plant budding during veg cycle, not autoflower

[mmmdankbuds420]

I have 4 clones (4 strains) I took myself off of plants that had been flowering for maybe 5 or 6 weeks. I did it mainly out of curiosity. After being under the t5 for 2 to 3 weeks some leaves did the spiral look like I had seen in Ed Rosenthal's book. There was stunted abnormal bushy looking growth for the first month and a half or so. it looked like leaves trying to form a retarded bud. I cut off all of this bush and left the longer branches much like mini lollipops. They finally look pretty normal. I keep under t5 another 2 weeks. I transplanted and put under a 400 watt. its 10 days now into veg and two of the clones are acting fairly normal with the exception of more pistils on a vegging plant then I've ever seen, but still a good plant structure for the most part and decent growth. The other two on the other hand are trying to bud. Both have fairly stunted growth and are budding, one is trying to push trichomes. I'm aware that hormones change in the plant when flowering to induce flowering and you shouldn't clone during flowering for this reason.
My question today, what is every bodies suggestions should I do with the two? Toss em? Or set em to the side of my perpetual system until they can take on vegatative growth? Thanks everybody!

 

[mmmdankbuds420]

Tricomes after ten days?

 

[mmmdankbuds420]

A couple other close ups

 

[shadyslater]

What light schedule you vegging in mate?
I have seen this problem on another forum if i find it i'll post back

 

[mmmdankbuds420]

18/6 should be vegging. any info helps, thanks a lot shady.

 

[Seamaiden]

If the mother was a good plant, I would try to get them growing normally again. I have no idea why they're doing that given everything you've outlined, especially post-transplant.

 

[mmmdankbuds420]

Thanks maiden, that's what I ended up doing. I was so indecisive last night. first I was gonna set em to the side, then I decided to pull em then I dug em back out of the back yard and put em 4" pots. I figured what the hell, if anything I'll use em as house plants. but I always feel bad anytime I have to toss a clone

 

[Seamaiden]

A suggestion--make a strong alfalfa tea. It should be a good shot of nitrogen, which helps spur vegetative growth, and you may also be getting at some triacontanol as well.

 

[Mr.Sputnik]

It's the t5 and it's normal if your plants get really really close to the bulb. I've actually sexed plants doing that on purpose.

 

[Thoth]

It's the t5 and it's normal if your plants get really really close to the bulb. I've actually sexed plants doing that on purpose.

Can you expand on this statement?

 

[Mr.Sputnik]

Every time I have had plants practically touching the bulbs they show sex, they don't really autoflower but just pop a few calyxes or nanners. Different strains, solid ones I have been cloning for a decade do it. And it's only under florescent light this seems to happen. They only show sex on the parts of the plant closest to the bulb, the bottom won't show sex but just the top right up in the light will. It's a weird issue but I have it happen repeatedly.

 

[Mr.Sputnik]

I should mention it doesn't look like what is going on in the pictures posted on this thread though, I should have looked at those first.

 

[neverbreak]

Every time I have had plants practically touching the bulbs they show sex, they don't really autoflower but just pop a few calyxes or nanners. Different strains, solid ones I have been cloning for a decade do it. And it's only under florescent light this seems to happen. They only show sex on the parts of the plant closest to the bulb, the bottom won't show sex but just the top right up in the light will. It's a weird issue but I have it happen repeatedly.

wonder what's goin on there? tryin to think of an explanation but can't...lol

neverbreak

 

[Mr.Sputnik]

I think it's stress induced, like when root bound plants just start flowering.

 

[mmmdankbuds420]

Yes plants will always show signs of their sex when only given light from T5's. Its because of the amount of blue spectrum. That could explain the pistils, but what about the trichomes? I actally still have the two plants under T5 right now just to see what happens. I've been trimming the flowering growth off and one of them look like I'll be throwing it in the perpetual next cycle. The other one though will most likely just be donated to somebody wanting to gamble on it.

