Im sold on these MPB's. Few Q's

  • Thread starter jakew215
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J

jakew215

okay so i have some questions on MPB, ive been doing a TON of reading, i havent gotten off my computer in weeks after finding DD's thread and completely reading the entire thing, been reading lost's thread, and many many others. i beleive i have a firm grasp on how the system operates and what not, i just have some specific questions about space issues and what would be the best way to maximize my area with my 6 plant limitation, and first and formost everyones number one issue, budget.

i will be growing to donate to my local collective, will be growing blue dream. so yeild is a major concern gowing hand in hand with cost effectiveness.

the room i will be using is 11.5 x 17 ft. one issue is the 7'6" ceiling. this has me a little worried. will i have an issue im going to be re-sheet rocking the entire room and ceiling (as it has sectional roofing now) with mold resistant paneling along with running new electrical (luckily i have a trained/certified friend in this department and have already came to an agreement) throughout and adding plugs to the ceiling and all over. the carpet is being pulled (old and torn up anyways) then i will epoxy the concrete slab with some bright white (used to be my job, have done gigantic hangers) then completely seal the room.

okay on with the nitty gritty

i have been really kicking ideas around with lighting and plant layout. and wondering if MPB is even the way to go if i cant afford a 9 Light 4 plant setup.

Im trying to stay down around 4-6 lights, with the math ive been doing this should keep me in my 6k budget (ol lady) i will be able to spend a little more if needed but just to be frank 10k+ is outta my range financially. this will already take some time as is.

im thinking my biggest purchases other than the lighting itself will be the A/C, (i have a 10 ton for my house i can use if i really need to. just have to put a dampner in i think... correct me please people) water chiller.

so my enitial thoughts on layouts were these here...

4 Plant 5 light.

L
P P
L L L
P P
L


4 plant 6 Light

P
L L
P
L L
P
L L
P

4 Plant 5 Light

P L P

L P L

P L P

4 Plant 5 light

L P L

P L P

L P L

4 Pant 6 light

L L

P P

L L

P P

L L

4 Plant 7 light

L L

P P
L L L
P P

L L


Or should i just save my money on the extra lights and do 6 lights in hoods over 6 plants. keep in mind im just trying to yeild as much as i can with 6 plants. as many times a year i can.

and if the MPB bucket just isnt the right system for me, PLEASE let me know. it just seems like a fairly siple straight forward system that someone can get introduced into hydro with. ive been doing much research on the topic and it seems like the way to go for us Cali Kids.

with the research ive been doing and the yeilds people are suggesting and showing i have come to think i can grow a pound per plant 5 times a year. im looking for a 20-25lb year. i'd be okay with 15lbs/year. Am i being realistic with a sub 9k room?


input is appreciated, thanks all.
 
J

jakew215

i think im gonna go with a 5 light four plant set up

L P L

P L P

L P L

All four plants getting light from three sides. do you guys think its possible to yield 1/2 to 1 pound per plant this way?

very space friendly i think, should leave plenty of room to wall off so i can keep the pumps and res seperate.

Should start doing some tear down on the room here in a few weeks then get all the walls sealed up then bug bomb and disinfect. my current basement area is just too dirty and impossible to completely seal. just gotta get this harvest out of the way and get to building.


My plan is to run a 40 gal res with a 1/4 hp chiller. do you think ill need a bigger chiller and res? i could go with a 70 gal res. (my hydro store has some low profile ones in 40 and 70)

Im trying to keep the setup as clean, compact and simple as possible.

Im still not even sure if this is all in my budget yet or not. im hearing people say dont get started without 15k. its like jeez i cant add up enough things that i could possibly need for that much. granted im not taking in the account of the cost of the actual room itself with drywall and all. this is just an investment on my house and isnt part of my actual grow budget.
 
TrichromeFan

TrichromeFan

the room i will be using is 11.5 x 17 ft. one issue is the 7'6" ceiling. this has me a little worried.

Im trying to stay down around 4-6 lights, with the math ive been doing this should keep me in my 6k budget (ol lady) i will be able to spend a little more if needed but just to be frank 10k+ is outta my range financially. this will already take some time as is.

im thinking my biggest purchases other than the lighting itself will be the A/C, (i have a 10 ton for my house i can use if i really need to. just have to put a dampner in i think... correct me please people) water chiller.

Or should i just save my money on the extra lights and do 6 lights in hoods over 6 plants. keep in mind im just trying to yeild as much as i can with 6 plants. as many times a year i can.

and if the MPB bucket just isnt the right system for me, PLEASE let me know. Am i being realistic with a sub 9k room?

i think im gonna go with a 5 light four plant set up

L P L

P L P

L P L

All four plants getting light from three sides. do you guys think its possible to yield 1/2 to 1 pound per plant this way?

very space friendly i think, should leave plenty of room to wall off so i can keep the pumps and res seperate.

