Help with Fox Farms 70/30 coco…

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Bullmark69

Bullmark69

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Hello, I’m trying Fox farms 70/30 coco for the first time and jumped in before I knew enough about coco.
I decided to amend the medium with Gaia Green 4-4-4, kelp meal, EWC, and granular myco.
Anyway, I have 2 photos (Amnesia and Gelato Og) in one gallon fabrics under a 320w r-spec HLG LED light at 80% intensity…..about 25” above the tops.
Plants appear to be doing fine for being less than 4 weeks old.
My questions are related to waterings and PH……everything I’ve read says coco needs to be watered frequently and runoff is the norm. Also the ph should be lower than soil in the 5.8-6.2 window.
When I’ve watered it’s been impossible to avoid runoff and any amount other than a few drops seems to flow right through the medium, yet the medium retains good moisture. I’ve been ph’ing to 6.0.
One big concern is that I’m leeching the amendments out before they’ve been used…I measured the ppm of the runoff and it was crazy high as I suspected.
I realize now that the organic amended medium method might not be the best fit for coco….but what should I do??
I decided to treat one of the two plants more like soil and wait until the medium dried out some before watering. Granted it’s only been 5-6 days but it still looks great. I just topped them and they took it well.
Actually the only issue with either plant was right after the transplant from solo cup to 1gal pot. The amnesia suddenly showed some yellowing on the oldest, most bottom 2 leaves. This has not progressed.
I’m totally confused on how to water/feed these plants in this medium.
The plan was to top and grow out a few more weeks in the 1 gal, then transplant to their final 5 gal pots before the flip.
The pic is before I topped and right after their dark period….so they look a tad droopy.
They look really good considering I’ve been confused and indecisive the entire time.
Any help, comments, advice or random thoughts would be most appreciated here.
Thanks to everyone……as they say “it takes a village”.
Cheers
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m8ty

m8ty

615
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Treat it like growing in media and water once a week, you can see the speed bumps on the leaves from over watering to frequently, and don't feed anything other than R.O. water and 150 ppm of calmag.
 
Bullmark69

Bullmark69

107
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Treat it like growing in media and water once a week, you can see the speed bumps on the leaves from over watering to frequently, and don't feed anything other than R.O. water and 150 ppm of calmag.
Pardon my ignorance of the terminology but when you say “treat it like growing in media”, you mean to allow it to go through a wet to mostly dry cycle??
Also, RO water isn’t an option at the moment….but my tap is only 144ppm.
Perhaps I can get away with tap and a very small dose of cal mag (if needed at all)??
One last thing….I’m not sure how rapidly the amendments are being washed out in the runoff, but I had planned on top dressing once every 3-4 weeks…..probably more cycle appropriate Gaia Green, EWC, etc. Is this a viable plan??
Thank u so much for helping….I appreciate it and will try to help someone less knowledgeable, if that’s possible, in the future.
 
F

frogyrogy

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I don't know how to link to other posts, however @Aqua Man Man has a good one here titled:

HOW TO WATER COCO FOR BEST RESULTS.​

 
Aqua Man

Aqua Man

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I don't know how to link to other posts, however @Aqua Man Man has a good one here titled:

HOW TO WATER COCO FOR BEST RESULTS.​

Thanks for the mention brother. The things is he is doing organic coco and that changes the watering needs because organics hold a lot of water unlike coco perlite without.

In his case id treat it like a peat based media such as promix. This is because the organics increase the water table, lower the gas exchange rates and overall air holding capacity.

This will help him understand how the different types of media and other factors effect your watering strategy.

 
Bullmark69

Bullmark69

107
43
Thanks for the mention brother. The things is he is doing organic coco and that changes the watering needs because organics hold a lot of water unlike coco perlite without.

In his case id treat it like a peat based media such as promix. This is because the organics increase the water table, lower the gas exchange rates and overall air holding capacity.

This will help him understand how the different types of media and other factors effect your watering strategy.

So if I understand correctly, with the organics added in, my watering should resemble somewhere in the middle between coco w/ synthetic nutes (daily water w/ runoff) and an organic soil grow (wet to dry w/ no significant runoff)…??
It’s been a challenge to water and not get a fair amount of runoff, so I’m just not sure how quickly I’m leeching out my nutrients.
Perhaps bottom watering would be the answer?
I’m just throwing out thoughts and hoping one might make sense.
Thanks a ton for the help.
 
