Light Outage During Early Veg While I Was Gone: Extreme Plant Stress

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thcoso

thcoso

202
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Day 25 Veg:

Terribly Bad News:

My grow is almost all automated. My RH, temps, lights and when needed, watering and feeding can automate for about 7 days. I'm trying to make my own strains that are different than what I currently have. So, to add to my current stock of Gorilla Glue and Blue Dream fem pollen collected from bananas that occurred during my last grow, 3 strains from Purple City Genetics: Lemon Berry Crisp, 14 Bombers and HeadHunter fem/photo seeds. So, I flew to Jamaica for 8 days to seed hunt, leaving my current grow to run on autopilot. At some point during the trip, the main timer controlling the LED became disconnected from its power source by a freak accident, leaving the ladies in total dark for an unknown number of days--at least 4 (I had a friend drop by to check the auto-watering system was correctly feeding and not under or over watering. He did not know when my dark period was, so the dark tent did not cause him to worry. However, at 8am when he was there, there should have been lights. That means it was at least 4 days, but I think it was more. I think it was all 8 light cycles; because, the ladies showed almost no growth from the day I set the water system up. Three days before I left, I topped the plants to split the main stalk. The topping I did had only sprouted a few millimeters in 8 days, which was close to where they were when I left. The growth is yellowish/brown and the leaves are curled under. This makes me think they were w/o light for all 8 cycles and the 8th cycle being when I noticed around 4pm--11 hours into its 18 hour cycle. I think in my hurry to set all the automations for 8 days which requires me to switch my digital timer out with an analog. To do this I had to remove the wire tie keeping the timer securely attracted to its power source. In my hurry to get to the airport, I didnt replace the wire tie which allowed the mass of the earth to warp space. It is this warping of space that caused the timer to come dislodged from the power. In other words, gravity took over where my stupidity stopped.

But, overall when I first found them, they looked sick, but not too far gone. I assessed that 66.6% of the plants look they could recover. All 3 strains are mostly green with some slight yellowing. At this point, I did not know how long the lights were out. HOWEVER, once I restarted the light cycle, within a couple of hours all three began to show signs of extreme stress. All the leaves on all plants are quickly and drastically shrinking, turning yellow with the ends and edges dying as they curl under even more.

The main stalks are losing their colosr. So, I decided to do the same process I use when young vegging plants have transplant shock.

I raised the light to lower the amount of intense light causing the light shock, switched it to 24 hours of light to provide as much photosynthesis time as possible, usually 14 days of 24/0 light, and raised the humidity level to 85%; however, I have not added humidity due to the insane amount of rain we have had, which is keeping the RH in the upper 90's. If needed, I will add a pan of water with a rag touching it on one end and attached to the fan on the other to up the RH as the ladies recover.

9:32pm-- almost 30 hours into their recovery, it is now obvious that 14 Bombers is dead. All leaves are either dead or almost dead and it shows no signs of any new, green growth. To the contrary, it is shrinking and turning white.

LBC is not looking happy, but not all her leaves are dead; its stalk is still mostly green and there is signs of fresh, new green growth from inside the bottom node. However the tops I split will probably be removed tomorrow if they dont show recovery. There is no need to waste what little energy the photosynthesis provides on necrosis. I needs to concentrate the growth on the bottom nodes. If recovery stalls anymore or doesnt show enough recovery, I will probably top it back down to node 2 or 3 then essentially repeat veg starting around day 12-15 since that is where they were in height at that time.

Headhunter--like LBC it is still mostly green with dead leaf tips and some dying edges. The stalk is mostly green and it is showing some new, green growth on the lower nodes.. I think it is suffering from some light shock that LBC seems to not show. Hopefully, once the light shock passes, new growth will reoccur.

As for 14 bombers, I will not be dropping another seed this grow.

LBC and HH will no longer follow the grow parameters I set for these 3 plants: make lots of clones, once it is obvious there is at least 1 strong clone growing from each plant, flip the original mamas and flower them while the clones veg to become isolated mama plants that will provide many generations of clones.

Instead, I am dropping 6 of my newly acquired Jamaican seeds: 2 strawberry, 2 raspberry and 2 Jamaican Kush. These 6 plants will become seedlings and hopefully catch up in size to LBC and HH over the next 14 days as they recover from the light loss along with another topping topping in a few days to remove all stems and leaves that appear to be draining and straining the plant as the dying parts use up the little amounts of energy and nutrients being produced.

I do not plan to do any excessive training other than some very basic LST, topping and lollypopping.

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New Green Growth
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Frankster

Frankster

“Be realistic, demand the impossible!”
Supporter
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I think this is a problem where we think we have everything on autopilot, then the autopilot crashes, and we wonder how it all went wrong.