My plan is to run a 40 gal res with a 1/4 hp chiller. do you think ill need a bigger chiller and res? i could go with a 70 gal res.

Im trying to keep the setup as clean, compact and simple as possible.

Im still not even sure if this is all in my budget yet or not. im hearing people say dont get started without 15k. its like jeez i cant add up enough things that i could possibly need for that much. granted im not taking in the account of the cost of the actual room itself with drywall and all. this is just an investment on my house and isnt part of my actual grow budget.
I would agree. I think that the 4 plant 5 light would be the way to go. If you go MPB with 7'6h you will be maxing out at 5'h. I think that will work. Otherwise you could always go with a UC. They take about 18" - 24" less height for the system. Your AC is the biggest cost, and you should not skimp there. Name brand, inverter based, split AC is the way to go. 1/4hp chiller should work for that, but a 1/2 will give you some extra insurance. Again, don't skimp on that one either. 70g for sure on the rez. You can definitely hit the numbers that you are talking about. You should also check out mr dizzle's grows on here, if you haven't already. Awesome stuff.

-TF:evilgrin0013:
 
J

jakew215

ive been looking at fujitsu mini splits for ac. i want it stay completely sealed so a window unit wouldnt work, so ive been reading. This would be a hefty expense i think. and yeah i was thinking the cooler would be around 600. the ones ive been looking at least.

i think it was a big jump to the 1/2 hp chiller on the price. it scared me. but ive been reading more and more on how important water temp is so ill probably end up getting the bigger.

and ill definitely get the 70 gal. maybe a 100 if i can manage, more water = less temperature fluctuation. but im so worried that i wont be able to afford my AN/H&G lineup going through so much water every week. lol

thanks a lot for the input TF.
 
J

jakew215

will 18k btus be enough? in this case the 18cl

or 24k btus, the 24cl

fujitsu models. prices range from 1500 to 2200 on google shopping. + line kits is about 150 - 250 then 160 for the remote. free shipping. id probably install it myself and have a HVAC come vac the lines. im pretty mechanical but ive heard its hard not to screw this up.
 
Luke Harrison

Luke Harrison

It ranges about 5,000 btu's for one 1000w light ball park, depending on the surrounding air temp around the outside of sealed grow room and how well insulated it is.
 
J

jakew215

yeah after just reading up on it a bit more it looks like i need to shoot for more in the 3 ton range. all the electrical and what not will be on another side of a wall in the basement, ill take some pictures tomorrow of what ill be working with. the room has a large window that i can vent out of too. maybe run cool tubes through there. idk.
 
TrichromeFan

TrichromeFan

jake,
I've heard good stuff about the fujitsu units. I got a friedrich from kingerson's myself. Haven't fired it up yet. Still getting over botched install-itis. They have awesome deals, but bossman got burned by them. There are window units that do not leak air, but they are not nearly as efficient as the inverter units, and from what I understand the inverter splits run more, but at a lower current draw. This means better dehumidification and energy savings. Important with trees especially. Luke Harrison is right. You definitely want to go for the 24k unit at least.
I am going with a 100g rez, but I am running 5 buckets. I would think that the 70 should do it, but it depends on your school of thought. More nute cost vs buffer. I also went with a jbj artica 1/2 hp chiller for mine.
 
J

jakew215

So i think im gonna just bite the bullet and get the 1/2 hp. that way if i ever want to expand i can.

i found a hydrofarm for 750 + shipping are they any good?

shipping is only like 30 bucks for ground shipping via UPS.




And ive been looking at the A/C and was wondering if i could get away with 30k instead of 36k and if i wanted to add lights in the future i can just add another 30k maybe? the most ill ever run in the room is nine lights.

and ive been looking at the friedrichs TF, and the prices are about the same. what unit are you running exactly if you dont mind me asking.
 
J

jakew215

oh wow those window units are much more economical.

but you said they dont run as efficient as mini splits. im not gonna see like a 100 dollar a month difference between the two do you? if thats the case ill save my pennies now and get a mini split.

i didnt know they had three ton window units.
 
