Mikedin’s Living Soil Adventure and Living Soil discussion topic

[Eledin]

Well that would make my job way easier hahaha. I use fermented plant extract, from kelp, tropical plants and from my previous harvests. I dont let nothing go to waste so I make a concentrate, add some enzymes to help the process of decomposing chlorophyl in compounds the plant can use to produce it herself (otherwise the roots wont take it) and yeah... thats a very good product that I try to imitate the best I can. Honestly, its very easy as the leaves already contain the NPK ratios that the plants want. I dont rely only on it because it doesnt give everything but its certainly in their diet.

Basically what Im saying is that it contains a very similar composition to that product. But I dont think as complete, for example I dont know what it has to make silica more available, I just use epsom salts from time to time to avoid my cheap potassium silicate from forming salts. I could use silicon dioxide but its very expensive. And yes, I do add silica to my soil, despite the fact that it already has silica, like any other peat based soil, but I notice that it helps when I push them to grow bigger.

 

[Mikedin]

Not necessarily, they dont mind any ph from 6 to 7, that wont alter their functions in the rhizosphere.

Using pH Up or Down products in soil (typically formulated for hydroponics or water systems) can damage or even kill rhizosphere life if not used carefully.




Why This Is Risky in Soil:

1.


Harsh Chemical Reactions

• Products like:
  • pH Down often contains phosphoric acid, nitric acid, or sulfuric acid.
  • pH Up usually contains potassium hydroxide or sodium carbonate.
• 
  
• These are highly reactive and can burn roots, sterilize beneficial microbes, or disrupt soil structure when added directly

2.


Disruption of Soil Biology

• The rhizosphere is full of sensitive life—bacteria, fungi, nematodes, etc.
• Sudden, extreme pH shifts can:
  • Kill off mycorrhizal fungi and nitrogen-fixing bacteria.
  • Reduce diversity and function of the soil food web.
  • Slow or halt nutrient cycling.

3.


Overcorrection Risk

• Soil has a buffering capacity, but if overwhelmed, pH swings can persist.
• Overuse can cause nutrient lockout or toxic conditions.

Bottom Line








Using pH Up or Down in soil can damage or kill rhizosphere life. They’re designed for hydroponic systems, not living soil. Instead, use natural amendments and allow time for biology to adjust the pH gradually.

 

[Eledin]

Using pH Up or Down products in soil (typically formulated for hydroponics or water systems) can damage or even kill rhizosphere life if not used carefully.




Why This Is Risky in Soil:

1.


Harsh Chemical Reactions

• Products like:
  • pH Down often contains phosphoric acid, nitric acid, or sulfuric acid.
  • pH Up usually contains potassium hydroxide or sodium carbonate.
• 
  
• These are highly reactive and can burn roots, sterilize beneficial microbes, or disrupt soil structure when added directly

2.


Disruption of Soil Biology

• The rhizosphere is full of sensitive life—bacteria, fungi, nematodes, etc.
• Sudden, extreme pH shifts can:
  • Kill off mycorrhizal fungi and nitrogen-fixing bacteria.
  • Reduce diversity and function of the soil food web.
  • Slow or halt nutrient cycling.

3.


Overcorrection Risk

• Soil has a buffering capacity, but if overwhelmed, pH swings can persist.
• Overuse can cause nutrient lockout or toxic conditions.

Bottom Line








Using pH Up or Down in soil can damage or kill rhizosphere life. They’re designed for hydroponic systems, not living soil. Instead, use natural amendments and allow time for biology to adjust the pH gradually.

Thats the point, using it in moderation and avoid acids that are short lived in the soil like citric acid. GH has the perfect PH down using phosphoric and nitric acid, they are long lived in the soil and as long as you use them with moderation its totally fine. As I said before, Iguana Juice has phosphoric acid, thats the best kind of acid to regulate PH in the soil as its stable and durable.
You dont want sudden PH shifts wether youre growing organic or not, for different reasons. Thats when PH buffers in the soil help aswell. My soil is buffered at a PH of 6-6,5 so it takes time or using a lot of PH down to change them. It has worm castings, leonardite, dolomite lime and a couple more things that regulate the PH of the soil.

 

[Mikedin]

Im one of those who pushes the plants to the limit, Im not happy until I see some crispy leaves. I ammend the soil, then top dress a bit after 3rd week of flower and then push with organic liquids. I think that pushing a plant with ammendments is way too hard as you need time for the nutes to become available for the plant, if you used too much well too bad, its burning hahaha and if you used too little its already showing deficiencies so it makes sense to go with a sensible approach.

