Killing Microbial Life

[Shredder]

Thanks

 

[motherlode]

awesome thread bro

 

[Udyana Peace]

Thanks

You're more than welcome.

UP

 

[Udyana Peace]

Shredder

Another agent to consider using is kelp and any of its forms - kelp meal tea, kelp/seaweed extract/et al.

It's established science (circa 1918) that kelp contains compounds that limit the ability of 'spider mites' from hatching.

Mites and mildew are THE most studied deal in the agriculture and horticulture worlds. Getting good, solid information is difficult and especially in the pot growing paradigm.

Use this search engine - SCIRUS.com and you'll find just about any peer-reviewed study on any/all processes that you can come up with.

At the very least this search engine will give you the information necessary to come up with something that makes sense to you perhaps.

Peace

UP

 

[Seamaiden]

Another source of saponins is quinoa. It requires rinsing specifically because of the saponins, and if you've ever eaten unrinsed vs rinsed, you'll immediately taste the difference.

Another source, rich source, of CaCO3 is coral. However, I will always beg anyone who's considering using that as a source to find another, we don't need coral reefs to be further assaulted by man.

Thanks for the tip on Scirus, I've been relying on Google Scholar.

 

[leadsled]

Thanks

Thanks everyone. UP your a wealth of information, appreciate the recipe and link.

Leadsled, do you have any dr bronners soap to try? I've been under the assumption it was fine, but without looking, I could very well be wrong....shredder

no I do not, I can test it out and report back. Was planning on testing yucca extract/saponin as the next wetting agent.

-Lead.

 

[motherlode]

I would like to know the effect Ducth Masters has on the microbes in my root zone

if the salts and edta is killing the benes then Im pouring cash down the drain - literally

 

[The Joker]

You're mixing up any number of 'terms' and 'agents' so it's virtually impossible (no pun intended) to address any of your queries.

Slack lime (hydrated lime) is not elemental Calcium or Calcium Carbonate or even your term, i.e. 'Lime Plaster"

I know and understand that in the world of growing 'pot' these terms have little, if any meaning. But in the 'real world' of chemistry, biology, botany, reality, etc. these terms do, in fact, have specific meanings.

HTH

UP

P.S. - look up the terms you're using as that will prove very helpful.

How about this ? The lime I use for plaster is made from marble. A byproduct of the marble industry. It's baked and slaked and strained and aged. It will burn you and it also has amazing properties for building and has been used since Roman times. It's the main ingredient in Lime Plaster. A real thing.

Calcium Hydroxide and Hydraulic Lime are both used. Hydrated lime...

Products made with lime plaster are heralded in the Green Building Industry, because lime has antimicrobial properties. A home plastered with lime plaster will not get moldy unlike gypsum. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njga5Ce1fug

Is that the same kind of lime people add to soil mixes to lower ph and buffer soil? In the building industry, there are many kinds... Type S etc.

If it is.... how does that affect soil life? Since lime is anti microbial. If people are adding lime to their soil mixes, is it affecting the soil life in a significantly negative way?

 

[mrbong73]

I found this article from New Zealand relating to lime and soil Biology.

Fine Lime Boosts Soil Biology and Farm Productivity

 

[leadsled]

leadsled

RE: Calcium Carbonate

Calcium Carbonate (CaCO3) cannot not and does not kill any microbes. You're using a 'liquid' Calcium product and it is a physical impossibility to liquify Calcium without the use of a chemical agent and generally in grow store 'cal mag' products (like Botanicare Cal-Mag product) are manufactured using Ethylenediaminetetraacetic acid (EDTA).

That's what is killing your microbe herds. There are very easy ways to extract Calcium from Calcium Carbonate sources with resorting to using EDTA.

HTH

UP

fyi, I am not using a liquid cal/mag product.

used cal carb only in the aact test with microscope.

 

[Seamaiden]

Sure - why not?

To make 4 gallons of a mixture that you would want to use 1/4 cup (2 oz) to 1 gallon of water. That's an important number as things progress.

1 lb. of organic rosemary branches and remove the individual leaves from the branches. This is an important step.

