Canna A & B. This Has Been Working But Should I Add/change Anything?

[Samoan]

My TAP water is 7.3ph and 155ppm. I'm using Canna A and B light feeding, ph 5.8-6.0 using citric acid crystals.. Would anyone suggest that I add any CalMag? I think I read that canna is designed to be used with tap? A little silica blast in veg. ...just ordered some hy-Brix molasses
That is all I'm using. Just started bubbling compost tea.
Im pretty sure this OG BIO WAR beneficial microbes are definitely working some magic
HAND-WATERED COCO COIR

 

[Saint Skinny]

if your into podcasts or on youtube check out Dude Grows show. Scotty (the stonier funny one) uses Canna coco a and b with Recharge (beneficial microbes, I highly suggest using microbes, let them do some of the work for you) and If I remember correctly, a little Armor Kote or Protekt for silica. sounds like you guys have similar growing styles

 

[Mr Bee]

Im of the opinion of something ain't broke then don't fix it.
If your getting results with what your useing I would stick with that.add cal/wen needed only.not that it would do any harm but u don't wanna be useing stuff unneccisarily.i heard someone say canna coco a&b shouldn't have to be supplemented with cal/mag although I couldn't say for sure if that's right.

 

[JMcG]

if your into podcasts or on youtube check out Dude Grows show. Scotty (the stonier funny one) uses Canna coco a and b with Recharge (beneficial microbes, I highly suggest using microbes, let them do some of the work for you) and If I remember correctly, a little Armor Kote or Protekt for silica. sounds like you guys have similar growing styles

Sup skinny!
Fellow DGC here...

 

[FennarioMike]

Canna Coco A and B isn't DESIGNED for tap water, because tap water quality varies enormously from city to city. It's more designed for a more pure water, but CAN be used with tap water if the quality is good enough.

Your water is very good quality with low ppm and therefore isn't an issue. You probably don't need to ADD ca/mg because it's likely already present in your water. If you were using RO water, or your city water was low in hardness, you'd need to add it. But your plants have good green stems - you shouldn't need to add any at all.

 

[Samoan]

Sounds good. I've read that Canna suggests your water to be at .2 EC. before adding part a and b. I'm wondering if that's to make up for cal mag or iron? Is it a buffer? I have been told that if you are using R/O water than you should add cal mag to bring your EC up to .2 prior to a and b. I believe some people also mix r/o with tap to bring ec up. I have also been told that if you are using the A and B at a high enough dosage, say around 700ppm, than there should be sufficient so amounts of cal mag and iron so you won't have to add any.
My tap is .3 and I feed light around 250-650ppm. I see some red stem but barely any, I will add 1/8 tspcalmag/gal if I need. I guess the molecules in tap are too large to be absorbed by the roots.
Also, I've been told that if you do use TAP water make sure too DECHLORINATE it first by letting it sit out open to the air for at least 24 hours, or you can bubble it with an air stone for at least 4 hours. -I guess this is so you don't harm the bennifial bacteria.
And one more thing, SILICA. I read that Potassium Silicate or Silica should always be adding to the water FIRST. before cal mag, then A and B.
I read that it should be done in this order to prevent nutrient lockout and also to prevent your nutrient mixture from clouding up.
However, I have also read that some add Silica last to adjust there PH. -Personally I just started adding it first.
@Saint Skinny @Mr Bee @JMcG @FennarioMike

 

[Samoan]

Also, I just added EPSOM SALT to the mix, I read that mine has just Magnesium @ 9.8% and Sulfur @ 12.98%. I add this before I PhDown my water with Citric Acid Crystals. I add at 1/8 Tsp/gal. Correct me if I am wrong but I think I read that she wants more mag and sulfur in mid-veg-early-flower, but most needed in early flower?

I started gardening with a Ph down product by Botanigaurd. It was a 29% Suphuric Acid Solution. Now I am using a different Ph down product from Earth Juice called 'NaturalDown'. Correct me if I'm wrong but I think EJ uses Citric Acid Crystals. -this stuff is strong, and imo it's a lot harder To get the same Ph every time because some of the crystals are larger or denser taking up more volume concentrating the solution. But I like it because it seems natural and honestly it sells at good price for how long it may last. I think 1/8 tsp brings my solution down over 10 points after its diluted.
QUESTION:
I was thinking about using the citric acid crystals to lower my Ph while my plants are vegetating. And then switching to a sulphuric acid Ph down when I transition my plants into bloom.

Does anyone have any advice on this?

