Need Opinion on Set-up .....

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LTG

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I would like to thank anybody in advance who reads this and can offer any suggestions to help me on my 1st set-up. Hopefully, I include everything so it will make it easier to give advice. Here we go:

Grow Area 10' x 3.5' x 7'

- I am planning on separating this space into 2-3 areas. I know for sure that I will have a Veg area that will be 3' x 3.5' x 7'. The remaining space will be for Flowering. Let's say that is 7' x 3.5' x 7'. Not sure if I am going to divide this up into 2 spaces, but let me list what else I have planned for this area.


-Walls and floor will be made from panda film. While I may like the mylar, I hear some bad things about it's losing it's reflectiveness after time and that it's causes a lot of hot spots which can damage leaves, so it's all panda film for me.

-I will be using a 8" inline fan for cooling the reflectors. There will be a home made carbon scrubber in use.

-I will be using a air-dryr in combination with a humidity controller to keep the humidity around 40%. I have never used this item, but I like the idea behind it vs. using a dehumidifier. I do feel this his necessary as I have seen bud rot and smaller yields from those who did not control humidity, so this will be my attempt to try and control humidity.

-Temperature Control will hopefully be good enough using the inline fan and drawing in cooler air from the basement. Summertime the air-dryr will be key as the temps in the basement are cool, but the humidity is higher. Air Conditioning will be a option, but I think I will make something to blow cool air in ....like the cooler with ice pack and making a fan to suck in air and blow the cooled air into the room. This may not be sufficent, but I will give this idea a go when the time is needed.

-C02
I will be using some 2 liter bottles for c02 to see how that works. Eventually down the line, if I am successful, I will look into a tank. But for now I figured that some C02 should be better than none and the 2 liter bottles should not put out over 1500 ppm's.

-Grow System ......well, I wanted to do a form of aeroponics, but I want to learn a bit first, especially about my strain, before I spend the extra money on this. For now, I am going to use the hempy buckets. It's simple and effective and not really hard to maintain compared to the aeroponics system I was going to build. Hempy buckets should also be easy to keep and maintain my mothers.

-Cloning System - Going to build a home made aeroponics system.

-Nutrients - Going to give Advanced Nutrients a go here. My only question here is using the Organic Stuff, does it yield less than say using their Connoisseur Line?
I will use the Organic way for my mother and veg plants, but when in flowering, I was really looking into the Connoisseur Line. If there is no considerable difference, then I will stick with the Organic way.

-Strains
Elite - Lemon Larry
OGR - xxx x Bubblegum (few different ones)
Barney's Farm - G13 x Haze & Red Diesel

Lighting- Here is where my problem lays ......what is best for my area. I have the following ballasts:
1 - Lumatek 400w
2 - Lumatek 600w
1 - Lumatek 1000w


Basically I was going to use the 400w with a Hydrofarm 6" air-cooled hood w/ lens in the veg room for my mothers. Is this 400w overkill to maintain 6 mothers? Could I get away with a 250w or would stretching become a issue? Or am I looking at this all wrong and should I be using 6500 Kelvin T5's?

Since we are on the Veg Space, do I need the full 7' or can I use like 4'-5' for the mother chamber and then use the space above for my clones? I was thinking of using T5's or what would even be better for me, CFL's. If the CFL's are good for clones, how many would I need for that space I have? It's easier and cheaper for me to built a light box with CFL's and opposed to buying a T5 fixture with the bulbs.


The Flowering Area - These are some of the ways I was thinking of doing it and I just can't decide on what is best due to me being so green (means new)....

Option #1 - (2) 600w Lumateks in either the Magum, Great White, or Mondo hoods (the biggest ones available).

Option #2 - (1) 600w Lumatek in either the Magum, Great White, or Mondo hoods. I would then split the Flowering Area into 2 equal spaces and just move the light (on a home made rail out of some unistrut and a roller assembly I have held onto for about 4 years that I may finally put to good use) into each room every 12 hours. The rooms will obviously be light proof.

Option #3 - (1) 1000w Lumatek on a Light Mover in either the Magum, Great White, or Mondo hoods. By what I read the 1000w should be ok for the space I have alone, but because of the space being rectangular vs. square, I feel the light mover will distribute the light better.