J

jakew215

ehh i think im just gonna get a 24k mini split. ive found them for around 1k shipped. and if things get too hot ill get some cool tubes i guess. and if i ever want to expand ill just get a second mini split.

this sounds a little more economical on my part. for power and initial costs sake.

and after doing some more measuring i only have 8' 6" in width to my new room at the ceiling level due to the upper floor ducting running between the upper and lower floors. (my room is on a lower floor) The house was designed very poorly and had a new A/C and heat added on to the side of the house and retrofitted to the old ducting system.

i hope this is making sense to everyone. so my actual dimensions are 18x8.5x7.5. The the part under the ducting is 6' 10" and extends from the wall about 2' 6".

I think im gonna be able to raise the ceiling a few more inches after i remove the panel roofing (the shit you see in office buildings) to maybe get a 8' ceiling. but well see.

im now worried about the 8 1/2' wide area now. will that be wide enough for my setup? 5 light four plant mpb

ill try to sketch up a drawing maybe on how i plan my layout. ill get a pic too.

let me know of some input. and you think 20"s is the min height of the buckets or the actual drain heights? it seems like 2' is high enough for the drains get a res with a 14" height or something maybe? i think my res room might even be lower than my new grow room.
 
J

jakew215

here is a picture of the room ill be using, just waiting for the roomates to move rooms so i can take over theres. haha.

as you can see it has a large closet on one end and
http://i40.invalid.com/albums/e243/jakew88/IMG_0381.jpg

on the opposite end is where i would like to put the plants you can see in the pictures the lower spot along the ceiling. i really hope this doesnt present problems for me when the time comes.
http://i40.invalid.com/albums/e243/jakew88/IMG_0382.jpg

now on the other side of this wall i want to put my res and chiller all my pumps and ballasts, get everything out of the room i can... this is actually where im growing now as you can see here. the room would be against the left wall.
http://i40.invalid.com/albums/e243/jakew88/IMG_0383.jpg

let me know what you guys think...
 
TrichromeFan

TrichromeFan

i found a hydrofarm for 750 + shipping are they any good?

shipping is only like 30 bucks for ground shipping via UPS.




And ive been looking at the A/C and was wondering if i could get away with 30k instead of 36k and if i wanted to add lights in the future i can just add another 30k maybe? the most ill ever run in the room is nine lights. and ive been looking at the friedrichs TF, and the prices are about the same. what unit are you running exactly if you dont mind me asking.
The chiller should work well. I know a lot of people on here run that model.

My AC is a 24k. Although I am only running 4 lights.
http://www.kingersons.com/Friedrichsplitairconditioner24k.html

oh wow those window units are much more economical.

but you said they dont run as efficient as mini splits. im not gonna see like a 100 dollar a month difference between the two do you? if thats the case ill save my pennies now and get a mini split.

i didnt know they had three ton window units.
To know the difference in energy savings you have to compare the seer ratings and do some math to see how it could save you.

I think that you may be able to get the 24k to work, but you will definitely need to run cool tubes. And, I would make sure that you get a good brand on the AC. Broken in a year is no savings for a possible lesser quality unit.

So, were you going to partition the room? If so what is the space for the MPB area? Maybe a drawing is in order.
 
J

jakew215

i found some LG's for fairly cheap on the web.

and as for partitioning the room i really didnt plan on it...

i didnt really see the need imo...

i was just thinking keeping the buckets toward the left hand corner there. so if they do grow REALLY high it wont grow into the lower part of the ceiling.

i can use this entire room just for budding, i already have a veg/clone/mother room in the basement.

if you think i should wall it off somewhere by all means let me know cuz this surely can be done.

thanks for your input TF. appreciate it.
 
TrichromeFan

TrichromeFan

I hear good stuff about LG's. If you run 18 x 8.5 as a footprint, you are using more co2 to saturate the area than you need. As far as the duct header, you shouldn't plan on any MPB buckets below them.
 
J

jakew215

I hear good stuff about LG's. If you run 18 x 8.5 as a footprint, you are using more co2 to saturate the area than you need. As far as the duct header, you shouldn't plan on any MPB buckets below them.
i was thinking that 18' would be easier to keep the temps stable in ya know? seems like smaller the room the faster and more drastic the heat changes will be. but then again i dont wanna be filling my bottle every two weeks.

and im gonna sketch up a drawing of my proposed layout and we'll see if that will work. so what centers should i be using with this setup? from light to bucket center and/or bucket to bucket centers.
 
TrichromeFan

TrichromeFan

I think that something like a 48" center to center on the mpb's would work. Turn the tubs so that you have the greatest walking area in the middle, and run the drains on the outsides.
 
J

jakew215

here are my initial thoughts on my layout. if you guys can decipher whats going on. im a rookie with paint. downloading autocad right now.

http://i40.invalid.com/albums/e243/jakew88/MyGrow/untitled.jpg
 
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