Question about lighting cycles

[maximusluminous]

Dimmers my friend. That's how you keep from frying those plants. I agree that I have more lighting than I need, but dimmers make your argument .... not really something to argue about. lol.

dimmers way lower the efficiency of LED drivers so you are flushing system efficiency down the drain when dimmed. my best led drivers are 94% efficient but that efficiency only comes with 100% power. at say 70 % power my driver runs at 85% efficiency.. hmmm see the issue???? The more its dimmed the more efficiency you are losing, might as well use HPS!

 

[MIMedGrower]

and get less product at more cost to run.. no thanks been there for 20 years & I have learned better now!

Yes i am aware how much you like your led’s.

I will upgrade one day. But after the tech stabilizes. So far the led companies best customers are previous owners upgrading their out of date lighting. Some multiple times per year.

They only recently even started with decent flowering spectrums. Everything grew too leafy with just the blue phosphers in my opinion.

Best results for quality I have had so far is hps and cmh together. Similar to the newest 3k and 2700k led lamps spectrum.

 

[MIMedGrower]

dimmers way lower the efficiency of LED drivers so you are flushing system efficiency down the drain when dimmed. my best led drivers are 94% efficient but that efficiency only comes with 100% power. at say 70 % power my driver runs at 85% efficiency.. hmmm see the issue???? The more its dimmed the more efficiency you are losing, might as well use HPS!

Thanks for this info. I have been wondering about this.

 

[maximusluminous]

Dimmers my friend. That's how you keep from frying those plants. I agree that I have more lighting than I need, but dimmers make your argument .... not really something to argue about. lol.

Yes i am aware how much you like your led’s.

I will upgrade one day. But after the tech stabilizes. So far the led companies best customers are previous owners upgrading their out of date lighting. Some multiple times per year.

They only recently even started with decent flowering spectrums. Everything grew too leafy with just the blue phosphers in my opinion.

Best results for quality I have had so far is hps and cmh together. Similar to the newest 3k and 2700k led lamps spectrum.

How could I not love LED when I have been growing for over 20 years (started in 1997) & a year ago I bought a cheap chinese fixture at a local grow store, it was used & they wanted $200 for it, an 8 bar, 3x3', 480 watts.. deal.. put it up & easily matched the yield my 1000 HPS right next to it did.. 510 actual wall watts draw vs 1100 wall watts draw & this was some chinese BS, not total junk because it easily kept pace with a 1k Sodium.. So I figured what would good LED's be like & I learded it only gets better, way better.. pulling 2lbs + from 640 watts of led with no co2... ya im sold & I could never go back but I could see mixing hps with LEd or mixing cmh with led because the finished products are not the same, neither is better or worse but they are slightly different so both lights would be my top choice even if only running the HPS or CMH like 6 hours per day

 

[MIGrampaUSA]

dimmers way lower the efficiency of LED drivers so you are flushing system efficiency down the drain when dimmed. my best led drivers are 94% efficient but that efficiency only comes with 100% power. at say 70 % power my driver runs at 85% efficiency.. hmmm see the issue????

You lower the draw, you up the efficiency of your leds and prolong the life of the lighting. Total draw is still less with the loss of efficiency at the driver. However, your driver will never run at 100% even at 100% power. A high efficiency driver running at 100% is typically about 85% efficient in converting the AC power to DC anyway.

I'll get out my kill-o-watt device this evening and see what happens. I bet even with the loss at the potentiometer style dimmer (it uses resistance to control your current which does waste electricity) your total draw from the wall is less when you turn your dimmer down.

 

[maximusluminous]

You lower the draw, you up the efficiency of your leds and prolong the life of the lighting. Total draw is still less with the loss of efficiency at the driver. However, your driver will never run at 100% even at 100% power. A high efficiency driver running at 100% is typically about 85% efficient in converting the AC power to DC anyway.

I'll get out my kill-o-watt device this evening and see what happens. I bet even with the loss at the potentiometer style dimmer (it uses resistance to control your current which does waste electricity) your total draw from the wall is less when you turn your dimmer down.

wrong meanwell drivers are between 92 & 95% depending on the wattage, the more wattage aka bigger driver the more efficient they are with meanwell

 

[MIGrampaUSA]

wrong meanwell drivers are between 92 & 95% depending on the wattage

I'll verify that too.

 

[maximusluminous]

You lower the draw, you up the efficiency of your leds and prolong the life of the lighting. Total draw is still less with the loss of efficiency at the driver. However, your driver will never run at 100% even at 100% power. A high efficiency driver running at 100% is typically about 85% efficient in converting the AC power to DC anyway.

I'll get out my kill-o-watt device this evening and see what happens. I bet even with the loss at the potentiometer style dimmer (it uses resistance to control your current which does waste electricity) your total draw from the wall is less when you turn your dimmer down.

