Monsanto And Bayer Maneuvering To Take Over Cannabis Indistry

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guymandude

guymandude

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read this today.

As growers we value our buds and love our plants. We love the fact that we grow the best we can and do not po-ison anyone that enjoys our products. Well, We as growers nee to step up against this corporate monster looming ahead of us. Monsanto and Scotts are in bed together. Scotts recently bought Botanicare, General Hydroponics and Gavita. We as respinsibile growers should be boycotting products from theses companies and do what we can to insure not one dime goes to Scotts and Monanto.

http://www.wakingtimes.com/2017/06/21/monsanto-bayer-maneuvering-take-cannabis-industry/
 
guymandude

guymandude

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many people do. it's a fucking shame the family that started GH sold out. I will never use their products again. Or Botanicare or Gavita. We have to make a stand. Otherwise these corporate giants will pay off the politicians to pass legislation making it illegal for anyone to grow and distribute but them, and we will be back growing in secret, instead of owning legit businesses.
 
h4ppyf4rmer

h4ppyf4rmer

863
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many people do. it's a fucking shame the family that started GH sold out. I will never use their products again. Or Botanicare or Gavita. We have to make a stand. Otherwise these corporate giants will pay off the politicians to pass legislation making it illegal for anyone to grow and distribute but them, and we will be back growing in secret, instead of owning legit businesses.

what do you recommend for a hydroponic RDWC system? I would like to find a good alternative when my GH runs out (which could be over a year seeing that I just bought the 1-gallon 3-parts)
 
LocalGrowGuy

LocalGrowGuy

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If you want to buy fancy nutrients with claims of awesomeness, buy advanced. I've heard good things about new millenium too. I like this recipe because you can buy 5 years worth for a hundred bucks. This is several years old:

The following is a simple fertilization formula for growing cannabis in hydroculture using Peters Professional 5-11-26 “Hydroponic Special” water soluble fertilizer. This formulation has been run successfully in my gardens for several years in several types of rooting media. This formula is intended to be run throughout the life cycle of the crop, from the seedling stage to finish. I hope you find this information useful.

Materials needed:

Peters Professional 5-11-26 “Hydroponic Special” water soluble fertilizer – sold in 25 lbs. bag

Yara Liva CALCINIT Calcium Nitrate – sold in 50 lbs. bag

Magnesium Sulphate (Epsom Salts) – sold in 50 lbs. bag

To make a working solution to be top fed, dripped or used in flood tables mix the following:

1.89g/gallon Peters Professional 5-11-26

1.84g/gallon Yara Liva CALCINIT Calcium Nitrate

0.94g/gallon Magnesium Sulphate (Epsom Salts)

Mixed together this will deliver PPM 100-24-108-93-25 (N-P-K-Ca-Mg)

He used .2 grams per gallon of Monopotassium phosphate at flip.

edit- I don't know and don't have time to see if Peter's is owned or an offshoot of monsanto/bayer/etc
 
guymandude

guymandude

605
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AN is good stuff. An was better before they changed formulas though. That being said, AN does have a version fo the GH 3 part that is actually less money and you can Lucas formula and all kinds of things with it. That being said, I'm getting ready to test out the Emerald Harvest nutes. I'm looking to get away from AN. Been using them for 10 years and the formula change really screwed up my yields.

if you really want to get basic, check out a website called Custom Hydro Nutrients. You can get everything you need for mixing your raw salts there. Quantrill (owner) is a great guy too.

did i mention that mixing raw salts is stupid cheap too
 
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LocalGrowGuy

LocalGrowGuy

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what do you recommend for a hydroponic RDWC system? I would like to find a good alternative when my GH runs out (which could be over a year seeing that I just bought the 1-gallon 3-parts)
I would skip Advanced and the eleventy brazilian bottles of mostly water, they have a couple of decent products but you don't need the whole line to grow good weed. With AN you are paying for the name as much as what's in the bottle along with all that water. You'll find plenty of growers who swear by AN though. To each his own.