Aqua Man

Aqua Man

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So if I understand correctly, with the organics added in, my watering should resemble somewhere in the middle between coco w/ synthetic nutes (daily water w/ runoff) and an organic soil grow (wet to dry w/ no significant runoff)…??
It’s been a challenge to water and not get a fair amount of runoff, so I’m just not sure how quickly I’m leeching out my nutrients.
Perhaps bottom watering would be the answer?
I’m just throwing out thoughts and hoping one might make sense.
Thanks a ton for the help.
No bottom watering imo. Water evenly over the top in increments of a few min apart until you get a feel. Then stop at the forst sign of a drip.

Go by the weight of the pot it will be more than a day and likely 2-3 at this point. You will feel a noticeable difference when you need to water. If you even have to think about it wait another day. More water does not mean more growtg and quite the opposite.

With the mix your using you can afford to let it get a bit to dry once to get an idea…. And you will be shocked how long between watering to reach wilt i bet.

This is how fast they recover from being bone dry to the point of wilt… you dont want to do this often but I honestly suggest doing it once so you can gauge the weight and get a first hand understanding.

Watch this clone in real time recover from being underwatered to the point of wilt.

 
Bullmark69

Bullmark69

107
43
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E1C2010C 2251 47CC 93EC BE361E3CD047
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Treat it like growing in media and water once a week, you can see the speed bumps on the leaves from over watering to frequently, and don't feed anything other than R.O. water and 150 ppm of calmag.
Hey again, I wanted to pick your brain about these plants. It’s been a month since I posted the thread and the plants have just grown like crazy.
Shortly after the thread I transplanted them along with a third photo into 5 gal pots with the same mix….70/30 coco, dry amendments & EWC.
I have not watered like traditional coco/synthetic nutes, but I keep the mix moist……I usually give tap water ph’ed to 6.1-6.3 every other or third day. It’s impossible to not get some runoff but I’m not getting an excessive amount.
I also give them stump tea once a week for microbial action.
Out of curiosity I do check the runoff ppm but the numbers are wildly inconsistent and don’t have any real pattern.
I just flipped them yesterday and would have earlier but I was finishing up a small auto in the same space.
I’m afraid I may run out of room….my closet is 2’x 6’ and they are already bunching up against the sides. I’ve topped, defoliated heavily and kinda lollipopped them for even canopies.
U wouldn’t believe how many leaves I’ve taken plus stripped the bottom third of each plant.
The good news is I don’t see any issues whatsoever and growth is vibrant.
I just don’t know if all 3 can be supported in a 2x6 space. How big are they gonna get after they stretch?
Should I take some of the side branches off? Only grow 2 plants? The height is not a problem but it’s a very narrow space.
Lastly, I was gonna top dress after the flip with Gaia Green 2-8-4 and EWC…..but I’m torn on when to do it. In roughly 1 week they will have been in the current mix for 1 month…..so waiting till then makes sense to me.
I’ve included group pics in the grow space and individual pics.
The smallest shortest is a Gelato OG, the tallest is a Jack Herer and lastly there’s the Amnesia (which has a great canopy with a crazy number of tops).
Lemme know what u think…..and I appreciate your time and input.
768F873D 508E 4891 BCCE F79E9CEDCBAA
 