Option #4 - (1) 1000w Lumatek in either the Magum, Great White, or Mondo hoods. I would then split the Flowering Area into 2 equal spaces and just move the light (on a home made rail out of some unistrut and a roller assembly I have held onto for about 4 years that I may finally put to good use) into each room every 12 hours. The rooms will obviously be light proof.


Here are some of the things I was trying to weigh out when trying to figure out which lighting is best for me:

1 - Cost to Run
A- Using the (1) 1000w would be the most cost effective way for flowering, but with the shape of the space and using a mover, I'm not sure if that will yield better results than using 2 600w. I do know you get the most bang for your buck with the 600w.... Also, with using just (1) 1000w on a light mover, I'm sure I will need to fuss a little bit with air-cooling (flex pipe) to keep it from hitting the canopy. I can't see this being a huge factor, but I'm sure I will need to tweak it to get it working. Flex pipe being twisted different ways should effect the power of the air-cooling. Also, I have not really read anything as to what is a good timing to stop at the ends to give equal amount of time under the light.

B - Using the (1) 1000w in 2 separate areas would give the most direct lumens, but the cost of this is higher than I really would like to run, unless I can figure out a alternative for the Mother Chamber.

C - Using the (2) 600w seems to be the best way to me, but will my yields be that much smaller and bud quality not as good as opposed to using the 1000w?
Quality is more of a concern to me. I really do think that the penetration on a 600w would be enough, but like I stated earlier, I'm green. Also, is there a advantage of having 2 separate rooms besides for the perpetual harvest idea? I mean even if I had 2 strains going at once, I should be able to keep the canopy of each at a even height if the room was just one and not 2 separate spaces without it really effecting each other.
If the 2 rooms are better, then I will do some form of perpetual harvest. Since I will be vegging and flowering in the same room, the 600w seems perfect. The 1000w seems like overkill to me for a space that is 3.5' x 3.5'.

Techniques to be used:

As stated earlier, I am going to go with the hempy buckets at first. I figure that each 3.5' x 3.5' space can hold 4-5 plants. I do plan on vegging for 2-4 weeks as I will be trying FIM, topping, LST, Super-cropping techniques. While the SOG method is appealing, I can keep less plants and have a better yield for the gear I have. The stuff from Barney's may be better for SOG, but I will find out in time after I have selected a mother (if I get a female) and do a hempy first so I can learn how my girls react to different amounts of nutrients, time in flowering, etc. I only say that about Barney's gear because they list the yields higher than the other gear I have selected, but the genetics and quality are most like better than Barney's gear. I still have to contact the breeders with a few questions like how tall do they get in flowering, how wide they get, nutrient schedule, weeks in flowering. I have a range of 36" that I am looking to get. That should give me about 12" of leeway in case something takes off more than expected.

-Hempy Bucket

Only thing here that I need to decide on is the grow medium. I know I am going to use the stones on the bottom (forgot the name of the stuff) and then the rest is a combo mixture. I was wondering if you can use coco and how it is used in this system? Do I just use pure coco over the stones on the bottom or is this a mix? Which coco is best for this and how do I prep it? I am attracted to the coco because of the balanced pH and how it works well in hydroponic systems.

Also, .is using a 5 gallon bucket too much or should I used something like a 3.5 - 4 gallon bucket?

I know many growers have had a failed first crop and some don't like to help out, at least that is the way I feel as I ask questions around and don't really get help, but I still would like to thank them for the information they do post. I have learned a lot and feel that I can finally move forward in the near future. A year ago I thought I would be ready to just jump in, but as I kept reading, I kept learning about something else and then would change my mind. I have successfully germinated some ditch-weed seeds before I took the step of wasting quality seeds in my experiment, so hopefully that will help out when I am ready. I really should have taken a break here and there so I would not be so damn confused, but I guess as GI Joe used to say ....Knowing is half the battle.

If there is anything else I forgot to mention, just ask and I will get you the answer. I don't know if it matters, but I do have the following:

-Bluelab Truncheon
-Hanna PH meter
-Temp/Hygrometer w/ Hi/Low readings for the day
-Fans for air circulation in the room to help strengthen the plants as well as to provide more air circulation
 
jadins_journey

jadins_journey

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LTG, I must say I am impressed with the amount of research you have done and the list of equipment you have put together. I re-read your post a couple of times and came to a couple of conclusions:
1- you are going to run multiple strains at the same time
2- you are going to veg and flower in the same chamber

If this is your plan then I would seperate the flower chambers and light proof each. Nothing worse than to have clones ready to go but flower chamber is on 12/12 for another 3 weeks, hope that makes some sense, multiple strains multiple flower times etc.

