Scroggers advice please. First week of flower

[greentomatoes2025]

Hi scroggers,

Just looking for general advice on growth expectations and scrog technique over the next few weeks.

I have flipped my WW x BB (photoperiod) 3 days ago having now seemingly corrected a calmag deficiency (now keeping a keen eye on nutrient burn).

Some grow info below:
Medium
Coco coir (30% perlite)
Currently phasing in bloom nutrients
Fertigate every 1-2 days
Ph: 6.1
Ec: 2.4

Lights
AC infinity Evo4
Height from net: 20"
Currently at 20% power providing 20 DLI & 300ppfd at the net.

My question is:
- Given these are only in week 1 of flower and expected to stretch (between 50% to 100%?), should I raise height of the net now? (Net is currently 10" above soil level) ... or manage accordingly by raising if the net is full prior to completion of stretch (week 4 perhaps?)

Does anyone have any other suggestions from previous experiences? I feel implementing changes now is going to be way easier than later.

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

[ArtfulCodger]

This is a nitpicky little thing, but I'd turn the plant 45 degrees, so the "points" of the (somewhat) square-shaped canopy are growing into the corners of the tent. That will give your main branches a little more room to stretch. As far as net height goes, it depends on whether you're using the trellis primarily to spread out (absorb) the stretch, or just to support the plants as they grow up. I tend to flip earlier than you have, and then train the plants out wide. Your plant will be out to the tent walls within a week, and then it will have nowhere to go but up. You could move your trellis higher, or you can add a second trellis, which is something a lot of people do.

 

[JIMKSI64]

With the overgrown nature of this grow I may suggest something that will be controversial.
Reduce the run count on your grow.
You have almost no room outwards and it's going to need to go outwards to not crowd so flowering will be difficult to manage. Count out total stems with tops and nodes that will go into flower and produce a top. See if this is manageable amount of flowers to maintain. My guess is you would prolly be happy with 36 flowers growing and that is how many squares you have in your trellis. If you have more that that consider reducing the count to balance the grow to a manageable productive grow that will not bud rot or go all faded from too many flowers for the root system.

 

[Galgrows]

I think it's fine and managable. Just keep tucking the tops an direct them into open squares. You might want to raise the net several inches now or soon. Then look at the underneighth parts to trim out later during flower. In small space tents we just can't veg. photos for 8wks, well you can but at the plants health not worth it.

 

[greentomatoes2025]

This is a nitpicky little thing, but I'd turn the plant 45 degrees, so the "points" of the (somewhat) square-shaped canopy are growing into the corners of the tent. That will give your main branches a little more room to stretch. As far as net height goes, it depends on whether you're using the trellis primarily to spread out (absorb) the stretch, or just to support the plants as they grow up. I tend to flip earlier than you have, and then train the plants out wide. Your plant will be out to the tent walls within a week, and then it will have nowhere to go but up. You could move your trellis higher, or you can add a second trellis, which is something a lot of people do.

Thanks mate,

Haha yeah I've been switching back and forth the 45 deg trying to decide.. or anticipate how to maximise this small space. I may rotate 45 deg again for good like you say and move the fan.. have been worried about growth below it.

I agree I have vegged too long here, something to keep in mind for next time. I guess I can also lower the pot a couple inches by cutting the supports which may relieve the horizontal spread. I only have 5" remaining to raise my lights.

 

[greentomatoes2025]

With the overgrown nature of this grow I may suggest something that will be controversial.
Reduce the run count on your grow.
You have almost no room outwards and it's going to need to go outwards to not crowd so flowering will be difficult to manage. Count out total stems with tops and nodes that will go into flower and produce a top. See if this is manageable amount of flowers to maintain. My guess is you would prolly be happy with 36 flowers growing and that is how many squares you have in your trellis. If you have more that that consider reducing the count to balance the grow to a manageable productive grow that will not bud rot or go all faded from too many flowers for the root system.

What do you mean by run count? Bud sites? (Sorry my first grow). But yeah that sounds reasonable.. I have been concerned with bud rot especially with this strain and finding it hard to keep RH below 60% consistently.

Do you think at my 21 day defoliation it might be an appropriate time to decide what to keep?

