Top Down Yellowing Leaves... After deep reflection I still can't figure it out...

[ethcan]

You can't drown a plant unless the water is stagnant and depleted of oxygen. It doesn't actually drown it just doesn't have enough oxygen.

Look at hydro much the same roots are submerged all the time.

Alright.... so I’m theory, the more waterings, the more oxygen?

 

[Aqua Man]

Alright.... so I’m theory, the more waterings, the more oxygen?

Yea as the waters travels through the media it pulls air with it and the fresh water should be well oxygenated plus coco has a really good air holding capacity and exchange. That's why it's difficult to overwater

 

[ethcan]

Yea as the waters travels through the media it pulls air with it and the fresh water should be well oxygenated plus coco has a really good air holding capacity and exchange. That's why it's difficult to overwater

EC still rising in runoff. I’ve upped my feeds to 4 times per day, with 20% runoff each time.
plants still looking meh. Coco is staying pretty much soaked at all times now, except at night.

 

[ethcan]

Lights on at 7:00.
first two feeds are an hour apart to get the media saturated quickly. Then two more feedings throughout the day.

 

[Aqua Man]

Lights on at 7:00.
first two feeds are an hour apart to get the media saturated quickly. Then two more feedings throughout the day.

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Yeah it's gonna take a bit to flush through unless you flush the media significantly. What the run off ec

 

[Aqua Man]

You did a flush already though right? Sorry been in a lot of threads the past few days

 

[ethcan]

You did a flush already though right? Sorry been in a lot of threads the past few days

Yes I flushed hard.

I flushed down till the feed EC (1.0ms) matched the runoff EC (1.0ms)

The EC just keeps rising. I think I'll lower my feed strength.

 

[Dusty Green]

Hey bud,

Sorry to see your sad plants...If I had to guess, Id say you have multiple problems.

First, Id say your PH is off; check your run off PH, and compare it with your feeding PH; My guess is your coco is holding your PH up and causing lockout.. I grew in Pro-Mix and kept it between 5.5 and 6.0; I know coco is a tad different, but Im pretty sure its close to six.

I cant stress enough that a bad PH meter can cause so many headaches. Also, check your run off for TDS, and EC; each strain can only tolerate so much, some more some less.

Also, calibrate your PH/EC/TDS meters every day, and I recommend using more than one meter for each, to verify and compare results; especially if they arent super expensive...Remember water temp affects the calibration/reading results.

Yellowing can also come from overwatering.

Also looks like I see some heat stress.

Good luck.

Dusty

 

[ethcan]

Hey bud,

Sorry to see your sad plants...If I had to guess, Id say you have multiple problems.

First, Id say your PH is off; check your run off PH, and compare it with your feeding PH; My guess is your coco is holding your PH up and causing lockout.. I grew in Pro-Mix and kept it between 5.5 and 6.0; I know coco is a tad different, but Im pretty sure its close to six.

I cant stress enough that a bad PH meter can cause so many headaches. Also, check your run off for TDS, and EC; each strain can only tolerate so much, some more some less.

Also, calibrate your PH/EC/TDS meters every day, and I recommend using more than one meter for each, to verify and compare results; especially if they arent super expensive...Remember water temp affects the calibration/reading results.

Yellowing can also come from overwatering.

Also looks like I see some heat stress.

Good luck.

Dusty

Absolutely about the pH. The runoff pH is shooting up to 6.9 when fed at 5.8. I know people say not to read too much into pH in runoff in coco. But I can't help but notice it continually rising.

 

[ethcan]

This is a plant that was pruned up and about to get flipped. just stopped growing. Look at the roots.

 

[ethcan]

Roots are rotten. Why? I run chlorine and res temp at 68*.


@cemchris

 

[cemchris]

I don't even pay attention to rez temps in DTW. Never have an issue on that front.

What exactly are you feeding or adding of each per gal?

 

[ethcan]

I don't even pay attention to rez temps in DTW. Never have an issue on that front.

What exactly are you feeding or adding of each per gal?

Jacks 321.
athena Ag cleanse.
heavy 16 roots.
EZ Wet.



new thoughts... what do you think?

i think the shallowness of the media is what’s causing my root rot. there is hardly any moisture gradient from top to bottom so they are soaking wet when watered.

ive just transplanted these to 3 gallon smart pots. Hoping the extra media and aeration will help revive the root system.

i threw out the worst of the plants, about 50 per room.

the rest are very healthy and very tall. I’ve spread them out and bent them through nets to maximize canopy. I normally run a high plant count so ended up with enough healthy plants to do 12 per 5x5.

the worst of the sick plants for sure won’t recover. Just zombie plants, waiting to die. Roots totally blasted.

i’m hoping I’ve found my solution in these two attached photos.

