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Iron deficiency, or something else? Just about to flip to 12/12

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Iron deficiency, or something else? Just about to flip to 12/12

KnuckleHead 33 Replies 5,363 Views
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KnuckleHead

KnuckleHead

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#1
Ok heads, I was going to flip this Granddaddy purp to flower this saturday, but yesterday it became apparent that the middle of leaves that are new growth are strikingly pale. And the bottom oldest stuff looks horrible. 2 pics here showing the pale new growth and 1 pic of a lower stem that looks like cabbage.

DWC in hydroton
GH trio + Orca + Calmag + Armor Si
Roots look great
Light is HGL 350R PPFD at canopy is about 750
water temp averages 72
room temp about 75 with about 60% RH
ph 5.8-6.5
EC at 1.4

Referencing deficiency pics of leaves, I thought it might be early iron def because my ph has been regularly between 6-6.5 for the past week. I guess I doubt that diagnoses, that's why I'm consulting you hemp gurus. I thought maybe it was nothing to worry about until I saw that lower growth.



Iron deficiency or something else just about to flip to 1212

Iron deficiency or something else just about to flip to 1212 2

Iron deficiency or something else just about to flip to 1212 3
 
#2
Mine look like that too, I was thinking not enough light?
 
#6
Hey KH,

I think what you’re seeing is not a nutrient deficiency, per se. Instead the plant is in a serious vegetative stage and can sometimes outgrow its own nutrient availability. It’s young tissue. My cannabis plants in the vegetable garden look identical. They will green up.

If you need confirmation - add about one teaspoon of FeSO4 powder to a 0.5L spray bottle fill with water then do a foliar application to half your plants. Of course the control plants may naturally catch up with the foliar fed ones.

I foliar feed with Epsom salts and iron pretty frequently.

Zill.
 
#7
Zill said:
Hey KH,

I think what you’re seeing is not a nutrient deficiency, per se. Instead the plant is in a serious vegetative stage and can sometimes outgrow its own nutrient availability. It’s young tissue. My cannabis plants in the vegetable garden look identical. They will green up.

If you need confirmation - add about one teaspoon of FeSO4 powder to a 0.5L spray bottle fill with water then do a foliar application to half your plants. Of course the control plants may naturally catch up with the foliar fed ones.

I foliar feed with Epsom salts and iron pretty frequently.

Zill.
Click to expand...
Good point. I'm hoping that's what it is. The lower stuff looked so bad. But I lollipopped it last night anyway getting ready for the flip saturday, so all that stuff is gone. The ppms this week went from 780-720-680- 660, so I think you may be right.
 
#9
Looks like fresh growth from my front porch.
 
#10
750 ppfd seems high for veg, heads of branches seem to be showing signs of light avoidance. New growth looks like it's growing well which is throwing me off. When a plant goes into light avoidance. It slows growth dramatically, so it's possible I just don't know what I am talking about. Did you increase the light recently? Looks like maybe over the last two weeks you either, forgot to move the light up with new growth, or increased the light strength. This would not effect the lower leaves, but would make sense on the pale new growth, just my thoughts and as a disclaimer I am really bad at diagnosing plants, just saying.
 
#12
Pilted said:
750 ppfd seems high for veg, heads of branches seem to be showing signs of light avoidance. New growth looks like it's growing well which is throwing me off. When a plant goes into light avoidance. It slows growth dramatically, so it's possible I just don't know what I am talking about. Did you increase the light recently? Looks like maybe over the last two weeks you either, forgot to move the light up with new growth, or increased the light strength. This would not effect the lower leaves, but would make sense on the pale new growth, just my thoughts and as a disclaimer I am really bad at diagnosing plants, just saying.
Click to expand...
About 10 days ago I increased the intensity to keep the edges of the canopy at 500ppfd, which makes the brightest areas about 750. So across the canopy it ranges between 750-500. That's the HGL, I like the mars hydro in the other grow space that has way less drop off at the edges. But you are right, 750 is a bit high. When I flip saturday I will probably leave the light at that level for the first couple weeks of flower.
 
#13
First few pics, just an observation made from 21 actual growing years and probably many more "seasons",,but those downward clawing leaves ussually are telling me there may be slight over/under watering issue going on. the pale color on the new growth usually happens on all but a few of the strains i grow when they are close to flowering, have you kicked them yet or are they on a straight light schedule? also the heavy serrations and clawing in general can also indicate some instensity issue with your lights. so either way the condition of the new growth wont matter much once they start to stretch, im thinking most of my plants put on four or five nodes at least during this growth spurt, so you'll be dealing with the results that you can come up with not what you have now, get the girls right before you kick them, your yield will repay you in tenfold.
 