 

[greentomatoes2025]

I think it's fine and managable. Just keep tucking the tops an direct them into open squares. You might want to raise the net several inches now or soon. Then look at the underneighth parts to trim out later during flower. In small space tents we just can't veg. photos for 8wks, well you can but at the plants health not worth it.

Yeah I think given other responses I may adjust either the pot lower or net higher 2 inches.. definitely will be defoliating/lollipopping in a couple/few weeks.

Agreed I think I was worried about trying to fill the net lol. Topped a total of 8 times which is likely overkill for my grow space! Will aim for 4 weeks vege next time

 

[JIMKSI64]

What do you mean by run count? Bud sites? (Sorry my first grow). But yeah that sounds reasonable.. I have been concerned with bud rot especially with this strain and finding it hard to keep RH below 60% consistently.

Do you think at my 21 day defoliation it might be an appropriate time to decide what to keep?

Run counts are tops that you have that will develop into a flower. They are the areas that new growth appear at. They are normally lighter green. In flower the leaf sprout is replaced by pistles the next time it adds vegetarian.
Lower stems ( and you have lots ) will develop into bud sites and flowers after the stretch. These produce loads cause there can be many but you do not have a lot of room.. you have a handful of stems from down low going up the sides of the grow. These are going to be what clogs your tent edges. In addition I found in my own grow the small stems need support when the flower gets big. Ya I know terrible problem to have.
I put my net above my grow and use it as hoist support points for my large colas that needed support. I also used the net to pull tops in and out of the light pattern as needed. And I needed. 31x31x63 tent.

Wires pulling and holding down, wires holding up and pulling sideways.

 

[greentomatoes2025]

Thanks for your info man. Those are some fat colas! What strain are you running may I ask?

I ended up taking out the grill my pot was sitting on which has lowered my canopy an extra 3". Hopefully this helps a little against the horizontal squeeze over the next few weeks.

Probably widely debated question but what ppfd or DLI should I be aiming for entering flower?

I've now adjusted a couple of things with my light at its maximum height above the net (24inches) and increased dimmer to 30% giving me about 420ppfd and 18DLI at the net.

If I step up again to 40% I'm looking at 500 ppfd and 20DLI.

 

[JIMKSI64]

My old journals where I ran the White Widow photos is gone. I had put everything into that journal and my logs are disorganized but the data is there.
I measured in Lux. It does not matter how you measure it matters how you move your measurements. There is no system that says this plant and this moment needs this ppfd or lux.
Use it to document changes in your journal like today I moved my light to 20 inches on power 72% and this gave me 42000 lux at canopy top and 27K at lowest bud sites. This is a good informative way to document your lights. Now move up no more than 3-5% in power by moving lights down or power level up. Document again but ensure a 3 hour peek for problems. Taco bleaching dropping whatever. If no problem and it liked it move up but no more than once a day.
My widows wound up at 65k lux at tops with every once in a while a cola slipping a wire and moving to over 70k. I choose this as the accepted Cannabis saturation level is about 75k lux without CO2 use
Depending on spectrum choice my ppfd was between 910 and 1050 but I do not have a ppfd tool

 

[greentomatoes2025]

My old journals where I ran the White Widow photos is gone. I had put everything into that journal and my logs are disorganized but the data is there.
I measured in Lux. It does not matter how you measure it matters how you move your measurements. There is no system that says this plant and this moment needs this ppfd or lux.
Use it to document changes in your journal like today I moved my light to 20 inches on power 72% and this gave me 42000 lux at canopy top and 27K at lowest bud sites. This is a good informative way to document your lights. Now move up no more than 3-5% in power by moving lights down or power level up. Document again but ensure a 3 hour peek for problems. Taco bleaching dropping whatever. If no problem and it liked it move up but no more than once a day.
My widows wound up at 65k lux at tops with every once in a while a cola slipping a wire and moving to over 70k. I choose this as the accepted Cannabis saturation level is about 75k lux without CO2 use
Depending on spectrum choice my ppfd was between 910 and 1050 but I do not have a ppfd tool

Hey thanks for that detailed reply very much appreciated! apologies have had a very busy week. I have done a bit of comparison of where they are at now vs lux measurement. I think by the time the cola reach maturity they will also be around 60k to 65k lux.

The way you document changes in the grow environment also makes sense. I started this way however just need to be more disciplined in putting pen to paper when changes are made.

Anyway another week gone.. the canopy level has grown about 3 inches this week.

