Please help - seedlings with drooping leaves and dark undersides

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inovermyhead

Hello, this is my first time and I am worried about a couple of my little ones. Here is a rundown of the situation:

1) Strain - Chocolopes, 11 days from seed.
2) Growing indoor under 4 24" t5's, temp 70-80, humidity erratic (25-4
3) Watering schedule - kind of erratic - just when the cups feel light / and or seperate from the side, using a mix of ph'd tap water and distilled at 6.5, 1 drop of superthive per gallon, and just started a tiny bit of genisis b and 2 (1/8 tsp per gallon)
4) Growing Medium - pro mix seedling


three days ago I noticed a couple plants with wilting leaves, they are also looking puckered if that makes any sense. The underside is darker than the others. I put next to one of her more robust sisters for a contrast. Should I just lay off on the water for those plants? Anything else i can do? I also need to mention that the whole tray got knocked over that same day and I had to re set the plants. Added some dry soil around the base to prop them up some. But, an Alaskan Ice that landed on it's head looks even better than before the fall.
 
pimpin

pimpin

strain hoarder
Supporter
do u have drain holes on the bottom for the water to drain my opinion inever give babys any nutes just water or ur soil might b to hot or maybe over watering
 
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inovermyhead

Yeah, drain holes on bottom and some on sides too. I really want to know if it's too late. I'm letting them dry now and no more nutes. I gave them an extremely diluted dose (under 200 ppm) since there arent any in the soil. I mean, in nature don't plants get nutes from the soil? Ever seen that dark color on the bottom?

It hasnt been above 80 in there.

Thanks
 
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inovermyhead

Not repot, just set them up straight and put a little extra dirt on top. Hopefully it will pull through. I keep getting mixed signals on feeding - how could it be a nitrogen deficiency if the cotyledons have enough food to meet their needs? I did feed a little bit - mainly because it seems like in a soiless mix it would make sense to enrich the soil a little. Should I just give ph'd water until the cotyldons shrivel up?
 
budboy299

budboy299

I get this too depending on strain sometimes. Same conditions with 2 strains growing side by side and 1 strain will do the droop thing. Must be 1 strain is more sensitive than another. My pure purple did that but and then suddenly by the 3rd or 4th set of leaves suddenly straightened right up.
 
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tenacious

is it possible for you to buy clones??? imo clones are much ezier for beginers. i would mix about 1/3 worm casting & add perilite to the pro-mix. the worm castings will supply all the nitrogen you will until transplanting. i would water w/ dilute maxi-crop[seaweed] & maybe some molassas.
keep in mind, the 2 most common mistakes beginers make are over-watering & over-fertilizing.
i'd also buy seeds that are known to be 'forgiving' & desease-resistant.
plants that are 'mostly indica' tend to be stronger & ezier to work w/ imo.
 
og dmc

og dmc

could be too cold. 75-80 degrees is good for seedlings. Soil stay too wet when its cold. I dont think they look that bad though.
 
C

CrippledCrow

Guest
Just genetics man , I play with alot of purple strains and and I get seedling with purple undersides quite abit , they will grow out of it and the purpling will disappear and come back in flowering , try adding a space heater on low to get the soil temps up . I have some of my purple jesus seedlings that just grew out of the purple undersiding a week back.
Its all good bro.
 
C

CrippledCrow

Guest
Yes you can add soil to give them structure, you can remove the embryonic leaves at the very bottom and add soil past them to give your seedlings better support.
 
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inovermyhead

Thanks for the advice and encouragement. No clones - I am totally out of the loop which is why i am doing this. So you (tenacious) think I should add the worm castings and perlite on top or pull them out and re pot? I will be repotting anyway in a week or so to the regular pro mix with nutes. I did order some kelp based supplements (greenfuse). I picked those two strains b/c they were supposed to be forgiving and pest resistant. The Alaskan Ice is unstoppable. I literally dropped one on its head, and a day later it was stronger than before the fall (up until then it needed some support b/c it stretched. Their (the AI) cotyledons are starting to yellow too - so they should be hungry soon right?
 
I

inovermyhead

Alright, I just went to check on them after letting them sleep on the heat mat. No real change in the weakling - maybe a little worse but the cup doesnt seem to be drying much. However, a couple otherwise healthy ones have developed some spots on the first set of leaves. It almost looks like a layer of the leaf has been shaved away in those spots. Most of the cotyledons are yellowing so is it time to feed now? When the cups are completely dry should i saturate them and let the plants appear overwatered for a few days and repeat when completely dry? They all look really dry but are about 20 g heavier than a cup with just dry soil.

