My journey to the MPB Universe!

[Lost]

You guys are scaring me with the coco pots... I've had 2 harvests with them and no problems with them (lots of problems with a faulty Harbor Point A/C)

Do you think its ok as long as they are young and not root bound?

 

[mrdizzle]

thats what im thinking, when I had to chop my last room, I transplanted my cuts 3wks early into the room, two weeks later they are huge, and I put them in very small. I started vegging them longer because I wanted to shorten the time vegging in the buckets. but it seems to still take 2-3wks.

Im thinking I was overwatering them on my veg + getting them rootbound as fuck. its really hard to say for sure but thats my theory.
because its soo rootbound it seems to stay very wet, which is doesnt when they werent so root bound

seems my problems have come from the top bucket, Im liking the UC in the fact you dont have that top feed issuse

 

[Papa]

Im liking the UC in the fact you dont have that top feed issuse

how is the UC different than the MPBs in this regard?











Papa

 

[bakershredhead]

I'm a little confused. I have a aerocloner which does work great as long as your water doesn't get to warm which pretty much won't work in the summer. On Easy que I tried cloning into the coco pots the 3 inch and the six inch. It worked great and seemed to be pretty easy for the mpb. I don't understand exactly how there becoming root bound. Don't the roots pretty much just take over the little coco pot which is transplanted into the 10 inch net pots. Is it because you guys are using the pots that aren't slotted all over. Just trying to avoid any future problems as I've had my share of hurdles already.

 

[antimatter]

Was it the coco or the coco pot that was causing the problem?

Have you tried 3.5 gallon buckets with holes drilled filled with coco straight coco and no coco pots? just curious since I know no matter how wet I get my coco it never seems to get to wet but Ive never ran coco in full on hydro.

 

[easypleasie]

Amstercal, i'll keep the journal going till I finish this round. I don't mind helping out where I'm able. We're all still learning so it's just an exchange of ideas and sharing our trials.

Lost, I don't think it's a reason to get too alarmed, especially since you're not top feeding like we were. You've had good luck with it so far but keep a close eye on things as always.

I'm still gonna use my little coco pots next round but i'm gonna put them in the netpots sooner. Putting them in the netpot 10 days after taking the cutting so the roots can roam around more instead of getting rootbound and/or air pruned. Mine were in little 6" coco pots for 3 weeks from cutting before I put them in the netpots so roots were jam packed. As dizzle said, it's just a theory but one that could have some merit. I'm gonna go with it and see how things go.

I had serious gph top feed going so that could have been a cause with too many roots in the netpot. But the biggest problem was not using something that had holes throughout. I like the 3.5 gallon buckets for the mere fact there's more surface area for the roots to come out...but definitely drill a shit load of holes up the sides. Still not sure if i'm gonna do the buckets or all mesh netpots this upcoming round.

antimatter, my problem was getting rootbound in the netpots and drainage wasn't happening...causing things to stay too wet. I've had some coco plants that were too rootbound that didn't drain very well but I wasn't feeding them 24/7 either. Also, if your coco gets too compacted, it takes all the air space out that allows good drainage. I wouldn't recommend coco with no coco pots as it would make a mess in your res. You'd need something to filter it out or wash it all off like northone does.

This system can be a little stressful if you're not used to running a ton of pumps, chiller, etc. I've woken up plenty of times in the middle of the night just to make sure everything was still running (and no floods). I never worried so much when I was growing in straight coco. Kinda hard to mess that up. Hell, even the 50/50 hempy chow mix i'm using for my white fire is kicking ass so I might consider doing a run sometime with that for a little more peace of mind.

 

[Giddeon]

I had serious gph top feed going so that could have been a cause with too many roots in the netpot. .

what kind of emitters are you using on your top fed lines?
sorry if Missed it checked your thread manually and with the search tool and couldn't find it,

I was going to start mine with 2- 2GPH drip emitters per unit and go from there but if that whats you were using I might start smaller.

