus I would have to write it up :p. These, I already have written. I have more but I don't want to spam up this part of the forum so I'll let some time pass.

I'll also try to wrap up the big one I have about Pit Bulls, where I use actual science, sound math, & appropriate statistics to show that there isn't a Pit Bull problem. I got to work with two of the biggest experts in the U.S.A. to compile all the info. The research contained within was exhausting & tedious (for them, I have the easy job of making the arguments). It is a monumental goal they have set, & continued to achieve. They went to all the cases of dog related fatalities from the past 11 years or so, to speak with the people involved, exhume the body if possible, DNA test, & catalogue all the info. A massive sacrifice that has continued for over a decade. So I feel a sense of obligation, to make sure the writing is perfect, & the presentation of the arguments is persuasive. In light of that goal, I've tended to procrastinate. But I will get it done.

I also need to check out some other threads & see what everyone else in here is talking about.

I forgot to mention something in the post. Many people think a problem dog is one that bites, is aggressive etc. Of course, that dog is a problem in that moment.

However, most dogs have displayed earlier signs that people just didn't see. What I'm about to say is not the "there are no bad dogs, just bad owners" thing. A dog that is violent, needs to be put down, no matter whose fault it is.

But the real problem there was not the dog. The dog was showing signs all along, people just didn't see it. Dogs learn how to escalate. If someone is at the door they will bark. If that person continues to knock he may come closer to the door & bark louder. If it continues, the dog may start to growl or sound more fierce. A healthy dog has learned to respond to a threat commensurate with the danger. If the danger continues, they will escalate their offense. A dog like that, you can teach.

The real dangerous dogs are the ones who don't know how to escalate. Taken from it's family too young, no socialization, or some "defect," whatever the cause, a dog like this does not know how to escalate it's objection, the steps in between "your making me uncomfortable" & "kill." For a human to teach a dog those steps is very difficult, they have usually learned it from the family/siblings. But it's also very hard to teach them those things because throughout that long process, they are a danger to everyone around them.

My wife & I have the scars of one such dog who lives around the corner. Attacked 3 different people at different times on the same day. This dog's goal is to kill. I shared with the owner everything I could, but they kept the dog. It's out in the backyard, by itself, & runs full speed at anything that walks by to kill it, until his chain runs out. That dog thinks everything is a threat, & the only solution it knows is to kill it. What they are doing now, is only making it worse. Those are the dogs that kill people.
 
Junk

Junk

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No wrinkles in the head or face, commissures pulled forward, they are ready to bite...

See how things need to be put into context :p

Good looking dogs. We had a light Golden like the one on the bottom.
 
Toaster79

Toaster79

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Man you rock! And what you're saying is what I learned myself through my life with totally different breeds at totally different ages and am still learning.

We have this large field for dog walking where I live where you can set your dog free and it can interact with other dogs being there raised by all different people and you can almost read the owners character by watching the dogs behavior.

There's so more to it than just a pet :D
 
Junk

Junk

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Man you rock! And what you're saying is what I learned myself through my life with totally different breeds at totally different ages and am still learning.

We have this large field for dog walking where I live where you can set your dog free and it can interact with other dogs being there raised by all different people and you can almost read the owners character by watching the dogs behavior.

There's so more to it than just a pet :D

One of my articles is about dogs in the dog park.
 
below frigid

below frigid

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Some good info, and probably right on for most dogs your not familiar with. The whale eye with my dog means get ready for here to try and lick your face. A yawn while she has whale eye could mean a dog tongue down your throate. LOL
 
NaturalTherapy

NaturalTherapy

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Great write up, thanks for sharing.
Only been bitten once, by a Doberman that went for my throat when I was about 7. Luckily I moved quickly and she only got my armpit, and thankfully it was a scared dog and not an aggressive dog or I'd have been torn up. Taught me early to read dogs well.

Invariably, I have a problem with people who hit their animals. Seems a hallmark of those who were hit excessively as a child.