This is Chocolate Charm from 14er in Boulder, grown with jacks and the recipe above. From the fantastical garden that belongs to @xavier7995
ChocCharm1



ChocCharm2

ChocCharm3
 
h4ppyf4rmer

h4ppyf4rmer

863
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I would skip Advanced and the eleventy brazilian bottles of mostly water, they have a couple of decent products but you don't need the whole line to grow good weed. With AN you are paying for the name as much as what's in the bottle along with all that water. You'll find plenty of growers who swear by AN though. To each his own.

This is Chocolate Charm from 14er in Boulder, grown with jacks and the recipe above. From the fantastical garden that belongs to @xavier7995

I was looking at Jack's hydro stuff, I might switch to that when my GH bottles are empty(I hate to waste money)
thanks
 
h4ppyf4rmer

h4ppyf4rmer

863
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To make a working solution to be top fed, dripped or used in flood tables mix the following:

1.89g/gallon Peters Professional 5-11-26

1.84g/gallon Yara Liva CALCINIT Calcium Nitrate

0.94g/gallon Magnesium Sulphate (Epsom Salts)

Mixed together this will deliver PPM 100-24-108-93-25 (N-P-K-Ca-Mg)

Anything special knowledge I need to mix this stuff up or any special order of the components? BTW: this is for an RDWC ~35 gallon system.
 
guymandude

guymandude

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I was looking at Jack's hydro stuff, I might switch to that when my GH bottles are empty(I hate to waste money)
thanks
I hate throwing things away too. I've been milking my GH ph down for about a year now. Got a bottle of Techniflora ph down to replace it. I won't buy GH ever again.

As far as the bazillion bottles of AN, that's a farce. All I have ever used was the Hobbyist line - and i will be the first in line to tell you you don;t need everything they put out. I will tell you though, AN works and works very well.
 
B

Burned Haze

Guest
Fuck the salts , run. Soul synthetics if you gotta run bottle (95% organic , 5% converted )
 
LocalGrowGuy

LocalGrowGuy

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Anything special knowledge I need to mix this stuff up or any special order of the components? BTW: this is for an RDWC ~35 gallon system.
Add the jacks first, then the epsom salts and calcinit. Cooler water will take longer to dissolve, when I was DWC I threw a water pump into a 55 gallon drum to flume and the motor added a bit of heat, probably 5-7 degrees, and be careful when you add the bloom booster. I don't run DWC anymore, too much of a pain in the ass keeping things cool. Shoot me a pm if you can't find it, I have bags for years of most formulations centennial carried back in the day.

Fuck the salts , run. Soul synthetics if you gotta run bottle (95% organic , 5% converted )
There are positives and negatives for both salt-based fertilizers, and organics. Stop derailing the thread with a stupid hit and run insult to a method of growing that shows good results. Why don't you post your soul synthetics flowers and let the pictures speak for themselves?

I hate throwing things away too. I've been milking my GH ph down for about a year now. Got a bottle of Techniflora ph down to replace it. I won't buy GH ever again.

As far as the bazillion bottles of AN, that's a farce. All I have ever used was the Hobbyist line - and i will be the first in line to tell you you don;t need everything they put out. I will tell you though, AN works and works very well.
If you are also saying that using AN's full line is a farce, then I agree with you. There are a couple of products that work well, but I don't support them as a company when they water down their supplements so much and don't put ingredients on the bottle. Their dosage is bullshit too but that's for another thread. However, I don't think AN and salts are comparable as it relates to cost, though.
 
guymandude

guymandude

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If you are also saying that using AN's full line is a farce, then I agree with you. There are a couple of products that work well, but I don't support them as a company when they water down their supplements so much and don't put ingredients on the bottle. Their dosage is bullshit too but that's for another thread. However, I don't think AN and salts are comparable as it relates to cost, though.