I used to do that, but I felt my overall quality suffered,

I altered my organic amendments run after run working to perfect it but I’d always end up with some crispies. While I don’t necessarily see that as a negative I noticed reduced loudness in the terps I pushed harder

I also messed with a combo organic / synthetic runs I went full Gaia green with my other usual mix I made then did full dose Megacrop on top, and added flower fuel as well the run was great, I still did not PH and had crispy leaves, larger yield, but taste and smell suffered I think

 

[Mikedin]

Thats the point, using it in moderation and avoid acids that are short lived in the soil like citric acid. GH has the perfect PH down using phosphoric and nitric acid, they are long lived in the soil and as long as you use them with moderation its totally fine. As I said before, Iguana Juice has phosphoric acid, thats the best kind of acid to regulate PH in the soil as its stable and durable.
You dont want sudden PH shifts wether youre growing organic or not, for different reasons. Thats when PH buffers in the soil help aswell. My soil is buffered at a PH of 6-6,5 so it takes time or using a lot of PH down to change them. It has worm castings, leonardite, dolomite lime and a couple more things that regulate the PH of the soil.

Yep basically what I use the FPF for a organic PH buffer

 

[Eledin]

Yep basically what I use the FPF for a organic PH buffer

Yup, that works aswell! Anything that helps keep the PH that you want is welcomed. I wish that product was available in Spain, we have very basic stuff here when it comes to organic ammendments or liquid nutrients. Hell, I aint paying what Iguana Juice costs because I like paying extra hahaha, its the most complete NPK liquid BY MILES compared to what I have available here. In the end, if I go for the cheap stuff, I need to supplement more stuff, so fugg it.

 

[Eledin]

I used to do that, but I felt my overall quality suffered,

I altered my organic amendments run after run working to perfect it but I’d always end up with some crispies. While I don’t necessarily see that as a negative I noticed reduced loudness in the terps I pushed harder

I also messed with a combo organic / synthetic runs I went full Gaia green with my other usual mix I made then did full dose Megacrop on top, and added flower fuel as well the run was great, I still did not PH and had crispy leaves, larger yield, but taste and smell suffered I think

Yes, feeding too much is definetely way worse than feeding too little. At least if you feed too little your buds will be way more smokeable. Thats why I like my week of flush too, makes me feel good, its not only about depleting suggars and minerals its so the plant only takes what it needs from the leaves. I dont know, feels like a purification process and I certainly think it smokes smoother because I dont cough as much and seems to burn better, whiter ash, but I cant be sure, maybe its my mind playing tricks on me.

 

[Mikedin]

Yup, that works aswell! Anything that helps keep the PH that you want is welcomed. I wish that product was available in Spain, we have very basic stuff here when it comes to organic ammendments or liquid nutrients. Hell, I aint paying what Iguana Juice costs because I like paying extra hahaha, its the most complete NPK liquid BY MILES compared to what I have available here. In the end, if I go for the cheap stuff, I need to supplement more stuff, so fugg it.

Can you order from build a soil?? That’s where I got the FPF

 

[Mikedin]

Yes, feeding too much is definetely way worse than feeding too little. At least if you feed too little your buds will be way more smokeable. Thats why I like my week of flush too, makes me feel good, its not only about depleting suggars and minerals its so the plant only takes what it needs from the leaves. I dont know, feels like a purification process and I certainly think it smokes smoother because I dont cough as much and seems to burn better, whiter ash, but I cant be sure, maybe its my mind playing tricks on me.

Also I agree I stopped feeding the build a bloom last week in the 4x8 figured I have about a week to a week and a half left, so I’ll let them just fade out, with organics they’ll keep taking what they need but that’s the concept of living soil

Believe me I have no opposition to any method, it’s all in the consumers preference, I like the flavors I’m getting with pure organics / living soil, im sure I could double yield but I’m chasing quality only, but to counteract the yield issue I nearly tripled soil volume

 

[Eledin]

I used to do that, but I felt my overall quality suffered,

I altered my organic amendments run after run working to perfect it but I’d always end up with some crispies. While I don’t necessarily see that as a negative I noticed reduced loudness in the terps I pushed harder

I also messed with a combo organic / synthetic runs I went full Gaia green with my other usual mix I made then did full dose Megacrop on top, and added flower fuel as well the run was great, I still did not PH and had crispy leaves, larger yield, but taste and smell suffered I think

I think that if you wanna mix organic and synthetic you need to go with sensi ph perfect. Its specially formulated to help microorganisms despite being synthetic. Other kind of synthetic might kill them as you probably know.