The whole idea of trust is thwarted when you hit a dog, they no longer trust you, just abide you and behave obediently out of self preservation. Much like humans actually.

Especially with large dogs, hitting them tells them you are unstable and out of control, and they must become dominant and control you.

One of the funny things I noticed, when being around big dogs, other dogs jut tend to submit immediately. My former grow partner raised an English Mastiff, and to the puppy I was the second most important human he knew. But everywhere I went dogs would come up, sit next to me and "happily" look up at me. Took about 4 months after my homie moved to another state that dogs began not noticing me again.
 
Junk

Junk

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Some good info, and probably right on for most dogs your not familiar with. The whale eye with my dog means get ready for here to try and lick your face. A yawn while she has whale eye could mean a dog tongue down your throate. LOL


You nailed it. Absolutely nailed it. In one of the threads I mentioned how everything needs to be put into context...

Dogs at play will do all kinds of crazy things. I have a "bully" breed. He likes to boss other dogs around with sheer force. He likes to play really rough with bigger dogs. If it's a much bigger dog, he likes to run full speed right at them & see who moves first (chicken, he plays chicken) He may be small (60 lbs exactly) but it's all muscle, & he knows how to use it. I've actually watched him do some things & thought to myself, "Wow, those people who compete in The World's Strongest Man shows could really learn something about mechanics just by watching these dogs." If you put him with a little dog, he plays just fine too. He will usually let the little dog be the attacker, & he plays the helpless victim at the other dog's mercy. If it's a chase dog, he'll chase, & he is pretty fast for about 100 yards lol. (He's a born sprinter, not a distance runner).

But anyway, with dogs & people he knows, he will do the whale eye as play. He is like, "I'm not looking at you, so you can look away...I'm not looking at you, so you can look away...& then he slaps a big wet tongue on your face. I can look him directly in the eye, & he thinks it's a game to be perfectly still, until he moves to lick your face. Were another person to stare at him, like the propane guy (Buddy has a strong objection to the use of fossil fuels, he is very politically & socially conscious this one). If the propane guy did that, Buddy would perceive it as a challenge & escalate accordingly.

So, I should have prefaced it better. This article was originally written to help people who do not have dogs, but are around them a lot. Or people who have dogs, but don't understand their behavior sometimes. Or people who have a fear of dogs...what signs to look for to know if a dog is ok or not.

There are a lot of people, who own dogs, & watch Cesar Milan etc. who don't know ANY of the above info. Have you ever watched Cesar & something is going on & he says, "You see this here...this is not good," & he runs over to fix it. Most people don't see what he is talking about. Hopefully this article will help people see those early signs so they can act accordingly.

For instance, it is very important to socialize your dog. It needs to learn to be around people, kids, cats, other dogs etc. Many times when dogs meet (especially two males) they will posture & try to be dominant. A lot of times the other dog isn't having it. Buddy for instance, will not back down. So a lot of times, two dogs like this will get into a scuffle.

This frightens a lot of people. It appears to be an all out dog fight! It's loud, it's fast, it appears extremely violent. But most of the time it is not. If this happens & you forever shield your dog from then on you are doing your dog a HUGE disservice. Especially if they are younger. They need to learn proper doggie manners. Often times, a youngster will approach an older dog in a manner that is rude in dog world, & that dog will often correct your dog. But it is typically not violent, no blood, or hard biting. A healthy dog has bite inhibition. They can temper the force so that it's appropriate. So, it sounds scary, & terrible, but it's usually just discipline or an argument. But you need to know your dog.

A relative got a boxer that is too much to handle. He was born the only male (so he was automatically the alpha), he was removed from the litter WAY too early, he is very high energy/drive, & he has no socialization at all. They brought him here for me to check him out & see what the problem was. The way he approached Buddy was highly disrespectful. This is Buddy's yard. There is no better way to teach him not to do that anymore than let him see what happens. So I put him in the fence with Buddy. My aunt had to go inside the house after a few minutes, she couldn't stand it. The neighbors called the police because they thought I was fighting dogs! If you think about it, two men (my uncle & I) with two dogs making a racket as we circle around & watch. I wasn't mad at my neighbors.