Growing great cannabis takes time and energy period, and while setting up automation is a great objective and can take a lot of the physical work out of growing, I don't think it's the way for any newer grower to start out TBH, it's really advanced technique and should be attempted by professionals, and those with good diagnostic and calibration acumen.

To be sure, I'm not trying to bomb you situation but I'm trying to wrap my head around what's gone wrong here, because I've been there before in times past. I've always tried to pick up the pieces, learn from it and move on. Also, I'm not suggesting that automation cannot be successfully implemented by the hobbyist or even novice growers. I'm only suggesting that "hands on" creates opportunity.


Personally,, I get a tremendous amount of satisfaction about simply doing some things manually. Although, I have considered it of late.
 
thcoso

thcoso

202
43
I think this is a problem where we think we have everything on autopilot, then the autopilot crashes, and we wonder how it all went wrong.

Growing great cannabis takes time and energy period, and while setting up automation is a great objective and can take a lot of the physical work out of growing, I don't think it's the way for any newer grower to start out TBH, it's really advanced technique and should be attempted by professionals, and those with good diagnostic and calibration acumen.

To be sure, I'm not trying to bomb you situation but I'm trying to wrap my head around what's gone wrong here, because I've been there before in times past. I've always tried to pick up the pieces, learn from it and move on. Also, I'm not suggesting that automation cannot be successfully implemented by the hobbyist or even novice growers. I'm only suggesting that "hands on" creates opportunity.


Personally,, I get a tremendous amount of satisfaction about simply doing some things manually. Although, I have considered it of late.
I've been growing since 1996. The automation did not cause the problem, unless we classify a timer as automation--which technically it is, but not one that is usually subject to major failure. The water automation is just a small $15 fish tank water pump I mainly use to add O2 to my compost tea and gallon jugs of water/food.

I knew the timer was too heavy for the Edison outlet it was in, hence the wire ties securing it to the outlet. I really should buy a new outlet. I was in a hurry to get to the airport because I had an alert that security was requesting 3 hours early instead of 2. In my hurry I just forgot to redo the wire tie when I switched out the timers. I don't know why I only have 1 digital timer and 5 analog, except for the fact, I only bought the digital timer for its ability to program for up to 14 days utilizing times as low as 1 min. That is perfect for a watering system and overkill for my early veg light.

Had I not used a water system and let my friend hand water--this would have been avoided
Had I wire tied the timer once I replaced the digital--this would have been avoided
Had I made known my light schedule to my friend, he would have investigated the lack of lights cause he knows how anal I am over everything being as well organized, as well maintained, basically as proactive as possible to avoid issues. Since I stopped using MH and SP lights for LED's and completely redid my RH system to be self contained and fully programmable and gave my main tent it's own 125btu AC and after 2 grows of testing different heaters, I discovered a simple $10 hairdryer set to low heat and on a timer was perfect when paired with the T6 and T4 exhaust fan system I use for controlling the cold, and buying 15 sheets of silver backed 1/2 inch 4x8 sheets of stiff foam insulation and lots of 2x4's, framed in some temp walls and completely covered all sides, top and bottom of the 2 main tents while venting all exhaust air and removed humidity into a French drain that is 3 feet below the tent and dumps into a 20 foot, charcoal / sand filled drain in my back yard. I've been building this set up which is now 3 tents, and a cloning station that covers almost half of a 1400 sq ft basement. Once a grow is in full swing, I'll easily spend over 20 hours a week with my girls on top of a 60 plus hour work week sept-may (I work in higher education--no pun intended) so I over work 7.5 months a year and stay stoned the other months.

The lesson here is, dont be careless. When you make a change, triple check the change for accuracy. And avoid leaving the grow unattended for more than 3 light cycles cause after 72 hours of any major stress event, recovery becomes harder to achieve.

I dont remember the professor teaching me to strap up a timer during a plant science class, prob cause the sun is on its own timer. lol....... But he did teach us about how dark caused necrosis and the math behind when a plant wont recover for extended dark.

The water is simple. On Wednesday the pump would come on for 3 minutes which is about .5 gal per plant and on sat it would dump the other .5 gal. Even if that failed, my soil would have kept moisture I use 1/3 happy frog, 1/3 coco loco and 1/3 strawberry fields with some added organics from roots organic. They were in 5 gal pots with 1 gal of extra water in the trays for uptake.
 
lvstealth

lvstealth

Supporter
1,310
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Did your water system work? What you describe sounds like no water instead of no light.

I've had to leave a few times and found I can have lots of dark time without much harm.