 

[Eledin]

Also I agree I stopped feeding the build a bloom last week in the 4x8 figured I have about a week to a week and a half left, so I’ll let them just fade out, with organics they’ll keep taking what they need but that’s the concept of living soil

Believe me I have no opposition to any method, it’s all in the consumers preference, I like the flavors I’m getting with pure organics / living soil, im sure I could double yield but I’m chasing quality only, but to counteract the yield issue I nearly tripled soil volume

I totally understand. Flushing for 1 week is not for everyone, yes it makes it smoother, but youre losing yield and terpene production. Its just way better for me because Im asthmatic, many people would prefeer to cough their lungs out with a 30% thc strain hahaha I would die. I noticed it, but for me it pays off, still sends me to the moon. Im not into concentrates or edibles so a good joint always works for me, if anything some hash or kief from time to time.

 

[Eledin]

Can you order from build a soil?? That’s where I got the FPF

No, Ive already seen their products in the forum and I tried, they dont ship to Spain. Sometimes you can find Gaia Green if youre lucky in amazon but usually not available either, nor fox farm or many others.

 

[Mikedin]

I totally understand. Flushing for 1 week is not for everyone, yes it makes it smoother, but youre losing yield and terpene production. Its just way better for me because Im asthmatic, many people would prefeer to cough their lungs out with a 30% thc strain hahaha I would die. I noticed it, but for me it pays off, still sends me to the moon. Im not into concentrates or edibles so a good joint always works for me, if anything some hash or kief from time to time.

I hear ya! That’s what made me switch to organic, then to living soil, I’d prefer a clean smooth smoke, even with flushing, bud washing, etc I couldn’t get there with synthetic, the difference going to 100% organic was huge (to me, I know people say they can’t tell the difference)

I’m a jointer as well, my preferred method to smoke

I was gunna run the sensi, @smallz6714 dad runs that next door to me, he’ll be taking my Frostette mother soon to out outdoors so I’ll be able to watch er grow all summer along with the rest he does lol

 

[Mikedin]

No, Ive already seen their products in the forum and I tried, they dont ship to Spain. Sometimes you can find Gaia Green if youre lucky in amazon but usually not available either, nor fox farm or many others.

That sucks, it’d probably actually be beneficial to you to run living soil then, you’re 90% there,

The current run I did “the build a soil way” and added nothing I diddnt get from them, so far it’s blowing anything else I’ve done outta the water, in the 3x3 I’m loosening my grip on her a bit and allowing in some other additions like the OG organics etc, even when I find a proven method I continue to experiment, so that’s what I was so happy to do the spiderfarmer setup, this first run I’ve already changed it up, did half light recipe, half 100% Canadian peat (lamberts) amended the soil as if it was ran in already, etc, only real difference is half the light power (but smaller tent) and one of my 12 gallon fabric pots instead of the 30 gallon living soil bags

 

[Eledin]

That sucks, it’d probably actually be beneficial to you to run living soil then, you’re 90% there,

The current run I did “the build a soil way” and added nothing I diddnt get from them, so far it’s blowing anything else I’ve done outta the water, in the 3x3 I’m loosening my grip on her a bit and allowing in some other additions like the OG organics etc, even when I find a proven method I continue to experiment, so that’s what I was so happy to do the spiderfarmer setup, this first run I’ve already changed it up, did half light recipe, half 100% Canadian peat (lamberts) amended the soil as if it was ran in already, etc, only real difference is half the light power (but smaller tent) and one of my 12 gallon fabric pots instead of the 30 gallon living soil bags

Im already there, my soil is living soil, the only difference is that instead of buying a bag of premixed ammendments I have to go 1 by 1 myself hahaha . These are some of my ammendments (many of which are only available in small containers):

And this is the composition of great white premium (google translate):

Endomycorrhiza composition of the Great White Premium​

• Gigaspora daisy 11 propagules per gram.
• Glomus mosseae 83 propagules per gram.
• Glomus etunicatum 83 propagules per gram.
• Glomus monosporum 11 propagules per gram.
• Glomus aggregatum 83 propagules per gram.
• Glomus intraradices 83 propagules per gram.
• Paraglomus brazilianum 11 propagules per gram.
• Glomus deserticola 11 propagules per gram.
• Glomus clarum 11 propagules per gram.