LED's are cheap, a photoboost strip is $27 that has 100 led's on it (96 white & 4 red) so replacing a strip is nothing!

 

[maximusluminous]

I'll verify that too.

you will find out Im 100% on the $$$ man I assure you, please do go verify because I do not BS people!!

 

[MIMedGrower]

How could I not love LED when I have been growing for over 20 years (started in 1997) & a year ago I bought a cheap chinese fixture at a local grow store, it was used & they wanted $200 for it, an 8 bar, 3x3', 480 watts.. deal.. put it up & easily matched the yield my 1000 HPS right next to it did.. 510 actual wall watts draw vs 1100 wall watts draw & this was some chinese BS, not total junk because it easily kept pace with a 1k Sodium.. So I figured what would good LED's be like & I learded it only gets better, way better.. pulling 2lbs + from 640 watts of led with no co2... ya im sold & I could never go back but I could see mixing hps with LEd or mixing cmh with led because the finished products are not the same, neither is better or worse but they are slightly different so both lights would be my top choice even if only running the HPS or CMH like 6 hours per day

But I can get 1.5 under a 600hps now. Still doesnt make financial sense to put out the cash yet for me.

You keep exagerating the benefit. If i need a heater during lights on all the cost benefit goes away. And it will cost a lot to find out.

 

[maximusluminous]

I'll verify that too.

doing the photoboost strip build you are only running the LED's at like 65-70% max when you run a 320 watt driver at max power on 8 of them, that is 40 watts per & those strips hit 2.78 efficiency at 37.5 watt, 2.53 efficiency at 53.2 watts, you are already running them very easy for LED's at max power so even lower power isn't gonna make em last much if any longer

 

[maximusluminous]

doing the photoboost strip build you are only running the LED's at like 65-70% max when you run a 320 watt driver at max power on 8 of them, that is 40 watts per & those strips hit 2.78 efficiency at 37.5 watt, 2.53 efficiency at 53.2 watts, you are already running them very easy for LED's at max power so even lower power isn't gonna make em last much if any longer

well I did good to get 1.25lbs from a 1k sodium, my max ever was like 1.5lbs from a 1k HPS,, no co2 again, No BS overly inflated #'s either! I kill those #'s with LED bigtime!! If you get 1.5lbs from a 600 I would hate to see what you would get from 640 watts of GOOD LED

 

[maximusluminous]

But I can get 1.5 under a 600hps now. Still doesnt make financial sense to put out the cash yet for me.

You keep exagerating the benefit. If i need a heater during lights on all the cost benefit goes away. And it will cost a lot to find out.

My room on average yielded 5 lbs from 4 1k sodiums, but running 480 + 640 +480 watts worth of LED (480 watts worth being chinese junk led's) & a 1k sodium I yielded 6 lbs.. so with me 4000 watts = 5 lbs....but with 2600 watts (480 of again being kinda of junk & 1000 being sodium) I got 6lbs right off the bat with no dialing in at all.. those are the facts & it has only gotten better with dialing it in!

 

[MIGrampaUSA]

My room on average yielded 5 lbs from 4 1k sodiums, but running 480 + 640 +480 watts worth of LED (480 watts worth being chinese junk led's) & a 1k sodium I yielded 6 lbs.. so with me 4000 watts = 5 lbs....but with 2600 watts (480 of again being kinda of junk & 1000 being sodium) I got 6lbs right off the bat with no dialing in at all.. those are the facts & it has only gotten better with dialing it in!

I just checked the efficiency rating on MY mean-well drivers. Here is the information from their website:

HLG-240H series is a 240W AC/DC LED driver featuring the dual mode constant voltage and constantcurrent output. HLG-240H operates from 90 305VAC and offers models with different rated voltage ranging～between 12V and 54V. Thanks to the high efficiency up to 93.5%, with the fanless design, the entire series isable to operate for -40~ +90°C°Ccase temperature under free air convection. The design of metal housingand IP67/IP65 ingress protection level allows this series to fit both indoor and outdoor applications.HLG-240His equipped with various function options, such asdimming methodologies, so as to provide the optimal designflexibility for LED lighting system.

It's stating it's efficiency rating is UP TO 93.5%. Here's where I have a problem with your statement in a previous post. You stated that your driver runs at it's highest efficiency when it's running 100%. That's usually not how electricity works. Where there is heat, there is a loss of efficiency. Your driver at 100% is going to be hotter than it is at 70%. So your driver is MORE efficient at lower wattage than it is at 100%. If you have your LED driver mounted remotely because of heat ... it's highly unlikely its running at 95% efficiency. More typical would be 85% with most switching power supplies.

If I am wrong about this, I'll eat crow AFTER seeing it from a non-biased source. I did a quick search online for 3rd party testing and didn't find it at a glance.

