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colchicine

Discussion in 'Advanced Techniques & Problems' started by MegaSuiter, Dec 4, 2013.

  1. Recently a professor said that you could use a solution of colchicine and it will result in a seedless plant. I understand that part, but can you treat live plants with this?!
     
  2. ya have to breed with it to get those results. not entirely sure have ya use it, but ya gotta treat a plant prior to it setting seed. half those seeds will be tetraploids meaning they have 4 sets of chromosomes instead of two. then you backcross those tetraploids with the diploid parent to result in triploid progeny, which are seedless.

    neverbreak
     
  3. Actually neverbreak it's even simpler than that. Steps and explanation are ass follows.

    1. Treat young female plant with colchicine. (A normal fertilization takes place between a 1n mother cell and 1n father cell, creating a diploid embryo--when treated with colchicine the female eggs will mature with a diploid number of chromosomes--2n)

    2. Fertilize female. (results in triploid embryos).

    3. Plant and grow triploid embryos. They bear fruit but cannot be fertilized.

    4. Profit.
     
  4. geologic

    geologic Old Pharmer Supporter

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    Very poisonous stuff--
    right???...
     
  5. ~400mg is the predicted LD50 (dose at which half of subjects will die) for a 150lbs human. Similar to arsenic poisoning. Interrupts cellular respiration, very toxic stuff.

    It is used as a treatment for several disorders, but dosing and observation by a physician is very important.

    MSDS Safety Sheet:

    http://www.sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId=9923531
     
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  6. lino

    lino

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    Wow this dangerous

    Colchicine
    Unfortunately, colchicine is very toxic and hazardous to handle. It is acutely toxic and has been responsible for many accidental poisonings by people or pets consuming the “autumn crocus” (Colchicum sp.) that are sometimes used in gardens. In addition to its acute toxicity, it also causes chromosomal defects. Overall, this chemical in it pure form is best handled in a chemistry lab with a fume hood with gloves and other personal protective equipment. Once it is dissolved and diluted into water, it can be handled outside the fume hoods but gloves are still a necessity since the chemical may be adsorbed through the skin.

    What squiggs is saying is this stuff in dangerous without the proper knowledge... be careful, yikes
     
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  7. fractal

    fractal

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    Cool thread, I have been interested in this lately. Polyploid cannabis plants produce twice as much due to double stacked bud sites and can have extremely high levels of THC and other cannabinoids. They grow fast too because they have more leaves per node. Thanks for the cliff notes squiggs.
     
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  8. lino

    lino

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    sorry, i complained bout this chemical in another thread that might have been your thread. Second thoughts have me thinking it would probably be better to learn about this chemical instead of trying to keep this info from cannabis growers.
     
    frebo likes this.
  9. frebo

    frebo

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    Back in the 1980's we tried to treat seeds with Colchicine. We emptied a Gout prescription capsule in the germination water. The starts stalks and leaves were trice as thick as normal but died before getting 1 1/2" high. We gave up and never heard about it until now. At the time we were warned that it was poison and that we would have to wait for plants from the seeds from the first generation seeds to be able to smoke it.
    I have gout and take indomethacin and some other drug I cannot remember and have not used colchicine for gout but believe it is still prescribed for it. This dose MUST be LOW.
    I have always wanted to know if anyone has ever had any experience with colchicine and IF some of these new super strains are the result of some of this type of breeding. I still have one of those capsules from the '80's.
     
  10. lino

    lino

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    Pills are Not effective!

    you would need a BioReagent, that will show plant cell culture tested, ≥95% (HPLC) - dangerous with out proper protection.

    The dosing procedure involves creating a concentrated colchicine solution by adding 0.5 g of colchicine into 100 mL of purified (HPLC-grade) water. This created a “stock” solution of 5000 ppm colchicine by weight. For each treatment, the stock solution was diluted to achieve the desired concentration of colchicine. For example, the 500 ppm solution involved diluting 1 mL of the stock solution by adding 9 mL of purified water in a test tube. The control group just had 10 mL of pure water added to it. The seeds were added to the test tubes and they were allowed to soak in the solution for 96 hour. The test tubes were wrapped in aluminum foil to protect the solutions from light since colchicine breaks down in light. They were stored at room temperature for the 96 hours. The solutions were shaken each day to make sure that the seeds were in contact with the solution since many of the seeds initially floated on the solution. The seeds were stratified in a refrigerator for 4 weeks before being dosed with colchicine.