I run their Sensi Bloom A&B, B52, Voodoo Juice (Awesome stuff love it), Big Bud (i grow in coco and use none of the coco specific nutes, btw), Overdrive, Bud Factor X, Cal Mag extra, Sugar Daddy. That's it. The expensive stuff (Voodoo Juice and Bud Factor X) you can get online for half of what stores are charging. This is a touch more than the hobbyist level, but man it works sooooo damn well. I'm posting harvest/bud shots in my journal today. check them out.
As far as dosage goes, i've found the nutrient chart for Sensi Bloom is pretty spot on. I'll feed a liter and a half - 2 liters of full strength nutes to my coco girls, then next time i water them - just plain water. Feed water feed water Got a little nute burn on the tips of the leaves, skip another feeding and just give water. It's pretty damn easy. Been using the stuff for over 10 years in fact. I have mad eit even easier as far as mixing and such. I discovered that if i mixed in a 2 1/2 gallon container - I actually use a gas can - it takes 1 full shot glass of A&B and 1/2 a shot of the additives (at the appropriate time, of course). ph to 6.0-6.1 is what works for me. I give my 3 galln pots about a liter and a half to 2 liters of full strength (it's very close to full strength anyway) one day then plain water then next. Keep in mind, AN was designed for growing cannabis. So was Canna, I think House & Garden was too, and Emerald Harvest was as well. It does work very very well. Fox Farm was made for Tomatoes, GH was made for general gardening plants.
I'm really not looking forward to having to measure out 12 ml's per can for the Emerald Harvest stuff, and 5 ml's that this and that. But, since AN changed their formulation, I've had a personal vendetta against the company for a while now. it's time to try something else for me.

as far as raw salts go, paying $12 for 40 pounds of a raw salt - well, there is no comparison to how cheap that is. You just have to mix the stuff right. That's very important.
 
LocalGrowGuy

LocalGrowGuy

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We'll have to agree to disagree. I don't like AN in general, and the more I find out, the more I don't like it. What is your voodoo juice other than water? Not much: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...ce.pdf&usg=AFQjCNGINuKhoT_aZW-dRdTmhVdmEraqpQ
-If the link doesn't work it's just the MSDS for voodoo juice. One of the ingredients is Ethylenediaminetetraacetate, which is related to Daminozide. [wiki - Daminozide — also known as Alar, Kylar, B-NINE, DMASA, SADH, or B 995 — is a plant growth regulator, a chemical sprayed on fruit to regulate their growth, make their harvest easier, and keep apples from falling off the trees before they are ripe.]

For example, I see all of the nice plants and succulents that are so popular at the box home stores, but it's so painfully obvious that they are exposed to PGR's during growth. They grow differently than other plants of the same species, are treated with neonicotinoids, and even though they look pretty with all of that new growth, I find it frustrating that they don't disclose this to their customers. Because money.

Using AN as an example, why don't they list their ingredients like everyone else? Why don't they say that Bud Factor X contains Chitosan?

Why doesn't AN list that Chitosan 'The agricultural and horticultural uses for chitosan, primarily for plant defense and yield increase, are based on how this glucosamine polymer influences the biochemistry and molecular biology of the plant cell. The cellular targets are the plasma membrane and nuclear chromatin. Subsequent changes occur in cell membranes, chromatin, DNA, calcium, MAP Kinase, oxidative burst, reactive oxygen species, callose pathogenesis-related (PR) genes and phytoalexins.'

Do you think AN's sales would go up or down if they listed their ingredients? I think they'd go down based on the stuff I can find out, which tellingly, is difficult to find. AN hides behind their own language wrt metal exposures on their label, but if you actually go to the site, http://www.aapfco.org/metals.html, it doesn't say anything about what's in the bottle.

I would say that this falls into the GMO arena since Chitosan changes cell function and DNA? How is that different than GMO?

