Questions about reflectors and watts per sqf

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Snowman

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I have a few questions and ideas would like to bounce of a few of the farmers about watts per sqf and reflectors.

I have fully read TexasKids post

https://www.thcfarmer.com/community/threads/watts-lumens-per-square-foot.4448/

And most other threads about watts per sqf and reflectors.I am really just looking for clarity on a few things.

1. If you link 5 1k lights together over a 4x20 length table your plant canopy is 80sqf even if you overall room could be slightly bigger say 6x20?

2. When running a horizontal set up like in the above example will the cross over lighting from the linked lights increase the watts per sqf?

Normally when running single plant per light horizontal set ups. Normally a grower would prune to make a large bush, trim out any under growth, selective defoliation and focus in on growing the top 12' to 18 inches of the 4x4 canopy.

Next questions

3. If cooling wasn't an issue would a Vertizontal reflector be a good choice as the reflector its self is 48 inches around which is 4x4? What would be the pros and cons of using this type of reflector?

4. Someone whom I trust was saying buy a xxxl reflector. He claimed that it would cover a 5x5 area. He also said that you can get the plants closer, but I have heard that the Vertizontal reflectors dissipate heat well. What would be my pros and cons of the xxxl style hood vs the Vertizontal?

5. It is also possible that I could come by some old school air cooled hoods with slide out glass that is not as airtight as some of the newer ones, but again I don't see heat being an issue. If one were to run lets say 6 of these hoods over the same space (4x20) would this be a better idea?

The goal being to have excellent quality and get 1 to 1.5 potatoes per 1k.

PS I have read all about vertical grows and I agree that gpkwh it is better, however I am not ready for that. Maybe one day.

I would like to keep this thread on Ideas for a horizontal grow focusing on the to 12 to 18 inches of the canopy. If you need more information just ask.

Any suggestions or even just opinions on the questions would be very helpful.

Thanks in advance.
 
GR33NL3AF

GR33NL3AF

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If you need a reflector for a 4x20 space grab the blockbuster 6", cheap and simple... see the reflector test:

Magnum XXXL hoods are badass, I have some, but if you're canopy is only 4' you're wasting light as the XXXL and the Raptor will easy cover a 5x5 area, IMO.

With a canopy the size of 4x20 I would run 6 reflectors but I over light shit, my 5x10 bed has 3 magnums over the top of it. With this amount of light you get the amount of watts per sq ft and that extra overlapping light to have yourself an exceptional harvest. 1-1.5 per 1K is easily doable.
 
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Snowman

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Magnum XXXL hoods are badass, I have some, but if you're canopy is only 4' you're wasting light as the XXXL and the Raptor will easy cover a 5x5 area, IMO.

There could be another 4x20 18inches away...:rolleyes:

With a canopy the size of 4x20 I would run 6 reflectors but I over light shit, my 5x10 bed has 3 magnums over the top of it. With this amount of light you get the amount of watts per sq ft and that extra overlapping light to have yourself an exceptional harvest. 1-1.5 per 1K is easily doable.

So basically what TK said more lights more lumas mo better. 4x20 needs 6k.

I was really thinking that is I could use vertizontal reflector and trying to prune as many colas in that 4x4 footprint as possible 12 to 18 inches deep with anything left over skirted out early.

Seamaiden you said some nice things about your vertizontal do you think its footprint combined with limited cola height would be enough penitration to only run 5k in 4x20?

Or with quality, density and frosting being most important. Using smaller reflectors with more bulbs like 6k over 5 plants?

Thanks for all the feed back just really trying to work some ideas and theories out and listening to others viewpoints and experiances.
 
LexLuthor

LexLuthor

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If you want a hood that dissipates heat and covers a large area the Adjust a wings are WAY better then the vertizontal hoods, I don't know the actual science behind it, but I've heard from so many people the vertizontals don't work as good as a horizontal bulb in a high quality hood. A large A-wing with a 1k will cover a 6x4 area really good. IMO if you need to air cool then go with XXXL's, but if heat won't be an issue go with A-wings.
 
LexLuthor

LexLuthor

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When I had a 600w in a small 13" wide reflector the heat at canopy level was about high 70's, when I got my A-wing with 2 600's in 1 large hood the heat remained the same. So they dissipate heat real good and I'm positive if you held a light meter under a normal horizontal hood or a vetizontal with the same bulb there would be a significant difference in the amount of light.

