seamadien I need help plz

[dogznova]

seamadien, How you doing.. I'm new to this forum but not new to forums in general. So when I read a few of your post I thought well this person will be able to set me in the right direction.

So i'll start off by saying i've been running this strain for approx 8 yrs from clone and fem seeds that I made. The strain is a dutch passion blueberry crossed with a old school skunk #1. Not sure if that maters but I thought I would throw it in there.. Here is the thing, when I veg this strain under MH or T5's the plants show no sign of a deficiency at all. But when I run this strain under LED's I get a massive ca deficiency. I have no clue why it only shows up under LED's but I got 3 different types of LED units and it shows up under all of them.. The stronger the LED unit, the more the deficiency shows up in this strain.. I no this is not an LED section but I just wanted to give a background of my situation. I have vegged a few different strains under all of these dif LED units and most strains if not all won't have this ca deficiency just the old school blueberry cross that I love. Go figure lol.

The reason I think it's a ca deficiency only (but I could be wrong). It's pretty much at the top of the plants in week 4 of veg.. Now mind you I didn't know it was a ca deficiency only until I read some of your post.. It does start down at the bottom of the plant in week 2 or 3 of veg, but by the time it's in week 5 of veg (like the plants are now) it's all the way to the top of the plants.. Until I read some of your post, I thought it was a ca/mg deficiency so I added cal/mag plus, but it just seems to make the problem worse. might be getting nut lock from adding it IDK.

Now I no i'm not gonna be able to fix this problem on this run, i'm getting ready to put these girls into flower in a few days. It's just gonna have to be like the other runs under LED's with this strain lol all F'ed up. But I got new babies of this strain ready to go in solo cups. They have been under the led's for 10 days or so and not showing signs of the problem yet.. But I know in a week or two it will start to show it's ugly head again. I would kinda like to fix this problem this time or at least get pointed in the right direction and start fixing the problem and I feel I might be talking to the right person about this.

The first pic is the bottom older leaves and then pics 2 and 3 are going up the plant.. Pic 3 is 2 leaf sets below the top of the plant. The forth pic is the baby in a solo cup with no signs of the problem yet.. key word YET lol .

So here is what i'm using.

lighting is 600w LED for veg (2 300w units) and Flower I use a 600w 2K HPS on a mover

Dirt : Pro Mix HP in 3 gal pots

I use tap water left out overnight to evaporate the chlorine and my tap water is approx 130 ppm

Nutes: I'm using Botanicare pro blend for soil 15 mils

I use 5 mils of liquid karma every other watering

I use 5 mils of Ca/mag plus under the LED's only.. Seems I don't have to run the cal/mag plus under conventional lighting such as MH or T5's when I veg... Haven't been able to figure that out yet lol but whatever, prolly shouldn't be using cal/mag plus at all is my guess.

PH all mixed up is 6.5

Total PPM is 700 to 750 during veg

Dirt PH ... Sorry I have no clue. I could check run off PH if you like?

So it seems from what i've read of your post.. You recomend foil spray for a ca deficiency only. Any suggestions of what I should try? I'm so sick of the girls not running right under these LED's it frustrates the hell out me.. lol Hope U can help.

Thanks for your time.

 

[baba G]

what are your canopy temps?

 

[baba G]

Look into Nectar for the Gods if your looking for Calcium...

 

[dogznova]

what are your canopy temps?

Under the LED's not that high.. The top of the room temp is prolly in the upper 80's but the surface temps of leaves is much lower .. Led's don't seem to put much surface temps.. ie. radiant heat. I would guess the canopy temps to be upper 70's to maybe lower 80's at best

 

[dogznova]

Look into Nectar for the Gods if your looking for Calcium...

Thank you I will

 

[dogznova]

Looks like this could be some high quality stuff
Demeter’s Destiny : Also known as Liquid Calcium by Harvest Moon.

 

[Coir]

It looks more like a potassium deficiency to me. The best way to be sure would be to send in some effected leaves for testing. You would know right away then what the deficiency is for sure and if it's being caused from under feeding or too much of something else.
You can also calculate how many ppm's you are feeding of K, Ca, and Mg, to see if that sheds any light on the problem. I run much higher overall levels than you are and my K is at 300ppm, Ca at 170ppm, and Mg at 48ppm in my veg feed.

 

[dogznova]

Yes.. I will try the Botanicare pro bloom base this run during veg.. Maybe the higher K in the bloom formula will show me a sign if i'm going it the right direction..

Great point on the potassium def.. I'ts def and easy try. Thanks

 

[dogznova]

Found this..

Role in Nutrition of the Plant
Found in the whole cannabis plant, potassium is essential for all of the plants activities that pertain to the transportation of water. It is also essential in all of the stages of growth including the development of the buds. Potassium is also responsible for creating thick, sturdy stems, photosynthesis, water respiration and disease resistance.

Solving the Problem
While a minor potassium deficiency will affect the cosmetics of the plant, it does not affect the plant growth or the yield of the harvest.

To repair the deficiency, choose a water-soluble fertilizer that contains high levels of potassium. A fertilizer that is intended for the blooms will typically contain the highest levels and is used to balance the pH levels. Potassium is highly alkaline and is useful in balancing acidic P. Ashes from wood will also quickly deliver potassium to the plant.