 

[STgrowin]

Hey everyone. I am having an issue that has been plaguing me for quite some time now.

I don't know what I'm doing wrong even after a thorough reflection, so I'm reaching out to see if someone can help me out.

Basically what occurs is a slowing of the growth and a very intense yellowing from the top down. If left on automatic daily irrigation, the plant will die once in flower. I will attach as many photos as I can of the symptoms.

This same symptomology has been occuring my flower rooms as well. I basically axxed 30% of my yield this last flower run due to plants looking like this. Previously in these flower rooms I was fertigating twice a day (probably way too much, I wasn't measuring how much runoff I was getting) and plants that took on this symptomology would look worse and worse and worse, until they would eventually just wilt dry and die.



View attachment 995257
View attachment 995259

I'm going to list all my variables and make it very easy to understand my plants.


-Nutrients
Jacks in the 321 formula
Power SI
Heavy 16 Roots
Hypochlorous Acid (Athena Ag Cleanse)
Phosphoric Acid for pH Down (Used rarely)
Potassium Bicarbonate for pH Up (Used often)

-Sprays
Plant Therapy every 3 days
Spinosad
Azaguard

-Media
~1.1gal (4L) of Char Coir coco perlite 50/50 mix.

-Lighting
Gavita DE 1000w HPS/MH

-High CO2 (1100ppm)
-VPD: I try to keep it around ~1.0kpa
-80*F 65%-70% relative humidity
-lots and lots of air movement.


Watering Habits:

I was previously watering daily in this room with enough water to produce 20% runoff. I was doing this through my drip system. When the yellowing began to come in full force, I thought "overwatering" and have now been picking each plant up daily and feeding when it is significantly lighter than full saturation but does not look dry (allowing dry downs but not too dry)

Currently they are being fed (starting with RO water)
pH 5.8
EC 1.4mS
Jacks 321
Power SI
Roots
Cleanse

I have runoff collectors and I am getting constant readings of
pH 6.4
EC 2.2


It is worth noting that I pulled a few of the sick plants out of their pots and did observe less developed root systems than some of the healthier ones, although this was NOT a universal rule as there were also yellow plants with great pearly white dense root systems.

Also you will note some spray damage. That was caused by a foliar feed recipe with a pH far too acidic. That has now been rectified.

Some of my theories are,
I initially overwatered this crop by giving daily irrigations too soon.
I then backed off too much out of fear of overwatering, and allowed them to dry, allowing salts to build.
Now they are locked out as hell and I have no idea how to fix them.

Each day they are not seeming to be improving. I ensure good runoff at each feeding and am allowing a bit of a dryback to ensure I'm not overwatering.


A few of the severely yellow plants that were clearly stunted also had very poor stabilizer roots and the trunk would swing with the fans. It needed a stake.


Am I just in need of a really really high volume flush and then up my EC?


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How I'm used to my rooms looking... This is stressful!

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Over watering cause me to have an issue like this. You know more then me but I heard over watering can cause your plants to have a hard time taking in its nutrients. It looks like it needs nitrogen but I would make sure it drys out first. Then water till run off and check your ppm again.

 

[BurnzYzBudZz]

Ditch the plastic nursery pots and gets some bags or fabric pots. Better aeration to the roots. I think they are suffocating in those pots even though some say it’s impossible to drowned roots in coco. Hope you get to the bottom of this.
Burnz

 

[ethcan]

Ditch the plastic nursery pots and gets some bags or fabric pots. Better aeration to the roots. I think they are suffocating in those pots even though some say it’s impossible to drowned roots in coco. Hope you get to the bottom of this.
Burnz

Hi burnz. I’ve actually just transplanted them all into 3 gal cloth pots. Was thinking the same.

 

[BurnzYzBudZz]

Hi burnz. I’ve actually just transplanted them all into 3 gal cloth pots. Was thinking the same.

You will conquer this brotha. Happy grows.

 

[ethcan]

You will conquer this brotha. Happy grows.

Thank you I appreciate it. Stressful stuff

 

[Hymie]

hi. you figure it out?
im gonna guess light intensity and photoinhibition