 

[mmmdankbuds420]

A little off subject but just for anybody who is not familiar With sexing with a t5, you can keep your plants on a 18/6, 24/0, or whatever veg cycle you use and still sex your plants simply using a t5 fluorescent. The blue light causes the plant to either put off pistils for the ladies we love or pop out those stamem thatll put a knot in any farmers stomach. Unless your breeding, then your gonna be dimming the lights and puttin on some barry white cause your plants are bout to get it on. Lol

 

[Seamaiden]

I've never done it, but on the surface it makes no sense. We read so often about blue light helping with more vegetative growth, and red light spectra being THE controller of flowering (phytochrome manipulation uses red wavelengths, no?) that it seems counterintuitive to me. And while I haven't used T5's (yet) for vegging, I do use a healthy mix of T8, T12 and CFL fluoros, and I know that fluoros heavy in the blue spectrum don't cause flowering all by themselves, and I also know that T5s are simply a different, perhaps more efficient fluoro footprint. Ya see where I'm going with this?

Help me understand, please. :)

 

[mmmdankbuds420]

I definitely know what your talkin about maiden. Its something that confused me, its almost like an oxymoron. I actually only a few weeks ago read about using blue light to induce signs of sex. But I will be more than happy to find the information and pass it on :) For anybody who owns the book "Ed Rosenthals marijuana growers handbook" (WHICH I HIGHLY RECOMMEMD) this information will be posted word for word and can be found on pages 357 and 358.

"BLUE LIGHT

Blue light is another option for sexing. As mentioned earlier in this chapter, marijuana flowering is Very sensitive to red light of specific spectrums. Any interuption of the dark period with light that contains the red, 660 nm spectrum returns the flowering hormone Pr back to its inactive state, pfr. This prevents flowering.
Blue light at 400-450 nm also has an inhibitory effect on flowering, but its effect is weaker than red light. Plants grow some flowers when blue light is kept on during the dark period; however, they continue to grow vegetatively as well. If you use blue LED or fluorescent lights to provide the plants with nothing but pure blue light, they will get enough stimulation to produce some flowers for sexual identification but not go into full flowering mode.
This is a good sexing technique to use anytime, but especially when a large number of plants are involved. No cuttings need to be taken and matched to their mothers, so there is no chance of a mix-up, or dead non-indicative clones. As soon as a plant produces male flowers, eliminate it from the space. Once all the plants indicate, replace the blue light with a full spectrum light period to keep plants growing vegetatively.
Plants use blue light to regulate flowering as well as for photosynthesis. Blue light is not as efficient A source of energy for photosynthesis as red light indoors because blue light has a higher energy value than red light and it requires more energy to produce than red light. However, the plant obtains the same amount of energy from both of them. When blue light is turned on during the dark period, plants photosynthesize, but the growth From the blue light is not significant. The stems grow a little more stocky.
The effect of blue light on flowering is more important to us. See the phytochrome response chart, which shows phytochrome pf-pfr sensitivity across the light spectrum. The red-far-red portion shows high activity. The blue light shows just a little bump This indicates a slight activity. The resultnis sporadic flowering on all plants.
You can create a pure blue light with LED's and blue CFL's. Use about 200 watts of mixed blue light per 1000 watts of regular light. I have done initial experimentation with this so test this in a limited way first."

I know there is plenty of irrelevant information there but I figured id copy the whole section as to leave no stone unturned. I'll work on getting a picture of the chart reffered to above :)

 

[mmmdankbuds420]

How the first picture is upside down I have no idea and apologize.

 

[AlterEgo860]

try 20/4... light cycle on revegging plants.. ive seen a huge difference in time it takes to get normal growth back.. if still have trouble some I go 24/7 lights on.. and works fine.... one thing u need to realize is.. a lot of the time wen revegging.. it looks like there trying to flower.. but really they are working there way out of flowering.. your going to see more pistils n more trichs on reveg plants... in veg..

another thing ive been doing for flowering plants.. if I need a clone.. ill clone it.. then pull off the buds... leaving some smaller new growth to continue growing.. but man ive had Single LEAF clones that didn't have anything but a LEAF on a STEM.. from fucking up pulling too much of the bud off before cloning.. and abuot 2 months later.. it had popped a new head .. and started growing again.. it was the weirdest thing ive seen..