 

[antimatter]

antimatter, my problem was getting rootbound in the netpots and drainage wasn't happening...causing things to stay too wet. I've had some coco plants that were too rootbound that didn't drain very well but I wasn't feeding them 24/7 either. Also, if your coco gets too compacted, it takes all the air space out that allows good drainage. I wouldn't recommend coco with no coco pots as it would make a mess in your res. You'd need something to filter it out or wash it all off like northone does.

Yhea I was thinking more along the lines of some rooting cloth in the bottom, but no holes on the side. Would you say 24/7 feeding in coco is to much? I remember Jalisco mentioning coco gets to wet and he used the chow mix instead, but I like to hear more then 1 opinion.

 

[Lost]

Lost, I don't think it's a reason to get too alarmed, especially since you're not top feeding like we were. You've had good luck with it so far but keep a close eye on things as always.

About the top feed: I really took it to heart a year or more ago when DD's said that the top feed was only to get the roots to the water, after that its not doing much. I have never top fed and never had a top rot issue. I'm just saying that when I tried to recreate DD's work, with the experience I already had, I just figured fusk the top feed, the only reason for the top bucket is something to hold the plant upright into the nutrient solution. The plant is getting its nutes fro the bottom, why feed the top? It creates not only a wonderful meidum for bugs and fungas, but makes the plant concentrate on an area of the plant that is not a focus.

I have really tried to keep quiet about the chances for bad with top feed, but after seing my bro have such issues, I gotta ask, "Is it worth it to top feed? Are you reallygoinging enought weight wise as opposed to the possible things that can go wrong?

I hand fed my current batch for 2 days before the feeler roots hit the water and after that Im done. The coco is still pretty damp and inch above the water line, its like a candle wick.. no need fo top feed with to coco.

Ok, well I have made an ass of myself once again, and EP, and Dizzle, you know how highly I think of you and your work. Anyway, much love...

 

[mrdizzle]

I cut my top feed for now, I dont think you need other than getting the roots down there either. I hadnt done me wrong but unless Im running 100% hydroton I wont be using it the whole grow. my new focus having roots dangling out of the 10in net pots before I transplant.

my rooms fine, just a scare. could have been the roots excel I added causign teh roots to look brown, but when I flushed and hit them with the sm-90 it seemed to clean the roots right off

the shitty thing is since I lost my last room Im on high high alert, which is a good thing, but I liked it better when I thought nothing could go wrong

I guess anytime your fucking around with water sports shit can go wrong at anything

easy I forgot to say, keep that res pumped with h202 and sm-90, to make sure those other 3 make it through

 

[600gph]

Easy and Lost,

What was the reason you decided to go with coco instead of the rockwool/hydroton because of your familiarity with that medium????

The only reason I keep the top feed going is for the extra gph.....

Easy,

Hope you stick around....This subforum seems pretty mellow....The only way we all learn is by posting our problems and mistakes so it doesnt happen again...

Dizzle,

Thought the UC had a top feed????

Agreed would be nice if I could flip right away, but the girls seem to take about 10 - 14 days to adjust to the big lights...


Jackmayhoffer uses the hortilux dual arcs....From what i understand they are a 600hps and 400mh in one bulb....Do you think these bulbs have the same penetration as a regular 1000....I cant imagine that it would but he liked his results.....


mc

 

[easypleasie]

Giddeon, I made my own drip rings and had a 1200 gph pump hooked up to 5 girls. Serious overkill. It was working great till roots filled up the netpot. I switched out to a 700 gph and then had to add a cycle timer...and eventually had to turn the top feed off completely. My original thought was to increase DO by having extra flow going through the system. It didn't work out the way I was expecting.

antimatter, I wouldn't recommend any top buckets without the holes up the side...mainly cause I just lost two of my biggest plants ever. I'd rather not take the chance of that happening again. I've never done 24/7 in straight coco (other than the coco pots) but my gut feeling tells me it would stay too wet. I wouldn't do 24/7 with the chow mix either, only straight hydroton.