A 1000 watter in a 3.5 x 3.5 is far from overkill, it's actually close to ideal giving you 81watts/F2. With the equipment list you have I would split the rooms and run a 600 in each with a sealed air system seperate from room air ventilation. The 400 in your mother room is the only thing that might be close to overkill especially if you are going to section off part of the upper area for clones, it will work but your gonna have to be on top of your mother plants or they'll get huge.

just a couple ideas, I'm sure there will be more experienced farmers help you out in short order.

jj
 
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LTG

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JJ,
I welcome all comments and/or suggestions and appreciate you taking the time to post your suggestions. I will answer your questions as best as I can, but I need to do that in a few hours as I am suddenly pressed for time .......I mean to keep things short, but for some odd reason, I can't stop talking :P


I also should have included that I will be using MH Blue Hortilux bulbs for Veg and HPS Super Enhanced Hortilux for Flowering.
 
greenthumbdanny

greenthumbdanny

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Sounds like ya watched See More Buds on the Tube eh.

Personally me, The 400 would be great for housing mothers. They will grow fast and plentyful and supply you with plenty of cuts if thats what you are looking for.. With the 400 stretch will not be an issue. If you don't need them in such a plentyful amount then 200watter would be probably more up your alley. What Jardin said was right on IMO.

The 1000 watter is what ya want for flowering. You will see by the results bro..

But since you have 3 areas. I would split them up and run the 400 for veg/mothers.. Break off another with the 2 600 waters, and then another with the 1000 watter.. You will be happier than pigs in shit lol.
GTD
 
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LTG

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Back Again :)

GTD thanks for your response as well :)

See More Buds? Movie - Video? Or is that a joke like Seymour Buttz?

@ JJ

1 - I did want to run a few strains at the same time. I'm not looking for anything but personal and I am going to shoot for 4 z's per plant ( I see that is what they get at max yield) and hope for 2 z's per plant with my attempt. I figure 5 plants = 10 z's (20 z's when I tune it in) that should keep me good till the next harvest is cured and then I can put at least 4 z's into storage for future use. So doing a few strains will keep variety in my life :)

2 - I don't think I will have the room in the mother chamber to veg with them or will I? If I was able to do that, I would be VERY Happy. I just can't picture the size of the mothers in the pictures that I see. There is really nothing in the back ground for me to gauge size and pictures can be deceiving. What I mean by that is, let's say you fish. When you take a picture of the catch, you can hold it different ways to show the size of the fish. If you like to tell tales of size, you would hold the fish away from your body and in the picture your average fish looks like you caught a monster.

Also, I need to figure out the size of the buckets I should use for hempy. I was going to do 5 gallon buckets because I figured that I wanted the girls to grow to 36"-44", but then I saw a few other posts where guys say they are using like 2-3 gallons buckets. That makes me wonder if that is better or would that limit the root mass that will develop and thus have a effect on yield. If I do stick with the 5 gallon buckets, I will most likely do 4 of them and not 5. By what I see in the pictures, they grow out to the sides with training and it looks to be a little past the buckets, so lets say they will have less than 2 sq' radius to grow in. On the flip side, I do see guys who veg for months and end up with bushes that are like 3'-4' wide. That would mean one monster plant!


@ gtd

I think I will hang onto the 400 for the first few months since I will be trying to gorilla grow with some clones. My idea here is to put 2 girls in 6 different spots just to see how they do in certain areas as well as how the strains I have do in the climate in my region of the country. While I have that, I have 4 real spots where I want to put 10 plants each next year. This year I will monitor those areas, work the soil, and plant some natural vegetation to hide my spots for next year. You know, some thorny bushes and stuff. I'm not into seeing people hurt, so there will be no traps. If they get it, they get it.