All that happened was about 45 minutes of Cooper (the boxer) being disrespectful, & Buddy stomping him for it. The reason this was a good idea is because I know my dog. I know he is not going to hurt Cooper (in the context that we are in). But he is going to teach him that this is not how you do it. & the reason it was important is because if Cooper ever does this to another dog, who does not have the training & socialization that Buddy has, the other dog might seriously hurt or kill him. Buddy did not so much as leave a scratch (literally). All Buddy did was continuously pin Cooper & put his nose on his neck, which tells the other dog "I could end it here if I wanted to."

When the police showed up I separated the dogs. Long story short he checked out each dog & Cooper didn't have a hair out of place. Buddy had some scratches typical of a boxer interaction but it was obviously not dog fighting. I explained what I was doing & actually showed the cop (explaining the dog body language etc). He was satisfied & went to talk to the neighbor & all was good. About 2 hours later, they were playing together.

I'm not saying you should go out & let your dog tussle with every dog in the neighborhood, but that shielding your dog from many interactions because you are afraid of the "noise" is not doing the dog any good. So if you know the signs to look for, you can usually tell if it's just an outburst, or something with real violent intentions.

Like the fourth pic down, with the red Bulldog. He is just looking to set the rules. Even if that mix challenged him, it would more than likely sound loud, ferocious & scary. But ime, neither dog would have a scratch on them when it was done. Even the photo under it, with the two dog's bearing teeth...that will most likely only turn bloody/deadly if neither dog backs down from the escalations. Those two dogs are escalating. Which means they have the knowledge of the different phases of confrontation, & they are matching each other's intensity. It's obviously not good that they are having a confrontation, but the fact that they are both displaying the same behavior, at the same time, tells me that they are trying to "talk" it out, & neither one is coming at the other one with too much force. So if/when it escalates to a fight, ime, the dogs are content to settle it over a mutual decision, not by killing the other dog. If they wanted to kill the other dog they would be doing it already.

The next time I introduce my dog to another dog I'll record it & link it so you can see what I mean. On the one hand, I don't want people living in constant fear their dog is a killing machine, because how they handle that usually just perpetuates the problem.

On the other hand, I don't want everyone thinking, "Junk said most of the time they are not out to kill each other" & just give the dog free reign.

Both situations can be dangerous (not trusting the dog at all, or too much trust)...I'm just trying to help people see the difference.

Here is Buddy & his "cousins" playing. The big American Bulldog is Hiccup (120lbs) & the one showing her teeth is Alli, short for Alligator. When these dogs play together it is rowdy. A lot of dominance displays, biting, slamming into each other. Ali & Buddy will play fight all day, until they are dead tired. At which point they just lie next to each other & paw punch the other one in the face when they have the energy. So, all the signs I pointed to above, change.

I.e. Ali's face would indicate bad news, but she is playing. She willfully allowing herself to be on her back, which is a sign that she trusts the other dogs, so the body language stuff doesn't mean the same.

This picture is after about 4 hours of going at it HARD! As you can see, they aren't running around any more. Rather, they are exhausted, but still play fighting. Ali & Buddy play fight fiercely. Buddy is like Mike Tyson, Ali is like a Ninja. She will grab him by the neck & flip him right over. But if you zoom in, you can see there isn't a mark on any of the dogs, socialization has taught them bite inhibition. Next time they come over, I'll get some footage & post that too
Vicious ally
 
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ShroomKing

ShroomKing

Best of luck. Peace
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This is some great , spot on dog info.