Depending on where they were in flower, I'd worry about the water friend who gave them light in the dark time.

Even automated, I monitor mine remotely through my phone. I even have an old phone I use with Alfred app so I can see things.

Good luck with it though! Glad you got a few seeds from your trip! Did you take pics in Jamaica? Love to see!
 
thcoso

thcoso

202
43
Did your water system work? What you describe sounds like no water instead of no light.

I've had to leave a few times and found I can have lots of dark time without much harm.

Depending on where they were in flower, I'd worry about the water friend who gave them light in the dark time.

Even automated, I monitor mine remotely through my phone. I even have an old phone I use with Alfred app so I can see things.

Good luck with it though! Glad you got a few seeds from your trip! Did you take pics in Jamaica? Love to see!
watering system worked exactly as it should. I've used it many times. It is def light starvation. the plants were actually over watered for my taste, but not to the point of lockout or rot. I rely on the light to provide a steady and predictable heat source from which I can mathematically determine my rate of water loss via humidity. I think I could have gone all 8 days and not over stressed by inderwatering. My soil is awesome at holding moisture and allowing excess to drain all at the same time.
1/3 happy frog, 1/3 cocoloco, 1/3 strawberry fields with some extra peat moss and roots organic dry additives.
 
thcoso

thcoso

202
43
I think this is a problem where we think we have everything on autopilot, then the autopilot crashes, and we wonder how it all went wrong.

Growing great cannabis takes time and energy period, and while setting up automation is a great objective and can take a lot of the physical work out of growing, I don't think it's the way for any newer grower to start out TBH, it's really advanced technique and should be attempted by professionals, and those with good diagnostic and calibration acumen.

To be sure, I'm not trying to bomb you situation but I'm trying to wrap my head around what's gone wrong here, because I've been there before in times past. I've always tried to pick up the pieces, learn from it and move on. Also, I'm not suggesting that automation cannot be successfully implemented by the hobbyist or even novice growers. I'm only suggesting that "hands on" creates opportunity.


Personally,, I get a tremendous amount of satisfaction about simply doing some things manually. Although, I have considered it of late.
Here is my last grow diary of 8 plants 4 gorilla glue and 4 blue dream crossed with 1 of 4 different strains due to bananas where the seeds were being produced.

 
thcoso

thcoso

202
43
Did your water system work? What you describe sounds like no water instead of no light.

I've had to leave a few times and found I can have lots of dark time without much harm.

Depending on where they were in flower, I'd worry about the water friend who gave them light in the dark time.

Even automated, I monitor mine remotely through my phone. I even have an old phone I use with Alfred app so I can see things.

Good luck with it though! Glad you got a few seeds from your trip! Did you take pics in Jamaica? Love to see!
Hit me up privately and we will talk......THCoso
 
thcoso

thcoso

202
43
UPDATE ON PLANTS: THEY SHOULD ALL LIVE!!!!!

Veg Day 31

Stress Recovery Day 8

Since I discovered my 3 ladies were in shock from 4-7 days of complete darkness. Over the past 7 days, the ladies have really taken different paths in their recovery.

When I have moderate-severe transplant shock, my typical fix is to:

a. isolate the plant
b. place it under 24 light but lower the intensity
c. raise the RH to no less than 80% (90% if possible)
d. raise the heat to no less than 80 degrees f

Usually within 2-5 days the plant will completely recover.

So, I am trying this same approach with these ladies except:
I will not raise the RH nor Temp for more than 36 hours since they all have developed root systems leaving me to believe they will be able to process water better than a plant in transplant shock.

The results have been drastically different for each strain.

Lemon Berry Crisp—


She has made a complete recovery and shows little signs of any shock, except for a couple of fan leaves swith some yellow spots.

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Head Hunter—


In the beginning, this plant looked just like LBC in both size, leaf color and amount of overall distress. However, as soon as the 24 hour light schedule started, it was obvious she was not happy. She instantly turned all leaves in a downward curl away from the light. So, I lowered the light intensity on her, which seemed to help. By day the 4, her old growth was almost all yellow, but she had all new growth sprouting out of node 1. So, I made the decision to cut my losses and top her back down to node 1. I know she has a strong root system that should be able to sustain the plant over the next couple of weeks while she concentrates her energy on making more chlorophyll producing foliage for photosynthesis. Until then, I imagine all root production will stop.

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14 Bombers—this girl is the most impressive. She is in the worst shape; she has been almost dead for the past 7 days, but she keeps on living. She was always the slowest to develop, and I declared her dead when I found them last week. But, she refuses to quit. Every day she shows a little more green foliage. Like Head Hunter, she had most of her fan leaves ruined by the dark shock, but I did not have to top her back down to node 1. She may outgrow the HH over the next couple of weeks.

