Epsom Salt dosage rates

Dizzy Weasel

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How much do you guys typically put for cal mag supplement? .3ml per gallon seems like it would be around 80ppm... Thanks guys
 

Dizzy Weasel

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Thanks got these candylands keep lookin like they need more mg. purple stalks and stringy.... Then others look better I think the others are stealing it right out of the water since there is not much... I don't have a scale but that is roughly .5ml correct? I used to use it for flush and was told 1g per gal and I thought it ended up being close to 1ml.... Do you use CS nutes? Was told they had more cal mg then most...
 

Seamaiden

Living dead girl
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How much do you guys typically put for cal mag supplement? .3ml per gallon seems like it would be around 80ppm... Thanks guys
You know that Epsom is MgSO4, which means there's not a single atom of calcium in it, right? Start with 1/4tsp, or about 1g per gallon, go from there.
Thanks got these candylands keep lookin like they need more mg. purple stalks and stringy.... Then others look better I think the others are stealing it right out of the water since there is not much... I don't have a scale but that is roughly .5ml correct? I used to use it for flush and was told 1g per gal and I thought it ended up being close to 1ml.... Do you use CS nutes? Was told they had more cal mg then most...
Sounds more like a P- than anything else. See my sig line?
 

Dizzy Weasel

Loves Eating Tacos
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Thanks.... What is your sig line? Defiantly correct on the no calcium just meant in place of cal mg... Ya I def don't have a nute issue tho, got randoms with rot they were white 3days ago been away from them too much the last week, but 90% of the rest are 110% healthy, other systems with difernt genetics are 100% winners, candyland just had always had weak root systems...
 

Seamaiden

Living dead girl
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It's confusing to me when people talk about replacing 'cal mag' with Epsom salts. You're only replacing Mg. What are you going to do about Ca, and how are you going to get it up to the correct ratio?
 
I found a good article, almost started a new thread... but i decided to use SEARCH BOX:couchpotato:

http://www.saltworks.us/gardening-with-epsom-salt.asp
Well, good is always subjective. What I see there is a good sales page for Ultra Epsom Salts. I'm not singling you out, as I think Cal/Mag and epsom salts to be overused, period. Over the years, most of the Ca and Mg issues I have seen in weed forum Infirmaries, are tied to something other than a lack of enough Ca or Mg in the nutes. Like rootzone pH issues, failure to water appropriately, nutritional elements in the wrong proportions (cation competition) and often combined with the use of tap water. Further, peat/perlite/vermiculite (what most 'dirt' farmers use) is NOT soil, leading to confusion on the 'right' pH range for MJ.

In hydro, not letting your res play from 5.1-2 to about 6.2, or so, can create issues for things like Ca and Mg uptake. With Mg, specifically, uptake sucks between about 5.5 and 6.0. It is a much more efficient process between 5.0-5.5. So, running hydro (any hydro, including RDWC) or a peat/per/ver (with a good 10-15% runoff) and forcing the pH to always be above 5.6, well, big effin surprise you are trying to foliar feed epsom or add it to your regime, 'cause yer girls seem Mg def. To compensate for a limited pH, people start having to mix and match disproportionate nutrients that then perform like shit if outside that limited pH range. Or even on different strains.

MJ plants are not Mg or Ca whores. Rather, they are often grown under the conditions I describe in this post, with resulting Ca or Mg deficiencies occurring, with most usually the wrong thing being done. Instead of actually fixing the problem, people start using foliar feed band-aids or more bottles of nute or bags of salt.

Never really fixing the condition (like wrong or limited pH range), or even understanding what the actual problem is ...

Having RO water does not mean you must add Cal/Mag, either. What makes one 'must' add it, is a deficient base (Macro/Secondary/Micro) nutrient regime, like, say, Botanicare's Pure Blend Pro. I have seen a lot of N toxicities in gardens of Cal/Mag users. A lot.

But, like a other things (e.g. WRONG pH range for hydro and peat/per/ver), this epsom salt and Cal/Mag thing has been cemented in stone on the weed forums.

Weed forums that are mostly Beginner and Intermediate growers, serving as one big Echo Chamber of, sometimes, complete bullshit on how to grow weed.

And, lot's 'o people have a lot of posts invested in pimping Cal/Mag and epsom, having 'developed' some patchwork, inefficient nutrient regime, so good luck finding many open minds about what is really causing all of these Ca and Mg def that show up in weed gardens and on weed forums. And weed being a Ca Whore, or an Mg slut ain't what really causes this. It is usually operator error ...

That article, in addition to being a sales page, used words like 'it is believed'. You have to discriminate, a bit, when taking stuff like this and applying it to an indoor weed garden using soiless peat/per/verm or hydro. In this case, you need to remember that Mg is very mobile - not just in plants, but also in the soil. Outdoors in REAL soil. It leaches and flushes through, which, after the course of time, can lead to Mg defciencies on the soil. Take that same exact soil mix that all of these rose, pepper and tomato gardeners are growing in in your backyard, and it would most likely limit your harvest. And, it will most like be an organic soil very low in Mg because of how mobile Mg is in the soil. Sure, throw some Mg salts in the soil in that case. And some perlite, and some worm castings, and a whole bunch 'o other crap, because it is just organic soil you dug out of the average backyard, deficient in many ways, with Mg being right up there.