I've started some very light defol pinching off some of the lowest leaves and bud sites every other day.

 

[JIMKSI64]

Dude that upward cant to the leaves is freakin awesome. I was not getting this in my tent until I got dialed in with less than a .07 vdp swing. This grow I learned how important the trace is keeping it in line.
Howuch more verticle room do you have. looks like horizontal is full and as you have not stretched yet you could be looking at another 14 inches of growth.

wahoo.
btw that clear tube looks to be holding water. Clear hose can allow algea to bloom.

 

[BearWater]

This is why i like the nets! : ) im not using one this round as i was fighting the amount of plants and moving aournd and all (pain in the ass) but i let mine grow up through the net the way it was going to grow from my training, then before they stretch too much i would bring them under the net and use that to spread them out more.

Like this : )

Really nice job! She is looking great! You’ve put a lot of time into it and it’s showing! : )

 

[DartKnight137]

Hi scroggers,

Just looking for general advice on growth expectations and scrog technique over the next few weeks.

I have flipped my WW x BB (photoperiod) 3 days ago having now seemingly corrected a calmag deficiency (now keeping a keen eye on nutrient burn).

Some grow info below:
Medium
Coco coir (30% perlite)
Currently phasing in bloom nutrients
Fertigate every 1-2 days
Ph: 6.1
Ec: 2.4

Lights
AC infinity Evo4
Height from net: 20"
Currently at 20% power providing 20 DLI & 300ppfd at the net.

My question is:
- Given these are only in week 1 of flower and expected to stretch (between 50% to 100%?), should I raise height of the net now? (Net is currently 10" above soil level) ... or manage accordingly by raising if the net is full prior to completion of stretch (week 4 perhaps?)

Does anyone have any other suggestions from previous experiences? I feel implementing changes now is going to be way easier than later.

Thanks in advance for your help.

Nice single set up

 

[greentomatoes2025]

Dude that upward cant to the leaves is freakin awesome. I was not getting this in my tent until I got dialed in with less than a .07 vdp swing. This grow I learned how important the trace is keeping it in line.
Howuch more verticle room do you have. looks like horizontal is full and as you have not stretched yet you could be looking at another 14 inches of growth.

wahoo.
btw that clear tube looks to be holding water. Clear hose can allow algea to bloom.

Cheers man! I have exactly 2 ft between net and light. 2 inches left between light and filter (see photo) I have the ability to raise the net if need be but not the light really.. I've raised it to max to try and even PAR distribution.

Noted on the tube.. I'll keep an eye on it. Although I've already had algae growing on my pearlite. Perhaps I can swap it out for something non-transparent easy enough!

 

[greentomatoes2025]

Nice single set up

Thanks dude! Wish I had gone for a 4x2 now but that's pretty easy fixed next round!

 

[greentomatoes2025]

This is why i like the nets! : ) im not using one this round as i was fighting the amount of plants and moving aournd and all (pain in the ass) but i let mine grow up through the net the way it was going to grow from my training, then before they stretch too much i would bring them under the net and use that to spread them out more.

Like this : ) View attachment 2438154

Really nice job! She is looking great! You’ve put a lot of time into it and it’s showing! : )

Thanks that means a lot! Yes this is the plan (keep tucking)... as someone pointed out earlier I really had let this veg too long and hadn't anticipated the impact of stretch. Still a few squares yet to fill and hoping some of the buds below the screen make it to the net soon so I can allocate their assigned square before letting them be

 

[JIMKSI64]

My 4x4 is keeping me growing. My back is and I needed the 3 doors to maintain the plants when they finally get stuck in. My original was a 31x31 and could not reach behind to clean up and remove low bud sprouts.

 

[greentomatoes2025]

My 4x4 is keeping me growing. My back is and I needed the 3 doors to maintain the plants when they finally get stuck in. My original was a 31x31 and could not reach behind to clean up and remove low bud sprouts.

I can imagine try to get to the back of that space late grow would be a tough time for sure. Due to my room setup I can really only access one side of this tent.. I had initially considered crafting a circular scrog net which the base of would sit on the top of the soil and allow me to rotate the pot and the net at the same time.. but that meant sacrificing grow area corners

 

[DartKnight137]

Thanks dude! Wish I had gone for a 4x2 now but that's pretty easy fixed next round!

Ac infinity be on point fr!!