I've been blessed to have been involved in training and breeding dogs all my life. By the age of 10 I was proficient in standard behavior training and have trained home guard dogs, bomb sniffing dogs for Homeland security , and capture/ cadaver dogs/ narcotic dogs for FL dept of corrections and fdle.
All that is behind me now. Besides training a dog for basic commands, and home defense, I like to let a dog be himself. It is fun to see how many words you can teach a smart dog. My Aussie knows about 120 words or phrases so far.
20150521 133326
 
Junk

Junk

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...have trained home guard dogs, bomb sniffing dogs for Homeland security , and capture/ cadaver dogs/ narcotic dogs for FL dept of corrections and fdle.

That is very cool! & also, ironic! lol

I play a game with Buddy I call "Find It." I make him sit by the back door & give him something, either a specific food or an article of clothing & I say, "smell," & he sniffs it. I then go hide it somewhere while he is in a sit/stay. I come back, clap my hands & say "Find it!" & he proceeds to search the house until he has found it. At which point he will sit by the area. If I prompt him "Where is it?" he will indicate with his nose. I then retrieve the item from the drawer, door, hamper, wherever I hid it, give him lots of praise & the treat. If it's my wife's socks I carry a treat with me to reward him.

Any dog will love this game. But especially if you have a scent dog, or a very smart dog. It's a great way to make your dog work for its food. I never feed my dog without making him do something. He will usually go into his crate & sit down, I feed him, walk away for a minute or so, then tell him "ok" at which point he will start to eat.

But if your dog knows how to sit & stay, it's very easy to teach them this game. Just start with food, they will be motivated (usually) to find it. You can then move on to other items, & reward the dog with food or praise when he finds it.

The thing with praise, in my opinion, is that it needs to be measured, so that it remains a high value reward. While a puppy, you intentionally go over the top with praise sometimes. But as they grow, you need to adapt so that praise is still exciting for him. When I praise my dog, you can see the happiness in his face that he knows he "done good." You have limited rewards at your disposal. Food, praise, freedom, affection. I'm speaking extemporaneously so I may be forgetting some. But what I mean is that in order for the dog to make the association that he has done something good, you only have a matter of seconds, literally two or less, to reward the dog so that he makes the association in his brain. There is obviously a different point for all dogs, but it's a matter of seconds no matter what breed. If you miss that point, there is no point in rewarding the dog or disciplining it. So things like fun, walks, the dog park etc are harder to incorporate as a direct reward/reinforcement, unless it's something directly tied to it. E.g. Sitting before going for a walk. You aren't going to teach your dog not to jump on your guests by using the dog park as a reward...do u get what I'm saying?

So you have those things I mentioned food, praise, freedom, affection, anything the dog likes that can be delivered within seconds. But many people offer too many rewards at the same time. Food for a dog is a reward. Unless you are trying to introduce a new command by word association, there is no need to overly praise the dog as well. Patting is a reward. Patting the dog, while you praise him is simply lessening the "value" of those rewards. Just use one at a time. Remember, the dog doesn't understand the words you are saying anyway. They pick up more just by your vibe...they can sense how you are feeling. So if it's difficult for you, just give him the praise in his head. It will come out in a way the dog can feel, & you aren't wasting the value of your praise as a reward.

Affection & praise, at times, are two different things. Our dog, like many, likes to snuggle on the couch with me or my wife, at night time while we watch TV. This is affection. But it's difficult to use that as a reward except for the things tied directly to it. For instance, before he can get on the couch he has to come & sit in front of where he would like to sit. He will wait for us to make eye contact, & tell him "ok." Then he gets to snuggle. But their brain is not like a humans in that regard. We can remember & generalize behaviors & consequences. A teenager can understand that they are grounded because of something they did earlier (more than 2 seconds ago lol) A dog can't make those connections.

But when he has done his good boy behavior & is granted permission to sit on the couch with us, that is all the reward he needs. We just need to monitor how often we accidentally or unnecessarily "double" reward the dog. You may think you are being mean, but you are actually making the dog happier, bc your rewards are now more meaningful to him. Here is the stud muffin once he is granted permission...

