Need Help With Setting Up New Under Current 13 Gal Xxl System And 8 Gal Xl Systems

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FLtoMI

FLtoMI

Hi there,

obviously I'm new to this, thankfully I have some friends with experience helping me. I would love to get your input on proper setup of 72 plant site.

Building: 6,000sqf metal insulated building. Main area is 96' long by about 40' wide with 18' high ceilings.
Equipment: Purchasing two 24 site Current Culture 13 gal XXL systems with Eco Plus commercial grade 1.5 HP water chillers plus two 24 site Current Culture 8 gal XL systems also with chillers.

I plan on using 2 plants per light setup, with 1,000 HPS vertical bulbs with parabolic hood setup for flowering, and change the bulbs to 1,000 MH for the veg periods. (not sure if this is the best setup, or if I should setup one of the rooms as dedicated veg room?)

Light spacing 5' center to center, plant spacing 4' center to center.

My initial idea was to build 2-3 rooms (maybe 16' x 32' dimensions) just framed up to the 18' ceilings (standard 2' spacing) and to use the panda film instead of wood to create the walls. Due to the cold climate and lack of AC system at the place, as well as having such high ceilings, my plan is to have vented rooms for now. Bring cold air (filtered) from outside with maybe 12" fans and exhaust hot air outside using a carbon filtered 12" again.

After finding the two 24 site 13 gal systems and the two 24 site 8 gal systems, I'm thinking to adjust the room dimensions, maybe put the two 24 site 13 gal XXL systems together in one 32' x 24' room? Maybe similar size room for the two 8 gal systems? That way I have 48 plant site in each room, maybe use the 8 gal for veg and the 13 gal to flower? Only downside is that I will only have 36 plants in each room, even though my systems allow for 48 plants in each room due to the limitations of my plant count. Or maybe setup the two 13 gal in one room for 48 plants, and just one 24 site 8 gal systems in one veg room, and veg for only 1 month after which move the 24 into the 48 plant flower room, thus feeding 24 plants every 1 month into the flower room?

Also I'm not clear on best setup as far as equipment goes. Should my main tanks be located outside of the grow rooms (in the open warehouse area) in order to keep temperature of the water down easier? How should I setup the intake/exhaust of air in each room best? Can I still run CO2 in the rooms if I have vented rooms or not worth it? What's the best setup in order to maximize production and minimize time? Thank you for any advice, it would be greatly appreciated!
 
FLtoMI

FLtoMI

Yes I sent them an email asking for help setting up the right way, waiting to hear from them. I wish there was someone experienced with RDWC and these systems that I could hire to come help me setup everything lol... Hate to make mistakes.
 
RoeBuck

RoeBuck

Wow, that's an ambitious setup. Personally, I would opt for a separate veg area rather than changing bulbs all the time. You may also find that staggering your systems may work better than planting, and harvesting, all 48 plants at once. I run two 8 plant systems with a separate 8 plant veg system. I harvest 8 plants every 5-6 weeks instead of all 16 at once. I try to keep things organized so I've always got the next batch finishing veg when one system is ready to harvest. Then I start vegging the next batch so it's ready when the second system is ready to harvest. You might also consider separate bloom rooms and run them on a flip. Bloom one system for 12 hours, then flip the lights on in the second room when the first one goes lights out. Spread the electrical usage out a bit.

There are several older threads in here that highlight big commercial setups. I'm sure if you look into them you might get some more ideas.
 
Purpletrain

Purpletrain

Being new i think your setting your self up for a major fail start off with a few figure out what is what
worse thing you an do is start off with that much
Either way its up to you lots of shit to figure out before jumping in a pool like learning how to swim first

Anyways Good luck i be watching
 
snoopytime

snoopytime

do a big coco smart pot run like 5 gallons each for the first 6 months til you dial the room in .. get your investment back . . then progress to ultra cutting edge :)
 