I also wanted to add that from now on when I transplant...
For preventative reasons and to boost my coco-ecosystem population of microbes and bennificial bacteria to aid and stimulate in root and plant growth growth, and nutrient absorption.
I soak the whole plant and roots prior to placing in it's new container -in the og bio-war compost tea. Composed of only the 'foliar' pack @ double strength 6 tbsp/gallon.-recipe from a fellow Hawaiian on here helped me with a scary Broad Mite problem. Recipe - Follow foliar pack 24 hour brew instructions. the OG BIOWAR Microbes, earth worm castings, molasses, and distilled, dechlorinated or r/o water.
-soon to add Aplphalpha Meal and maxi crop kelp to the mix
...any thoughts?

I also sprinkle 'extreme gardening mykos' Pure Mycorrizal Inoculum on and in into the new coco medium/container. It says that it 'must come into contact with roots.
I'm guessing that these are little clay granules impregnated with the bennicial mycorrhiZae.

Anyone use this?
-I heard 'Great White' is the best product for mykos root innoculum.

Also, I am wondering if anyone suggests that I also use this product or something like it.
It's called 'Superthrive', and I think it's something like Vitamin b-1. Supposed to be good for seedlings,cuttings,Keikis,transplants,foliar, and well I would imagine some might add it to there nutrient mixture as well.

Also, I don't believe that they post the ingredients on this bottle?
Hydro shop had something local they said was more 'natural' than this...need to get the name of the product again as it slipped...I should have just purchased it but I didn't know much about it at the time.

Just thought I would add I have never had to use 'warm' water to dilute neem, molasses, Epsom salt, Ph Crystals or anything for that matter. If it's really thick like the neem, I just use an egg beater. -a paint mixer would be ideal.

That's all I have for today. thank you and much mahalos for any advice and if I may have helped someone that would be rad too.
Feel free to ask me about anything. -respect, Aloha

 

[Samoan]

I made a mistake in this post!^



*OG BIO WAR AT 6 Tbsp / 5 Gallons of distilled, r/o or main thing de-chlorinated water.

 

[FennarioMike]

Sounds good. I've read that Canna suggests your water to be at .2 EC. before adding part a and b. I'm wondering if that's to make up for cal mag or iron? Is it a buffer? I have been told that if you are using R/O water than you should add cal mag to bring your EC up to .2 prior to a and b. I believe some people also mix r/o with tap to bring ec up. I have also been told that if you are using the A and B at a high enough dosage, say around 700ppm, than there should be sufficient so amounts of cal mag and iron so you won't have to add any.
My tap is .3 and I feed light around 250-650ppm. I see some red stem but barely any, I will add 1/8 tspcalmag/gal if I need. I guess the molecules in tap are too large to be absorbed by the roots.
Also, I've been told that if you do use TAP water make sure too DECHLORINATE it first by letting it sit out open to the air for at least 24 hours, or you can bubble it with an air stone for at least 4 hours. -I guess this is so you don't harm the bennifial bacteria.
And one more thing, SILICA. I read that Potassium Silicate or Silica should always be adding to the water FIRST. before cal mag, then A and B.
I read that it should be done in this order to prevent nutrient lockout and also to prevent your nutrient mixture from clouding up.
However, I have also read that some add Silica last to adjust there PH. -Personally I just started adding it first.
@Saint Skinny @Mr Bee @JMcG @FennarioMike

Here's their online nutrient calculator - http://www.cannagardening.com/growguide

They aren't recommending a starting EC value, as they are assuming that there is some sort of ca/mg present, whether it's in the water already, or if you're adding it before you mix your nutes. .2 EC is what they assume water that's LOW in ca/mg to be and .4EC is what they consider Standard Water. In the drop down for hardness level, you would select what you know about your source water first, and the starting EC assumption changes. If you are using RO water, add ca/mg to the manufacturer's recommendation by volume, not EC (the ca/mg manufacturer) - and don't really worry about it being exactly .4EC. I mean, if the label says mix 4 mL/gal then do that - don't mix it using EC. Then set the online calculator to Standard Water and it will calculate everything including your expected ppm.

