Cheap alternatives to overpriced hydroponic nutrients

[Big JAE]

btw, here is the formula for Jack's Professional 5-12-26 for 100 Liters @ 500ppm

Magnesium Sulfate (Epsom Salts) 63.9g
Potassium Nitrate 38g
Potassium Monobasic Phosphate 23.5g

So, to standardize to a 25 lb bag, we can mathematically get:
25 pounds = 11 339.8093 grams
63.9x + 38x + 23.5x = 11339.8
125.4x = 11339.8
x = 90.42


back to original equation

Magnesium Sulfate (Epsom Salts) 63.9g x 90.42 = 5778g
Potassium Nitrate 38g x 90.42 = 3436g
Potassium Monobasic Phosphate 23.5g = 2125g

This will yield 25 lbs of 5-12-26 formula, with Jack's you will also need the addition of micro /trace nutrients to get an exact copy.

I'm sorry but I don't understand this and was wondering if you could break this down into more lamen's terms. Possibly explain where to get what or brands to use in place of certain things. Sorry I don't understand very well but I did get the bag of jacks and cal nitrate together as I was told to by you or someone else in here to try out this jacks method vs the very expensive 3 part no ph test needed Advanced Nutrients nutrient pack.
I would really appreciate it, thanks.

 

[Big JAE]

Received my shipment of Jacks Hyrdo & Calcium.

I'm running the Hydro formula at .9EC, and the calcium mix at .6EC. For a total of 1.5EC.

Add the hydro formula first and let it fully dissolve. I've been letting it sit a few hours, then adding the calcium.

Plants look great, will keep you updated.

may I ask how exactly are you mixing that say per gallon and in what phase?

 

[Big JAE]

With Moab at 1 gram you get the following PPMs per 1 gallon.

N - 3
P - 60
K - 70

With Jacks at 3g and the cal nitrate at 2g you get the following:


Jacks 3.0g/ Cal 2.0g per gallon
N - 142
P- 41
K - 171
MG -50
S- 65
C - 122

Our Goal is to achieve:

Goal
N 120-150
p 40-60
K 180-240
Mg 60-80
S 40-60
Ca 100-140

So adding 1g of MOAB on top of jacks would result in the following:

N - 145
P- 101
K - 241
MG -50
S- 65
C - 122

So at most if you run jacks I would add at most .5g of MOAB or the likes.

I think the sweet spot is Jacks at 3.0g & Cal at 2g

N -122
P- 48
K - 200
MG -58
S- 76
C- 128

the sweet spot is jacks at 3grams and cal nitrate at 2g with .5 grams of moab? you have two listed as jacks and cal only with 2 if sets of numbers

 

[Fresh Starts]

the sweet spot is jacks at 3grams and cal nitrate at 2g with .5 grams of moab? you have two listed as jacks and cal only with 2 if sets of numbers

Have you ever used Jacks Hydro? If not then you could stick to the 3-2-1 Jacks Hydro-Cal/nit-Epsom salts recipe to keep it simple and achieve amazing results.

I just pulled down a run of headband that tested @ 28.86% THC using 3-2-1. No shit

 

[Lurkin4yrs]

Have you ever used Jacks Hydro? If not then you could stick to the 3-2-1 Jacks Hydro-Cal/nit-Epsom salts recipe to keep it simple and achieve amazing results.

I just pulled down a run of headband that tested @ 28.86% THC using 3-2-1. No shit

Pics or it didn't happen =X

-lurkin

 

[Capulator]

I said I would post this up so here it is:

For all of my strains I run this now, and as long as I water to runoff everything blows up.

Veg:

149:45:118:47:75:136 (N: P :K:Mg:S:Ca) <--- 128ppm NO3, 21ppm NH4

Bloom (starting week 4):

Same as above but I take out the MAP, Switch for MKP and reduce CaNO3 by 20%

114:45:148:47:75:109 <----- 7ppm NH4



This is a great raw salts formula. I am also adding organics (kelp, fishmeal, wormcastings) dry between runs.

weeks 6 and 7 I add molasses 5ml/gal.

Last week only water.


