Deficiency help. Phosphorous def? Salt buildup?

jdongle · May 24, 2023

-Week 4 or 5 flower

-Growing in happy frog soil

-Fox farm big bloom, grow big, and tiger bloom 2-3tsp/gallon each every other watering

-Plain PHd tap water every other watering

-PH of runoff is around 6.5-6.7

-Seems to be occurring on the upper fan leaves so a mobile nutrient issue?

I’m unsure if it’s locking something out or not. At first I thought it was a nitrogen deficiency so I added additional nitrogen, but it seems to be getting worse.

Any ideas? Thanks for the help!

jdongle · May 24, 2023

Early stages

jdongle · May 24, 2023

To me, it appears as a Phosphorous deficiency. Which is odd given that I use tiger bloom 15ml/gallon every other watering.

Zill · May 25, 2023

J,

That is not a phosphorus deficient plant. You are five weeks into an annual plant flowering. It’s approaching toe tag time.

Zill.

Scrogger2190 · May 25, 2023

So you're giving them big bloom, grow big, and tiger bloom? 15ml of each? At the same time? If do you probably have overdosed your plant and the salt buildup has locked you out. Those nutrients are fairly concentrated I've used them before. I had a plant that was 5ft tall and 4ft wide taking 5ml tiger bloom at peak flowering. Every other watering. I tried upping dose and started seeing symptoms so I backed off and it came right back. I would recommend using a flushing solution such as slf500 then the next watering back off on your dosage a bit and push 20% runoff through. Also synthetic nutes are difficult to use in soil unless you have decent coco% in there. Soil just isn't made for synthetic ferts. It has a lower CEC so it relies more on the micro herd to do the job, but synthetics will kill your micro herd. This is why it gets difficult

jdongle · May 25, 2023

Scrogger2190 said:
So you're giving them big bloom, grow big, and tiger bloom? 15ml of each? At the same time? If do you probably have overdosed your plant and the salt buildup has locked you out. Those nutrients are fairly concentrated I've used them before. I had a plant that was 5ft tall and 4ft wide taking 5ml tiger bloom at peak flowering. Every other watering. I tried upping dose and started seeing symptoms so I backed off and it came right back. I would recommend using a flushing solution such as slf500 then the next watering back off on your dosage a bit and push 20% runoff through. Also synthetic nutes are difficult to use in soil unless you have decent coco% in there. Soil just isn't made for synthetic ferts. It has a lower CEC so it relies more on the micro herd to do the job, but synthetics will kill your micro herd. This is why it gets difficult

This was also suggested from another site. FF nutrients are notorious for salt buildup. I plan on flushing all of them until the PPM looks good.

Any idea what an acceptable PPM range would be in flower? Thanks for the advice.

Trash_2002 · May 25, 2023

Scrogger2190 said:
So you're giving them big bloom, grow big, and tiger bloom? 15ml of each? At the same time? If do you probably have overdosed your plant and the salt buildup has locked you out. Those nutrients are fairly concentrated I've used them before. I had a plant that was 5ft tall and 4ft wide taking 5ml tiger bloom at peak flowering. Every other watering. I tried upping dose and started seeing symptoms so I backed off and it came right back. I would recommend using a flushing solution such as slf500 then the next watering back off on your dosage a bit and push 20% runoff through. Also synthetic nutes are difficult to use in soil unless you have decent coco% in there. Soil just isn't made for synthetic ferts. It has a lower CEC so it relies more on the micro herd to do the job, but synthetics will kill your micro herd. This is why it gets difficult

synthetic nutrients will not kill your microherd, thats a fact, if they have carbon and/or carbo available in the media they will thrive, witch the OP media has plenty of, you can boost carbon for example by adding humic acid to the feed schedule.

Trash_2002 · May 25, 2023

jdongle said:
This was also suggested from another site. FF nutrients are notorious for salt buildup. I plan on flushing all of them until the PPM looks good.

Any idea what an acceptable PPM range would be in flower? Thanks for the advice.

for hot soil, witch i assume happy frog is, in flowering stage you can hit em with EC 1.0-1.5ms max, once per week (500-750ppm 0.5 scale), rest of the days Ph'ed water only (with humic acid is better), if needed.
I recommend using EC and not ppm, its the best because it doesnt have 2 different conversions per region.