No thanks.
 
guymandude

guymandude

605
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that's funny, i've had a bottle of Voodoo juice that went past it's expiration ate and the bacteria had started to colonize in the bottle. Didn't smell bad, didn't smell like bad bugs.

here's a ink to the product label, since the MSDS points out dangerous and poisonous things and how to deal with exposure and spills, etc, and there's none of those inside the bottle.
as far as listing everything that's inside, very very few companies will list everything. Trade secrets abound, dude. That's; how business is. Recipes are secret.

as far as GMO's go, no one is injecting mouse genes into cannabis DNA. Period. Your point is valid however, because we create GMO's (your definition) every time we make a hybrid strain. We create GMO's every time we make feminized beans. big difference between injection completely foreign species genes into into a plants DNA that feeding a plant something that will help it grow stronger and healthier.

i encourage you to read this entire Wiki article instead of cherry picking from it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chitosan

the following is take from the above article
"
Natural biocontrol and elicitor[edit]
In agriculture, chitosan is typically used as a natural seed treatment and plant growth enhancer, and as an ecologically friendly biopesticide substance that boosts the innate ability of plants to defend themselves against fungal infections.[9] The natural biocontrol active ingredients, chitin/chitosan, are found in the shells of crustaceans, such as lobsters, crabs, and shrimp, and many other organisms, including insects and fungi. It is one of the most abundant biodegradable materials in the world.

Degraded molecules of chitin/chitosan exist in soil and water. Chitosan applications for plants and crops are regulated by the EPA, and the USDA National Organic Program regulates its use on organic certified farms and crops.[10] EPA-approved, biodegradable chitosan products are allowed for use outdoors and indoors on plants and crops grown commercially and by consumers.[11]

The natural biocontrol ability of chitosan should not be confused with the effects of fertilizers or pesticides upon plants or the environment. Chitosan active biopesticides represent a new tier of cost-effective biological control of crops for agriculture and horticulture.[12] The biocontrol mode of action of chitosan elicits natural innate defense responses within plant to resist insects, pathogens, and soil-borne diseases when applied to foliage or the soil.[13] Chitosan increases photosynthesis, promotes and enhances plant growth, stimulates nutrient uptake, increases germination and sprouting, and boosts plant vigor. When used as seed treatment or seed coating on cotton, corn, seed potatoes, soybeans, sugar beets, tomatoes, wheat and many other seeds, it elicits an innate immunityresponse in developing roots which destroys parasitic cyst nematodes without harming beneficial nematodes and organisms.[14][15]

Agricultural applications of chitosan can reduce environmental stress due to drought and soil deficiencies, strengthen seed vitality, improve stand quality, increase yields, and reduce fruit decay of vegetables, fruits and citrus crops .[16] Horticultural application of chitosan increases blooms and extends the life of cut flowers and Christmas trees. The US Forest Service has conducted research on chitosan to control pathogens in pine trees[17][18] and increase resin pitch outflow which resists pine beetle infestation.[19]


NASA life support GAP technology with untreated beans (left tube) and ODC chitosan biocontrol-treated beans (right tube) returned from the Mir space station aboard the space shuttle – September 1997
Chitosan has a rich history of being researched for applications in agriculture and horticulture dating back to the 1980s.[20] By 1989, chitosan salt solutions were applied to crops for improved freeze protection or to crop seed for seed priming.[21] Shortly thereafter, chitosan salt received the first ever biopesticide label from the EPA, then followed by other intellectual property applications.

Chitosan has been used to protect plants in space, as well, exemplified by NASA's experiment to protect adzuki beans grown aboard the space shuttle and Mir space station in 1997 (see photo left).[22] NASA results revealed chitosan induces increased growth (biomass) and pathogen resistance due to elevated levels of β-(1→3)-glucanase enzymes within plant cells. NASA confirmed chitosan elicits the same effect in plants on earth.[23]

Nontoxic, low molecular weight chitosan polymer solutions appear to be safe enough for broad-spectrum agricultural and horticultural uses.[24][25] In 2008, the EPA approved natural broad-spectrum elicitor status for an ultralow molecular active ingredient of 0.25% chitosan.[26]

A natural chitosan elicitor solution for agriculture and horticultural uses was granted an amended label for foliar and irrigation applications by the EPA in 2009.[16] Given its low potential for toxicity and abundance in the natural environment, chitosan does not harm people, pets, wildlife, or the environment when used according to label directions.[27][28][29] The US Forest Service tested chitosan as an ecofriendly biopesticide to prearm pine trees to defend themselves against mountain pine beetles.