To achieve the formulas I use jacks hydro 5-12-26 @ 1.5 grams, MAP @ 0.4 grams or MKP @0.4 grams (veg or bloom), K2SO4 @ 0.3 grams , CaNO3 @ 2.85 or 2.3 grams, and epsom salt @ 1 gram.

per gallon of course.

I do use AN ph down at 1mL per gal as well. LA city tap water.

This has been in use for roughly 8 months now and I am doing very well with it. So well that I stopped tinkering.

 

[Big JAE]

Have you ever used Jacks Hydro? If not then you could stick to the 3-2-1 Jacks Hydro-Cal/nit-Epsom salts recipe to keep it simple and achieve amazing results.

I just pulled down a run of headband that tested @ 28.86% THC using 3-2-1. No shit

ow that is amazing!!!!!!!!! please share with me you exact nutrient schedule if you would. No ive been using a 3 part no ph worry advanced nutrient kit for about 4 years now plus a few odds and ends. im very sick of buying water and have been on this site looking for someone who has results like yours to share there exact schedule. im glad I waited I was gonna buy the 25lb bag w the cal nit 2 for 1 special. I run a dozen 5 gallon bucket dwc w/ 10 inch net pots, all on movable dolly's for easy rotate and nutrient change outs, , two 1,000 watt hps / mhs air cooled lights with 2 6 inch inline fans set up so I can keep the heat inside for winter or outside for summer because 24' charcoal muffler / filter = no smell at all, lights set at 18/6 both on ratchet pully system, each bucket has "pinny lane" strain which is Chemdog , big bud and super silver haize child lol. I've been doing well just sick of paying for water like I said.

 

[Big JAE]

I became tired of weighing out and mixing in Jack's Pro/epsom/cal-nit so I went back to MaxiBloom.

Big JAE:
I bought the 4lb + 4lb combo pack.

hey thanks again I just ordered everything that you guys said to and an going to dp a 6 vs 6 run next time with the AN vs the jacks nutes on the schedule given here. I will be showing pictures of how they compare for more advice from you guys. thanks a bunch fellas

 

[Big JAE]

I said I would post this up so here it is:

For all of my strains I run this now, and as long as I water to runoff everything blows up.

Veg:

149:45:118:47:75:136 (N:K:Mg:S:Ca) <--- 128ppm NO3, 21ppm NH4

Bloom (starting week 4):

Same as above but I take out the MAP, Switch for MKP and reduce CaNO3 by 20%

114:45:148:47:75:109 <----- 7ppm NH4



This is a great raw salts formula. I am also adding organics (kelp, fishmeal, wormcastings) dry between runs.

weeks 6 and 7 I add molasses 5ml/gal.

Last week only water.


To achieve the formulas I use jacks hydro 5-12-26 @ 1.5 grams, MAP @ 0.4 grams or MKP @0.4 grams (veg or bloom), K2SO4 @ 0.3 grams , CaNO3 @ 2.85 or 2.3 grams, and epsom salt @ 1 gram.

per gallon of course.

I do use AN ph down at 1mL per gal as well. LA city tap water.

This has been in use for roughly 8 months now and I am doing very well with it. So well that I stopped tinkering.

sorry but I don't understand all the abbreviated stuff. bunch of 3 letter stuff I dnt know what is

mkp? can03? veg or bloom = what brand of what? map? mkp?

 

[Lurkin4yrs]

sorry but I don't understand all the abbreviated stuff. bunch of 3 letter stuff I dnt know what is

mkp? can03? veg or bloom = what brand of what? map? mkp?

A little google foo will fix that.

 

[Lurkin4yrs]

I said I would post this up so here it is:

For all of my strains I run this now, and as long as I water to runoff everything blows up.

Veg:

149:45:118:47:75:136 (N:K:Mg:S:Ca) <--- 128ppm NO3, 21ppm NH4

Bloom (starting week 4):

Same as above but I take out the MAP, Switch for MKP and reduce CaNO3 by 20%

114:45:148:47:75:109 <----- 7ppm NH4



This is a great raw salts formula. I am also adding organics (kelp, fishmeal, wormcastings) dry between runs.

weeks 6 and 7 I add molasses 5ml/gal.

Last week only water.


