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Pollen Sacks But No Pollen With Cs??? What Is Going On?

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Hey everyone...

So I have been trying to preserve all of the genetics I have currently and so I have been attempting to use Colloidal silver to reverse my plants, and then back cross them as well as pollen chucking across all my other strains to get some hybrid crosses.
***by the way... I am not looking to become a commercial brand doing this so no worries there about stolen IP and such.... just trying to preserve some plants genetics Ive had the luck of keeping for years....

The problem is...

I keep getting male pollen sacks to develop (big clusters of them) but can not get ANY viable pollen out of 4 attempts now...

My very first run was a complete success using my black cherry soda female which resulted in hundreds of BX seeds as well as about 7 other hybrid crosses each with hundreds of seeds. Since then, using different strains but the same method, I can not get any pollen to form, only the male pollen sacs. What is going on?

Here are the genetics I have tried to reverse..
Black Cherry Soda (success)
Ogiesel (Fail)
Grand Daddy Purple (2x fail)
Trainwreck (no visible pollen however 2 plants in the tent did make seeds so leads me to think it may have slightly released pollen).


My process with CS (I've tried a few different methods but all similar) is to spray 50ppm Colloidal Silver every day for the first 15-20 days of flowering until I see the male pollen sacks form. Once I see this I stop the CS spraying and wait.... Once the pollen is visible (only happened 1 out of 5 attemps) then I let it pollenate all the other females which are 1-2 weeks behind in the flowering cycle...

So I don't know what is going on....

Some unverified ideas are:
Is it possible that the plant genetics I have are already feminized genetics, therefore feminizing a feminized plant maybe is the cause?

I am topping the plants 2-3 times before using CS and inducing flowering... is topping the plants doing something to the hormones in the plant that is causing the male sacs to form but no pollen?

Am I doing the process wrong, or could I improve my results some how?

Should I use Silver Thiosulfate instead? I really don't want to use this stuff unless it just works that much better, as the ingredients aren't the nicest chemicals to work with, and being that I am in an apartment, and not a lab... I really don't want to be mixing these unless absolutely necessary.

What would you guys suggest....
 
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Yea I know I don't need a lab to mix the 2 chemicals together to make silver thiosulfate...

What I am concerned with is the 2 chemicals MSDS sheets and the use of either of the 2 chemicals in a small apartment, without PPE's, without fume hoods and without fire protection.

Silver nitrate looks like it could violently react with many many other chemicals as well as cause harm to lungs and mucus membranes...

Sodium Thiosulfate while not as reactive, still has extremely hazardous fumes that do not belong in the same place someone lives...

So that is why I really don't want to use either in my place of residence... its just not smart. Things like this should be mixed in a outdoor setting at least using PPE equipment... but have no business being in an apartment.

Thats why I use CS.... which has worked, and forms males sacs every time... but no pollen on 4 of 5 attempts...

If STS works 100% of the time, maybe I will source some already mixed where all I have to do is spray it with gloves and a mask on... then I'm ok with that... but getting the chemicals and mixing them is something I won't be doing.
 
835
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spray 50ppm Colloidal Silver every day for the first 15-20 days of flowering until I see the male pollen sacks form.

I am topping the plants 2-3 times before using CS and inducing flowering... is topping the plants doing something to the hormones in the plant that is causing the male sacs to form but no pollen?
So the methodology used in the Mohan Ram et al 1982 paper targeted only the growing apical shoot tip:

1. They ran consecutive STS applications @ 50-100ppm --> for 5-days (they also used Tween-80 as a surfactant)

2. The apical shoot tip-growth didn't resume until 20-25 days following treatment.

My guess is overkill.... and the altered auxin homeostasis in the apical node from the topping probably didn't help much either.

~
 
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I hear mixed reviews on this stuff..many say the warranty (WTF) expires just before you use the last of it..Also hear that it sometimes works, but they don't seem to list the ingredients (Oh no..secret sauce again..LMAO).
I am just starting off (3 days) and used my DIY CS..No real way to measure it (PPM meters no good on CS)..but I ran the generator for about 12 hrs and the water was good n grey..the silver wires were obviously a bit worn down too..I hope it works (in 3 days the clone's few pistils turned brown):)
 
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It's less effective than STS though.
I think I am going to have to order the silver nitrate and sodium thiosulfate then... I have heard nothing but good about using it... I haven't tried it yet as the SDS on the silver nitrate isn't too nice to use by the looks of it... but I found some already mixed to a 0.1M solution so should be good to go...

I did see a study a while back, not on cannabis but some other types of plants where they tested silver nitrate, silver thiosulfate and some type of boron and the STS was the most efficient.
 
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What I am concerned with is the 2 chemicals MSDS sheets and the use of either of the 2 chemicals in a small apartment, without PPE's, without fume hoods and without fire protection.

I think I am going to have to order the silver nitrate and sodium thiosulfate then... I have heard nothing but good about using it... I haven't tried it yet as the SDS on the silver nitrate isn't too nice to use by the looks of it.
Don't go by an MSDS/SDS... I could show you ingredients from dietary supplements on an SDS that would have you thinking radioactive waste lol. Check this clip out (the dude ain't even wearing gloves):

 
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I have had similar issues, and once only 3 seeds from a full on over the counter CS spray treatment as well. all 3 duds. if you are making your own, make sure you are using the ppm meter correctly, depending on your usage the ppm might not actually be 50~ even if your measures are correct...
 
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I have had similar issues, and once only 3 seeds from a full on over the counter CS spray treatment as well. all 3 duds. if you are making your own, make sure you are using the ppm meter correctly, depending on your usage the ppm might not actually be 50~ even if your measures are correct...
I am now making my own CS, but I hear that you need special meters to measure the concentration and the PPM meters don't work right on CS..Tried to measure store bought CS...not accurate with my meter..
 
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yea the conversion factor needs to be correct for the meter... im still figuring it out lol. actual 30ppm is all you should need... but then again some OTC products advertise that and do not deliver.
 
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I have had similar issues, and once only 3 seeds from a full on over the counter CS spray treatment as well. all 3 duds. if you are making your own, make sure you are using the ppm meter correctly, depending on your usage the ppm might not actually be 50~ even if your measures are correct...
After failing 4x I just purchased all the chemicals needed to make STS (Silver Thiosulfate) which supposedly works much better and from what I gather only needs 1 or 2 applications, instead of daily spraying like CS.
 
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Hey Icemud, I've had good success with regular old colloidal silver from the health food store. I tag one spot and spray it 1-2 times a day in veg for 2 weeks before flip and then continue spraying after flip for another 2 weeks. By week three the one site is loaded, and needs to be isolated or bagged for a week to ripen-leaving you the 30 days you need to mature seed before harvest. I only apply a tiny smudge of pollen to one bud site and get plenty of seed in one bud only. I ran testers on 6 x strains and no hermies, best qualities of both strains showed in the end too. Good luck!
 

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