my theory would be that you can flower successfully under 4/4, 6/6 or 8/8 light cycles

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Observationist

Observationist

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Moe.Red said:
Glad to help you if I can.
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I've been vegging with 4/2 but I don't have a control so I can't talk about how it compares to regular, besides it's working for me.

Flower is another beast, I briefly did 2/2 in the 5x5 solos before I went to 13/11, they stretched crazy and shot up, over a few days.

In one brief/few cycles under 2/2 in the 2x4 resulted in single finger leafs, switched cycle to 16/8 , they went back to normal.
 
Aqua Man

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Moe.Red said:
Very cool the direction this thread has taken.

I have tested the far red puts plants to bed sooner question personally. My conclusion was 60Watts in a 4x4 half of a 4x8 tent was no difference. I can elaborate if you want but I think like aqua said there is more to it.

It’s the R:FR ratio at a very high ppfd that matters. I did not have it right so I was not able to duplicate the results in the published study we all base this on.

I’d like to see it work once so if there is anything I can do to help you @PipeCarver lmk. I’ve got lights I can send you if you need more far red ppfd. I also have a far red ppfd meter from apogee. HPS would be awesome to run with your far red bar if you can swing it.

There’s a few wsys to run far red.

Emerson effect is also a ratio thing that causes additional photosynthesis to take place. Bigger yield.

Far red early in veg effects morphology by signaling indirect light triggering shade response which pushes the plant wide not tall.

Far red early to late flower like you are talking about running them pipe carver starts the switching of hormones to night mode more quickly. Why do we want that? So you can leave lights on longer remain in flower and increase DLI but not add any ppfd to the plant. So basically you can push them to the verge of cooking then push them a little harder. Bigger yield.

And yeah that green stuff is a whole other thing.

Glad to see you back to your old tricks aqua. We missed you around here during your move.
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There is also a similar effect with UV and blue to increase photosynthesis. So basically both ends of the spectrum. Where prior science said plants only use 400-700 wavelengths… we now know the the red and far red, blue and UV are dependent on both to increase photosynthesis further. This was missed because i think it was McCree who tested the photosynthetic range using only single spectrums that resulted in the prior thinking of only 400-700nm
 
Observationist

Observationist

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Aqua Man said:
There is also a similar effect with IV and blue to increase photosynthesis. So basically both ends of the spectrum. Where prior science said plants only use 400-700 wavelengths… we now know the the red and far red, blue and UV are dependent on both to increase photosynthesis further. This was missed because i think it was McCree who tested the photosynthetic range using only single spectrums that resulted in the prior thinking of only 400-700nm
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Agreed, afaik they'll respond to just about all wavelengths.
 
Moe.Red

Moe.Red

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Observationist said:
I've been vegging with 4/2 but I don't have a control so I can't talk about how it compares to regular, besides it's working for me.

Flower is another beast, I briefly did 2/2 in the 5x5 solos before I went to 13/11, they stretched crazy and shot up, over a few days.

In one brief/few cycles under 2/2 in the 2x4 resulted in single finger leafs, switched cycle to 16/8 , they went back to normal.
Click to expand...
Interesting is this in your solo cup thread? I gotta catch up.
 
GreenGalaxyFarm

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articles on molecular research on plant circadian rhythms is limited..
zero research has been done to alter clock from 24 to 12, 6 or another cycle(or that i can find). its is my understanding some plants however do have this ability and will work with what input stresses are put on in, the plants would respond by changing the rate at which biological processes occur within itself in response to light and temperature changes around it as it has for millenia.
 
GreenGalaxyFarm

GreenGalaxyFarm

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Aqua Man said:
My thoughts are the hormones wont allow anything less than 10 hrs of uninterrupted darkness for flower as they shift very fast when exposed to light and are very slow to shift lights out.
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this is dependent on plants exposure to levels of uv to fr 'sunrise' and fr to uv at 'sunset' more so than any other part of the spectrum
led allowing us to toy with uv/fr would enable the plants to shift into light and out sooner potentially
 
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GreenGalaxyFarm

GreenGalaxyFarm

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Edinburg said:
Nature finds a way, however I only cut my cycle to12/12 I don't like to wait.
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its said that increased cycles can lead to an increase in ripening. not wanting to wait could be a factor when deciding to play with the plants biological rhythms or circadian clock.
together with the correct phytochemicals, chemical signalling and aminos this can be done
 
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Aqua Man

Aqua Man

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GreenGalaxyFarm said:
this is dependent on plants exposure to levels of uv to fr 'sunrise' and fr to uv at 'sunset' more so than any other part of the spectrum
led allowing us to toy with uv/fr would enable the plants to shift into light and out sooner potentially
Click to expand...
No its dependant on the hormon florigen produced from light cycle periods not spectrum. Afaik unless you have some new updated science im unaware of
 
Moe.Red

Moe.Red

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Aqua Man said:
No its dependant on the hormon florigen produced from light cycle periods not spectrum. Afaik unless you have some new updated science im unaware of
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I have seen growers post about trying to shorten up nights and stay in flower - no reveg. While there is no hard fast rule and strains matter, in general anything under 10 hours full dark seems to be problematic. Plant health and other factors apply...

I can't help thinking there are so many other ways to tune the grow that clearly work, this one seems less appealing to attempt. I need to go back and read the solo cup thread, not clear to me if observationist tried this and succeeded or not. Can anyone demonstrate success with something like 4/4 or 6/6?
 
Aqua Man

Aqua Man

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Moe.Red said:
I have seen growers post about trying to shorten up nights and stay in flower - no reveg. While there is no hard fast rule and strains matter, in general anything under 10 hours full dark seems to be problematic. Plant health and other factors apply...

I can't help thinking there are so many other ways to tune the grow that clearly work, this one seems less appealing to attempt. I need to go back and read the solo cup thread, not clear to me if observationist tried this and succeeded or not. Can anyone demonstrate success with something like 4/4 or 6/6?
Click to expand...
My thoughts exactly 10 or more of full dark… 12 is just a safe bet but i do know a few doing 10-11 dark. Personally i dont see a need for a longer light period unless you are struggling with getting light intensity high enough to reach a good DLI
 
Observationist

Observationist

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GreenGalaxyFarm said:
articles on molecular research on plant circadian rhythms is limited..
Click to expand...

GreenGalaxyFarm said:
zero research has been done to alter clock from 24 to 12, 6 or another cycle(or that i can find).
Click to expand...

GreenGalaxyFarm said:
its is my understanding some plants however do have this ability and will work with what input stresses are put on in, the plants would respond by changing the rate at which biological processes occur within itself in response to light and temperature changes around it as it has for millenia.
Click to expand...
That's what I wanted to see.
 
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