IMG 0403
 
Junk

Junk

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This part,

" So if it's difficult for you, just give him the praise in his head." is suppose to say "in YOUR head." lol. My time to edit has expired. What I meant to say was, just say the praise to the dog to yourself.
 
Seamaiden

Seamaiden

Living dead girl
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My dog will throw it all the way down, so I can't let her do that (it already caused a huge problem in our neighborhood, when an intact boxer bitch would always try to get into it with Hazel. Hazel outweighed that dog by a good 30lbs and is the most athletic dog I've ever owned, she always leaves a mark). But a little dog? All she needs is for it to grab her face and it is game ON, she absolutely loves it, ass goes up in the air, then she starts running in that fool dawg sorta way.

My own stance on that subject is this--I AM YOUR ALPHA, BITCH (I'm the Mom, so I'm the boss)! So, I say what goes. If I see either dog behaving inappropriately, they're first warned that a correction will be coming (I use a sharp noise, hiss, clap, etc) and if I'm ignored, then I "bite."
 
Junk

Junk

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Invariably, I have a problem with people who hit their animals. Seems a hallmark of those who were hit excessively as a child.

The whole idea of trust is thwarted when you hit a dog, they no longer trust you, just abide you and behave obediently out of self preservation. Much like humans actually.

Especially with large dogs, hitting them tells them you are unstable and out of control, and they must become dominant and control you.

Have you ever read Koehler?

http://www.amazon.com/The-Koehler-Method-Dog-Training/dp/0876055773

SOME of what he does in that book I find to be way over the top. You may not want to read it. But that may give you an idea of what physical correction can do. If you decide to read it, I just want to make it clear that I'm not advocating for his style of training. It's just an example to show you what many people still practice. It's not all bad, I learned a lot from that book, I'm just not going to do some of what he does.

If you look at their natural structure, the pack leader will discipline with physical contact. A mother will discipline pups with appropriate physical contact (if it rises to that level). You'll also notice, that they escalate. A dog that is doing something "wrong," a mother may first bark, then growl, then go grab the little guy & bring him back. This is a very important behavior for a dog to learn, how to escalate. The stages of defusing a problem so that you can avoid violence. This is part of why removing a dog early from it's litter is almost always a terrible idea.

I agree with you that you don't need to "hit" a dog...almost ever.

You do need to constantly correct or commend. If you can do those two things consistently & effectively the dog will know, in short order what you expect from him. Remember the dog only has 2 seconds to associate his action with the correction/reward. In fact, you will do even better if you can catch him when the thought pops into his head. After a while with your dog, you will see it. E.g. When Buddy is free in the yard, he will stay within sight of us. But if I catch him smelling something delicious on the wind (he finds our compost pile to be a buffet) as soon as I see him look in that direction, I say "No." I said "No," exactly at the moment he was thinking, "I'm going to walk over there & eat some of that stuff," effectively, shutting that thought down. If I didn't catch him in time, his senses take over & he is on his way to the compost buffet. You have heard of nute lock right? Dogs get sense lock. After smelling that compost, & the thought to eat it, if he starts on his way the brain is focused on just that. They can actually (if they are excited enough) "not" hear you. You are just noise, & his brain is in zombie mode, just marching to the compost pile. You have to catch them quick, especially if they are in danger of getting "sense lock." (I just made that word up, but you get the idea).

Just as commending can mean physical contact (patting etc) corrections can sometimes mean physical contact. Not to rip off Cesar, but in my opinion he is absolutely right. You need to snap the dog's brain out of that state. He doesn't talk a lot about the timing of a dog's brain for that (2 seconds or less). Your corrections need to be commensurate with whatever is needed to snap the dog's brain out of that state. As fast as you see him enter that state, you need to prompt him to leave it. Sometimes a poke to the neck is needed, but this hardly hurts the dog.