To achieve the formulas I use jacks hydro 5-12-26 @ 1.5 grams, MAP @ 0.4 grams or MKP @0.4 grams (veg or bloom), K2SO4 @ 0.3 grams , CaNO3 @ 2.85 or 2.3 grams, and epsom salt @ 1 gram.

per gallon of course.

I do use AN ph down at 1mL per gal as well. LA city tap water.

This has been in use for roughly 8 months now and I am doing very well with it. So well that I stopped tinkering.

What ppm is your tap?
-lurkin

 

[Fresh Starts]

I said I would post this up so here it is:

For all of my strains I run this now, and as long as I water to runoff everything blows up.

Veg:

149:45:118:47:75:136 (N:K:Mg:S:Ca) <--- 128ppm NO3, 21ppm NH4

Bloom (starting week 4):

Same as above but I take out the MAP, Switch for MKP and reduce CaNO3 by 20%

114:45:148:47:75:109 <----- 7ppm NH4



This is a great raw salts formula. I am also adding organics (kelp, fishmeal, wormcastings) dry between runs.

weeks 6 and 7 I add molasses 5ml/gal.

Last week only water.


To achieve the formulas I use jacks hydro 5-12-26 @ 1.5 grams, MAP @ 0.4 grams or MKP @0.4 grams (veg or bloom), K2SO4 @ 0.3 grams , CaNO3 @ 2.85 or 2.3 grams, and epsom salt @ 1 gram.

per gallon of course.

I do use AN ph down at 1mL per gal as well. LA city tap water.

This has been in use for roughly 8 months now and I am doing very well with it. So well that I stopped tinkering.

Glad to see you post this recipe.
It looks like you meant to say N-P-K-Mg:S:Ca but the website is acting a fool.
Roughly Veg is 3-1-2.5 and Bloom is 2-1-3 with Ca:Mg ratio of 2:1-which looks good for coco. Is that your medium you're using?

Pics or it didn't happen
-lurkin

I have half a mind not to post this at all..
But here are the test results with pictures here

 

[Fresh Starts]

please share with me you exact nutrient schedule if you would.

In my last headband run I didn't change anything about the 3-2-1 recipe from Veg to Bloom except the EC/ppm of the solution. I take it to a maximum of 800-900 ppm in Bloom with temperatures ranging 80-85, humidity swinging from 50-55+, and Co2 enrichment @ 1000-1200 ppm. The EC is dependent upon plant stage and environment i.e humidity, temperature, and watering schedule.

For your DWC system the epsom salts become less relevant. The recipe can be changed to 3-2-.5 grams per gallon.

im glad I waited I was gonna buy the 25lb bag w the cal nit 2 for 1 special...

This is exactly what I buy. In fact I just ordered another 25 .lbs last night.

 

[Capulator]

What ppm is your tap?
-lurkin

coming from the tap I'm around 500-700 (.5 scale). My final EC rests around 2.7

In coco, rockwool, peat... this formula works with any substrate.

 

[Lurkin4yrs]

Glad to see you post this recipe.
It looks like you meant to say N-P-K-Mg:S:Ca but the website is acting a fool.
Roughly Veg is 3-1-2.5 and Bloom is 2-1-3 with Ca:Mg ratio of 2:1-which looks good for coco. Is that your medium you're using?




I have half a mind not to post this at all..
But here are the test results with pictures here

And it did happen! Good job brother! =)

-lurkin

 

[Big JAE]

Glad to see you post this recipe.
It looks like you meant to say N-P-K-Mg:S:Ca but the website is acting a fool.
Roughly Veg is 3-1-2.5 and Bloom is 2-1-3 with Ca:Mg ratio of 2:1-which looks good for coco. Is that your medium you're using?




I have half a mind not to post this at all..
But here are the test results with pictures here

did you post those pics i was curious to see them.

 

[Fresh Starts]

did you post those pics i was curious to see them.

Click "here" at the end of the post

 

[Fresh Starts]

I said I would post this up so here it is:

For all of my strains I run this now, and as long as I water to runoff everything blows up.