Water filtration[edit]
Chitosan can also be used in water processing engineering as a part of a filtration process. Chitosan causes the fine sediment particles to bind together, and is subsequently removed with the sediment during sand filtration. It also removes phosphorus, heavy minerals, and oils from the water. Chitosan is an important additive in the filtration process. Sand filtration apparently can remove up to 50% of the turbidity alone, while the chitosan with sand filtration removes up to 99% turbidity.[30] Chitosan has been used to precipitate caseins from bovine milk and cheese making.[31][32]

Chitosan is also useful in other filtration situations, where one may need to remove suspended particles from a liquid. In combination with bentonite, gelatin, silica gel, isinglass, or other fining agents, it is used to clarify wine, mead, and beer. Added late in the brewing process, chitosan improves flocculation, and removes yeast cells, fruit particles, and other detritus that cause hazy wine. Chitosan combined with colloidal silica is becoming a popular fining agent for white wines, because chitosan does not require acidic tannins (found primarily in red wines) with which to flocculate.[33]

Chitosan is among the biological adsorbents used for heavy metals removal without negative environmental impacts.[34]

Winemaking and fungal source chitosan[edit]
Chitosan has a long history for use as a fining agent in winemaking.[35][36] Fungal source chitosan has shown an increase in settling activity, reduction of oxidized polyphenolics in juice and wine, chelation and removal of copper (post-racking) and control of the spoilage yeast Brettanomyces. These products and uses are approved for European use by the EU and OIV standards.[37]"


Approved for use the EU. Hell they don;t allow much of anything to be added to anything they eat or drink. Must be ok for them. Also, plants in the wild eat Chitosan every day if it's in the soil, and usually it is in the form of dead bugs, dead mushrooms, etc.

AN, Emerald Harvest and Canna are a very few nutrient companies that have designed their nutrients to grow cannabis. You may not like the price, the marketing, color of the bottle what have you, the shit works and works well. I'm currently going to be trialing Emerald Harvest soon. I haven't like the results of the ph perfect AN line since they had a team of PhD's from Yale design the new formulas. What i mean by saying that is not thrown together by a bunch of stoners trying to out do Miracle Grow. If Emerald Harvest works for me, i'll be making the switch, mainly because Emerald Harvest was started by THE science guy behind the old AN formulas, who did not agree with the ph perfect crap and left the company. I had far better results with the old formulas so i am hoping that's what I'll find in Emerald Harvest.
 
LocalGrowGuy

LocalGrowGuy

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263
We never agreed on definitions and I didn't claim Chitosan equals GMO, I said it falls into the same arena and asked how it's different than GMO. I'll assume your posting of the entire wiki is a response to that, and I am not going to begin a GMO/nonGMO argument here. I am not an expert, reading the wiki doesn't make me an expert, and I am not in a position to make that claim, please don't put words in my mouth. Again, definitions matter here. I'll point out again that I don't think they are a 'bad' company like monsanto, I just disagree with how they do their thing. Perhaps if there was more of the important stuff in your bottle instead of mostly water, it might have been even more colonized than it was. I don't like paying AN prices for stuff that is over 90 percent water. I'm glad that it works for you, and obviously for many others as well. I don't think your are 'wrong' for using AN products, apologies if I implied that. To each his own. I am sharing why I dislike AN. I think the fact that you do not use their entire line speaks to my point rather than yours. I'll say again that some AN products work very well, and results aren't what I was trying to focus on.