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Tomorrow will be day 8 since I started their 24 hours of light. Since LBC is thriving, I will return her dark hours. I may begin with a graduated schedule:


days 1 and 2: 20/4


day 3 and 4: 19/5


day 5: 18/6 normal schedule





HH and 14 Bombers will be moved to another tent and kept under 24/0 for a few more days too help promote as much chlorophyll containing foliage as possible to provide enough energy via photosynthesis to sustain a dark cycle. I plan to keep them in 24/0 until they produce 2-4 full fan leaves to feed the new growth. At some point along the way, I will introduce them to a graduated light/dark as well, but I may proceed even more slowly to help reduce any more shock:


day 1: 22/2


day 2: 21/3


day 3: 20/4


day 4: 19/I 5


day 6: 18/6

tempImageUda9sa.png
 
Ponky

Ponky

1,390
163
When my plants have good genetics they handle thing like deprivation of light. I've had a chopped down plant with a bit of nugs left go in my garage. Getting just whatever light gone in from from the the door window and it regenerated and started growing with no added water. I found it revegging and trying to live. It was a potent kush. Didn't want to die. Fungus would have consumed any of my weaker discarded strains. So. Mixed blessing really. Killed the weak.
 
thcoso

thcoso

202
43
When my plants have good genetics they handle thing like deprivation of light. I've had a chopped down plant with a bit of nugs left go in my garage. Getting just whatever light gone in from from the the door window and it regenerated and started growing with no added water. I found it revegging and trying to live. It was a potent kush. Didn't want to die. Fungus would have consumed any of my weaker discarded strains. So. Mixed blessing really. Killed the weak.
Yea they all pulled through with one of them hardly showing any sings of distress.
 
chinacat420

chinacat420

27
3
Glad to see your ladies are recovering! Young plants can be extremely resilient and can overcome stressors that would wipe out older plants.

We all have had the ‘woulda, coulda, shoulda’ moments at some point(s) during our grows, and hopefully we learn something from those times. My biggest lesson was to always have more than one light in my tent (or at least a back up if two won’t fit). I had a new LED light that failed in week 3 of flower. Luckily I still had another LED in the tent, but wasn’t quite sufficient for my 3 plants so I had to Rush to buy another LED light. It took over 2 months to get the burned out light replaced; it was a Chinese made light that I bought via an American online grow shop that refused to exchange the light for me and had me deal with the light company in China myself. Second lesson: buy lights made/sold in the US and make sure the warranty includes quick replacement.
 
Frankster

Frankster

“Be realistic, demand the impossible!”
Supporter
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I've been growing since 1996. The automation did not cause the problem, unless we classify a timer as automation--which technically it is, but not one that is usually subject to major failure. The water automation is just a small $15 fish tank water pump I mainly use to add O2 to my compost tea and gallon jugs of water/food.

I knew the timer was too heavy for the Edison outlet it was in, hence the wire ties securing it to the outlet. I really should buy a new outlet. I was in a hurry to get to the airport because I had an alert that security was requesting 3 hours early instead of 2. In my hurry I just forgot to redo the wire tie when I switched out the timers. I don't know why I only have 1 digital timer and 5 analog, except for the fact, I only bought the digital timer for its ability to program for up to 14 days utilizing times as low as 1 min. That is perfect for a watering system and overkill for my early veg light.

Had I not used a water system and let my friend hand water--this would have been avoided
Had I wire tied the timer once I replaced the digital--this would have been avoided
Had I made known my light schedule to my friend, he would have investigated the lack of lights cause he knows how anal I am over everything being as well organized, as well maintained, basically as proactive as possible to avoid issues. Since I stopped using MH and SP lights for LED's and completely redid my RH system to be self contained and fully programmable and gave my main tent it's own 125btu AC and after 2 grows of testing different heaters, I discovered a simple $10 hairdryer set to low heat and on a timer was perfect when paired with the T6 and T4 exhaust fan system I use for controlling the cold, and buying 15 sheets of silver backed 1/2 inch 4x8 sheets of stiff foam insulation and lots of 2x4's, framed in some temp walls and completely covered all sides, top and bottom of the 2 main tents while venting all exhaust air and removed humidity into a French drain that is 3 feet below the tent and dumps into a 20 foot, charcoal / sand filled drain in my back yard. I've been building this set up which is now 3 tents, and a cloning station that covers almost half of a 1400 sq ft basement. Once a grow is in full swing, I'll easily spend over 20 hours a week with my girls on top of a 60 plus hour work week sept-may (I work in higher education--no pun intended) so I over work 7.5 months a year and stay stoned the other months.