Ectomycorrhizal Composition​

• Scleroderma strain - 5,219 propagules per gram.
• Scleroderma citrinum - 5,219 propagules per gram.
• Rhizopon fulvigleba - 5,219 propagules per gram.
• Pisoliyhus tinctorius – 187,875 propagules per gram
• Rhizopon amylopogon - 5,219 propagules per gram.
• Rhizopon villosullus - 5,219 propagules per gram.
• Rhizopon luteolus - 5,219 propagules per gram.

Composition Bacteria​

• Azotobacter chroococcum – 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Bacillus subtilis - 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Bacillus licheniformis - 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Bacillus azotoformans - 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Bacillus megaterium - 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Bacillus coagulans - 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Bacillus pumilus - 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Bacillus thuringiensis - 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Bacillus amyloliquefaciens - 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Paenibacillus durum – 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Paenibacillus polymyxa - 24,960 cfu per ml.
• Pseudomonas fluorescens -24,960 cfu per ml.
• Trichoderma koningii - 187,875 cfu per ml.
• Trichoderma harzianum – 125,250 cfu per ml.

 

[Eledin]

I did notice a huge difference when swaping to organic too. I started with the sensi ph line from AN so I always used microorganisms but the taste with organic is more pronounced, specially the earthy and hashy tones I believe. I find it smoother and tastier too.

 

[Mikedin]

Im already there, my soil is living soil, the only difference is that instead of buying a bag of premixed ammendments I have to go 1 by 1 myself hahaha . These are some of my ammendments (many of which are only available in small containers):
View attachment 2434750
And this is the composition of great white premium (google translate):

Endomycorrhiza composition of the Great White Premium​

• Gigaspora daisy 11 propagules per gram.
• Glomus mosseae 83 propagules per gram.
• Glomus etunicatum 83 propagules per gram.
• Glomus monosporum 11 propagules per gram.
• Glomus aggregatum 83 propagules per gram.
• Glomus intraradices 83 propagules per gram.
• Paraglomus brazilianum 11 propagules per gram.
• Glomus deserticola 11 propagules per gram.
• Glomus clarum 11 propagules per gram.

Ectomycorrhizal Composition​

• Scleroderma strain - 5,219 propagules per gram.
• Scleroderma citrinum - 5,219 propagules per gram.
• Rhizopon fulvigleba - 5,219 propagules per gram.
• Pisoliyhus tinctorius – 187,875 propagules per gram
• Rhizopon amylopogon - 5,219 propagules per gram.
• Rhizopon villosullus - 5,219 propagules per gram.
• Rhizopon luteolus - 5,219 propagules per gram.

Composition Bacteria​

• Azotobacter chroococcum – 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Bacillus subtilis - 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Bacillus licheniformis - 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Bacillus azotoformans - 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Bacillus megaterium - 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Bacillus coagulans - 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Bacillus pumilus - 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Bacillus thuringiensis - 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Bacillus amyloliquefaciens - 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Paenibacillus durum – 525,000 cfu per ml.
• Paenibacillus polymyxa - 24,960 cfu per ml.
• Pseudomonas fluorescens -24,960 cfu per ml.
• Trichoderma koningii - 187,875 cfu per ml.
• Trichoderma harzianum – 125,250 cfu per ml.

Yep I also have great white! Just used the last bit actually when I made up the 12 gallon pot, gotta grab some more

Also don’t worry if you’re having a discussion here and I stop responding, it’s not what you said I’m just at work hahaha

I work swing shift so my brain is all over the place hahaha

 

[Smokie08]

Yep I also have great white! Just used the last bit actually when I made up the 12 gallon pot, gotta grab some more

Also don’t worry if you’re having a discussion here and I stop responding, it’s not what you said I’m just at work hahaha

I work swing shift so my brain is all over the place hahaha

Ugh swing shift sucks

 

[Mikedin]

I did notice a huge difference when swaping to organic too. I started with the sensi ph line from AN so I always used microorganisms but the taste with organic is more pronounced, specially the earthy and hashy tones I believe. I find it smoother and tastier too.

People always say it’s not a noticeable difference but I completely disagree. I think it’s clearly noticeable, but people wouldn’t wanna say that because it’d be an obvious downer on Synthetic growers. Organic is a personal preference, and the people who smoke my bud do so spesifically because of the organic growing (why smoke synthetics when you wouldn’t grow your food with em right?)

 

[Mikedin]

Ugh swing shift sucks

I prefer the midnights 6-6 actually lol

I’ll get home at 7am, last night tonight, and it’ll be joint and beer o clock lol