Thinking of eating the cost of my HPS light, help.

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Purfict

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I’m looking at mars hydro and seeing their sales today. I spent 50$ on a MH bulb, 50$ on a sodium bulb, and 200 on the ballast. It’s put a noticeable dent in my electric bill aswell. I’m looking at the TSW 2000 300W light, and seeing that the ppfd would be much greater, and over time, I could save money. It’s 200$, which I find a steal, and I was maybe even thinking of buying a 150W for a veg tent. If you’re familiar with the fallacy of sunk costs, I think I might be a victim of it but wanted to get other input. I stopped myself with it in cart and all my information ready, but feel like it’s the right move. I could always sell my HPS later, right? Is it ok to switch to LED mid grow? I flipped my first attempt of a grow 3 days ago. Let me know what you guys think. I bought a tent from my local grow store, and want to get set up by next week.
 
Thinking of eating the cost of my hps light help
Thinking of eating the cost of my hps light help 2
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Purfict

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@Purfict - It sounds to me as though you've reasoned it out well. A 300W LED for $200 sounds good, too.
If you were to go back to the beginning of building your setup, would you recommend splurging now to say a 500W LED light? I just don’t want to end up in this same position of wanting to upgrade. Would a 500W LED light be enough for a high quality setup?
 
MartyMcFly42oh

MartyMcFly42oh

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4x4 tent with 4 plants. It says it can veg 4x4 and flower 3x3, but I thought I could make do until I get another few grows under my belt. I am setting up a 3x3 tent now that will be a veg tent.
I currently have five different mars hydro lights in my possession, a ts600, 2 ts1000’s, an sp150, and an fce3000. Up until a week ago I was a loyal customer, but one of my ts 1000 lights stopped working, I sent a detailed email to customer service with the original invoice Saturday afternoon and still haven’t gotten a response. The light was purchased in may of 2020 , wasn’t run continuously and just stopped working. I’m pretty sure it is a faulty driver and would replace myself but I am trying to go through the proper channels rather than eat the cost of a new driver. If I was going to buy another one from them I’d get one of the fc series with the Samsung chips.
 
ACSippi

ACSippi

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I hate you paid so much for your HID. Be careful at those shops. It's best to know exactly what you need before entering and NEVER seem ignorant or they'll be selling you the worst gimmics on the market at the highest profit margin 🤣.
 
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Purfict

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I hate you paid so much for your HID. Be careful at those shops. It's best to know exactly what you need before entering and NEVER seem ignorant or they'll be selling you the worst gimmics on the market at the highest profit margin 🤣.
Yea, I realize that now. My issue is I compared their prices to vivosun, which I now know they are just as overpriced. The shop got me a lot of cheap goods, my whole setup was about 700$ and the light was 300 of that, so that isn’t terrible. Now seeing high quality LEDs along with power bill I’m hoping I can save a lot of money.
 
LoveGrowingIt

LoveGrowingIt

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If you were to go back to the beginning of building your setup, would you recommend splurging now to say a 500W LED light?
Probably not. I do tend to look for a good feature set, though, like one of the new ones that have spectrum control. I think I'd also look for a system that can be extended by daisy chaining and that uses a single controller. That would provide options for changing your configuration over time.

I just don’t want to end up in this same position of wanting to upgrade.
Maybe not, but maybe not rule out upgrading, either. I've changed my setup for every grow since I started.

Would a 500W LED light be enough for a high quality setup?
It would be right for a 4x4. So would two 240@ lights. Consider the coverage. A bar light is probably better for that size and shape tent.
 
