HOW TO WATER COCO FOR BEST RESULTS.

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NoobJay

NoobJay

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I'm a noob myself so I'm only passing on what was told to me, I got a similar issue with one of my plants, not because of amount of water, but I was doing small waterings too often in a big pot, so I was not giving time for the water to drain from the root zone and let them breathe between drinks. I backed off back to 2 waters a day, but what I found was by waiting for them to 'dry', I missed the point where they recovered from the overwatering (literally only took them two hours), then mistook their thirst for still suffering from overwatering. I found once I just returned to my normal watering schedule with more water less often and runoff every time all came good. Had to cut the leaves off after a bit though as they didn't really recover and kept hanging in the dirt. Sorry if none of this is relevant it's late and I'm baked haha
Dam! It really bounced back nice! And thanks for sharing the wisdom I will take any good advice any day! And don’t worry I am baked also so I don’t mind if it’s not relevant I might get something out of it never know.
 
2Bad

2Bad

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I'm a noob myself so I'm only passing on what was told to me, I got a similar issue with one of my plants, not because of amount of water, but I was doing small waterings too often in a big pot, so I was not giving time for the water to drain from the root zone and let them breathe between drinks. I backed off back to 2 waters a day, but what I found was by waiting for them to 'dry', I missed the point where they recovered from the overwatering (literally only took them two hours), then mistook their thirst for still suffering from overwatering. I found once I just returned to my normal watering schedule with more water less often and runoff every time all came good.
This. Exactly this. 20 percent runoff. twice a day. overwatering just means the roots dont have air. And coco has a high air capacity meaning it barely ever drowns. unless its a small plant in seedling stage.
 
Nectarivorous

Nectarivorous

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Dam! It really bounced back nice! And thanks for sharing the wisdom I will take any good advice any day! And don’t worry I am baked also so I don’t mind if it’s not relevant I might get something out of it never know.
This is her at day 34. Bear in mind she had water stress four days ago, came good and was topped three days ago. Amazing how quickly they respond in Coco. She is missing her first three sets of true leaves as these were damaged beyond repair and hanging in dirt, were doing more harm then good. Almost at the same point with the last big fan leaves but feel like the plant needs them, though the new growth is taking over quickly anyway. Trimmed the fingers off one end that was in the dirt, the other is supported by the pot so I leave it for now and keep tucking it. :)
 
justice8965

justice8965

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Day 23 of 12/12. Massive works like a charm. 4 out of 6 plants stretched to a perfect height, the other 2 are a bit short but will still produce. Very happy. The platinum gorilla in front there is a monster. tops everywhere but with a nice open structure.

Screenshot_20210817-200023_Gallery.jpg


Screenshot_20210817-200042_Gallery.jpg

Screenshot_20210817-200312_Gallery.jpg
 
NoobJay

NoobJay

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Day 23 of 12/12. Massive works like a charm. 4 out of 6 plants stretched to a perfect height, the other 2 are a bit short but will still produce. Very happy. The platinum gorilla in front there is a monster. tops everywhere but with a nice open structure.

View attachment 1158420

View attachment 1158421
View attachment 1158422
Hope mine will bounce back like yours. And your drip says ten looks great. Nice set up! That canopy is looks awesome so many tops 👀 they are stretching nice. What bites are you using?
 
justice8965

justice8965

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Hope mine will bounce back like yours. And your drip says ten looks great. Nice set up! That canopy is looks awesome so many tops 👀 they are stretching nice. What bites are you using?

Thank you! Pretty much copied everything I learned from this thread for my watering system haha. Yeah they took until the end of week 3 to really stretch. I'm used to sativas which double in size in like 10 days so it was worrisome. But its looking great other than a couple short ones.

Nutes you mean?

GH Trio
GH Si
CalMag
GH Diamond Nectar (Humic acid)
GH Koolbloom (bloom booster)
Currently using Massive for the first time. I don't know it helped with the stretch but it might have. I'll drop it in a couple weeks
 
Charlie720

Charlie720

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3
Ok writing this cause i see this issue often and rather have a thread to link than explain this each time. This is not my work but a collection of info from many members here and I have put into practice myself.

So first off COCO is NOT soil. For best results we want to keep it saturated between 90-100% that does not mean you can't go below this but you may see slower growth or nutrient issues over time if your consistently letting COCO get to dry.

