Is this eary sign of cal-mag deficiencies, please help

[Ph 007]

Just a update if anyone interested lol

They where fed yesterday to run off
Feed
150-200ppm cal-mag
And 300-350ppm of A&B can coco feed
Total 500ppm. That's 1.0e.c

They looking better now ,
I didn't water today as the coco it still soaking if I pick pot yo very heavy and still drips out bottom, they are not sitting in runoff,
My plan is when roots show out bottom of the new pots their in ill water more often eventually daily..

THCMonster would you be watering daily with pot's still very wet and heavy?
I know they say water to run off brings fresh oxygen in to the roots but if had problems Many times with watering clones everyday


Here are sine pics from.today
On 1.0 e.c thats with 0.2-0.4 cal

 

[THCMonster]

Just a update if anyone interested lol

They where fed yesterday to run off
Feed
150-200ppm cal-mag
And 300-350ppm of A&B can coco feed
Total 500ppm. That's 1.0e.c

They looking better now ,
I didn't water today as the coco it still soaking if I pick pot yo very heavy and still drips out bottom, they are not sitting in runoff,
My plan is when roots show out bottom of the new pots their in ill water more often eventually daily..

THCMonster would you be watering daily with pot's still very wet and heavy?
I know they say water to run off brings fresh oxygen in to the roots but if had problems Many times with watering clones everyday


Here are sine pics from.today
On 1.0 e.c thats with 0.2-0.4 cal


View attachment 940970View attachment 940971View attachment 940973View attachment 940974View attachment 940975View attachment 940976View attachment 940977View attachment 940978View attachment 940979View attachment 940980View attachment 940981

No not if they are heavy, but dont let them go more then 2 days without food! Are you feeding them the whole Canna nutrient line or just the A&B? Like are you adding cannazyme and rhizo too?

Cause they will root out way faster with 150-200ppm of rhizo also added on. Rhizo is also your natural PH up too.

They still look lime green to me! They need more food!

You want them between dark green and light green. After a few feeding i would up the A&B to 450ppm.

But they are definitely looking better!

You want to get them to this shade of green! Or as close as you can

 

[Ph 007]

No not if they are heavy, but dont let them go more then 2 days without food! Are you feeding them the whole Canna nutrient line or just the A&B? Like are you adding cannazyme and rhizo too?

Cause they will root out way faster with 150-200ppm of rhizo also added on. Rhizo is also your natural PH up too.

They still look lime green to me! They need more food!

You want them between dark green and light green. After a few feeding i would up the A&B to 450ppm.

But they are definitely looking better!

You want to get them to this shade of green! Or as close as you can

View attachment 940987

Not using cannyzm yet
I am adding 4ml a litre rootonic
The cannyzm uses up 200ppm so I'm only on 500ppm , I'm worried if I add cannyzm its less room for a&b unless I upp from 500ppm to 700 that 1.4 e.c
1 seems enough to me especially the 2 smaller obces ud rather 0.8 but I'm use to soil new to coco so I'm can't tell

Also they look. It greener by eye but still tinny bit light Green but a lot better
Think its the light thats made the pictures look lighter


Forgot to say
When I fed 0.8e.c to run off the run off was very high 2.4/2.6e.c
But the run off was very dark its some roos stuff in the coco or some buffer stuff I duno, I do know if I run celan water through some coco from the bag its 0.2e.
But second feed with 1.0 run off was 1.2/1.4e.c and water looked not as dark brown

You i think said ignore the 0.2 e.c of the coco, i have

They had a re-pot remember so they first run off brought what ever is is the coco out look the colour of the water

 

[Ph 007]

Looking netter now still not wateree yet tmd I think in will , still bit heavy the pots are

This ibe below look really nice and green , not sure how the photo will look tho

 

[TheWizardOfOz]

Bro, my suggestion would have been to foliar some of that cal mag at a low strength, say 1/8th.

Then while that should help, work out what's going on in the root system.

Someone I know says the prebuffered coco is SHITE. Some even have runoff off over 2.0EC straight outta the bag, and very acidic, ridiculous.

Always check and know what's in your medium before planting. If it had an EC of 0.2, there could be something in it your plants didn't like. I hear of people flushing large quantities of fluid through their mediums in some situations like yours, i.e not always straight water, just a larger amount of a normal feed water to help flush out any crap that may be in the medium.

Other thing could be to get a new bottle or brand of nutes. I consider sometimes, certain nutrients might "turn" from age or heat for eg. and cause lockouts.

All the best!

Edit, looking at the photis again of your runoff, my money is on the "prebuffered" or unwashed coco you used. The plants just did not like it. Only way would be the flush the medium with a proper balance of nutes.

Always remember that with coco, you can go up to 6.3 to 6.5 if you have trouble keeping your plants green. And always remember you'll be feeding alot of the calmag to the coco itself, the plant will need extra.

 

[Ph 007]

Bro, my suggestion would have been to foliar some of that cal mag at a low strength, say 1/8th.

Then while that should help, work out what's going on in the root system.

Someone I know says the prebuffered coco is SHITE. Some even have runoff off over 2.0EC straight outta the bag, and very acidic, ridiculous.

Always check and know what's in your medium before planting. If it had an EC of 0.2, there could be something in it your plants didn't like. I hear of people flushing large quantities of fluid through their mediums in some situations like yours, i.e not always straight water, just a larger amount of a normal feed water to help flush out any crap that may be in the medium.

Other thing could be to get a new bottle or brand of nutes. I consider sometimes, certain nutrients might "turn" from age or heat for eg. and cause lockouts.

All the best!

Edit, looking at the photis again of your runoff, my money is on the "prebuffered" or unwashed coco you used. The plants just did not like it. Only way would be the flush the medium with a proper balance of nutes.

Always remember that with coco, you can go up to 6.3 to 6.5 if you have trouble keeping your plants green. And always remember you'll be feeding alot of the calmag to the coco itself, the plant will need extra.

Hi mate thanks for the info

Ye something's in the coco init , it is pre-buffed I know that says on bag.
Also when I start cuttings in 6" pots i dont always get problems , but when I do I normally can get then looking good again hut then i pot them I to 15litre pots later on and boom its starts all over again , like it gets new fresh coco and what ever is in it down agree. Or it's because I don't use cal-mag but iv had few grown with no cal-mag and all had been fine, also i used cal-mag in my first few grown I was fwttibg problems then as well hut u alwsi was over watering small plants big pots..

I have been meaning to try cal-mag as a spray as your said less shir going on at the roots then , but my cal-mag don't say you can spray it, I beeb planing to look fow one tuwt can be sprayed or is mine frine to spray.

I'm gonna just add cal-mag from now on and maybe flush the coco before using it, this sounds headwork that I didn't want to be doing lol,
Then next be new coco maygw brick and evantally might to back to ky old nutrients ad its for soft water the bpk is high but iv used it for years in soil no problems, also my first coco grow was with it and had 2 plants 600watt 7 oz dry a plant best iv every had in soil or coco, tueb since then with canna my yield had been less 3-4 a plant 4.5 sometimes, all I used on 7oz palntw was a&b and pk boost from 3rd week to 6th week
Was cheap asweoo a&b 40 quid lasts good half a year and pk boost is 12 quid last few crops canna way expensive
If I hit 7all time with canna I'd stay with it.

I was setting pH at 6.0 but out was 6.3 so I set to 5.8/5.9 now,, also my first coco grow with the 7oz was ph5.8

Hip fully it's more of a cal-mag problem rather then the coco

 

[Ph 007]

Fed today it's been 1.5/2 days since last watered.

I fed 150-200 ppm cal-mag
Cannyzm at 100ppm that's recommended dosage on the bottle.
And the a&b 250-300ppm
And rootonic at 4ml a litre..
Total fed was 500-600ppm that's 1.0/1.2 e.c
PH at 5.8

Run off was
700ppm that's 1.4e.c

Pics below im sure I can see sign of over feed on some leaf tips
Not 100% tho could be something else?
Also I can see some sort of leaf cupping
And the top of 1 of the plants has some what looks like a bit of twisting kewf on new growth only on one plant.


These pics where today and taken 15 mins after I watered.

Then here are pic's 1-2 hour or so after watering

Also I topped the 2 big one's when I watered earlier , they are growing a bit now,
And literally hour or 2 after watering today the roots had a bit of growth sticking out bottom now , its crazy how roots can grow so quick

 

[02trueblue]

They're getting better! You could use the Rhizotonic at 6ml/gal instead of full strength.

I'm surprised the Cannazym adds 100ppm. When i add 9ml/gal it only adds 40-50ppm. Are you sure this is correct? I'd use 100-150ppm of calmag instead of 150-200ppm.