Veg:

149:45:118:47:75:136 (N: P :K:Mg:S:Ca) <--- 128ppm NO3, 21ppm NH4

Bloom (starting week 4):

Same as above but I take out the MAP, Switch for MKP and reduce CaNO3 by 20%

114:45:148:47:75:109 <----- 7ppm NH4



This is a great raw salts formula. I am also adding organics (kelp, fishmeal, wormcastings) dry between runs.

weeks 6 and 7 I add molasses 5ml/gal.

Last week only water.


To achieve the formulas I use jacks hydro 5-12-26 @ 1.5 grams, MAP @ 0.4 grams or MKP @0.4 grams (veg or bloom), K2SO4 @ 0.3 grams , CaNO3 @ 2.85 or 2.3 grams, and epsom salt @ 1 gram.

per gallon of course.

I do use AN ph down at 1mL per gal as well. LA city tap water.

This has been in use for roughly 8 months now and I am doing very well with it. So well that I stopped tinkering.

I just bought a well known (and expensive) line of fertilizer to reverse engineer and custom tailor to my own system but now I don't know if I want to move forward with that project because this recipe looks dank. @Capulator

 

[Big JAE]

I just bought a well known (and expensive) line of fertilizer to reverse engineer and custom tailor to my own system but now I don't know if I want to move forward with that project because this recipe looks dank. @Capulator

wow that is cool I wasn't aware y could increase the THC content I thought that was a by strain max figure. Now I know why sometimes the finished product can seem to be weaker or stronger. I was blaming it on curing methods. So you can send t in to get a result huh? I figured something like that would be hella expensive? Also may I ask why the suggestion for the difference in the Epson salt because I run DWC buckets? I have noticed that since I made stacked circle (around the entire ID of the buckets) aerators instead of using stones my plants have been growing at a pace where you can see difference daily. Seems like they repair instantly after being pruned or topped. Can't wait to get the new nutrients! lol Any suggestions on where I can get feminized headband seeds shipped to the USA for a non ridiculous price? only need about 3-5? Hey thanks again for the help this forum has a lot of cool knowledgable people. Wish I would have found it before.

 

[Fresh Starts]

wow that is cool I wasn't aware y could increase the THC content I thought that was a by strain max figure. Now I know why sometimes the finished product can seem to be weaker or stronger. I was blaming it on curing methods. So you can send t in to get a result huh? I figured something like that would be hella expensive? Also may I ask why the suggestion for the difference in the Epson salt because I run DWC buckets? I have noticed that since I made stacked circle (around the entire ID of the buckets) aerators instead of using stones my plants have been growing at a pace where you can see difference daily. Seems like they repair instantly after being pruned or topped. Can't wait to get the new nutrients! lol Any suggestions on where I can get feminized headband seeds shipped to the USA for a non ridiculous price? only need about 3-5? Hey thanks again for the help this forum has a lot of cool knowledgable people. Wish I would have found it before.

For the most part genetics will determine THC content although it's the growers responsibility to provide the environment that will allow the strain to perform at it's peak.

Your question about magnesium in DWC has to do with cation exchange capacity- which I encourage you to read about via a google search some time even though for now you need not worry about it because you are running true hydroponics.

Coco users (like me) have to deal with the unique cation exchange capacity (CEC) of coconut coir (-) which has a negative charge and thus attracts big ions like calcium and potassium because they are the biggest ions by physical means and have the largest (+) positive charge (opposites attract). Once the matrix threshold is satisfied (think carpet rubbed ballon dipped into styrofoam bits) the Coco coir holds these ions in a matrix so that their levels are actually elevated. Due to this CEC function the potassium and calcium levels are higher than JPH in true hydro and need extra Mg throughout the cycle. The 3-2-1 recipe addresses this issue by balancing the elevated Ca with more Mg albeit since Jacks Pro Hydro has a high level of potassium it ultimately lacks the flexibility needed to be a perfect coco recipe. And thus members like @Capulator and others have decided that it is worth re-engineering a new recipe for coco bringing K levels into suitable ranges.

True Hydropincs = No CEC matrix to fulfill and K and Ca levels stay available at the desired rates. JPH has adequate levels of Mg already and supplementation can be given minimally according to environment and plant metabolism. :bookworm: