Happy Frog. Use Additional Amendments?

[OldSmokie76]

So I'm setting up to build some fresh soil mix. I'd really like to get thru this next grow with just water and periodic compost teas. Maybe create a top dressing if necessary.
I recently finished a small trial plant in HF all by itself. Once a week fed with NFTG nutes. It made it thru 9 wks beautifully. Larger plants I flipped later were yellowing and dropping leaves by week 4. Once a week feeding just will not bring them around. Yield is suffering. These older plants are same clone batch as the trial plant, just they vegged for a longer period depleting the nutrients.
My theory and conclusion is this...HF seemed to do the trick with very little feeding just as long as the plant is smaller and flipped immediately allowing the plant to only use the soil for the flowering period. Don't let them use up the soil prior to the flip. Veg very quickly. Small plants. Many plants. SOG. Or numerous upsizing on container size and fresh soil mix. Whatever the case, HF is great for clones/veg, but I think it could use a little help in flower. I know it's not designed for flower, but I'm pretty it could be amended and accommodate a full flower cycle using only water and teas. Any Farmers have some experience using HF as base soil and custom blending something for flower? Building super soil with HF?

This was the little Critical Cheese in HF.

 

[OldManRiver]

Your conclusions seem mixed up to me. You say you did "very little feeding" but also "fed once a week". Make up your mind. Thats a regular feeding schedule. Your buds are a result of your feeding program, not what Happy Frog has to offer. Nice work, not dissing your buds, just your conclusion.

I like happy frog for a substrate, almost like coir, to feed into. It can run a bit alkaline.

 

[OldSmokie76]

Was under the impression feeding once a week was light feeding. Lots of "feed every watering" instructions out there. With that said, I guess my goal is no actual supplemental feeding. Just water and teas, but I suppose compost teas are feeding so what am I getting at. Haha. Just generally interested in anybody's experience/recipes with amending HF for full flower cycle with no additional nutes. I'm assuming adding some additional amendments and some proper "cooking" will level out any pH issues.

 

[OldManRiver]

Was under the impression feeding once a week was light feeding. Lots of "feed every watering" instructions out there. With that said, I guess my goal is no actual supplemental feeding. Just water and teas, but I suppose compost teas are feeding so what am I getting at. Haha. Just generally interested in anybody's experience/recipes with amending HF for full flower cycle with no additional nutes. I'm assuming adding some additional amendments and some proper "cooking" will level out any pH issues.

If you are amending, you are attempting to feed. HF is designed to be fed into. I wouldn't try to beef it up with amendments; it works really well with Botanicare Pro.

 

[JWM2]

Imo you’re better off adding nutes as you go. They need different nutrients at various stages of their life and if you load the soil with nutes you have less control over the results.

 

[OldManRiver]

Imo you’re better off adding nutes as you go. They need different nutrients at various stages of their life and if you load the soil with nutes you have less control over the results.

This. Happy frog is a great low nutrient substrate. It needs nutes.

 

[OldSmokie76]

I'm trying desperately to veer away from bottles. I want to build a super soil mix using HF as a base. My first grow was in a mix I modeled after subcools infamous recipe. Some variations, but amazing. Very little feeding that go. My plans this time are similar using HF loaded like a supersoil. As long as it cooks for about month all those granular amendments become available. Not much need for nutes. I never had to muck with pH. This time I plan to use various compost teas also.

 

[OldManRiver]

You're doing a lot of work to avoid something that is easy and works. I don't get that. Sounds like religion to me.

 

[JWM2]

Yeah some people just like to overcomplicate their simplicity. Good luck with that.

And btw I knew subcool 15 years ago before he blew up. He got his start by f2ing Dutch Flowers on cannabis bay. I know because I used to photoshop his images for his auctions. Now that he is big time he won’t speak to those who helped him get where he is today. Sad but true.

 

[Jack og]

I use HF as a base and feed fish emulsion 1x per 5 water cycle during veg and fish/cal mag with bloom, sea kelp and bat guano. Yields well. And is not finicky.
It is alkaline as oldman said.
So watch that run off and adjust watering apportioned to feed.
Cheers.

 

[OldSmokie76]

Not much work at all. I'm just filling the soil with the goodies it needs in a fashion that is trusted and tested. I'm not impressed by the name that is behind the recipe just the soil's reputation and it's methods. Build and feed the soil, not the plant. Can't say much about the guy either. Notariaty and some fame can inflate even the most grounded ego. Lol. Although my efforts are a little excessive in the beginning, my long term goal is simplicity. Just add water. Set it and forget it. Haha. Plus the long-term investment is a bit less than buying the bottles all the time. $100 of granular amendments will allow me to build killer soil for many many grows. Plus I just snagged 6 2cf bags of HF for $1.99/ea. Score!

 

[CocoFun]

Ya know, we're supposed to be here to help each other out....why do some of you (oldManRiver for example) insist on being such assholes on these threads? Instead of just being a di*khead throwing in your 2cents, how about you just shut the f*** up next time? here, sit and spin.

 

[Stickman551]

I've been using HF for awhile now. I give it 3 weeks, then start adding fertilizer gradually. Starting at 50% recommendations. I'm at 100% and feed daily. If there are no signs of overfeeding, I keep on feeding.
HAG1

 

[PooToe]

I'm going to agree with @OldManRiver.

I'm a bottle feeder so I'm biased but I don't get why it's such a pain to pour a little nutrient into your water. IMO, amended soils fortified to go the distance can be detrimental as you don't know when soil nutrition will run out. Once you've figured out the deficiency you're going to stunt your plant and add a week or two onto your grow schedule. You're also at the mercy of the bacterial and fungal colonies in the soil having to break down the food into soluble ions that the plant can take up meaning even if there is a minimum of readily available ions you're limiting the plant to what it has available to take up.

I also like being able to manipulate the NPK ratios to be able to steer the plants to my liking. This allows me to figure out what that particular cultivar likes so when I run them again I know if they like this or that and can give it to them.

 

[Asmodeus]

I like happy frog

 

[Week4Bytch]

Odd how all these bottled feeders jumped into this "Organic Thread" to piss on this guy. To comment on the OP's question, you can reuse the Happy Frog after every grow by simply top dressing with organic dry amendments like Gaia Green, Down To Earth, Craft Blend, etc. Just work it in the topsoil per portions recommended by each manufacturer and your set. Adding that with some fresh compost and/or earthworm castings will kick your soils health up a few notches. And no it's not a religion, it's a philosophy. It's a vision for living and working in harmony with nature. Organic farmers avoid synthetic inputs and encourage natural systems to create a better future for people, animals, and the environment.

 

[SamSquatch]

So I'm setting up to build some fresh soil mix. I'd really like to get thru this next grow with just water and periodic compost teas. Maybe create a top dressing if necessary.
I recently finished a small trial plant in HF all by itself. Once a week fed with NFTG nutes. It made it thru 9 wks beautifully. Larger plants I flipped later were yellowing and dropping leaves by week 4. Once a week feeding just will not bring them around. Yield is suffering. These older plants are same clone batch as the trial plant, just they vegged for a longer period depleting the nutrients.
My theory and conclusion is this...HF seemed to do the trick with very little feeding just as long as the plant is smaller and flipped immediately allowing the plant to only use the soil for the flowering period. Don't let them use up the soil prior to the flip. Veg very quickly. Small plants. Many plants. SOG. Or numerous upsizing on container size and fresh soil mix. Whatever the case, HF is great for clones/veg, but I think it could use a little help in flower. I know it's not designed for flower, but I'm pretty it could be amended and accommodate a full flower cycle using only water and teas. Any Farmers have some experience using HF as base soil and custom blending something for flower? Building super soil with HF?

This was the little Critical Cheese in HF.

I have been a organic living soil grower using Happy Frog for over 10 years. I have things pretty well dialed in but there is always room for improvement. Here is my super charged soil recipe
1Bag 2 cu.ft Happy Frog
I bag 1.5 cu.ft. Ocean Forest
3 gal washed coco coir
3 gal composted cow manure
3 gal perlite
3 gal vermiculite
3 gal worm castings
2c Happy Frog all-purpose fert.
1c greensand
2c ground oyster shell
2c Dolomite lime
1/2 c blood meal
1/2 c high N bat guano
1/2 c high P bat guano
1c feather meal
2 c bone meal
1 c bulb food
1/2 c soft rock phosphate
1c gypsum
1c kelp meal
1c azomite
2 c alfalfa meal
2 c basmati rice
Good dusting Great White mycorrhizae
3 gal R.O. water with 1 tlbs Blackstrap Molasses per gal
Mix well let cook 2 months keep mixing
Makes about 40 gal soil
I grow in 7 gal fabric pots, veg for 5 weeks and don't add anything. When I put into flower each pot gets 1 gal R.O.water plus 4ml Advanced Nutrients Organic Ancient Earth Org 4ml Bud Candy 4 ml ANO Iguana Juice per week increasing dose by 1 ml per week until I get to 8 ml per gal on 3rd week I add Advanced Nutrients Organic Big Bud to mix and 10 drops Cal Mag. I also have been adding Hygrozyme to mix. I feed until 3 weeks before harvest giving 1 tlbs Black Strap Molasses per gal of water the first two of those weeks. This works for me. It may sound a little complicated but it is my religion.
I get most of my materials from Grow Green Michigan. The soil, worm castings, manure, perlite, vermiculite I get from grow or lawn and garden stores.
I am sure other recipes would work just as well.

 

[MellowRello]

Was under the impression feeding once a week was light feeding. Lots of "feed every watering" instructions out there. With that said, I guess my goal is no actual supplemental feeding. Just water and teas, but I suppose compost teas are feeding so what am I getting at. Haha. Just generally interested in anybody's experience/recipes with amending HF for full flower cycle with no additional nutes. I'm assuming adding some additional amendments and some proper "cooking" will level out any pH issues.

There's about 3-4 weeks of nutes in Happy Frog. So you can transant to final pot, veg 3 weeks and flip to flower...but then it's time to top dress.
The only way to "water only" is in gigantic pots..like 20+ gallon beds.