Next, publicly available information and proprietary info or IP are mutually exclusive.
"here's a ink to the product label, since the MSDS points out dangerous and poisonous things and how to deal with exposure and spills, etc, and there's none of those inside the bottle. as far as listing everything that's inside, very very few companies will list everything. Trade secrets abound, dude. That's; how business is. Recipes are secret."
-What are you talking about? Are you saying that you don't consider a hazardous material to be dangerous or poisonous? Chitosan being listed on the MSDS is the opposite of a secret.
-Chitosan 9012-76-4 33% - Hazardous Material Non-Ionic surfactant

I read the wiki article, and I wouldn't have posted the link if I haven't. Did you read the MSDS where it lists Chitosan and then 'Ingredients not precisely identified are proprietary or non-hazardous' I don't dislike AN because of their prices, label design/color/layout, nor do I dislike them because they have a broad definition of IP and proprietary info. As a consumer, I find the omission of Chitosan from the label to be problematic. As you say, recipes are proprietary, and the MSDS specifically addresses this. If AN considered their use of Chitosan to be proprietary, it would not be listed on the MSDS. If they wanted you to know it was in their product, they would advertise it. They don't, and that's where my beef lies.

I'm going to bow out at your seeming insistence to steer this to a GMO thread, and I am not interested in that type of discussion right now. My point remains that Advanced Nutrients should list their ingredients on the bottle especially ones that are hazardous, just like most if not all of their competition already does. All companies protect proprietary info and IP, so Advanced doesn't get a pass using that as an excuse for not putting enough on their labels. Also, I didn't say anything about anyone injecting mouse genes into cannabis, and that ridiculous assertion is a non-starter. You shouldn't assume your audience is ignorant just because they don't agree with you. This is a monsanto bayer thread, the least we could do is shit on them at least once per post, and I am not going to derail this thread further. Perhaps one day we can start another GMO thread. Happy Friday Guy.
 
guymandude

guymandude

605
143
hey, I get it, bro. I'm actually looking to switch from AN myelf. Trialing out Emerald Harvest as I tye this due to the attitude at AN, like you stated.

I've just never hear chitosan was hazardous. in fact i've just looked up a few place that say it is not hazardous, although the FDA won't clear it for drug delivery systems.

here, http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0169409X0900283X

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0014305712004181


do you have any links that show it its. I'd like to see them - and I'm not being a dick, i'd really like to see them.
 
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LocalGrowGuy

LocalGrowGuy

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hey, I get it, bro. I'm actually looking to switch from AN myelf. Trialing out Emerald Harvest as I tye this due to the attitude at AN, like you stated.

I've just never hear chitosan was hazardous. in fact i've just looked up a few place that say it is not hazardous, although the FDA won't clear it for drug delivery systems.

here, http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0169409X0900283X

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0014305712004181


do you have any links that show it its. I'd like to see them - and I'm not being a dick, i'd really like to see them.
I don't think you are being a dick, and I hope you don't think that I am being a dick by kindly refraining from engaging your query. To the point that other stuff is taking priority, and that I just don't have the time to research and look around for sources to cite. You may judge this as a copout, which is fine, but I simply don't care enough to spend any time on a thorough reply. My biggest issue was and continues to be the labeling for AN, and the reasons don't really matter. What's in the bottle doesn't matter, what matters to me is why they don't list the ingredients on the bottle like everyone else, and I don't buy that it's for proprietary reasons. You can have the chitosan argument, my lazy reply would be why the FDA won't clear it. I don't see anything that is very helpful other than perusing this, but it gets over my head and doesn't say anything about ingestion. https://books.google.com/books?id=9XQZVUO1CscC&pg=PA2338&lpg=PA2338&dq=fda+won+approved+chitosan+products&source=bl&ots=uGak9jfP3A&sig=5xV3TtFzBRwXevPAGza8F5NSXK0&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiS3uy0_ODVAhUJ0IMKHaBcBhcQ6AEILzAC#v=onepage&q=fda won approved chitosan products&f=false

Further, I would guess that the pharmaceutical delays with chitosan are more related to the shellfish issue than anything else, webmd lists side effects and interactions, although that's a drug supplement, not an ingredient in a fertilizer. If it's not recommended for preggos then the drugs or medications made with it would also be not recommended for preggos, but I'm just guessing. A GRAS Rating isn't enough for me to use them in consumable products.