Back on track again, if a 250w can give me say 5-6 clones every 5 weeks, that would be GREAT. If I could VEG in the mother chamber, would the 250 be enough? If so, that would be just AWESOME DUDE! Then I could have 2 Flowering chambers going and harvest one every 5-6 weeks. That was my original idea, but now I figured if I am going to be getting quality gear, why not get good genetics and keep some mothers and learn about what I have and see if I can get anything special :)

If the 1000 watter is what I want, then I am going to use my uni-strut w/ roller idea. That means every 12 hours I will need to be there to move the lights to the next area. Basically I will use one hood, ballast, bulb for the two areas. Every 12 hours I will just slide the light on the rail to the next area. I can use some spring clamps for the ends for the flexible tubing and then make a damper system to maintain a certain temperature in both rooms. I don't want the room with the light on to effect the temperature of the one with the light off. It will be light proof. Once I have this all set-up, I will post some pictures. Plus since I will have 2 Carbon filters, I will want constant air flow to keep the smell down.

The reason I will be using that rail is so I don't overload any circuit. I have dual 20 amps to use, but I would just feel better doing the alternating of the one light rather than using 2 ballasts, hoods. This way if a bulb went out or even the power, I won't have to worry about all the girl having issues rather, just the half :) When I get more cash and work picks up, I'm sure I will get the other hood and ballast so I can just set it and forget it with a timer.
 
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LTG

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See More Buds

......I must say after a search, It's cool as hell to have video here. I can't believe that. Such a BURNOUT, I never noticed that before. Thanks for turning me onto that :)
 
L

LTG

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After more thought, I am thinking that I am going to separate the 2 spaces and light them each with 600w Super HPS & 250w Blue MH in home made cool tubes hung vertically. I was thinking to keep the 600w HPS the top one and the 250 Blue MH the lower one. I will be connecting 2 Pyrex Baking Tubes. I Will be air cooling these as well. The will be 4 plants in each space ( 3.5' x 3.5' x 7') in 4 Gallon Hempy Buckets.....

With the Hempy Buckets I have decided that Diatomite on the bottom is not for me. By what I have read, it's good for anchoring, but very pourous and retains salts. With this retention of salts and it being know to not flush out, I don't want to risk my plants from salt build up. I am now thinking of using some river rock on the bottom and then using a 70 / 30 mix of CoCo and Course Perlite. If anybody could tell me if the brick of CoCo are ok for use like this in a Hempy Bucket, I would appreciate it.

Also, if somebody could also verify that a 250w BLUE MH will be good for my mother chamber (6 plants), that would pretty much get me done. Maybe some nutrient ?'s later or something, but this would get my system built.
 
greenthumbdanny

greenthumbdanny

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Im glad ya found the See More Buds Video's lol

Man sounds like you have lots of plans brewing bro..
Im not familiar with hempy buckets, but I know a few cats here are very successful with Coco hopefully they will chime in for ya..:damnhippie:

I think the vertical lighting in conjunction with your overhead will be very beneficial.. Least ya got lots of different options..

I also posted a video on the hempy bucket, but not sure if its what your lookin for.

GTD
 
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LTG

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Final decision is that there will be 2 flower rooms. Each will have vertical lighting with 4 plants surrounding it them. There will be a total of 2 lights per room - 1 x 600 & 1x 250. I was going to mount BOTH lights in pyrex baking tubes and connect them both together to make one tube. The top end of the tube will be drawing air in from the room through a home made carbon scrubber and the bottom will be connected to the inline motor and exhausting the air of the grow room.

Now looking at what I was thinking about the bulbs, couldn't I just use Enhanced HPS for both and then they will get the blue spectrum still?

I have seen journals with the vertical lighting and it looks like it uses the light better that way rather than in a reflector. If this is something that looks like a waste of time or I missed something, let me know or give me a link to it, I don't mind reading. If the reflector is better, I can just go to the 1000w, but wanted to save some electricity if I can re-position a light if the end results in quality that is just as good as having a 1000 in a reflector.
 
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LTG

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Is it just me or are there more posts shown now? I see 1000's when just the other day it was 100's. More for me to read here. Some good articles from some breeders too. Lot of tips that are given here and there :)
 
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LTG

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....then you read the Herbalizor grow with EG and see airpots and then gets me thinking of 600 Enhanced HPS Vertically with some T5's horizontally.....There comes a point where I have to read and start to do ......
 
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LTG

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Post #62

Kills my idea of the vertical lighting in the small space. I guess his plants yield over 2.2 lbs. and need cages to support them. They are so BIG he said he lost his dog in one for a few hours ....
 
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