Coco has an amazing gas exchange and air holding capacity when compared to soil. For this reason it is next to impossible to over water. Over watering is NOT to much water... its lack of o2. You will see this in soil with less drainage but because of coco's high drainage, air holding capacity and gas exchange its highly unlikely to see this in coco.

I do suggest if growing in more than 1 gal pots to add perlite if you are seeking faster grow rates. However if you want to water less often then you can eliminate the perlite as this will lower the drainage. As a rule of thumb:

1gal no perlite
2gal 20% perlite
3gal 30% perlite
4gal 40% perlite
5+gal 50% perlite

You can do more or less but it will affect the frequency of watering required. More perlite the more frequent you will have to feed. Personally I feel the better the drainage the faster the growth but its a balancing act and the above ratios i would say are a great place to start.

Coco has a low CEC (cation exchange capacity) so it does not hold onto nutrients as well as something like soil so we feed with every watering to keep a balanced nutrient ratio, ph and ppm in the coco. To do so we also need to flush out some of the last feed with each feeding to prevent a nutrient buildup which can affect all of these. THINK OF COCO AS SOILESS... much closer to hydro and very similar to rockwool.

I won't get into ppm in detail as thing will change quite a bit from grow to grow depending on many factors. But generally speaking start at around 300-400ppm and work up to around 800ppm. Now some may need to alter that as it will depend on your specific grow conditions.

HOW OFTEN DO WE FEED!!!

Ah the always debated subject.. 2 times a day, 1 time every 2 days, 10 times a day????

Forget that nonsense... like I say each grow is different so we need to use a better method. Let the plants tell you!!!!

Ok here is how we calculate it simply to your specific grow conditions, stage of growth, pot size and every other variable. You will never need to wonder am I feeding to much or to little again.

The formula:

1.Feed 5% of the pot size as your nutrient solution.
2. Of that we want 10-20% to come out as run off.
3. If you get more you can lower the frequency.
4. If we get less we need to increase the frequency and for that feed we need to add more to get our run off.

So I will do the calculations up to 5gal below to save you all some time. Feed the amount listed and check to make sure you get runoff of the amount listed from there adjust to dial in the feedings as they will change as the plants grow.

REMEMBER THIS IS A GUIDLINE AND NOT A HARD RULE. Our goal is to get as close as reasonably possible. It's not gonna kill your plants if its not exact.


I'm gonna round up.

1gal. Feed 250ml get 25-50ml of runoff

2gal. Feed 500ml get 50-100ml of runoff.

3gal. Feed 750ml get 75-150ml of runoff.

5 gal Feed 1litre get 100-200ml of runoff.

By doing this your plant will tell you how often you should be watering for best results.

Plant transpiration happens during photosynthesis so we only need to water during the lights on period. But in smaller containers you may find that you need to fertigate once in the middle of lights out if fertigation events are higher. Its unlikely but if your coco is dry before the first feed its not a bad idea to toss one in. Generally feed a couple hrs before lights out for the last time but you want to split the events evenly throughout lights on.

It may sound like you will be watering way to much but when you calculate how much you are feeding and then the frequency its not much more than most already do, just supplied in a manner that provides much greater stability. You will be using much smaller amounts of nutrient solution and by feeding much more frequently it doesn't take much to get your runoff while keeping the rootzone ph, ppm and moisture content ideal.
Now when you say 5% of your pot size, is that per day or per irrigation event?
I currently run:
Veg final pots in 3 gals
wk1 300 mls
wk2 600 mls
wk3 750 mls
Bloom
wk 1 810 mls
wk 2 945 mls
wk 3-6 1080 mls
wk 7-8 945 mls

The reason I ask is I had to dial back the percentages when I raised my humidity to match closer to the proper VPD.
Do you pay attention to VPD and Irrigation percentages?
 
Aqua Man

Aqua Man

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Need help I overwater my coco. Guy at the hydro store told me to go from propagation pot to 3 gal (both air pots ) and now I have sign of over watering like canoeing of the leaves and what seems like water bubble in the leafs also. Was just wondering if I should downsize to 1 gal now and take the risk of just water once every 2 days? I mess up I should of went for 1 gal first that was my mistake. Thanks any advice will be appreciated. View attachment 1158356
Watering is not your issue. The canoeing is a bit to much light. This increases transpirational demand. You will see canoeing on upper leaves, often some fading, blisters and stunting. If it was over watered it would have swollen interveinal tissue over the entire leaves and over the entire plant.

