Seedlings with dying bottom leaves

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Creep420

Creep420

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Hello all, I have started on my second grow. The first grow was a success, great yield and quality.
This second grow is giving me troubles however from the get go.
I am usually great with starting seeds and getting strong seedlings.
I ordered Happy Frog soil, as I read it is low in nutes and good for starting seeds. I also have Miracle gro seed starting mix (As it is pretty much also low in nutes unlike other Mg soils)

So I started half of the seeds in one, half of the seeds in the other to see what works best for the future.

I am noticing bottom leaves on a couple seedlings starting to get yellow/brown splotches and wilting leaves (bottom leaves)
I am just worried the others will get this issue, or it will progress further. They are about 8 days in . The other seedlings look okay so far apart from a couple of them

-I am using a T5 light (54w) Stand with hood. About 6” from the canopy
-It’s in a room and not in a tent for the seedling stage, as I’ve had success before
-The room is room temp about 73 degrees F
-I spray for humidity
-I HAVE been watering daily as it seems they dry out somewhat quickly but I think that may be too much even at this stage?
-A small fan to keep air moving, and the door is open to the rest of the house so it always has fresh air.
-No nutes added, just Poland Springs that has a standard PH of 7
-Seed started, 1 year old seeds from personal grown bagseed I let pollinate outdoors
-Solo cups, with small slits on the sides toward the bottom, and holes underneath for drainage

I am guessing and hoping I overwatered them, and that there isn’t a more severe issue. Can this happen from overwatering seedlings? I always kept seedlings on the damp side as I thought they needed that at this stage.
I noticed a couple deformed leaves on another plant (Maybe the seeds weren’t stored properly, remedying this currently)

Any advice is greatly appreciated, I am relatively new to this all, so be gentle lmao
Thanks all
 
Seedlings with dying bottom leaves
Seedlings with dying bottom leaves 2
Seedlings with dying bottom leaves 3
London bud

London bud

559
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Maybe a bit over watered, I'm not sure but a slightly lower ph wouldn't hurt, more 6.5.
Imo don't add nutes to fix this, if your using two different soils are the plants reacting badly in both soils or is it ony the plants in one type of soil? If so repot the damaged plants in the other soil.
 
Creep420

Creep420

60
18
So as expected a couple others are getting the same issue.
It’s coming from both soils, I am not sure what is going on.
I am hoping you are both right about them being over watered. There were days where I would water twice a day, It would only be a tiny bit but still, I’m sure it accumulated and didn’t let the roots breathe too much. Really hoping it stops, anxiety is sky rocketing.
I just want to solve the issue so I can learn, then avoid it in the future
 
MIMedGrower

MIMedGrower

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Creep420 said:
So as expected a couple others are getting the same issue.
It’s coming from both soils, I am not sure what is going on.
I am hoping you are both right about them being over watered. There were days where I would water twice a day, It would only be a tiny bit but still, I’m sure it accumulated and didn’t let the roots breathe too much. Really hoping it stops, anxiety is sky rocketing.
I just want to solve the issue so I can learn, then avoid it in the future
Click to expand...


Overwatering is watering too frequently not too much water at once. Should always saturate pot fully to good runoff and then wait til the pots are very dry and light to do it again.

Watering a little at a time and not saturating the pot causes problems.

This is a very common misconception.
 
Creep420

Creep420

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I am definitely grateful they are still alive! The new growth looks clean.

That makes sense MIMedgrower. I will keep to a strict watering regimen and make sure to lift the pots and feel the soil out before watering, and watering more when they need it rather than a little more often. I am still pretty new to this so I am sure I will get the swing of things.
I’ve been up since 2 Am reading and troubleshooting. It’s like having a sick child lol..
Some leaves are pointing downward so I believe overwatering will cause that, I am just hoping the odd spots aren’t leaf blight or something awful like that.
 
Creep420

Creep420

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Here are a couple shots of the two seedlings today. The leaves do appear to be pointing down moreso. In a room temp setting, with decent airflow how often should a seedling be watered? When they show signs and wilt slightly? Daily/2 days/3 days? I’m finding many mixed answers.
 
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570EF2D3 597C 4B01 B2C1 5D33515B1403
7CEB3446 5FF1 460F 9437 E8588438BA57
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MIMedGrower

MIMedGrower

17,190
438
Creep420 said:
Here are a couple shots of the two seedlings today. The leaves do appear to be pointing down moreso. In a room temp setting, with decent airflow how often should a seedling be watered? When they show signs and wilt slightly? Daily/2 days/3 days? I’m finding many mixed answers.
Click to expand...


i water a cup like that to runoff maybe once a week depending under t-5 flourescents. Couple days sooner usually under an hid.

When it gets down to 2-3 days its usually time to transplant up to a 1 gallon for me.

Then the plant tends to take 5-7 days to dry out enough for more water again in the new pot.

Patience is key to success. Over caring is not good.
 
skh

skh

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Seem to me like they're too big for those little pots. Could well be that the soil is simply running out of food. Also, those pots will not block light very well. As the roots grow to the edge of the pot they will retract away.

Pot them up.
 
