Need Help! Ph Problem Or Nute Deficiency?

Imo. .all of the above...I believe I read (2) 600 watt mh...you can definitely turn off 1. Up your N (grow)...always cal-mag..even if nothing appears wrong...and your ph looks adequate.

Jasper Geist said:

4. What type of hydro system are you using? Hempy 3/1 Perlite & Vermiculite (started in Pro-Mix HP)
5. What brand/type of nutrients are you using? Humboldt County's Own (Micro, Grow, Bloom, Snow Storm Ultra)
6. What is the Ph of your nutrient solution? 5.8

Click to expand...

Ok, I've done hempy perlite (no vermiculite, can't recall whether or not it can shift pH or causes alkalinity/resistance to pH shift), and everything did a lot better at a lower pH range, low to mid 5s.
Are you using *all* those nutrients at the same time? I haven't used that line and tend to prefer to keep things simple, at this stage I'd suggest sticking with grow and micro 1/xweek. I have no idea what the SSU does. If it's sugars, save your money and use sugar at low rates. If these fertilizers supply Ca and Mg at a ratio of 4:1 Ca:Mg, then no supplementation of Ca and Mg should be necessary. If they don't, then yes, you may need to add Ca and Mg, with Ca being most important here. The remaining question would be Ca and Mg levels in your source water and whether or not they're tied up with CO3 (carbonate, difficult molecule to break away from the others, needs strong acids).

My own suggestions here are as follows: Lower the pH, simplify the feeding routine to appropriate for the plant's life stage, and if still yellowing from the lowers up after making pH adjustments, N needs to be increased. If no Ca in feed, add a Ca product. I personally detest combination Cal-Mags because their ratios are usually off, usually in the 2:1-3:1 range, too little Ca. Plus, Mg- is stupid easy to diagnose and correct since it's so mobile. Ca, not so much.

Looks like you're overwatering I had the same issue earlier and resulted in nute lockout due to overwatering.

Betico said:

Looks like you're overwatering I had the same issue earlier and resulted in nute lockout due to overwatering.

Click to expand...

That would also be my guess by the drooping of the leaves in the non affected plant in the background. I suggest letting your pots dry out until they feel light when lifted before watering. Vermiculite holds water, I would try to pull them out enough to look at the roots, they may be waterlogged with that mix.

LOL! Last night I was hoping "I hope Seamaiden sees this and responds because she knows her s**t and always has an answer that makes sense..." Thank You! </blowingsmoke> ;)


I'v been running the Bloom with the Micro & Grow as the manufacturer recommends it. I thought it was odd to use the Bloom in veg as well. So... I decided to re-read the breakdown on the bottles. As in, really read them... The Micro has 5.0% of Calcium in it and no magnesium. Grow had neither Cal or Mag. Now Bloom has Mag but at 0.5%. Hence 10 to 1. But looking at the Bloom I don't see any reason to use it if the only thing the plants really (at this stage) need is the Mag. I was thinking that I was defic. on the Mag so I used my Botanicare Cal-Mag+ (+ being Iron) and guess what the ratio is on that? Just about 2.75 to 1 ! Hmmm... I think I have more than enough Cal... maybe too much :O
The SSU in basically Triacontanol.
I'm going to cut the BLOOM and the SSU out for now. Like you said "keep things simple" What about some epsom salt though? Again, Thank You!

Seamaiden said:

Ok, I've done hempy perlite (no vermiculite, can't recall whether or not it can shift pH or causes alkalinity/resistance to pH shift), and everything did a lot better at a lower pH range, low to mid 5s.
Are you using *all* those nutrients at the same time? I haven't used that line and tend to prefer to keep things simple, at this stage I'd suggest sticking with grow and micro 1/xweek. I have no idea what the SSU does. If it's sugars, save your money and use sugar at low rates. If these fertilizers supply Ca and Mg at a ratio of 4:1 Ca:Mg, then no supplementation of Ca and Mg should be necessary. If they don't, then yes, you may need to add Ca and Mg, with Ca being most important here. The remaining question would be Ca and Mg levels in your source water and whether or not they're tied up with CO3 (carbonate, difficult molecule to break away from the others, needs strong acids).

My own suggestions here are as follows: Lower the pH, simplify the feeding routine to appropriate for the plant's life stage, and if still yellowing from the lowers up after making pH adjustments, N needs to be increased. If no Ca in feed, add a Ca product. I personally detest combination Cal-Mags because their ratios are usually off, usually in the 2:1-3:1 range, too little Ca. Plus, Mg- is stupid easy to diagnose and correct since it's so mobile. Ca, not so much.

Click to expand...

Thanks Dr. and Betico

I should add that while the plant did have a bit of yellowing last week... A few days ago I transplanted them from gal. pots that were Pro-Mix HP with added perlite (I did about a 60% PMix with 40% perlite) to 5 gal. straight perlite/vermiculite and ran RO water through it till I had runoff. The next day the leaves really started turning yellow on the one plant and all of them had some drooping. Um, yeah, there might be a bit of excess water in my pot....
I can say that this morning (26th) the plant's leaves are up and about. Hoping for the best.