The lesson here is, dont be careless. When you make a change, triple check the change for accuracy. And avoid leaving the grow unattended for more than 3 light cycles cause after 72 hours of any major stress event, recovery becomes harder to achieve.

I dont remember the professor teaching me to strap up a timer during a plant science class, prob cause the sun is on its own timer. lol....... But he did teach us about how dark caused necrosis and the math behind when a plant wont recover for extended dark.

The water is simple. On Wednesday the pump would come on for 3 minutes which is about .5 gal per plant and on sat it would dump the other .5 gal. Even if that failed, my soil would have kept moisture I use 1/3 happy frog, 1/3 coco loco and 1/3 strawberry fields with some added organics from roots organic. They were in 5 gal pots with 1 gal of extra water in the trays for uptake.
Yea, no doubt I've had similar disasters.

Yea they all pulled through with one of them hardly showing any sings of distress.
Good to hear they pulled though it all. We put them though hell and they still can still deliver good results. The takeaway here is when you've got a gazillion timers and whatnot is to make sure everything's plugged into the correct whatever, and all your i's are dotted and t's crossed. Don't be in a rush and double, triple check things.

I do it a lot with pH these days, and while concocting solutions. I'll check the pH to figure how much I need to move it, then check again after I've put the next ingredient in, and then yet again sometimes. Same with the ppm's. I've simply made enough 1 time mistakes in the past, that I'm neurotic now. I've also got a bad habit of sometimes turning down the light units and then forgetting to turn them back up. Would be nice to see a dial that has an auto up built into it. Or simply a "attend" mode, that dials down the LED for a programmed amount of time. lol

Also, I think anytime we change anything, or establish a new routine, it always carries some inherent risk, or x factor. There's something to be said about having a consistent routine in place, and spending a fair amount of time tending the plants. I think it gives better insight. I'm more connected to them, picking them up, handling them these days, especially since I do so many transplanting from one container to the next. In my setting, all of your plants would still be in shot glass sized cups, or solo cups at maximum at that point. Not those big containers. I be building root balls before I transfer, because I think it induces vigor, and better overall resistance for the root zones. Better overall arbuscular mycorrhiza development.

These are the blueberry clones I've been working on of late.

IMG_20210830_180459.jpg
IMG_20210830_180508.jpg


Then when I move them, I like them at minimum about this thick. Not too root bound, not too little. So they can expand into the next layer. Usually a 1 or 2 gallon container. I try to not go up more than 3x-5x, so if it's in a shot glass, it goes up to a solo first, then onward. I do have some jiffy plugs coming though, and I do them also, it's convenient when I need to tent them, and I'm doing a bunch. This is what that looks like....

Generally speaking I use the jiffy of late, then transplant into the solo's, and then into 1's, that's been the order of things right now. Unless of course I'm lucky enough to get a few clones sent in the mail. 🤣 Then I'm really neurotic.
IMG_20210827_201239728.jpg

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Rooke

Rooke

1,044
163
Heya farmer’s I just read your posts and want to thank you for sharing them, lots said and lots learned and I really appreciate it! I currently have been growing outdoors for the last 5 years all hands on no automation 1 because I’m as anal as it comes and 2 I don’t know or trust anyone when it comes to my plants having said that it would sure be nice to have someone that I could depend on to be able to leave for a week and not worry about the friend having an emergency that would cause a problem cuz shit happens! Which makes me think that possibly a list of all feedings, light schedules, ph etc. Etc. And being able to double check and triple check that all is in order for Murphy can strike at anytime! I’m happy that you and others have shared this as I want to start growing indoors again so I can take 1 summer off and still be able to keep my supply full enough to get by. Now to find that special person is truly another story. It’s folks like yourselves that help us all by sharing these experiences that make us all better growers! ☮️
 
Frankster

Frankster

“Be realistic, demand the impossible!”
Supporter
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Yea, they filled out just fine. You are quite the little spider farmer by the looks of it. That's some old school technique there for sure. 👀 Some nice big healthy looking fans, it's thickening up nicely.

I bet you end up rewarded with some big towering cola's after all that fancy training. I see all the drill holes you've done over time, I've got an old leather punch I use on my cloth pots and plastic solo's, same concept. Then I get thin clip twist wire at the dollar store.

Tie downs are probably the single most important mechanical concept in cannabis growing, IMO. My mind has evolved on this concept infinitely. It levels the playing field, literally. Allows light to be dialed down evenly, and in a very precise controlled fashion..
 
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