So....
tap water = about 100ppm
A + B = 400ppm
Rhizotonic = 50ppm
Cannazym = 50ppm

That should be about 600ppm total. That's exactly what I feed my plants at pH 6.0

 

[Ph 007]

They're getting better! You could use the Rhizotonic at 6ml/gal instead of full strength.

I'm surprised the Cannazym adds 100ppm. When i add 9ml/gal it only adds 40-50ppm. Are you sure this is correct? I'd use 100-150ppm of calmag instead of 150-200ppm.

So....
tap water = about 100ppm
A + B = 400ppm
Rhizotonic = 50ppm
Cannazym = 50ppm

That should be about 600ppm total. That's exactly what I feed my plants at pH 6.0

I add cannyzm at 2.5ml a litre as the canna chart says, but it seems a lot I seem to put less a&b as they small and try keep my ppm down , I usually add it later on when their bigger.

My tap water is 0.75ppm or 0.65ppm
Can't remember exactly but its not over 0.75 tho.


I shall try what your said on the next feeding thanks

I fed and ppm out was 200ppm more that OK apparently the monster said and google lol

Since adding Cal-mag at 100-150ppm thats what I been addibg not 150-200ppm sorry
Since adding like THCmonster said the look a nice green colour now well, still something up but a lot better , maybe they just need note time now

 

[Ph 007]

Maybe add cal every other feed or not

 

[Ph 007]

Looking better again, and have grown a bit , I fed yesterday but not today as coco still soaking I'll water tomorrow now.

So far cal-mag and upping my feed e.c
Has really pulled these giros around.

THCmonster thank you for the help buddy

Before

After

 

[02trueblue]

I think you're on the right track! At this point, just keep doing what you're doing! Like you said, just give them more time. They're growing well at this point, so they'll keep getting better looking as the new growth comes in.

Seems like you're figuring it all out!
Monster's grow tips are on point.

Calmag every other watering is an option. Or, my personal approach is keep in continually but at a lower dose. There are definitely WRONG answers to many things in growing.. but most things have many approaches that work. Finding out what works for YOU is half the battle

 

[Ph 007]

I think you're on the right track! At this point, just keep doing what you're doing! Like you said, just give them more time. They're growing well at this point, so they'll keep getting better looking as the new growth comes in.

Seems like you're figuring it all out!
Monster's grow tips are on point.

Calmag every other watering is an option. Or, my personal approach is keep in continually but at a lower dose. There are definitely WRONG answers to many things in growing.. but most things have many approaches that work. Finding out what works for YOU is half the battle

Ye knew his stuff ,
And thank you mate for your info, I'll be doing roughly what you said everytine I plant a cutting , tontey keep ppn down for first few days,, so less cannyzm and and rootonic , I'll use half of cannyzm at 50ppm instead of the 100ppm same with roottonic, and still add caomag like THConster said, but I'll try messing about with that cal now , less or every other feed, to see how they react, deffo looking better tho, i had 4 that where looked great 1 week away from flower had to bin them, they went way down hill , I never give them cal gutted

 

[Ph 007]

I was wondering do i need cal-mag in my clone machine is did in the coco.

My problem is I use to use nutrients for soft water. Now on canna coco in my clone machine i always get some yellowing at the start since using canna coco nutrients. But with my old nutrients I didn't get it well nowhere as bad

reason i changed nutrients was my old nutrient's had a very high npk.

here is a picture if my cutting they where started in 0.4-0.6 e.c. thats 200-300 ppm
before roots showed and today I upped to 0.6 e.c thats 300 ppm , ph 5.8
My tap water ppm is 0.75ppm

im not sure why they are yellowing never use to with my old nutrients in the pics below but with cana coco nutrients in my cloner they seem to yellow
is it because these nutrients are for coco only, or do I need calmag?
Or is it I just need more feed a&b.


hard to see in the pics but the top of every cutting the where new growth would be is so yellow its almost white.