Lost, you have more experience at this than I do and that counts for a lot, bro. You have plenty to contribute. I don't know if the benefits of having a top feed is worth the potential problems. I may end up not using a top feed at all or at least cutting it out after the first couple weeks. I know if I had cut out the top feed after week 2 of flower, I probably wouldn't have lost my girls. Lots of trials to go before we find what works best for us and not necessarily what's best for the plants. Funny how that statement makes sense to me now.

dizzle, thanks for reminding me. I need to go add a little. I've been using h2o2 but haven't tried the sm-90. I'll go pick some of that up today. I only have 2 mpb girls left but they have bounced back and look like they will finish...might take an extra week or so to finish due to the setback.

 

[easypleasie]

Yo what up, mc! Posted before I read your post. I stuck with the coco cause I felt more comfortable with it. There are just so many different variables with this system that I was not familiar with. Hydro in general, chillers, air pumps, water pumps, etc...it's a lot to learn at first.

I'd like to see jack run one of his setups with a mix of 1k mh and 1k hps and compare with the dual arcs. I have a feeling the 1ks will blow the dual arcs away with bigger plants. I might try switching out a couple of my hps bulbs with dual arcs during the last couple weeks of flower. One of these days...

 

[billy liar]

Hi ep,
your prob must lie with the size of hole in the net pot IMO.
I ran this kind of system TOP FEED ONLY and never had any blockages in the pot, only in return lines...
I use a bucket and make my own holes in the bottom of the bucket, slightly smaller than your clay pebble, as many hole as i can, and this stops root strangulation..
Heath did a side by side test, to see if any difference was made by turning off the top feed once roots were established in the bottom tub. and no difference was found..
this system is the same as heaths water/aquafarm mods, and one of the first steps is to add to and increase the size of the holes in the waterfarm inner pot to stop root strangulation..
just my humble opinion, based on heaths teachings, and my experience.
peace
BL

 

[Lost]

Billy, could you PM me where this info can be found? Really curious to read about this test!

 

[easypleasie]

Hey billy, thanks for chiming in. How's your grow going? I recall reading about your one 600 watt grow.

There are quite a few things that could have contributed to the root cloggage. Too small of holes, not enough holes, too fast of top feed, too small of netpot, root bound in the coco pots, and explosive growth after using roots excel are a few possibilities. I'm gonna try to eliminate as much as I can on the next run.

I recall reading about Heath's mods in his threads...he uses pretty large top buckets. I really like the wide 4 gallon top buckets he's using now and have actually been looking for something similar. Lots of space for roots to come out.

I'm a huge fan of Heath's and have always valued everything he has said and done. His experience is unparalleled and if there's one person I look up to the most, it would be Heath. I wish he could post more often but I totally understand why he'd want to stay off the boards. He's been doing this for a long ass time. It's such a shame so much good info was lost when the other sites went down.

 

[mrdizzle]

this product is basically clorox and RO. regular clorox has 5.7% clorine, this product has 2.5%,

40-80ml of pythoff per 260gal( 1000L) of water will kill rot rot, so 40ml of bleach per 260gals will treat and kill root rot. I was using 25ml for 160gals of water and it really works

commerical greenhouses use bleach at 2ppm for the entire grow, the only bad thing is I cant find a PPM tester that works in saltwater to test the PPM

 

[600gph]

Dizzle,

Did you order the product or find it at the local hydro shop...

mc

 

[600gph]

Yo what up, mc! Posted before I read your post. I stuck with the coco cause I felt more comfortable with it. There are just so many different variables with this system that I was not familiar with. Hydro in general, chillers, air pumps, water pumps, etc...it's a lot to learn at first.

I'd like to see jack run one of his setups with a mix of 1k mh and 1k hps and compare with the dual arcs. I have a feeling the 1ks will blow the dual arcs away with bigger plants. I might try switching out a couple of my hps bulbs with dual arcs during the last couple weeks of flower. One of these days...

Or maybe use them for the adjustment period...Less lumens...

mc

 

[mrdizzle]

Dizzle,

Did you order the product or find it at the local hydro shop...

mc

I just used bleach at 25ml per 160gal, but thats one of the only products I could find that is suppose to kill root rot