DrMcSkunkins said:

That would also be my guess by the drooping of the leaves in the non affected plant in the background. I suggest letting your pots dry out until they feel light when lifted before watering. Vermiculite holds water, I would try to pull them out enough to look at the roots, they may be waterlogged with that mix.

Click to expand...

Jasper Geist said:

Thanks Dr. and Betico

I should add that while the plant did have a bit of yellowing last week... A few days ago I transplanted them from gal. pots that were Pro-Mix HP with added perlite (I did about a 60% PMix with 40% perlite) to 5 gal. straight perlite/vermiculite and ran RO water through it till I had runoff. The next day the leaves really started turning yellow on the one plant and all of them had some drooping. Um, yeah, there might be a bit of excess water in my pot....
I can say that this morning (26th) the plant's leaves are up and about. Hoping for the best.

Click to expand...

I didnt knowmthey had just been transplanted, that could account for the drooping. How did the roots look when you transplanted?

Nice and white and furry. They had been in smart pots and were growing through the bottom. No binding though.

I was reading on another forum that someone using verm/perlite mix that they kept their ph at 6.0 and had said they get great results.
You have a good ph pen?

It looks to be effecting

Seamaiden said:

Ok, I've done hempy perlite (no vermiculite, can't recall whether or not it can shift pH or causes alkalinity/resistance to pH shift), and everything did a lot better at a lower pH range, low to mid 5s.
Are you using *all* those nutrients at the same time? I haven't used that line and tend to prefer to keep things simple, at this stage I'd suggest sticking with grow and micro 1/xweek. I have no idea what the SSU does. If it's sugars, save your money and use sugar at low rates. If these fertilizers supply Ca and Mg at a ratio of 4:1 Ca:Mg, then no supplementation of Ca and Mg should be necessary. If they don't, then yes, you may need to add Ca and Mg, with Ca being most important here. The remaining question would be Ca and Mg levels in your source water and whether or not they're tied up with CO3 (carbonate, difficult molecule to break away from the others, needs strong acids).

My own suggestions here are as follows: Lower the pH, simplify the feeding routine to appropriate for the plant's life stage, and if still yellowing from the lowers up after making pH adjustments, N needs to be increased. If no Ca in feed, add a Ca product. I personally detest combination Cal-Mags because their ratios are usually off, usually in the 2:1-3:1 range, too little Ca. Plus, Mg- is stupid easy to diagnose and correct since it's so mobile. Ca, not so much.

Click to expand...

Jasper, I havent read any other reply's but this ole girl knows a thing or 2 about plants and biology, and when she preaches simplicity, she is dead on the money.. I will admit here and know, i dont know shit lol... So im reading your post to learn about hempy!

Hmmm... Hempy question... I have an Oakton PH and an EC pen. Now, I've heard with Hempy you really don't need to follow runoff numbers. true? Well, I fed the plants a couple of nights ago with RO water and after nutes I was about 6.3 and I ph downed to 5.8. Well, being hempy and having a small reservoir of water in the bottom I sucked some out of the drain hole to see what the numbers would be. The PPM was about 650 and the PH was 7.1
What does this mean? Could the PH climb after a few days of sitting in the bottom of the bucket or are they just more concentrated? Inquiring minds want to know!

Jasper Geist said:

Hmmm... Hempy question... I have an Oakton PH and an EC pen. Now, I've heard with Hempy you really don't need to follow runoff numbers. true? Well, I fed the plants a couple of nights ago with RO water and after nutes I was about 6.3 and I ph downed to 5.8. Well, being hempy and having a small reservoir of water in the bottom I sucked some out of the drain hole to see what the numbers would be. The PPM was about 650 and the PH was 7.1
What does this mean? Could the PH climb after a few days of sitting in the bottom of the bucket or are they just more concentrated? Inquiring minds want to know!

Click to expand...

Just a guess but I'm guessing that when you water you wash spent nutes out of the median and that is effecting different EC AND PH...
I THINK THATS WHY THEY SAY ITS A WASTE OF TIME...

So, having waaaay too much time on my hands what with the holidays and all... I was reading up on nutes and ph and assorted things. I came across on a post that had an issue kind of like mine. They solved the droopy plants, yellowing, etc... by using Advanced Nutrients Revive. They swore by it. I'm not a fan of AN but then again I haven't used it either... so, I go on the AN website and the Revive product page said it was a "crop saver" blah blah blah. They don't say what's in Revive though. I go to Amazon and they have lots of reviews. Again how it immediately turned the plant around, saved the crop, greatest thing since Shaw brother Hong Kong kung fu movies were filmed, etc...
I then called a friend of mine who works at a Hydro shop and asked her about it. Her first word was "NO". Then-"I REFUSE TO SELL THIS OVERPRICED CRAP TO YOU". I laughed and asked her just WHAT was in it. She grabbed the 1 liter bottle and told me it's 1-0-0 and here's the ingredients...
1% Nitrogen
Calcium
Magnesium
& Iron!
All for the mere price of $43 dollars...
She said the bottle does have a pretty lady on it though!