 

[FennarioMike]

Sounds good. I've read that Canna suggests your water to be at .2 EC. before adding part a and b. I'm wondering if that's to make up for cal mag or iron? Is it a buffer? I have been told that if you are using R/O water than you should add cal mag to bring your EC up to .2 prior to a and b. I believe some people also mix r/o with tap to bring ec up. I have also been told that if you are using the A and B at a high enough dosage, say around 700ppm, than there should be sufficient so amounts of cal mag and iron so you won't have to add any.
My tap is .3 and I feed light around 250-650ppm. I see some red stem but barely any, I will add 1/8 tspcalmag/gal if I need. I guess the molecules in tap are too large to be absorbed by the roots.
Also, I've been told that if you do use TAP water make sure too DECHLORINATE it first by letting it sit out open to the air for at least 24 hours, or you can bubble it with an air stone for at least 4 hours. -I guess this is so you don't harm the bennifial bacteria.
And one more thing, SILICA. I read that Potassium Silicate or Silica should always be adding to the water FIRST. before cal mag, then A and B.
I read that it should be done in this order to prevent nutrient lockout and also to prevent your nutrient mixture from clouding up.
However, I have also read that some add Silica last to adjust there PH. -Personally I just started adding it first.
@Saint Skinny @Mr Bee @JMcG @FennarioMike

Ok - there's a bunch of stuff here and a lot of it you are correct. As far as what Canna recommends - it's on their web site and in their nutrient calculator. Don't go by what someone has said.

There is zero ca/mg in Canna nutrients - none. At 700 ppm or 7000 ppm. It needs to be added. But, you mention that you are you using chlorinated city water and letting it off gas. Yes, off gassing chlorine works - yes, so that you don't kill bennies, but also so that the chlorine doesn't interfere with your nutrient mix and contribute to lockout. Since you are using city water, it probably has ca/mg at some level which you can find out. Every municipality tests the water regularly and those tests are made public, usually through the city's water department web site. Ca/mg levels will be expressed as Hardness in either PPM or grains/gallon. Then you will know if you need to add more or not. Don't go by the presence of red in the stem - some strains will have some of this regardless - know what your level is and how much you need to add to get it to where you want it to be. It very well might be fine as is if there is enough in the water already.

And yes, mix silica first, then ca/mg (if needed), then nutes, other additives and final pH adjust. Potassium silicate is very high pH and if you add it at the wrong time, it will cause nutrients to permanently precipitate out - which is the cloudiness. Alkaline chemicals first - then A (which is also alkaline), then B which is acidic. After that then final pH adjust.

 

[FennarioMike]

if your into podcasts or on youtube check out Dude Grows show. Scotty (the stonier funny one) uses Canna coco a and b with Recharge (beneficial microbes, I highly suggest using microbes, let them do some of the work for you) and If I remember correctly, a little Armor Kote or Protekt for silica. sounds like you guys have similar growing styles

Love Dude Grows!

 

[Saint Skinny]

Sup skinny!
Fellow DGC here...

Howdy Brotha! I love finding other DGC in random growing forums! Growers love and phat green buds ahaha

 

[JMcG]

Yeah man!
Wake and bake with the boys.

 

[Samoan]

@FennarioMike thank you for taking the time to clarify Much respect and appreciation for priceless knowledge

I took some extra time to really get down to the bottom of my water quality.
Hopefully I can successfully make my plant nutrients in a proper and safe way so my plants can enjoy them as much as possible.

To get an idea of what's in my TAP water I have included the water quality report for my area.

Tap water prior to be de-chlorinized:
167 PPM
7.8Ph

My Tap water Off-Gassed:
164 PPM
8.8 Ph

My R/O water
7.4 PH
102 PPM
-I believe it's time to change out stage 1 and 2 of my filters
There is a:
sediment filter: replace 6month
reduces sediment, dirt, rust, and suspended particles
pre-carbon cto: replace 6month
Reduces chlorine taste/odor
Increases water clarity
Reduces suspended particles
50 gdp membrane: replace 2-5 year
Reduces TDS
Filters to 1/10,000 of a micron
Post carbon Cto: replace 1 year/annually
Enhances water clarity
Reduces chlorine taste and odor
2,500

 

[Samoan]

@FennarioMike

So I aiming to have an EC at or around .4 prior to adding my Alkalines -Part A then my Acids Part B, the. Additives, then Ph.

I have Botanicare Silica Blast. 0-0-0.5
Guaranteed Analysis: Soluble Potash (K2o) 0.5%
Non-Plant Food Ingredient: 2.0% Silicon (Si) from Sodium Silicate and Potassium Silicate

Because I will be adding Potassium Silicate first, it suggests that I add it at 1/2-1tsp/gal. I have also read somewhere that 50-100PPM should be a sufficient amount.