Trash_2002 · May 25, 2023

Also your kind of media should be allowed to have just a little bit of dry back cycle like, first 1-2 inches of soil is dry after 3-4 days before next watering/feeding.
Example:
Feed them with fert on monday with ec 1.0 ms depending on stage of flowering and how they look you can adjust strenght, than hopefully you gave em just enough so that by thursday the top inch or two of the soil is dry than do a Ph'ed Water+Humic Acid, than monday again another fert feed.

Humic acid is an amazing chelator and helps "unbond" P of the soil and make it more available reducing its accumulation and toxicity, it also feed the microherd on your media. It does many more things, its a great, if not the best addon, for any feeding schedule.

Scrogger2190 · May 25, 2023

Trash_2002 said:
synthetic nutrients will not kill your microherd, thats a fact, if they have carbon and/or carbo available in the media they will thrive, witch the OP media has plenty of, you can boost carbon for example by adding humic acid to the feed schedule.

I've just always heard that the salts kill your microherd. Do you have a source I can read? I'm just curious about it now

Trash_2002 · May 25, 2023

Scrogger2190 said:
I've just always heard that the salts kill your microherd. Do you have a source I can read? I'm just curious about it now

didnt read tho but was the second top in duckduckgo search:

Does Fertilizer Kill Soil Bacteria?

Do synthetic fertilizers kill bacteria in soil? Is the soil food web right? Find out what really happens in the soil after adding fertilizer.

www.gardenmyths.com

you can also make a test, do a strong synthetic fert solution with molasses or humic acid 2.0EC and put great white or mycos or recharge etc.. and brew a tea with air stones for 24h, the "synthetic tea" will foam over the top of your reservoir.. gonna be active as hell.

Scrogger2190 · May 25, 2023

Trash_2002 said:
didnt read tho but was the second top in duckduckgo search:

Does Fertilizer Kill Soil Bacteria?

Do synthetic fertilizers kill bacteria in soil? Is the soil food web right? Find out what really happens in the soil after adding fertilizer.

www.gardenmyths.com

you can also make a test, do a strong synthetic fert solution with molasses or humic acid 2.0EC and put great white or mycos or recharge etc.. and brew a tea with air stones for 24h, the "synthetic tea" will foam over the top of your reservoir.. gonna be active as hell.

Thank you very much it's always like walking on eggshells asking someone to prove something because you've been misinformed XD

Trash_2002 · May 25, 2023

Scrogger2190 said:
Thank you very much it's always like walking on eggshells asking someone to prove something because you've been misinformed XD

all good mate, thats what foruns are all about.. get good infos.
i have a pretty long time growing (since 2002) , i've seen pretty much it all. "Been there done that" kinda shit lol

Scrogger2190 · May 25, 2023

Trash_2002 said:
all good mate, thats what foruns are all about.. get good infos.
i have a pretty long time growing (since 2002) , i've seen pretty much it all. "Been there done that" kinda shit lol

I only had the chance to grow for a 6 year period XD soon I'll be able to start back up just waiting on laws lol

Deficiency help. Phosphorous def? Salt buildup?

Deficiency help. Phosphorous def? Salt buildup?

jdongle

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jdongle

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jdongle

Zill

Scrogger2190

jdongle

Trash_2002

Trash_2002

Trash_2002

Scrogger2190

Trash_2002

Does Fertilizer Kill Soil Bacteria?

Scrogger2190

Does Fertilizer Kill Soil Bacteria?

Trash_2002

Scrogger2190

Deficiency help. Phosphorous def? Salt buildup?

Deficiency help. Phosphorous def? Salt buildup?

jdongle

Attachments

jdongle

Attachments

jdongle

Zill

Scrogger2190

jdongle

Trash_2002

Trash_2002

Trash_2002

Scrogger2190

Trash_2002

Does Fertilizer Kill Soil Bacteria?

Scrogger2190

Does Fertilizer Kill Soil Bacteria?

Trash_2002

Scrogger2190

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