Just like plant growth hormones and regulators, just like the potential effects of combusted propylene glycol and other carriers, I don't know that there is enough information to make an informed decision. It seems like chitosan clearing regulatory hurdles is more related to it's purity from how it's derived, removing heavy metals and seafood allergens from shellfish byproducts, but again, over my head.

I have noticed that some of the suppliers of plants for the big box stores have added consumption warnings on a lot of their products. Initially I figured it was related to their increased use of neonicotinoids as pest controls, but now it seems that there is a fairly widespread use of PGR's. For example, from a product website:

Introduction: How Plant Growth Regulators Can Improve Plant Quality and Appearance, While Saving Time and Labor


Growth Regulators (PGRs) have been around for a long time and have been an important part of the professional turf and sports industry. Until recently they were not frequently used by homeowners. Their use is now on the rise as people discover the benefits of professional plant growth regulators. Growth regulators do not interfere with plant respiration, photosynthesis, or other internal functions.


There are growth regulators designed for many plant types, including grasses, trees and shrubs, and flowers. (There are even insecticides that are actually bio-friendly insect growth regulators.) With plants, growth regulators are designed to stimulate a specific plant function or mimic a plant hormone that will help, hinder, or change the pattern of plant growth. There are now dozens of products that can perform an increasing array of functions.

With turfgrass growth regulators, the original goal was to slow grass growth, for reducing the amount clippings and frequency of mowing. Reducing labor costs was a powerful motivator for the use and development of PGRs. They are now used along garden and cement edges to slow runner growth and reduce trimming time. They are used to improve grass appearance by preventing seedhead and stalk formations. They are even used for preventing energy depletion that can be used during stress periods. Some that are labeled for grass are also labeled for other landscape plants as well. Uses include trees and shrubs, flowers and vegetables.

I don't like that consumers aren't able to make a choice between products that have PGR's and those that don't. That the big box stores or their suppliers like altman farms don't openly disclose that they spray the crap out of their plants when they ship them is problematic for me.


I'm not going to look around and find reasons why chitosan is safe for me to consume, I'm simply going to stay away from products that have it. This is only one product from AN, and because of this and other reasons, I choose to stay away from them in general. I would also choose to not purchase plants from the big box stores that have been treated with PGR's or other products that aren't listed or disclosed. The FDA not clearing chitosan is just more confirmation bias for me to not spend further time or effort looking into something that contains those products. That AN still chooses to put this into their products, knowing that consumers will likely be combusting/consuming the plant at some point, is a problem for me. I don't expect you to share the same risk profile that I do.

It would be interesting to revisit this at a future date, but I wanted to reply to you in a timely manner, and I haven't had a nice long post to piss off the gallery in a couple of days so hey, two birds.
 
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guymandude

guymandude

605
143
well, staying away from it is a choice. I've been running AN for years and the stuff does work very very well.
that being said, I am triualing Emerald Harvest at the moment. haven't gotten into flower yet.

The one thought i keep coming to is this: if AN was dangerous, it would not be sold in Washington or Oregon. There's been several bottled nutrients and/or additives taken off the market because of the diligence and testing from those two states.

The shell fish allergy has to do with being allergic to iodine. So if they can remove the iodine, which i doubt can happen, there'd be little worry.

be well, my friend
 
markscastle

markscastle

Well-Known Farmer
4,825
263
I grow in dirt so never needed any pre mixed up bottled stuff. I used raw ingreaadence like manures ,earthworm droppings ,ash ,home made multch, ect. Always have award winning quality and yield ! Old Hippies do it right!
 

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