- update i cut off one of the leaves to take pics top and bottom - I really think this is some sort of ailment. I added two more pics of the leaf I cut off top and bottom view. You see that the darkness on the bottom is gome from where the spots are yellow on top, also the spots are bound in by the veins. It looks like domething I saw on other plants called downy mildew. So, not what? Do I pitch them all? If this is something that's all over plants outside will i be stuck without being able to grow?
 
I

inovermyhead

There don't seem to be any bugs on any of the plants, the description of Downy Mildew fits it to a tee "On some plants, downy mildew infection may look similar to injury from foliar nematodes. In both cases, angular lesions are bounded by leaf veins. However, downy mildew infection results in a soft, fluffy gray, brown or purple fungal sporulation developing on the underside of leaves." doesnt that fit my last two pics to a tee? See more at: http://www.hort.uconn.edu/Ipm/greenh.../downymlgh.htm but now I don't know how to treat it without causing damage to these fragile young plants (maybe their not so fragile???) THe intial droopy one is about to get separated and doused with ortho ecosense (.08% copper octanoate) because it's the only thing i could get right now. As for the rest I'm gonna try to keep the temps above 75 becuase supposedly it doesnt like that. The only thing I can't figure out is that my humidity in the closet hasnt been over 50% but I guess it must be higher right there at that first set of leaves??? From the article it sounds like the spores are everywhere you just have to make the environement inhospitable. An article about growing chocolope mentioned a spray "Also after the first week I begin my spray program of Neem oil, Clove oil, and Garlic oil. I sprayed every 3-4 days up into the 3rd week of flower. I have found if you spray kind of heavy in the vegetive state and into 3 weeks of flower you usually wont have a problem with bugs or powder etc." Any idea how to make this? What do you guys think about the ortho ecosense stuff - will it kill the seedlings? Also, what about cutting off the first set of leaves to separate the rest of the leaves from the moisture in the soil. Also, I am trying watering from below to keep the top dry - again just trying to be inhospitable.
 
D

dna genetics

Guest
hey inover,
it looks like PM (powdery mildew). there are a few thing you can
1. try using milk and spraying it on the affected plant. this method helps with PM.
2. you can also use a sulpher burner this helps stop the mildew from growing on the leafs.
3. you can get a product called GC3 or Mildew Cure there the same product just 2 diff. names. we use this product when any signs of PM are occurring .

be sure not to use to much of any spray product sometimes they burn and kill plant so be care full.

hope this helps,
A
 
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inovermyhead

Thank you very much for taking the time to look at my situation. I will look for the GC3.
 
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tenacious

1st follow dna's advise to control the 'PM'
??how much air circulation do you have???
i keep a small fan on my seedlings 24/7, making sure it is gentle!
good air circulation helps avoid problems & makes for a stronger plant [physically]
 
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inovermyhead

Thanks, I couldnt find the gc3 locally but did get some serenade. I have powdery on some plants (azaleas and camelias) outside but this is definitely different - and the more I research the more it looks like downy mildew. I have cut down on the humidity and yeah, I have slight circulation in that space, I think one of my problems might have been that the soil level was (is) pretty low in the cup so the lower parts are shielded from the air movement and there is probably a huge difference in the humidity inside of that little space than the rh of the closet.

Definitely learning some lessons here. It would figure that I would get some weird stuff that no one else does!
 
Big Buddy

Big Buddy

I get this effect with my seedlings when I need to upsize the pot, from the looks of it the soil is pretty dry, and very far down in the cut. My guess is they really just want to get those roots out there, move em up to a 1 gal and see how they do. other than that little issue you have though, your doing great.
And another thing you could use on the PM is a product called benomyl, uses the same bacteria thats in milk, but this is what known as a systemic, therefor it stays in the plants system for a week or so, then is totally dissipated, but that time left in the system of the plant makes it very hard for the pm to get back there, usually after a few treatments, your golden.
Hope that helps out a little.
 
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tenacious

well i just got this 'shit' for the 1st time. at 1st i thought it was just 'purple expression', but i remebered this thread & sure enough....i got it. the purple turned to necrosis. i only have 4 of the 10 seeds i started b/c they were 2 years old. i'm thinking of just starting fresh b/c i think they have already have too much stress & treatment will be too much more stress.
 
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