ChuckFinnl3y

ChuckFinnl3y

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I’m looking at mars hydro and seeing their sales today. I spent 50$ on a MH bulb, 50$ on a sodium bulb, and 200 on the ballast. It’s put a noticeable dent in my electric bill aswell. I’m looking at the TSW 2000 300W light, and seeing that the ppfd would be much greater, and over time, I could save money. It’s 200$, which I find a steal, and I was maybe even thinking of buying a 150W for a veg tent. If you’re familiar with the fallacy of sunk costs, I think I might be a victim of it but wanted to get other input. I stopped myself with it in cart and all my information ready, but feel like it’s the right move. I could always sell my HPS later, right? Is it ok to switch to LED mid grow? I flipped my first attempt of a grow 3 days ago. Let me know what you guys think. I bought a tent from my local grow store, and want to get set up by next week.
I heared good and bad things about the MarsHydro Lights, not growing myself yet -so take it with a grain of salt- as im still in the processing of choosing the rest of my Gear but took me about a Month until i finally decided on a Light after a lot back and forth and help from the awesome people around here. So i though i atleast tell you what my conculsions where until browsing all over the web:

For the MarsHydro Lights (mostly prefering to those with the same build as shown on the picture) I personally wouldnt get them myself and even if gifted i would be conflicted about runnin them in my Tent. Many people using them and have good results with it but then are also people that reported faulty Leds after a few Months, continued with Flickering on lower settings. Some even reported burning smells and noticed electrical damaged due to overheating, given there could be many reasons for it and some are most defintly due to user error but i havent heared the same about any other Light brand i researched/taken into account. If your in a tent I wouldnt want the risk of a potential Fire hazard. A Local grow Shop here also was aware of those lets call them errors and wouldnt sell them because of it, so there seems something to it. But if its the only thing you Consider and can get a redudant system to detect possible smoking cables and mitigate the risk of the tent catching on fire it may be worth a try.

I firstly was settling on something around the Price range from those Hydros aswell early on in my research cycle but figured i prob. wouldnt be satisfied with them a few Grows down the line and settle for something else bit more costly but also more efficient while still cost effective from my view point.

Inbetween i was captivaed by those "higher Tier" Lights but they are not as much of an upgrade as the Sellers might want you to believe as in spending 100% more on light wont result in 100% more quality&/Yield. Thanks to the decent people around here i gladly figured that out soon enough before goin all in research on those.

For the Lights with full spectrum Control, i just found one Brand that i considered was in the affordable range, and not horrible overpriced.
Even though the Brand seemed fine and i found enough reports and Grow Diaries with it, it was only sold from China with high delivery times and prob no support if theres something wrong.

What i would consider/recommend so far is getting an Inexpensive/ Cost effictive Light from a reputable Brand thats known to run well and can assist if they are errors. Say you get an Bar Light which bars are not build into the Frame itself ie. can be moved around and has its own connection to th frame you can just get another Bar from the Seller -if one is at the End of its Lifecylce- in most cases rather than buying a whole new Light.
Don't rely too much on manufacturer and its details and check independet Sources that do their own Testing -preferebly none that are selling their own lights thats always a red flag for me-
I mostly relied on https://www.cocoforcannabis.com/equipment-products-guide/grow-lights/ also running an Youtube channel, but def. check out the Homepage as it has some nifty details and compiling all the details from its test that are shown on youtube.
Many also trust Migro on Youtube with his test but hes also selling his own Lights, but many consider him reputable.

I dont want to say too much about pricing as im not in the US and some prices drastically differ but to have some idea are you on a really tight budget or can you afford a bit more than the a.m. price ?
 
ChuckFinnl3y

ChuckFinnl3y

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Adding to it, it was @LoveGrowingIt thanks again for that brother 👍 ✌️ that said:
,,I've grown some darn good weed with ordinary full spectrum grow lights. So, I asked myself how much better it could get if I invested in high-tech lights. The answer is not enough to be worth the cost or the effort."
Which lead me down that path.
 
StalkerAF

StalkerAF

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4x4 tent with 4 plants. It says it can veg 4x4 and flower 3x3, but I thought I could make do until I get another few grows under my belt. I am setting up a 3x3 tent now that will be a veg tent.
If you plan on flowering in a 4x4 space with four plants, would recommend filling that space out almost completely with the right size and watt light. Look at your tent dimensions and find the proper size light minus couple inches for side clearance. You probably want at least 350 watt range but I’d say 400+ and just turn it down as needed.