You could piss in a jug every day, dilute it a bit, and throw it one your lawn and see positive results. And that is because the medium that the lawn is growing in is way less precise, taken care of, fed, full of nutrients than your bottles bought at the grow shop, etc., than the medium in a weed garden. Doesn't mean I want to start pissing on my weed plants, though ...

What's my epsom salt AND Cal/Mag dosage WITH RO water? 0mL/ga.
 
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Seamaiden

Living dead girl
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http://www.foliarsprays.com/en/welcome/mineralized-soil.html

If you want to know what soil is, and what well mineralized soil is, read this article. I've excerpted some key points, but to get the complete picture the entire article should be read. There can be coir or peat mixed into a soil base, but without the humus and minerals, Capulator is 100% on point, it ain't soil.

The Four Bases of Mineralized Soil
Soil is a marvelous and complex part of creation. Soil has been meticulously studied and written about from many perspectives. Beginning in the 1850’s Russian scientists began to classify soils based on their various properties including geological origins. By 1900 American scientists were significantly adding to the knowledge of soil science. From the 1920’s-1950’s Russian research on soil microbiology was at its pinnacle.

Soil Energy
Soil energy refers to a soils ability to grow a crop and bring it to maturity. It also takes energy to digest limestone and other rock powders. Soil energy comes from the synchronization that occurs when various fertilizers come in contact with soil and/or other fertilizers.

Foundational Minerals
Foundational minerals refer primarily to adequate available calcium and phosphorous. While both calcium and phosphorous can be obtained in the form of commercial fertilizers, these fertilizers do not build a proper foundation to construct a mineralized soil. Very few soils are naturally endowed with adequate levels of foundational minerals. If the levels are insufficient then they must be supplied in the form of insoluble rock powders. These powders require both soil energy and soil biology to break down into an available form.

Specific soil amendments used to build the foundational minerals include limestone, soft rock phosphate, and gypsum. Sadly, conventional agriculture almost entirely misses the need for foundational minerals. Instead they are content with a pH over 6.5 and a minimal amount of available phosphorous. Due to their strong focus on humus, organic matter, and biology most organic farmers are woefully short of calcium and many times short of phosphorous. The exception to this is on small areas with extreme application rates of compost or manure.

Foundational minerals are the backbone of establishing a mineralized soil. Available calcium plays a decisive role in determining the quantity of yield produced. It also plays a tremendous role in the health and quantity of plant roots. When soil has at least 2,000 lbs. of available calcium roots, rootlets, and fine root hairs abound. These fine root hairs are continually growing and sloughing off into the soil. This base exchange of root hairs stimulates soil bacteria and builds humus in the soil.

Humus and Biology
Humus and biology refers to the living, breathing aspect of soil. As soil biology proliferates they leave behind organic residues or metabolites. These residues increase the humus content of soil. As they decompose these organic compounds give off carbon dioxide which plants use to produce carbohydrates and the cycle starts all over. While conventional agriculture has all but ignored this most important aspect of mineralized soil, many organic farmers have hailed it as the ultimate panacea with nothing else needed – thank you. Both of these approaches are incomplete.

Products used to increase humus in soil include: cover crops, green manures, compost, fresh or aged manures, dry humates and many more. Products used to stimulate soil biology include: microbial inoculants, liquid humates, compost tea, molasses, sugar, bio stimulants, enzymes, and many other proprietary products. There are a myriad of approaches on how to stimulate soil biology and increase humus. Many people become so enamored with increasing soil humus and biology that they neglect 1st and 2nd base. This leads to a soil with a fabulous “feel-good factor” but completely unable to produce high-brix foods.

The approach taken by the early pioneers was to apply some organic material mostly in the form of manures and then inoculate and stimulate the biology from that point on. As humus and biology increase in a mineralized soil they impact soil energy. Soil biology will create some energy and the humus will regulate that energy and generally even out the extremes. This explains why fully mineralized soils need less energy inputs i.e. soluble fertilizers.

Trace Elements
The final aspect of a mineralized soil is the addition of a plentiful supply of trace elements. These include the more commonly recognized elements such as boron, copper, iron, manganese, and zinc and the rarer elements such as chromium, molybdenum, nickel, iodine, vanadium, lithium, selenium, cobalt and many others. Products used to supply these minerals include the sulfates and chelates of the more common elements, seaweed, sea minerals, and various rock powders for broad spectrum trace elements.


four-bases-of-soil-mineralization.jpg
 
"I have never seen a case of CA deficiency in cannabis"------Ed Rosenthal
Cal-mag.....probably the most overused unnecessary product in the growing world.
 

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