Light drives transpiration (as well as other things) I find indicas like it a bit lower RH than sativa. Drop to about 55%

Reduce the light intensity and give it about 5 days. The damaged leaves won't get better bit you should see the symtoms stop on new growth.
 
Aqua Man

Aqua Man

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Now when you say 5% of your pot size, is that per day or per irrigation event?
I currently run:
Veg final pots in 3 gals
wk1 300 mls
wk2 600 mls
wk3 750 mls
Bloom
wk 1 810 mls
wk 2 945 mls
wk 3-6 1080 mls
wk 7-8 945 mls

The reason I ask is I had to dial back the percentages when I raised my humidity to match closer to the proper VPD.
Do you pay attention to VPD and Irrigation percentages?
Per event not per day.

Indica like the higher end of vpd scale and sative lower I find. Yes I follow VPD.

 
Nectarivorous

Nectarivorous

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Per event not per day.

Indica like the higher end of vpd scale and sative lower I find. Yes I follow VPD.

I feel like EC and pH and lockout are like the kindergarten level basics from what I've seen on the forum. Starting to employ some of that but still need to nail down the basics of environment. Right now I need to flush for scarids. Look more like fruit fly than gnats but either way tonight they return to the source. But once you start to look at what your lights can do, I quickly realise CO2 is my limiting factor and if you're going to worry about that then VPD becomes all important. I've actually seen people saying VPD determines nute levels far more than the label on the bottle?
 
Aqua Man

Aqua Man

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I feel like EC and pH and lockout are like the kindergarten level basics from what I've seen on the forum. Starting to employ some of that but still need to nail down the basics of environment. Right now I need to flush for scarids. Look more like fruit fly than gnats but either way tonight they return to the source. But once you start to look at what your lights can do, I quickly realise CO2 is my limiting factor and if you're going to worry about that then VPD becomes all important. I've actually seen people saying VPD determines nute levels far more than the label on the bottle?
Kinda sorta yes. Anything that effects transpiration. Temps, humidity, wind, temp and available o2 in the rootzone, light intensity. You can steer these with VPD to a point.

You are absolutely right the more light the more things need to be dialed in and the more beneficial co2 becomes.

With fast growth comes fast problems so first thing is always reduce light when you see any issue. Dial in then back up.

Keep in mind increases in co2 actually slow transpiration so you may need to run a little lower RH or a bit higher nute concentration or a a combination of both. With co2 I recommend about 5-10% lower than VPD calculations and the nutes should need a minimal increase then.
 
NoobJay

NoobJay

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This is her at day 34. Bear in mind she had water stress four days ago, came good and was topped three days ago. Amazing how quickly they respond in Coco. She is missing her first three sets of true leaves as these were damaged beyond repair and hanging in dirt, were doing more harm then good. Almost at the same point with the last big fan leaves but feel like the plant needs them, though the new growth is taking over quickly anyway. Trimmed the fingers off one end that was in the dirt, the other is supported by the pot so I leave it for now and keep tucking it. :)
I seem to be having the same issue with the bottom leaves like you have in your pics. It’s like a camouflage like pattern on the bottom fan leaves. I also cut the bottom 2 nodes as they were getting too thick and hand watering was a pain lol. They look great tho and they bounce back fast it’s crazy. Trying to set up my watering system before I go in flower but still learning how to maintain a reservoir. I seem to over oxygenate my water as I get floating particles if I bubble or stir too long with just the pump. Still trying to find my balance lol. So much info out there but not working for me as of yet.
image.jpg
image.jpg
 
NoobJay

NoobJay

38
18
I seem to be having the same issue with the bottom leaves like you have in your pics. It’s like a camouflage like pattern on the bottom fan leaves. I also cut the bottom 2 nodes as they were getting too thick and hand watering was a pain lol. They look great tho and they bounce back fast it’s crazy. Trying to set up my watering system before I go in flower but still learning how to maintain a reservoir. I seem to over oxygenate my water as I get floating particles if I bubble or stir too long with just the pump. Still trying to find my balance lol. So much info out there but not working for me as of yet. View attachment 1162823 View attachment 1162824
Was
This is her at day 34. Bear in mind she had water stress four days ago, came good and was topped three days ago. Amazing how quickly they respond in Coco. She is missing her first three sets of true leaves as these were damaged beyond repair and hanging in dirt, were doing more harm then good. Almost at the same point with the last big fan leaves but feel like the plant needs them, though the new growth is taking over quickly anyway. Trimmed the fingers off one end that was in the dirt, the other is supported by the pot so I leave it for now and keep tucking it. :)
was the camouflage pattern on you bottom leaves du to water stress in the third pic on your last post. The droopy leave that is laying on the pot?
 