Take the rosemary leaves and put into a food processor with an equal amount of pure water and puree this mess. Add 2 each habanero chilis, 10 cloves of garlic (leave the skin on) and an equal amount of fresh ginger (very important component)

Once you have this mess pureed place into a 5-gallon paint bucket and fill with 4 gallons of water. Add pureed mint (however you get there) and try to get at least 3 cups of mint puree - go with diversity, IMHO

Add 1 tablespoon of live yogurt (read the label) and any/all of the following at 1/2 teaspoon:

Miso - organic
Vinegar - organic
Mesu - organic
Beer - organic
Kefir - organic

You'll also want to add a carbohydrate source - I prefer and use palm sugar as it's minimally processed. Easily sourced at Southeast Asian markets - especially Vietnamese and Thai markets.

You MUST use organic sources because conventional/transitional forms will always contain preservatives which will arrest this process.

Let this mess/mixture ferment down to < 3.5 pH - lower is even better. Once you hit your acidic numbers strain the plant material from the liquid and toss into your worm bin or compost pile.

With the liquid apply as a foliar spray using 2 oz. (i.e. 1/4 cup) to 1 gallon of water and hit it every 3 days until you have the mites arrested and killed. Follow up with weekly applications of either neem or karanja oil at the prescribed rates.

Result? End of mites, powdery mildew, aphids, white flies, gnats, et al.

HTH

UP

Quick question, how much coverage can this offer? In other words, how much canopy can this amount of
base' cover? Does this question make sense?

 

[mrbong73]

Quick question, how much coverage can this offer? In other words, how much canopy can this amount of
base' cover? Does this question make sense?

Based on my experience spraying my yard with different foliar recipes using a backpack sprayer, I would say you could get at least 500-700 sqft of canopy with 4 gallons.
The commercial compost tea spraying companies are using between 5-7 gallons of diluted compost tea per 1000 sf. (to do lawns and gardens as an example)
Remember he suggests 1/4 cup mixture per gallon of water.

 

[Udyana Peace]

Thanks, MrBong! Spot on answer!

 

[Seamaiden]

Thank you both, that is extremely helpful. :)

 

[Buddy Hemphill]

If mixing my teas with chem ferts kills microbes, do they kill microbes if you alternate feedings with chem ferts and teas? (in the soil, not the feed/water)

I like to hit the ladies with a chem bloom booster, once in week 5 and once in week 6.

Am I killing microbes this way? Or can they survive chem nutes as long as they are in the soil....and not mixed into the feed?

 

[primeform]

The book "teaming with microbes" recommends applying tea after each time you use chemicals to re-establish the microbe colonies that were killed. It does state that chemical fertilizers do kill the microbes but not sure if it also recommends doing this after using chemical ferts. Or simply avoiding ones with high NPK.


The Soil Food Web Gardening Rules

13. applications of synthetic fertilizers kill off most or all of the soil food web microbes.

14. stay away from additives that have high NPK numbers.

15. Follow any chemical spraying or soil drenching with an application of compost tea.

 

[Seamaiden]

Anything over 10%, according to TWM as I recall, yep!

 

[Buddy Hemphill]

I use a tea with every feeding. I dont know what I am killing....but I am putting new ones back in immediately....the plants loved it.

This was my biggest yeild so far, per light.

With only so many feedings possible....I try for the max on each one. At least MY max for whatever nutes I am using...including teas. I dont like waiting for pots to dry.

Maybe I will try alternating nutes and teas.

FWIW....After I added the filtered tea to the res....I was over 3000 ppms on several occasions. One strain did over 2 els a candle!..in 3 gallon pots!

I'm sold on aact's. I just wanna learn to tweak their abilities in my garden.


If I am using a tea with every feeding....does it matter if I kill a few with chems?

 

[Seamaiden]

You cannot accurately measure ppm's (EC/uS) of organic compounds and/or molecules. You can accurately measure pH, but not the teas.

If you're re-inoculating, that's good, but in my opinion it's not best. Bacteria make a home for themselves, and right now I'm thinking about how it goes with aquaria, the succession of bacteria that occurs (nitrifying Nitrosomonas and Nitrobacter spp, which also happen to be the same genuses of nitrifiers in soil), how those bacteria require a surface to attach to before they can even consider eating, let alone shitting. I mean, I don't know about you, but when I travel I stop having BMs, and so do the bacteria.

Obviously, there's other life you're culturing there, too. But without being able to directly assay both media and feed samples to compare against, it's a lot of guessing on my part.

 

[ncga]

Ledsled

Dead is not useless

In 2009 I started using what I THOUGHT was ACT well in 2010 I bought a dissolved oxygen meter. I found out quickly that my method had way below the recommended dissolved oxygen it. I was amazed it had worked in the past, No with a good scope and meter the ACT really worked it's magic. But I was still amazed at how well dead tea worked.

nc