For instance, Buddy gets very excited to see other dogs when we are walking. He wants to meet every dog. I need him to walk, with me...paying attention to me. So if we are walking, & I see a dog he REALLY likes & he starts to fixate, I either give him a tap on the butt with my outside leg, or I may have to imitate a bite like Seamaiden said to snap him out of it. I also issue a verbal command just before. This way, he starts to associate the verbal command with a physical correction to follow. So as time goes on, a lot of times all I need is to say "hey," not loudly or angrily, just firmly.

Just for something to mentally chew on...(it kind of says what you were saying Natural Therapy)

I read a study quite a few years ago, in which 3 groups of dogs were given to 4 trainers, group A, B, C & D. The trainer's instructions in group A were to only reward the dog for good behavior. Group B was only to discipline the dog for bad behavior. Group C was to do both. Group D was also to do both, but not relative to the dog's behavior. In other words, if the dog was good, sometimes they would commend it. For the same behavior, sometimes they would correct it. The whole point of Group D was to be consistent with "commenting" on the dog's behavior, but to be inconsistent with what was good or bad.

In the end, group D was the most obedient group, by a fairly large margin. However, these dogs also displayed signs of stress & anxiety, which led to other bad behaviors. The manner in which they got them to be so obedient led to other problems like chewing things they shouldn't etc. By training them the way they did, they perpetuated other bad behaviors that were not the result of a bad dog...just the manifestations of the stress they were under.

Group C was deemed the happiest group, they were also the second most obedient. That's why when some people train with the mantra "Only reward good behavior, don't discipline." I listen to what they have to say (they may have great reward tips) but it's not what I will practice. Everyone needs discipline, like you were saying though, it doesn't have to be violent.

One thing to remember I picked up from the only American to win the French Ring with an Amstaff. He said "One good correction is worth 1,000 half-hearted or ineffective ones."
 
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Seamaiden

Seamaiden

Living dead girl
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That's why when some people train with the mantra "Only reward good behavior, don't discipline." I listen to what they have to say (they may have great reward tips) but it's not what I will practice. Everyone needs discipline, like you were saying though, it doesn't have to be violent.
That's the thing that I learned with horses, that applies to all living things--the reward, and punishment, and whether or not, REALLY depends on the individual. I've found it's very important to tailor the treatment to the individual rather than taking a more formulaic stance. Of course, I'm the gal who rarely cooks with a recipe, too, so... :o
 
NaturalTherapy

NaturalTherapy

Lighthouse
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Very interesting. The simulated bite was among my go to actions with the Mastiff when he was getting too rambunctious, (I'd hold his ear between my teeth and he'd sit down and relax almost instantly) but it's amazing what just a stern voice will do. If the firm tone was not enough, sometimes a light two finger tap on the nose or forehead above the eyes was about all he needed to know he was misbehaving.

But in this case he was about the sweetest large dog you could imagine, we raised him from a pup, so he'd never been around abusive humans.

I imagine an abused dog would need some different queuing or reinforcement. I've never done any doggy rehab type training, so I'm totally ignorant in that regard.

Thanks again for sharing this information, I'm learning a lot!
 
DemonTrich

DemonTrich

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awesome thread, and great info. my family is picking up our pure bred male basset hound up at the end of the month (lemon color) from a private breeder. we also have a 18mo old boy and a stupid ass 15 week old male crazy cat....which I really hope would run out the door and never come back (I am 10000% NOT a cat person). the wife wants to crate train the pup for house breaking. ill be reading up on.

I had a female pure bred basset hound growing up and LOVED that dog. iirc, she lived for about 12 yrs , ate a box of oreo cookies (and made a huge nasty mess all over the carpet, got into a bottle of bleach (still lived), and used to pull me as a kid on my bike on walks...or rather runs. lol

im not sure if im going to get him fixed or stud him out in the future.
 
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