With the verti's all the light is thrown sideways and then reflects and comes down, so it loses intensity through all the space it travels before it reaches the canopy. With a horizontal hood like a XXXL or A-wing the light comes directly down from the bulb, plus the light that reflects travels less distance, especially in the A-wing because its completely rounded.
 
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Snowman

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Check this thread out, super old and the poster is long gone. Check out his reflectors and his 5'x15' beds!
https://www.thcfarmer.com/community/threads/soil-sog-grower-needs-mentor-to-switch-to-hydro.25499/

I refer allot of people here, allot of good knowledge.

Yes GreenLeaf I have read that thread.....crazy for him to want to make the change with those numbers.But again who am I to question anyones reasons for making a change......especially when he is the one hiting thoes numbers....lol

Yes I saw his reflectors I have researched them and they are a consideration just cant find the pictures at this moment.

The ones I was considering were these



However with the size of these type of hoods I could only run 5 over a 4x20 dueto the sizeof the hood 48 inches roun. While that would be perfect for my ideal 4x4 canopy foot print. I just wonder if the broader light coverage area would makeup for the extra 1k I could run using smaller hoods.

While I would love the savings on having to run less 1k lights per row, my real goal is to put out dense, high quality, loaded with trichs.
 
Natural

Natural

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I run some vertizontals..they are hard to quit. They work really well for large footprints...like a couple for a small room. If you link them together really tight they will trap the heat (like an umbrella). I like to have at least 12" between verts. The big adjuastawings are bad-ass for stacking in rows tighter.
 
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Snowman

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If you want a hood that dissipates heat and covers a large area the Adjust a wings are WAY better then the vertizontal hoods, I don't know the actual science behind it, but I've heard from so many people the vertizontals don't work as good as a horizontal bulb in a high quality hood. A large A-wing with a 1k will cover a 6x4 area really good. IMO if you need to air cool then go with XXXL's, but if heat won't be an issue go with A-wings.

Yes Large Awings are on the list of considerations as well as XXXL.

TheVertizontal hoodI am looking at is this one



I can hang the bulb horizontally inside the large umbrella type hood. Excuse meif you already knew this but I just wanted to make sure you understood I wasnt planing on running the bulbs vertically inside the hood.

The Awings are attractive as well and I know they spread light, also I am sure I could run 6 over 4x20 space.

My main issue is I know I lose direct lighting by running less lights but considering my canopy shouldnt be deeper than 12 to 18 inches should i focus more on spreading or penitration?

Thanks for everyons input into this thread,the more data I can sift through the better.
 
Natural

Natural

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yes those are exactly the ones I run...the bulb stays horizontal if you run them vertical..they will give you less headroom and more distance to your canopy. If you stack these hoods tight..you will have heat issues no matter how great your AC is. If you have the money..get the big sealed hoods. Any small hoods and you might as well run 600 watt bulbs.
 
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Snowman

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I run some vertizontals..they are hard to quit. They work really well for large footprints...like a couple for a small room. If you link them together really tight they will trap the heat (like an umbrella). I like to have at least 12" between verts. The big adjuastawings are bad-ass for stacking in rows tighter.

Thanks for the info Natural.

I dont think cooling will be a big issue for most of the year.....but I like to have total control over the enviroment so the issue you raised about the close spacing of verts has been a bit of an eye opener. Which gave me an idea.

I like to veg in a room the same size as I flower in. To me it saves time to the flip by already allowing the canopy to fill into the space they will be blooming in.

So I am starting to think about running 4 vertizontals over a 4x20 footprint in the veg room and take advantage of the spread while the plants are still less dense with mass.

Then on the flip move them into room with the 6 1ks over the 4x20 footprint for more penitration and intensity as the start to branchout and fill in.

Anyone see and issues with this line of thinking?

Thanks again for your participation.
 
S

Snowman

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. If you have the money..get the big sealed hoods. Any small hoods and you might as well run 600 watt bulbs.

Natural when you say if you smaller hoods that i might as well be running 600s, is it due to the light footprint or are the XXXL reflectors just that much better.

I can get a hold of some very old hoods dirt cheap that are over 10 years old...lol. They are air cooled and sealed but no where near todays standards.

Money is always somewhat of an issue when starting up due to the lag time months and set up costs. But at the end of the day the finished product is what matters most to me.

I have read some farmers say the glass on air cooled loses some lumens. Also some of the super sealed air cooled hoods I have seen and owned are very difficult to clean the glass. Howevere I have also seen many that are a simply unlatch.