If you get a smaller light you are always going to want a bigger one… tons of good lights out there and hard to choose sometimes
 
StalkerAF

StalkerAF

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If you plan on flowering in a 4x4 space with four plants, would recommend filling that space out almost completely with the right size and watt light. Look at your tent dimensions and find the proper size light minus couple inches for side clearance. You probably want at least 350 watt range but I’d say 400+ and just turn it down as needed.

If you get a smaller light you are always going to want a bigger one… tons of good lights out there and hard to choose sometimes

If you’re looking at mars maybe check something like this out below. Most of all brands have something similar to fc-e4800 like spider farm, Ac infinity. Would also look at a bar led style light if you have any worry about heat issues. The led board panels generally are going to run hotter than the board panels and may require more distance in between the plant and light compared to bar leds.

Look for at least 32x32” if you are flowering in a 48x48” space and bigger if your budget allows for it.

 
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Purfict

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After thinking about it and hearing these comments, I’m tempted to go with the mars hydro TS 3000 450W light in my flower tent and take out the HID light. Also was looking into a mars ts 1000 for my 3x3 veg tent. Plan to sprout in that tent, then veg for 6 weeks, transplant into 5gal, then give them two weeks to train before flipping. What do you guys think?
 
StalkerAF

StalkerAF

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After thinking about it and hearing these comments, I’m tempted to go with the mars hydro TS 3000 450W light in my flower tent and take out the HID light. Also was looking into a mars ts 1000 for my 3x3 veg tent. Plan to sprout in that tent, then veg for 6 weeks, transplant into 5gal, then give them two weeks to train before flipping. What do you guys think?
Sounds like you have a solid plan, might consider 7gal pots depending on how many plants you want. I recently just switched to 7gal pots and really like the size increase from 5 gal. Wish I could go 10gal…

I did watch a video on the ts3000 and seems like a good option and has good reviews. The light does seem to run a bit warm from the driver so keep that in mind if purchasing. You might also research their fc-e4800 as another option. Looks like it would be slightly larger and provide better light coverage to the outer corners of your tent. It would also run cooler and you could keep it closer to the canopy if needed.

If you do switch your new light out mid grow, try to let the plants adjust to the change and add some extra height from the light. Whenever I make changes in my grow environment or any cutting&training on the plants, I like to let them recover at least 3 days before doing the next thing adjustment. Slowly reduce the light distance over a couple of days to where the plant is happy with it. There’s a light meter app you can use to help so your not just guessing what the ppfd reading is.
 
Jmaes Mabley

Jmaes Mabley

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Id get a 680w Mammoth Emerald Green 6 Bar. 2095pppf. 2592 Diodes. 432 per Bar.

When Gavita came out with the 1700e, it was made to replace a 1000w HID, in a 4 x 4 area.

The Gavita was/is 645w. Thats 42w - sq/ft.

The Gavita, is around 2.7 efficiency, and since the Gavita came out, lights have improved, their eficiency by about 12.5%, and the best are about 3.1 efficiency. The Mammoth Emerald Green 680w, and the Mammoth Emerald Green, 880w, both are about as good as it gets, right now, for efficiency. 3.1.


Mammoth use the best Diodes money can buy, as well as Drivers, and the spectrum, is probably the closest to the sun, than any light out there.


. These readings are obtained within a 5' x 5' tent to minimize light reflection, a factor often overlooked in 4' x 4' tents commonly used by other manufacturers. It's important to acknowledge that when employing multiple lights, actual readings may register higher due to light overlap. Conversely, within a 4' x 4' space, the edges are accentuated thanks to reflective walls.

Mammoth's Recommendations:​

Vegetative Stage: Aim for PPFD levels between 600 and 900.

Flowering Stage: Target PPFD levels ranging from 1100 to 1800, with a reduction in the last 2 weeks.

For advanced CO2 users and professional growers, considering even higher targets can be advantageous.

These recommendations are grounded in extensive research, drawing insights from third-party academic studies and Mammoth Lighting's own trials. It's paramount to recognize that achieving these targets necessitates meticulous fine-tuning of your environmental conditions. Notably, academic studies have revealed a linear relationship between light intensity and hemp yield, with notable benefits observed up to approximately 1800 PPFD.

At Mammoth Lighting, we are committed to providing you with scientifically backed recommendations to elevate your cultivation experience. Trust in our expertise and integrate these optimized PPFD targets into your grow strategy for the best possible results.



Cannabis Yield, in almost all academic studies, is linear to light intensity up to ~1800 ppfd (and potentially higher).

Veg:
High Light Intensities Can Be Used to Grow Healthy and Robust Cannabis Plants During the Vegetative Stage of Indoor Production

Flower:
Cannabis Yield, Potency, and Leaf Photosynthesis Respond Differently to Increasing Light Levels in an Indoor Environment

The Profitability of Growing Cannabis Under High Intensity Light

"If you want to maximize yield you need to push it hard with light"...Dr. Bugbee Utah State


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680ww Canna Green Spectrum-6 Bar-2592 Diodes
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Highbay / Greenhouse Light

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JKash

JKash

Can you out GRAV The Gravmaster???
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I’m looking at mars hydro and seeing their sales today. I spent 50$ on a MH bulb, 50$ on a sodium bulb, and 200 on the ballast. It’s put a noticeable dent in my electric bill aswell. I’m looking at the TSW 2000 300W light, and seeing that the ppfd would be much greater, and over time, I could save money. It’s 200$, which I find a steal, and I was maybe even thinking of buying a 150W for a veg tent. If you’re familiar with the fallacy of sunk costs, I think I might be a victim of it but wanted to get other input. I stopped myself with it in cart and all my information ready, but feel like it’s the right move. I could always sell my HPS later, right? Is it ok to switch to LED mid grow? I flipped my first attempt of a grow 3 days ago. Let me know what you guys think. I bought a tent from my local grow store, and want to get set up by next week.
If you want to just say screw it... look into the phlizon fd6500.... it's 350 bucks for a 640w led... this will suit your 4x4 perfectly!!!!

I've had great harvests under that light and won't kill your power bill... also you will not have as much heat issues either...

I got my boss to switch lights in middle of her veg cycle and her plants are much happier under LED compared to her mh/hps
 
ACSippi

ACSippi

374
93
Bugbee...I saw his name mentioned. He's part of the problem in the cannabis world. He's a scientist trying real hard to get everyone to believe they have to grow like scientists to be successful. Then he tells you what you gotta buy and iirc all that stuff is in his store. ChaChing!!! Nothing wrong with that just be aware if you don't have money to blow. The guy totally scares people away from homegrowing. Too expensive to start, overwhelmed with information.

I don't use nothing he promotes, I grow as basic as I can. He can't outdo me 🤣 you can quote me on that. He can't outdo a lot of us since it isn't just me fwiw.
 
JKash

JKash

Can you out GRAV The Gravmaster???
Supporter
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263
Bugbee...I saw his name mentioned. He's part of the problem in the cannabis world. He's a scientist trying real hard to get everyone to believe they have to grow like scientists to be successful. Then he tells you what you gotta buy and iirc all that stuff is in his store. ChaChing!!! Nothing wrong with that just be aware if you don't have money to blow. The guy totally scares people away from homegrowing. Too expensive to start, overwhelmed with information.

I don't use nothing he promotes, I grow as basic as I can. He can't outdo me 🤣 you can quote me on that. He can't outdo a lot of us since it isn't just me fwiw.
Yes he owns his own company...apogee... but you don't have to buy his equipment to be a home grower....

But he is basically the pioneer in scientific research in the cannabis world... he has been able to prove and disprove science and bro-science...

Simple things for example... like terpenes are produced during light hours not dark hours.. people used to go dark for 3 days plus before chop down.... his research found this ineffective in a nutshell....

Or flushing is not needed

I would not toss him aside all together as his research on cannabis is really incredible... not bad for a Cornell professor!
 
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