Yeah, $43 bucks for a liter of cal-mag.
She also thinks it's the cold nights here in the NorCal Gold Country that's causing a nute lockup. I looked at my poor plant for the 10th time today and thought "it really isn't that bad.. just relax"

I think youre Overthinking this. Aside from the great suggestions. Understand every strain is different. Some grow better in different media. Hempy is a wet medium. Your particular strain may always show signs of overwatering...the yellowing is an easy fix. Playing with the ph a bit may yield some benefit. Good luck

Looks like light stress. if your upper leaves are yellowing with "wrinkles" then you have to much light coupled with heat stress. I would invest in a par meter so you know exactly how much light you are providing. this will help with how high or low you will place your lights from your conopy. as well as you will be able to place your plants perfectly under your lights.

Fix your lights first, then make sure you are in the right ph range. Vegging ph should be kept 5.3-6.1 in hydro and for soil towards the 6.0 range. p

I love to foliar feed. I use Heavy 16 or you can alternate with seeweed kelp extract. works amazing. I swith my foliar feeding. 1week: heavy 16(go light if you use this. ) then after a day or so I'll spray with pure R/O water to rinse off the leaves of all the salts thats left over from foliar feeding to prep for the next foliar feeding as well as rinsing your plants so those stomatas are nice and clean and ready for the next foliar feeding.

week 2 or 3 or whenever im not being lazy ill foliar feed with seaweed extract and superthrive....then repeat foliar rince with pure water

week 4 or 5 heavy 16 and then a day or so later pure water spray..

I bend, supercrop, top. etc and since ive
started foliar feeding ive notice plant recovery and response to be a lot better.

Also you can foliar feed with 1/4strength of your reg nute program.

You said you were doing a "Hydro" grow, but what kind of hydro system do you have?


Also i would flush with pure water then add fresh nutes. and you can add some cal mag to your foliar spray if you are mixing your own mix. also looks like over water as well.

I would flush then add fresh nutes, once thats done foliar a few days later. and then check within a few days on your plants recovery.

once your leafs discolor, burn etc they will never go back to what they were, check your new growth. if everything under your new growth is nice and green/healthy then you are good. new growth will always be light yelllow

Jasper Geist said:

I'v been running the Bloom with the Micro & Grow as the manufacturer recommends it. I thought it was odd to use the Bloom in veg as well. So... I decided to re-read the breakdown on the bottles. As in, really read them... The Micro has 5.0% of Calcium in it and no magnesium. Grow had neither Cal or Mag. Now Bloom has Mag but at 0.5%. Hence 10 to 1. But looking at the Bloom I don't see any reason to use it if the only thing the plants really (at this stage) need is the Mag. I was thinking that I was defic. on the Mag so I used my Botanicare Cal-Mag+ (+ being Iron) and guess what the ratio is on that? Just about 2.75 to 1 ! Hmmm... I think I have more than enough Cal... maybe too much :O
The SSU in basically Triacontanol.
I'm going to cut the BLOOM and the SSU out for now. Like you said "keep things simple" What about some epsom salt though? Again, Thank You!

Click to expand...

Most welcome! If the Micro has 5% Ca, then you can make up a 1%-2% solution using Epsom salt, then you don't have to deal with Cal-Mag. But try this first before adding Mg to your mix. I don't know that that is too much Ca, in my world it's one of the more difficult nutrients to manage.

Mix 1/4tsp Epsom salt (+sticker/spreader, a couple drops of liquid dish soap works great) to a gallon of water. Apply as a foliar, focusing on the undersides of the leaves. If it greens up within a day or less, then your mix is definitely deficient in Mg. If not then we're back to the N.

If that does the trick, then you can probably start adding a very small amount of the Epsoms to your feeding regimen, but be careful and work that math so you don't shift the Ca:Mg ratios out of range (4:1 Ca:Mg is a minimum, often I've seen plants perform much better at 6:1).

Jasper Geist said:

She also thinks it's the cold nights here in the NorCal Gold Country that's causing a nute lockup. I looked at my poor plant for the 10th time today and thought "it really isn't that bad.. just relax"

Click to expand...

I just moved from Gold Country. But, if you're growing indoors, your girls aren't being exposed to the cold, are they? Cold absolutely will lock out some nutrients, usually P is the first one to show.

@Seamaiden No, they're indoors. After a few days I'm thinking that the cold was the root cause to all the symptoms. Cold screws with nutes and my lights might have been too close. Lights fixed. I've been struggling with electrical issues that are caused by one device... the heater. The heater would trip the circuit when the lights powered on - but only if it was running at that very moment. I've since moved the heater off of the circuit and got a dedicated timer for the heater(s) that makes damn sure they are off when the ballast ignites. So, I'm hoping a few days of stable temps and a good plain water flush to start the girls off fresh will get them happy. Hey, thanks for the mag tips too!

If I'm going to run a heater, I'd rather run a light. I went with the Electric Blanket Sandwich to save $$$.