 

[maximusluminous]

I just checked the efficiency rating on MY mean-well drivers. Here is the information from their website:

HLG-240H series is a 240W AC/DC LED driver featuring the dual mode constant voltage and constantcurrent output. HLG-240H operates from 90 305VAC and offers models with different rated voltage ranging～between 12V and 54V. Thanks to the high efficiency up to 93.5%, with the fanless design, the entire series isable to operate for -40~ +90°C°Ccase temperature under free air convection. The design of metal housingand IP67/IP65 ingress protection level allows this series to fit both indoor and outdoor applications.HLG-240His equipped with various function options, such asdimming methodologies, so as to provide the optimal designflexibility for LED lighting system.

It's stating it's efficiency rating is UP TO 93.5%. Here's where I have a problem with your statement in a previous post. You stated that your driver runs at it's highest efficiency when it's running 100%. That's usually not how electricity works. Where there is heat, there is a loss of efficiency. Your driver at 100% is going to be hotter than it is at 70%. So your driver is MORE efficient at lower wattage than it is at 100%. If you have your LED driver mounted remotely because of heat ... it's highly unlikely its running at 95% efficiency. More typical would be 85% with most switching power supplies.

If I am wrong about this, I'll eat crow AFTER seeing it from a non-biased source. I did a quick search online for 3rd party testing and didn't find it at a glance.

its exactly how it works, look it up I am not BS ing you good lord man...sheesh! They only operate at fulleffeciency at 100% power, that is fact not some BS!

 

[MIGrampaUSA]

its exactly how it works, look it up I am not BS ing you good lord man...sheesh! They only operate at fulleffeciency at 100% power, that is fact not some BS!

So your driver doesn't get the least bit warm ... I'd like to see your link to your information.

 

[maximusluminous]

I just checked the efficiency rating on MY mean-well drivers. Here is the information from their website:

HLG-240H series is a 240W AC/DC LED driver featuring the dual mode constant voltage and constantcurrent output. HLG-240H operates from 90 305VAC and offers models with different rated voltage ranging～between 12V and 54V. Thanks to the high efficiency up to 93.5%, with the fanless design, the entire series isable to operate for -40~ +90°C°Ccase temperature under free air convection. The design of metal housingand IP67/IP65 ingress protection level allows this series to fit both indoor and outdoor applications.HLG-240His equipped with various function options, such asdimming methodologies, so as to provide the optimal designflexibility for LED lighting system.

It's stating it's efficiency rating is UP TO 93.5%. Here's where I have a problem with your statement in a previous post. You stated that your driver runs at it's highest efficiency when it's running 100%. That's usually not how electricity works. Where there is heat, there is a loss of efficiency. Your driver at 100% is going to be hotter than it is at 70%. So your driver is MORE efficient at lower wattage than it is at 100%. If you have your LED driver mounted remotely because of heat ... it's highly unlikely its running at 95% efficiency. More typical would be 85% with most switching power supplies.

If I am wrong about this, I'll eat crow AFTER seeing it from a non-biased source. I did a quick search online for 3rd party testing and didn't find it at a glance.

You have no idea the time & study I have already put into this, I mean I have more time invested in LCD tech than you would ever believe because I was tired of being the guy out of the loop with the modern tech & I now know more about LED tech than anyone I come across outside of light engineers!

 

[maximusluminous]

So your driver doesn't get the least bit warm ... I'd like to see your link to your information.

well I have a fan hitting all my drivers so they get a tad warm, not hot tho

 

[MIGrampaUSA]

You have no idea the time & study I have already put into this, I mean I have more time invested in LCD tech than you would ever believe because I was tired of being the guy out of the loop with the modern tech & I now know more about LED tech than anyone I come across outside of light engineers!

I don't need to have any idea about how much you have studied this. I want to see independent studies backing more specifically Mean-Well's claim of such high efficiency at 100% power. Then I will believe you because I think you have been misled.

 

[MIMedGrower]

well I did good to get 1.25lbs from a 1k sodium, my max ever was like 1.5lbs from a 1k HPS,, no co2 again, No BS overly inflated #'s either! I kill those #'s with LED bigtime!! If you get 1.5lbs from a 600 I would hate to see what you would get from 640 watts of GOOD LED

I do not believe the numbers would go up proportionately. Efficiency is not the whole picture.

And if you never got 1gpw with hps you never got all they can give. And i dont weigh loose or small buds they go in with the close bud trim for coconut oil. And dry weight is about 20% of wet weight.

I have been using all the same stuff for over 5 years now. Plenty of practice. Plenty of pics in my thread of plants grown to high potential. But i stagger them for continual plants to harvest. Im not growing them all at once anymore. I yield more per month with plenty of variety this way.

The numbers I quoted for yield were mono crops. 4 plants under the 600 of known clones.