#14
KnuckleHead said:
About 10 days ago I increased the intensity to keep the edges of the canopy at 500ppfd, which makes the brightest areas about 750. So across the canopy it ranges between 750-500. That's the HGL, I like the mars hydro in the other grow space that has way less drop off at the edges. But you are right, 750 is a bit high. When I flip saturday I will probably leave the light at that level for the first couple weeks of flower.
Click to expand...
Just watch for the growth to be slow, if it's slow I would back the light off a little, acceptable range for flower is 500-1000 ppfd ( there are exceptions to this mainly if you use CO2 but it's a good general guide) early stage of flower the plant will be able to handle less, then after stretch it can handle.more. you don't wanna start flower with the plant in light avoidance. The first two weeks is very important in building the structure of your colas. Again remember I am newish and my suggestions should be handled as that, a suggestion. I would pull light back a little give it a few days to get out of light avoidance, and then flip. This would allow the plant to conquer that first two weeks of flower at full speed. Slow growth withing that first two weeks of flower can dramatically effect yeild.

Just my two cents. Again remember I am newish and no one else is saying this. So take advice with a grain of salt.
 
#15
strider26554 said:
First few pics, just an observation made from 21 actual growing years and probably many more "seasons",,but those downward clawing leaves ussually are telling me there may be slight over/under watering issue going on. the pale color on the new growth usually happens on all but a few of the strains i grow when they are close to flowering, have you kicked them yet or are they on a straight light schedule? also the heavy serrations and clawing in general can also indicate some instensity issue with your lights. so either way the condition of the new growth wont matter much once they start to stretch, im thinking most of my plants put on four or five nodes at least during this growth spurt, so you'll be dealing with the results that you can come up with not what you have now, get the girls right before you kick them, your yield will repay you in tenfold.
Click to expand...
Just so we're not confused what we are looking at, my pics are only the first 3 in the original post. I'm in hydro. The next 3 were posted by JohnBlazr. He's in soil.
 
#16
Pilted said:
Just watch for the growth to be slow, if it's slow I would back the light off a little, acceptable range for flower is 500-1000 ppfd ( there are exceptions to this mainly if you use CO2 but it's a good general guide) early stage of flower the plant will be able to handle less, then after stretch it can handle.more. you don't wanna start flower with the plant in light avoidance. The first two weeks is very important in building the structure of your colas. Again remember I am newish and my suggestions should be handled as that, a suggestion. I would pull light back a little give it a few days to get out of light avoidance, and then flip. This would allow the plant to conquer that first two weeks of flower at full speed. Slow growth withing that first two weeks of flower can dramatically effect yeild.

Just my two cents. Again remember I am newish and no one else is saying this. So take advice with a grain of salt.
Click to expand...
That's good advice, thanks.
 
#17
KnuckleHead said:
Just so we're not confused what we are looking at, my pics are only the first 3 in the original post. I'm in hydro. The next 3 were posted by JohnBlazr. He's in soil.
Click to expand...
Yes. You see how some of your heads are not looking at the light and how some are kinda just laying there almost like they are taking a nap, when in proper light they will be stretching towards the light in a praying manor, when too much light those heads will look more like what I see in your pictures, not the other person that posted after you with the other pictures. I really think you have a couple issues and too much light at this stage is one of them, the lower leaves that's not light avoidance so something else is going on there also, but I think pulling the light back a few days will solve one issue. Again too much light will slow growth dramatically so if you haven't noticed slower growth since you increased light then maybe I am wrong and it's something else. But if that was my plants the first thing I would do is pull light back.
 
#18
Pilted said:
Yes. You see how some of your heads are not looking at the light and how some are kinda just laying there almost like they are taking a nap, when in proper light they will be stretching towards the light in a praying manor, when too much light those heads will look more like what I see in your pictures, not the other person that posted after you with the other pictures. I really think you have a couple issues and too much light at this stage is one of them, the lower leaves that's not light avoidance so something else is going on there also, but I think pulling the light back a few days will solve one issue. Again too much light will slow growth dramatically so if you haven't noticed slower growth since you increased light then maybe I am wrong and it's something else. But if that was my plants the first thing I would do is pull light back.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I see your point. I will back it off tonight, 600 ppfd in center 400 at the edge? Sound better?
 
#19
KnuckleHead said:
Yeah, I see your point. I will back it off tonight, 600 ppfd in center 400 at the edge? Sound better?
Click to expand...
I think that sounds like a solid plan, one things for sure it can't hurt. And if you see those heads start to look a bit stronger after a day or two, you know your heading in the right direction.
 
#20
Thank
Pilted said:
I think that sounds like a solid plan, one things for sure it can't hurt. And if you see those heads start to look a bit stronger after a day or two, you know your heading in the right direction.
Click to expand...

Thanks for that Pilted, I'm a big proponent of less is more. I'll post results.
 
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