Wood ash, bloom fertilizers and liquid kelp are among the fertilizers that are most commonly used and that work the quickest to correct this deficiency. To prevent these deficiencies in the first place, many growers choose to use greensand and granite dust.

Although the leaves that have damage caused by a potassium deficiency will never recover, the plants themselves will recover within five days of the application of a fast-acting product.

 

[Joe Fresh]

well first, i will say that promix is not soil, its soiless....according to promix it should be watered with nutes every time, no fresh water in between...

im in promix right now, as young plants/fresh planted clones they get 500ppm total, as the weeks go on i up it by 50-100 ppm per week and watch plants for stress and adjust accordingly, right now i got one room in flower im feeding 650ppm, they are at 5 weeks in, the other room is taking up nutes better and is at 800 ppm every watering and they are at day 17 of 12/12

light intensity plays a huge role in plants ability to take up more nutes, more light -= more nutes...i run multiple 1kw lights, im not sure how an LED is cuz ive never used one..

that being said, check run off PH and report back, if its anywhere below 5.5 then it means you are starting a salt buildup, if its below 5 then panic and flush, lol...if your ph is fine then i would suggest upping the nutes.



i def see calcium def, but the number one cause for calcium def's are high salt content in the medium making the calcium unavailable to the plants, so feeding them more calcium to the roots will just make things worse, leaving a huge ionic imbalence in the root system...if you ask me cut ur cal/mag, i give 1ml/L(my CA/mg is 3-0-0), @ 5 ml a L is too much especially for such young plants....i would rather spray with calcium that pour more in the roots

check runoff ph though, it will tell you alot

 

[dogznova]

Ok cool.. I will check run off in an hour or so when the lights come on..

 

[dogznova]

PH run off looks to be 5.9 to 6.0

 

[Joe Fresh]

ph is right where it should be...

so if like you say in your description, it sounds as if your just not feeding enough base nutes, and maybe too much cal/mg


so when you say the stronger the light, the more the deficiency shows up...this is pretty simple, more light = more nutes...so it just sounds to me that you need to up your base nutes...ive never worked with pure blend so i cant say for sure, i run promix and use dry salts

does this happen under the HPS? or only LED? ive never used LED before, the smallest grow ive had was a 4kw room

 

[Seamaiden]

I've just skimmed through this thread after reading the first post. You need to read the thread Capulator started on light spectrum affecting nutrient uptake. Let me see if I can find it for you, hold on, BRB!

Here it is: https://www.thcfarmer.com/community...m-affects-nutrient-use-in-plant-tissue.58621/

It's known, it's proven, it's a fact. Light spectrum can and does affect nutrient use.

If need be I'll go through the information again, but I took a quick look at the pix and only one shows what might be Ca-, the others are looking more like P or K to me.

 

[dogznova]

does this happen under the HPS? or only LED? ive never used LED before, the smallest grow ive had was a 4kw room[/quote]

Thats def what's F'in with me.. Using the same exact nute program this problem will not show up under MH or 65k T'5 during veg. I haven't tried to veg under HPS but I'm guessing the deficiency wouldn't show up under the HPS as well. But when they go to flower.. Yes it's still there but once the girls get under conventional flowering lighting (HPS) the deficiency seems to subside, unlike during veg.. If I kept the girls vegging under the LED's for lets say 10 weeks instead of the 5 weeks I currently veg them, they would be dead lol .

 

[dogznova]

I've just skimmed through this thread after reading the first post. You need to read the thread Capulator started on light spectrum affecting nutrient uptake. Let me see if I can find it for you, hold on, BRB!

Here it is: https://www.thcfarmer.com/community...m-affects-nutrient-use-in-plant-tissue.58621/

It's known, it's proven, it's a fact. Light spectrum can and does affect nutrient use.

If need be I'll go through the information again, but I took a quick look at the pix and only one shows what might be Ca-, the others are looking more like P or K to me.

I will def read that tread Thank You. Yes i've been thinking it's one of the spectrums in these led's.. Not sure which one but that tread will hopefuly give me some good info..

So if it is indeed a P or K issue would using the bloom base instead of the grow base put me in the right direction?

 

[dogznova]

That thread says it's most likely caused by the strong red spectrum.. Funny before reading that thread I would of thought it was the blue spectrum causing the problem.. But now that I think about it.. These Led units (and most on the market) emphasizes on the red spectrum, so yeah it's prolly the red spectrum causing this strain to need more P and K .. Great thread thank you.

 

[Seamaiden]

does this happen under the HPS? or only LED? ive never used LED before, the smallest grow ive had was a 4kw room

Thats def what's F'in with me.. Using the same exact nute program this problem will not show up under MH or 65k T'5 during veg. I haven't tried to veg under HPS but I'm guessing the deficiency wouldn't show up under the HPS as well. But when they go to flower.. Yes it's still there but once the girls get under conventional flowering lighting (HPS) the deficiency seems to subside, unlike during veg.. If I kept the girls vegging under the LED's for lets say 10 weeks instead of the 5 weeks I currently veg them, they would be dead lol .

Seems to me that there are some significant differences in spectrum between HPS and MH or even those fluoros. What's one of the huge areas missing? The blue end, including UV. I can't say what happens under LEDs, I don't know enough about what they're putting out right now to really speak to it.