All4freedumb

All4freedumb

What's up Farmer! Congratulations on your new adventure, it sounds like you have a big one on your hands... I would definitely listen to CCH2O guys on this build out as they have seen many build outs.
I'm not sure as to why you don't have an ac to run, maybe seasonal or the area you're in, but if you plan on adding an ac to your space keep your cooling load in each room in mind. I would think about using an AC blower to pull from your outside, filter your air and distribute your air in your rooms. That way you can control your flow exactly where you want it like a central AC unit and you can always add your condenser unit later on down the road if or when needed.
I like the idea of splitting your flower rooms up into two rooms with a 24 site in each room. I also flip flop my flowering rooms, saving on my power load, as well as off setting my harvest. You can also use one ac unit for both rooms using a zone controller. Splitting your flower rooms also allows for half of the plants needed in veg at one time. I have a third room that I have split up for moms, clones and veg. I like that you are planning out your veg using an UC. I would look into their pro modules with lids for 4 or 6 net pots per module for veg and get one extra so you can veg out more than the exact plant count needed. You can then choose your best 24. The will also take up less sq ft. for veg and less water, if using 6 site lids. Less sq ft. for veg means less lighting needed to cover that area.
I keep all my gear in a third room split with electrical on one side and water tanks and epicenters on the other. This allows me to access everything without entering my girls rooms. My water tanks for top off equals the gallons my systems holds. I have one per system. I then have a larger tank/tanks that hold 3× + the volume of water in my systems that holds ro water.
You then want a room big enough for all your drying needs so you don't need to take up your grow space and you can reload your rooms as soon as you harvest and cleanup. Then a trim room, I like to keep my trim room separate from everything with an entrance away from the grow. My trim rooms have two entrances, one for trimmers to enter and one to bring product from the dry room. Some worker bees only need to know what's in between the 4 walls they are working in. This also allows only workers that are clean and knowledgeable about the grow around the plants.
I would also have a separate clean room that you walk in before your grow areas. This will allow you and workers to change into clothes dedicated to the grow. Bringing in outside elements is a big problem in large grows.
Have you looked into running de bulbs with those tall ceilings? Maybe rock those with some 600 verts down the rows... Does this place have city water or is it on a well?
Keep in mind that those tall ceilings rock in your flower rooms but in your trim, dry, veg, mom and clone rooms and electrical/water bridge the ceilings can be 8ft. So you can add a second floor and stack those areas. That would let you utilize your space more efficiently.
You can start out big and have success. Just keep it slow and easy and listen to the guys at CCH2O. People always want to push their plants in the UC but nothing good usually comes from that. I look forward to hearing your choices and listening to your thoughts along the way. Feel free to ask questions, you will find the help. If you want help or have questions designing this beast pm me, I've built out a few of these and will make some time to help where I can. Thanks for sharing your plans and I hope you continue to share along the ride...
A4FD
 
FLtoMI

FLtoMI

Wow thank you so much A4FD, that's some awesome info and food for thought. Love the advice and your ideas about the extra room setup, I have plenty of space to make it happen and also thought about stacking some rooms on top of each other for future expansion. The place is on Well by the way, so I will be running water tests to figure our my RO system, I'm sure I will need an RO..

I've been looking at the Gavita DE bulbs, a friend is advising me to go with that setup, and he thinks the 600 can do just as well as the 1,000w but I don't know. Price is about $427 per setup, while the 1,000 HPS could be had for about half that, with parabolic reflectors and vertical bulbs using Hortilux HPS, which allows the flexibility to change to MH bulbs if needed, not sure if that would ever be needed in any of the rooms if you have a dedicated grow room.

Also this guy is getting some huge amounts from his plants in the 13 gal system, but he has them spaced at 5' centers plant to plant. I thought that's pretty big space for these plants, and not sure how to figure out the lights, as I was planning to use 2 plant per 1 light setup, so if the lights are spaced 5' apart and the plants are spaced 5' apart, the count will be coming closer to 1 light per 1 plant it seems... :( Not sure how to do it. The Gavita's setup seems to be 4' x 6' coverage from what I read, but he was saying to hang them very high, maybe 14' high rather than lower. That way they overlap, I'm just not sure if there will be enough light penetration at that height.
 