Now my question is:

My de-chlorinated water is now 164ppm or .328 EC
So after first mixing in my Potassium Silicate at suggested rates, Should I only need to add about about 36ppm of Cal-Mag to properly buffer the mix to around .4EC before adding Part A and B?

I have Cal-Mag Plus. 2-0-0
Guaranteed Analysis: Total Nitrogen (N) 2.0%
2.0% Nitrate Nitrogen
Calcium (Ca) 3.2%
Magnesium (Mg) 1.2%
1.2% Water Soluble Magnesium (Mg)
Iron (Fe) 0.1%
0.1% Chelated Iron (Fe)

I was also wondering about my Cal-Mag Product, it seems most farmers here are using:
Dyna-Grow Pro-Tekt 0-0-3
3.7% Potassium
7.8% Silicon

Can anyone explain the differences between Botanicare Silica Blast and Dyn-Grow Pro-Tekt?

 

[Samoan]

Should my buffered water @.4 EC include Potassium Silicate?
Or just Cal-Mag?

 

[Samoan]

Is Epsom Salt considered neutral? and should it be added and mixed into the nutrition solution last?

Also, using only Canna A and B, should I need to add Epsom salt?
From what I read, some farmers decrease there cal-mag product and possibly nutrients as well to add Epsom salts for what I am guessing is extra sulfur for the plant

Is this correct?

At what stages in growth might a plant benefit from from the addition of Epsom Salt?

I have an Epsom Salt Product that is Magnesium Sulfate USP 100% and it has a Gauranteed Analysis of:
9.8% Water Soluble Magnesium (Mg)
12.9% Combined Sulfur (S) Derived from Magnesium Sulfur

 

[Samoan]

I will have 1lb Potassium Sulfate, and 1lb Monopotassium Phosphate.

I want to make my own Bloom Booster
to add to my Canna A and B.

I was going to make this Hammerhead Pk 9/18

1L Recipe:
1L/830 grams distilled H2o 0-0-0
Soluble Potash 91.8 grams 0-0-60
Mono-Potassium Phosphate MKP 78.2 grams 0-52-34
Add potash first.
0-9-18

Will this work well together?

Canna has a product called Pk13/14 that's actually pretty innexpensive but to be honest I really just want to learn to make my own nutrients and of course if I learn to do that right it is possible that I can make my own plant nutrients without having to spend as much money.

Does anyone have any advice on homemade additives and nutrient recipes that are tailored for growing in coco coir like Canna?

 

[Samoan]

@FennarioMike @JMcG
-Checked out the Dude Grow Show, it's radical now I'm going to have to find more time in my day. DGC

@Saint Skinny Thank you for Turning me on to this member now
Armor Kote or Pro-Tekt? -Noticed you didn't mention Silica blast?

@Mr Bee Mahalo for your advice.
-I got my Answer on Canna and Ca/Mg. Canna contains zero calcium and magnesium which is why you need to add it to your water to buffer it prior to adding A and B. The A and B mixture is designed for water with an EC of .4 -which for most TAP water should have sufficient trace amounts of Calcium and Magnesium already for your plants.

However, I did read that the Calcium and Magnesium Molecules in most Tap water are too large to be taken up by the plants roots.
Is this usually true?

...maybe that's why Canna suggests water at .4 EC but they don't say whether or not that it is TAP or R/O with anything else include, -calcium,magnesium,silica,iron...

 

[Mr Bee]

@FennarioMike @JMcG
-Checked out the Dude Grow Show, it's radical now I'm going to have to find more time in my day. DGC

@Saint Skinny Thank you for Turning me on to this member now
Armor Kote or Pro-Tekt? -Noticed you didn't mention Silica blast?

@Mr Bee Mahalo for your advice.
-I got my Answer on Canna and Ca/Mg. Canna contains zero calcium and magnesium which is why you need to add it to your water to buffer it prior to adding A and B. The A and B mixture is designed for water with an EC of .4 -which for most TAP water should have sufficient trace amounts of Calcium and Magnesium already for your plants.

However, I did read that the Calcium and Magnesium Molecules in most Tap water are too large to be taken up by the plants roots.
Is this usually true?

...maybe that's why Canna suggests water at .4 EC but they don't say whether or not that it is TAP or R/O with anything else include, -calcium,magnesium,silica,iron...

Well not sure about the molecules but iv used canna coco a and b for a short time with tap water and nothing needed cal/mag but the varieties your running may be different as may your tap water as we have real nice water in Scotland