m8ty

m8ty

615
143
Hey again, I wanted to pick your brain about these plants. It’s been a month since I posted the thread and the plants have just grown like crazy.
Shortly after the thread I transplanted them along with a third photo into 5 gal pots with the same mix….70/30 coco, dry amendments & EWC.
I have not watered like traditional coco/synthetic nutes, but I keep the mix moist……I usually give tap water ph’ed to 6.1-6.3 every other or third day. It’s impossible to not get some runoff but I’m not getting an excessive amount.
I also give them stump tea once a week for microbial action.
Out of curiosity I do check the runoff ppm but the numbers are wildly inconsistent and don’t have any real pattern.
I just flipped them yesterday and would have earlier but I was finishing up a small auto in the same space.
I’m afraid I may run out of room….my closet is 2’x 6’ and they are already bunching up against the sides. I’ve topped, defoliated heavily and kinda lollipopped them for even canopies.
U wouldn’t believe how many leaves I’ve taken plus stripped the bottom third of each plant.
The good news is I don’t see any issues whatsoever and growth is vibrant.
I just don’t know if all 3 can be supported in a 2x6 space. How big are they gonna get after they stretch?
Should I take some of the side branches off? Only grow 2 plants? The height is not a problem but it’s a very narrow space.
Lastly, I was gonna top dress after the flip with Gaia Green 2-8-4 and EWC…..but I’m torn on when to do it. In roughly 1 week they will have been in the current mix for 1 month…..so waiting till then makes sense to me.
I’ve included group pics in the grow space and individual pics.
The smallest shortest is a Gelato OG, the tallest is a Jack Herer and lastly there’s the Amnesia (which has a great canopy with a crazy number of tops).
Lemme know what u think…..and I appreciate your time and input. View attachment 1260885
Good looking plants! Keep doing what you're doing, flip them now and don't cut anything except the very bottoms that won't catch up with the top canopy, the plants will double in size and will fill that space up nicely, and top dress at the end of week two into flower. Good job👍
 
Bullmark69

Bullmark69

107
43
Good looking plants! Keep doing what you're doing, flip them now and don't cut anything except the very bottoms that won't catch up with the top canopy, the plants will double in size and will fill that space up nicely, and top dress at the end of week two into flower. Good job👍
Thanks man….I posed this question on another site and got a response that was highly technical and well above my pay grade for understanding.
Basically said I was running too wet and my ph (6.2-6.3) was too high. They pointed out a few issues like yellow meristems, leaves starting to curl a bit, and the darker green (almost blue) edges on some of the leaves. See the pic…plant on the right was watered yesterday and does have darker bluish edges….the other plant is due to be watered today and is a more consistent shade of green.
He said the plants may have issues processing certain micro nutrients….yada yada yada…..to run them drier and drop the ph to 5.8.
I tell ya, I’ve never had a plant grow as rapidly as these and I know an experienced grower could find some issues to deal with but if they flower like they’ve vegged I’ll have a closet full of smelly buds.
I’m inclined to keep doing what I’m doing until I can see a more of a problem. Maybe I’ll water every 3 days instead of every 2….the mix is still fairly moist when I water now, except for the surface, but it’s dry an hour after watering.
I could not provide a good response to why I PH at 6.2-6.3, and I didn’t wanna say because Mr Canuck does it that way…but he does run the same mix and I believe he goes with a PH or 6.3-6.5.
Anyway, I’m not trying to win the Cannabis Cup but I do want to make the things I can control as optimal as possible…the PH and how often I water is definitely in that category.
I don’t mean to make u my pot growing “phone a friend” but any light you could shed on this would help immensely.
Thanks again for your time and help.
Image
 
Neueregel

Neueregel

235
93
Treat it like growing in media and water once a week, you can see the speed bumps on the leaves from over watering to frequently, and don't feed anything other than R.O. water and 150 ppm of calmag.
is that for his coco perlite mix? or does that also pertain to regular Fox Farm soil? thanks
 
Bullmark69

Bullmark69

107
43
I let them go an extra day for water and I could really feel it in the weight of the pot. But the plant showed no signs of being thirsty. Anyway, I watered and added a light dose (150ppm) of cal mag.
Also today is the first day of 12/12…..can’t wait for the stretch and some baby nuggets.
I had to cut back some of the side branches on the widest plant….:they have plenty of room to go up, but they’re packed in tight on the sides.
I just hope they do half as good in flower as they’ve done so far….
Now it’s just water and wait about two weeks until I top dress. They’ll get stump teakelp meal tea to ease them into flower, and light silica until then….and I almost forgot about cal mag. I guess I should probably continue to give at least minimal amounts for the time being.
The pic is the Jack Herer and I’ve been really impressed with the way it’s grown so evenly and responded well to the toppings and defoliation.
This grow I’m calling box of chocolates cause it’s 3 different strains and I don’t know what to expect from any of the 3.
Thanks to all for giving their time and advice.
As they say, “ It takes a village”
 
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