    There have been numerous accidental people and pets contaminated with colchicine in concentrated forms. I'm not a chemist but I have read of reaction with this chemical when combined with other elements that can be lethal.

    this chemical in a concentrated form is best handled in a chemistry lab with a fume hood with gloves and other personal protective equipment
     
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2013
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  11. frebo

    frebo

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    Thank you Lino. I was about to try that again. Well maybe not. My weed is already too good.
     
    lino likes this.
  12. It is a very dangerous chemical. Scrubbed laminar flow hood required for safe handling. Gloves, lab coat, the whole 9. Preferably done near a shower you can be in, in less than 20 seconds from a spill.
     
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  13. lino

    lino

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    The above experiment was handled by a professor out the University of Washington. I was responsible for documentation software, seed stock and other supplies, carnivorous plant species were used in this experiment. The colchicine was handled in a chemistry class. The final seed inoculation was performed by the Washington State Agriculture dept (Univ). The dosages and procedure would be different for cannabis. I'm guessing based on some study of G13 colchicine was used in several steps in the creation of original G13 but colchicine treatments alone did create G13. There was more steps in the genetic modification of G13.
     
    Chronic Monster likes this.
  14. I remember reading about inducing polyploidy with colchicine before I started growing. I was given a few books to read and this was in one of them. Always wondered about it...
     
  15. lino

    lino

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    typo, sorry, here is the correction:
    I'm guessing based on some study of G13, colchicine was used in several steps in the creation of original G13 but colchicine treatments were NOT the only techniques used to create G13.
     
  16. good info lino bro. playin with fire for sure.

    neverbreak
     
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  17. I have tossed around this idea for some time. After reading testimonials of folks who claimed to try, not very scientific however, all had failed. One photo in high times some timearound 94 dude took a pict of a HEAVILY vvariegated flowered plant. Claimed it was with the use of colchicine. Treating seed will likely kill off most and spraying on plant, meristematic material obviously, may give the same results. Though not if polyploidy is your goal.
    This used to be a method employed by breeder of ornamental shrubs flowers etc to obtain novel traits. Then cloned, grafted and/or bred for those qualities.

    Peace
     
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  18. lino

    lino

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    nice post chronicMonster... and to add to this controversy is the use of these toxic chemicals outdoors. Experiments are performed outdoors and now new studies on mycorrhiza show that many of these harsh chemical can effect plants for up to MILEs away.. in ancient forest where mycorrhiza organisms are massive./ A good dose of radio activity was induced on a branch of a tree. Research showed other trees miles away with radiation reaction, what was the contaminating the other trees with radiation? Not Water, Not air, it was in the mycorrhiza of the soil. Radiation traveled from plant to plant thru mycorrhiza. The plants talk to each other! Im finding lots of new and other research that is showing this mutualism that is off the chart in Pumpkins and Cannabis. So what I'm trying to say if a guy goes out in the back yard with an Internet order of harsh chemicals and he not sure about what the science is behind his newly discovered chemical,,, the chemical might make into the backyard and might be genetically modifying all the plants for many of his neighbors yards around him. I argued with professors about mycorrhiza and the extent of the Colo organism and its reach .... I was wrong -with a simple accidental backyard experiment I proved to myself that MY mycorrhiza stretches far beyond the perimeter of my yard, Shock to me! and then coupled with new thigmomorphogenesis science and I'm freakN out on how aware fucking cannabis and Pumpkins plants are of there surroundings. In working with Giant Pumpkin I'm discovering that plants know which other plants exist in the garden, GP dont like tomato's! they can find Toms even one in pots, But Fucking how,,,, You can train fucking Giant Pumpkins almost like them fuckers got a brain, smartest plant I've worked with. If you stay still and trim in an outdoor garden the Pumpkin tentacle could find me form a foot away in less that 30 min.. they'd move to me and wrap my belt loops often. no one believed me till they's helped me trim in my Cannbis /Pumpkin garden. I think the SOB GP find you thru thigmomorphtropism by using the mycorrhiza and there roots to know it's environment.
    Yes < I'm freak that does bongs and goes out in the green house and tickles Giant Pumpkin tentacles... Got to luv the worlds larges female organ on the planet,,, If I could just GMO my buds with Giant Pumpkins,,, grafting has not been effective with GP to cannabis thus far, Jolly Green Giant Pumking Bud ,,, lol
     
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