Creep420

Creep420

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Understood, these answers were extremely helpful. I keep a notebook and will be logging this in.
So I will definitely ease up on the watering from now on out, and give them a more thorough watering when the pots feel light. I will also get them into darker and slightly larger pots today/tomorrow latest, I have half gallon pots at the ready with Happy Frog soil and Veg nutes. So I can lightly start feeding, to my knowledge Happy Frog soil has little to no nutes at all added to the mix. Maybe I should let them establish for a week before a feeding?
Thank you all for your help, this really helped ease the anxiety
 
skh

skh

16
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I could grow a plant all the way through in a pot that size - and have done. My point is more that the leaf problem could be due to a nutrient being low or the balance of nutrients not being quite right - not having enough N can affect K take-up, for example. Potting them up will help with that.
 
Creep420

Creep420

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18
Ohh I got you. That went over my head for a minute. So adding some more balanced soil can help a plant that isn’t getting enough or correct nutrients to depleting soils
 
skh

skh

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I'm assuming that as they are in soil, he hasn't given them anything yet. However, yes, overfeeding can also disrupt the transposition of nutrients. K in particular struggles in acidic soil. Too much P makes soil acidic and this prevents the take up of K - causing necrosis on the leaves and a fairly quick death.
 
Creep420

Creep420

60
18
That is something I do need to learn more about, I’m not going to pretend.
My first grow I will admit I was lucky not to have many issues apart from some Nute burn during the middle of Veg which was sorted.
And yes, they are in soil, so far with these guys I have not added any nutrients yet, as I figured they wouldn’t need it at such a small size/young age

Edit: I just researched some more on Happy Frog soil. It definitely has some added nutrients, I was recommended by a couple people here a month or so ago to get it as it’s great for seedlings, and didn’t have added nutrients. 🤷🏻‍♂️.
 
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MIMedGrower

MIMedGrower

17,190
438
Creep420 said:
Understood, these answers were extremely helpful. I keep a notebook and will be logging this in.
So I will definitely ease up on the watering from now on out, and give them a more thorough watering when the pots feel light. I will also get them into darker and slightly larger pots today/tomorrow latest, I have half gallon pots at the ready with Happy Frog soil and Veg nutes. So I can lightly start feeding, to my knowledge Happy Frog soil has little to no nutes at all added to the mix. Maybe I should let them establish for a week before a feeding?
Thank you all for your help, this really helped ease the anxiety
Click to expand...


Happy frog will not need additional nutrients for a young plant for at least 3 weeks in my experience. Has plenty of nutrients included. Needs added perlite for drainage though.
 
MIMedGrower

MIMedGrower

17,190
438
Creep420 said:
That is something I do need to learn more about, I’m not going to pretend.
My first grow I will admit I was lucky not to have many issues apart from some Nute burn during the middle of Veg which was sorted.
And yes, they are in soil, so far with these guys I have not added any nutrients yet, as I figured they wouldn’t need it at such a small size/young age

Edit: I just researched some more on Happy Frog soil. It definitely has some added nutrients, I was recommended by a couple people here a month or so ago to get it as it’s great for seedlings, and didn’t have added nutrients. 🤷🏻‍♂️.
Click to expand...


Listening to forum posts without a good general knowledge of gardening to know who actually knows what they are talking about will get you in trouble every time.

better to read and follow a grow book.
 
skh

skh

16
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It's way easier to monitor this stuff in hydro... soil is an excellent buffer but it still runs into problems. The trouble is in the high P products available for flower. Although high P works good temporarily in a farm setting it only works once and the land can't be used again until the P has dissipated. In a pot, there's no real place for the P to go. So it builds and causes hot spots in the soil where the roots can't take up iron or K very well. K is probably the second most important nute next to N and is the most important during flower.

But still, all of this seems premature for a seedling in a plastic party cup. I'd be more inclined to go for some type of deficiency caused by they being in those little pots. I also don't like how transparent the sides of the pot are. Light kills roots. I'd just pot them up.

Yeah, as stated, I'm by no means an expert. I've been growing for around 15 years and have done some study on plant and nutrient behaviour. Just sharing the benefit of my experience. Couple that with the grower's own knowledge of their grow and hopefully something clicks.
 
Creep420

Creep420

60
18
Thanks guys!
I do have a decent understanding of the NPK ratio and the general needs of the plant, PH etc. But I definitely have trouble diagnosing issues that arise, deficiencies certain dos and don’ts .
You totally called it, being new to this does make it tough to decipher who’s giving you obvious wrong solutions. I do have a grow bible, I can definitely spend more time reading that and touching up on some things.
I will likely pot them up and see how that helps them, since the environment they are in currently isn’t the best it seems, with the roots being more light accessible. They do appear to have some sort of deficiency to me as well, comparing to other people’s photos posted for diagnoses. Definitely overwatered from what the leaves are telling me, so I’ll remedy that issue.
Either way, I am learning every day and will always research and read what I can. I think when I’ve hit a wall and can’t seem to solve a current issue I feel the problem will spread fast (as it often does) I go into a mild panic and ask for advice here. So thanks again for being patient with my questions everyone.
 
London bud

London bud

559
143
skh said:
Seem to me like they're too big for those little pots. Could well be that the soil is simply running out of food. Also, those pots will not block light very well. As the roots grow to the edge of the pot they will retract away.

Pot them up.
Click to expand...
The roots won't retract away because of light.
look at this, not an issue. These are the roots of cuttings taking but I have plants in flower full of roots wrapping round n round, exposed like this and it's no problem. I can't see that the light has any effect on the roots.
Id take a photo now to show you but lights are off
IMG 20190612 000108
IMG 20190612 000147



and there's no way them tiny plants have used up all the nutes in the soil yet, repotting won't hurt though.

patience is key
 
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