UCMENOW

UCMENOW

FLtoMI seems like you're putting in your due diligence. No doubt it will reap dividends once you embark on your grow journey!
 
FLtoMI

FLtoMI

Thank you for the DE 1,000W Hortilux video, that's awesome. I'm currently trying to decide on the light setup for the rooms so this is very helpful.

I have a friend proposing that the 6/750W flex DE from Gavita would be the best way to go. He thinks I will get better yield using those high up (3-4' above the plants or more). I know lumens diminish pretty quick when you move the source away from the plants, so this doesn't make much sense to me, but apparently it's working for many growers.

I also understand that Gavita has DE 1,000W light setups as well. My initial thought was to use the old and tried 1,000W HPS Hortilux in a parabolic setups, but it seems that there might be better options out there. What is your opinion on the BEST setup with respect to yield? I don't think it matters much how much electric it uses, as the yield benefits seem to largely outweigh the cost savings of electricity or bulb replacements and etc..
 
P

PoseidonXtrx

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Wow thank you so much A4FD, that's some awesome info and food for thought. Love the advice and your ideas about the extra room setup, I have plenty of space to make it happen and also thought about stacking some rooms on top of each other for future expansion. The place is on Well by the way, so I will be running water tests to figure our my RO system, I'm sure I will need an RO..

I've been looking at the Gavita DE bulbs, a friend is advising me to go with that setup, and he thinks the 600 can do just as well as the 1,000w but I don't know. Price is about $427 per setup, while the 1,000 HPS could be had for about half that, with parabolic reflectors and vertical bulbs using Hortilux HPS, which allows the flexibility to change to MH bulbs if needed, not sure if that would ever be needed in any of the rooms if you have a dedicated grow room.

Also this guy is getting some huge amounts from his plants in the 13 gal system, but he has them spaced at 5' centers plant to plant. I thought that's pretty big space for these plants, and not sure how to figure out the lights, as I was planning to use 2 plant per 1 light setup, so if the lights are spaced 5' apart and the plants are spaced 5' apart, the count will be coming closer to 1 light per 1 plant it seems... :( Not sure how to do it. The Gavita's setup seems to be 4' x 6' coverage from what I read, but he was saying to hang them very high, maybe 14' high rather than lower. That way they overlap, I'm just not sure if there will be enough light penetration at that height.
If your ceiling allows for 14' mounting then you can't go wrong with the 750 or 1000 DE gavitas.
I run the 1000s with 10' ceilings, 3-4' over the canopy head and no issues. Can't recommend DE lights enough!
 
FLtoMI

FLtoMI

Thank you for the info Poseidon, that's great to hear. Can I ask you a quick question if I may?

Do you believe there is a considerable difference between the 1,000 Watt HPS SE and the Double Ended 1,000 Watt lights? My biggest concern is with distance from plants. Everything I read says that the lumens and PAR diminishes very quick with distance, almost cut in half for every 6" to 12" that you move the light source away from the plants. Running the DE lights 3-4' away from the plants since they run quite hot would suggest that the actual PAR at the plants is cut to 20-25% of what is advertised. Wouldn't you just be wasting a lot of electric energy in doing so, for less results? Theoretically speaking of course... wouldn't you be better off getting 600W fixtures that you can run 12" away from the plants and get much better PAR at the plants, and thus better results? Or it's not as simple as that...

Also I've been reading a lot on the most efficient setup, and it seems like the Sun Systems AC/DE setup outperforms Gavita or anyone else when it comes to running cooler/closer to plants, and much higher PAR? Is that just marketing bs or is it true?
 
FLtoMI

FLtoMI

Also I have a question for all the experienced growers out there. What would be the best setup for highest yearly yield between these two options:

1. 36 Plants veg 60 days, 36 plants flower 60 days (total 6 harvests per year of 36 plants, for 216 plants total per year)
2. 24 Plants veg 30 days, another 24 plants veg the next 30 days, 48 plants flower 60 days (total 12 harvests of 24 plants but only vegged 30 days, 288 plants total per year)

Vegging in 8 gal system, flowered in 13 gal system.

Any ideas which method would yield better overall per year??
 
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