Nectarivorous

Nectarivorous

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Was

was the camouflage pattern on you bottom leaves du to water stress in the third pic on your last post. The droopy leave that is laying on the pot?
I am only going off what I've read, but based on pics that tends to be magnesium deficiency I believe. I think in some ways my watering practices did hinder this plant, but I found out at some point (sorry if converted in this post already) that my house water was 0.7 EC before I even added nutes. Was limiting my ability to add enough nutes without burning them. Have switched to RO and have seen much less of this in new growth
 
NoobJay

NoobJay

38
18
I am only going off what I've read, but based on pics that tends to be magnesium deficiency I believe. I think in some ways my watering practices did hinder this plant, but I found out at some point (sorry if converted in this post already) that my house water was 0.7 EC before I even added nutes. Was limiting my ability to add enough nutes without burning them. Have switched to RO and have seen much less of this in new growth
Dam .7 is high X) I also thought it was cal mag def and starting to add a bit in my base ro water. Was certain canna was made for ro water but after actually looking in to it I found out it was made for tap water. So still not certain how much I should bring my ec to of my ro water with cal mag before adding the base nutes as like you this will also bring my ppm/ec up a bit. Will bring my ppm up to 100 before I add my nutes and see how it goes unless you got suggestions for me 🤞 lol
 
Aqua Man

Aqua Man

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Usually If that's on bottom leaves there can be a few reasons.

Yes 1 is mag deficiency. It can be for many reasons and usually not lack of.

2 the leaves are just older and not performing well and the plant is starting to pull the mobile nutes.

3. There is a transpiration issue with those leaves. Like resting on the bucket or pro airflow to that area. .

Personally I'd just remove those to increase air flow. Microclimates are all to commonly looked over and they play a huge role in uptake.

4. Ratios of nutrients affect availability and that can also be a common issue
 
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Nectarivorous

Nectarivorous

582
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Usually I'd that's on bottom leaves there can be a few reasons.

Yes 1 is mag deficiency. It can be for many reasons.

2 the leaves are just older and not performing well and the plant is starting to pull the mobile nutes.

3. There is a transpiration issue with those leaves. Like resting on the bucket or pro airflow to that area. .

Personally I'd just remove those to increase air flow. Microclimates are all to commonly looked over and they play a huge role in uptake.

4. Ratios of nutrients affect availability and that can also be a common issue
Legend as always. I'm constantly reminded of the medical maxim 'when you hear thundering hooves don't look for zebras'. Occam's razor. The nutrient thing is such a rabbit hole, when in actual fact the answer to almost everything is environment so look there first.

I went down a rabbit hole this week of trying to fix wildly fluctuating pH. Now I've since discovered that I must buffer my RO with Calmag to prevent this. Another lesson learned. But as a responder told me - why are you going crazy over this when your plants look great? Yes there's a solution and here it is but why even measure your pH out and confuse the issue when you're totally happy with where your plants are?

I had taken on board what you said last time and I just cut them. Every time everything around that part of the plant perks up as they get more air and aren't having to support a leaf that isn't really supporting them any more. Great advice as always.

With buffering RO, I read somewhere last night that people are saying use pH up to get the water to 10, then pH down to 6 then begin adding bird nutes. That sounds like a recipe for a bucket of salt water to me? Any truth to this?
 
Aqua Man

Aqua Man

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Dam .7 is high X) I also thought it was cal mag def and starting to add a bit in my base ro water. Was certain canna was made for ro water but after actually looking in to it I found out it was made for tap water. So still not certain how much I should bring my ec to of my ro water with cal mag before adding the base nutes as like you this will also bring my ppm/ec up a bit. Will bring my ppm up to 100 before I add my nutes and see how it goes unless you got suggestions for me 🤞 lol
If using RO I always suggest cal mag. 100-150ppm is usually adequate
 

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