Her my are my old nutrients using these nutrients I never had yellowing like this in my clone machine, but with can a coco I get this yellowing

 

[Ph 007]

Anyone

 

[02trueblue]

Hmm. Cloning can be complicated

I'd give them 3-4ml/gal each of A + B. The extra cal-mag is for the coco itself, not necessarily for the plant. You could put 1-2ml/gal of cal-mag. I'd use 6ml/gal of Rhizotonic. Then keep the pH wherever you like it at for clones. Me personally, i always keep it right around 6.0, but 5.8 is fine too

Also - light color on new growth is fine, as long as the plant grows out of it. Once the leaves get a little larger they might darken up

 

[Ph 007]

Hmm. Cloning can be complicated

I'd give them 3-4ml/gal each of A + B. The extra cal-mag is for the coco itself, not necessarily for the plant. You could put 1-2ml/gal of cal-mag. I'd use 6ml/gal of Rhizotonic. Then keep the pH wherever you like it at for clones. Me personally, i always keep it right around 6.0, but 5.8 is fine too

Also - light color on new growth is fine, as long as the plant grows out of it. Once the leaves get a little larger they might darken up

I'll try that tomorrow I'll change the water, roots groot growth is very good
but plants are yellowing tho on 0.4e.c and i tried 0.6e.c of a&b ,

Today I changes the water just tap water that has a ppm of 0.75 I added calmag then till water was 200ppm that all is in the water, but the calmag contains some nitrogen.

Im doing exactly the same as I have for years but using canna coco nutrients instead of my old nutrients in pics above and getting yellowing tith the canna i wouldn't with my old nutrients

I know my old nutrients is for soft water
And canna is not
So that why I though calmag as my old nutrients contains what calmag supplies I think? Is that right so you know

Im wondering as well if I buy nutrients for soft water would I still need the calmag with the coco ,

 

[THCMonster]

Looking better again, and have grown a bit , I fed yesterday but not today as coco still soaking I'll water tomorrow now.

So far cal-mag and upping my feed e.c
Has really pulled these giros around.

THCmonster thank you for the help buddy

Before

View attachment 942250View attachment 942252View attachment 942253



After
View attachment 942254View attachment 942256View attachment 942257View attachment 942258

Glad to hear it man!

I know it can get really frustrating sometimes! Everyone thinks this shits easy! But they look like new plants! If you see the early signs like before hit them up with either more food (if they start to yellow out) or hit the with cal-mag if you see the rust spotting or yellow tiger stripes!

Great job man just keep it up!

If you ever need to ask me a question just msg me direct or if you want to get ahold of me in your thread just tag me by: @THCMonster

If you tag me if will notify me!

Just be careful with some of the things you get told on here! Not saying people are wrong, just try not to try a million different things otherwise you will mess up your plants in the end!

Great job man! Wish you the best of luck. Glad i was able to help

 

[THCMonster]

I was wondering do i need cal-mag in my clone machine is did in the coco.

My problem is I use to use nutrients for soft water. Now on canna coco in my clone machine i always get some yellowing at the start since using canna coco nutrients. But with my old nutrients I didn't get it well nowhere as bad

reason i changed nutrients was my old nutrient's had a very high npk.

here is a picture if my cutting they where started in 0.4-0.6 e.c. thats 200-300 ppm
before roots showed and today I upped to 0.6 e.c thats 300 ppm , ph 5.8
My tap water ppm is 0.75ppm

im not sure why they are yellowing never use to with my old nutrients in the pics below but with cana coco nutrients in my cloner they seem to yellow
is it because these nutrients are for coco only, or do I need calmag?
Or is it I just need more feed a&b.


hard to see in the pics but the top of every cutting the where new growth would be is so yellow its almost white.

View attachment 945241View attachment 945243View attachment 945246View attachment 945247View attachment 945248View attachment 945249View attachment 945251View attachment 945252View attachment 945253
View attachment 945263


Her my are my old nutrients using these nutrients I never had yellowing like this in my clone machine, but with can a coco I get this yellowing

View attachment 945254View attachment 945255View attachment 945257View attachment 945261

They need food, give them 200ppm of the A&B in the cloner, anytime you ever start getting roots give them nutes, but no more then 150-200ppm to start off with

Foliar them with some Rhizo too makes a big difference.

You can make a foliar of cal-mag and rhizo

100ppm rhizo
100ppm calmag

But i wouldnt bother with the cal-mag in the water! Your coco A has calcium in it already!

They are yellowing cause they need food!

 

[THCMonster]

also its not a big deal at all, but see in the pics above (of your plants, not your clones), see how the stems are purple in some spots, you have a very mild phosphorus deficiency, like i said its not a big deal at all, but i would recommend feeding your plants about 1-2ml/Gallon more of the Coco B then the A.

Like if your doing 8ml/Gallon of COCO A then do 10ml of COCO B.

It will help out on those purpling stems greatly!