The older hoods I have the glass slides out so it would give me the option of running without the glass in the cooler months and still give me the flexabilty of sealing them and cooling them during the summer months.

I am going to try to get then dementions of the hoods I have and look into seeing how large of coverage I have with them.

Thanks again for your help and ideas Natural.
 
Natural

Natural

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Natural when you say if you smaller hoods that i might as well be running 600s, is it due to the light footprint or are the XXXL reflectors just that much better.

..the footprint is smaller.
It would be easier to give advice if I knew your style a little better.IMO the sealed hoods will let you get closer creating a more bushy stocky plant and the umbrellas will spread the light and grow nice mini-trees (3'-6'). The small hoods just limit the 1k's imvho.
 
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Snowman

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I run a soil-perlite-chow mix in 25 to 30 gallon pots. Get them about 5ft tall 4 feet round 1 plant per light unless i decide to run a 6th light in the bloom room.

Also I tie open and trim everything below the top 12 to 18 inches of the canopy.
 
Natural

Natural

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I run a soil-perlite-chow mix in 25 to 30 gallon pots. Get them about 5ft tall 4 feet round 1 plant per light unless i decide to run a 6th light in the bloom room.

Also I tie open and trim everything below the top 12 to 18 inches of the canopy.

I'm guessing plant numbers are a concern for you. I think you cannot go wrong with any of the big hoods>>>
1) the vertizontals would be the hottest
2) the Grow wings would be the medium heat
3) the raptors, xxxl, etc. sealed would be the coolest

even with a dedicated ac, heat is always a concern...and if your running sealed it goes up a whole other level. The thing is, your style is trees and the next logical step is a bare-vert sealed-room.
 
KitsapGrapeApe

KitsapGrapeApe

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I personally don't like to try and cover a bigger then 4x4 area per 1k. If I was trying to cover a 5x5 I wouldn't run an air cools because I don't like the shape, I feel they cover 1 say better then the other, I would use the vertizontal reflector you posted a link to or the sun light super silver sun which is a little shallower and silver, I hate sunlight supply but I wouldn't buy anyone else's parabolic/vertizontal reflectors.
 
LexLuthor

LexLuthor

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263
Yes Large Awings are on the list of considerations as well as XXXL.

TheVertizontal hoodI am looking at is this one



I can hang the bulb horizontally inside the large umbrella type hood. Excuse meif you already knew this but I just wanted to make sure you understood I wasnt planing on running the bulbs vertically inside the hood.

The Awings are attractive as well and I know they spread light, also I am sure I could run 6 over 4x20 space.

My main issue is I know I lose direct lighting by running less lights but considering my canopy shouldnt be deeper than 12 to 18 inches should i focus more on spreading or penitration?

Thanks for everyons input into this thread,the more data I can sift through the better.




I didn't know you could place the bulb horizontal in those hoods, so that makes a big difference. I would still go with the A-wings because your canopy will be rectangular and the A-wings will throw the light in the same pattern. But those vertizontals look good too, I would use those if I grew tree's with vertical lighting and use those hoods overhead because the plants would be round.

The good thing about the A-wings is you can adjust them to penetrate more or spread the light wide, so you could use the wide setting when there young and small then during flower as the canopy thickens you can adjust the hood to focus more light downwards for deeper penetration. Since your not gonna air cool the hoods I wouldn't bother with the XXXL's.
 
LexLuthor

LexLuthor

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I run a soil-perlite-chow mix in 25 to 30 gallon pots. Get them about 5ft tall 4 feet round 1 plant per light unless i decide to run a 6th light in the bloom room.

Also I tie open and trim everything below the top 12 to 18 inches of the canopy.


I assumed you grew smaller plants kinda like a SOG, so the vertizontals would be a great choice if you have enough cooling power. I don't think the difference between A-wings and vertizontals would make a huge difference when it comes to yield, but with round plants the vertizontals look like the logical choice.
 
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Snowman

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. The thing is, your style is trees and the next logical step is a bare-vert sealed-room.

Yeah I know.......:( I just cant seem to figure out a way that I could comfortably work. I fully admit that your getting the most of the light. However when considering the learing curve on each strain and how far the stretch to the centers can afford the headaches right now.

However reading Capulators wall of bud journal and thinking of the journal of the SOG you linked with the rolling tables....ive been hit with some inspiration.....;).

But I think I have to at least plan what i described for now.
 
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