Didn't Flush Enough - When Can I Flush Agian?

barhoc11 · Apr 17, 2023

I noticed what I think is nutrient lockout going on in my indoor grow and 'flushed' with about 2 gallons of water per 3 gallon potted plant. It doesn't seem to have helped AND I realized I was supposed to flush with 3x the size of the pot? Would that mean 9 gallons of ph water per 3 gallon pot?

If I didn't flush properly and need to do it with 3x the water to pot ratio, when can I do a proper flush? It has been 3 days and pots have dried out somewhat... can I do a proper flush now?

Cirroji · Apr 17, 2023

barhoc11 said:
I noticed what I think is nutrient lockout going on in my indoor grow and 'flushed' with about 2 gallons of water per 3 gallon potted plant. It doesn't seem to have helped AND I realized I was supposed to flush with 3x the size of the pot? Would that mean 9 gallons of ph water per 3 gallon pot?

If I didn't flush properly and need to do it with 3x the water to pot ratio, when can I do a proper flush? It has been 3 days and pots have dried out somewhat... can I do a proper flush now?

what did you give it to eat after it's flush?

pics help. also what kind of growing medium and environment. they all play a part in the nutrient uptake.

barhoc11 · Apr 17, 2023

Cirroji said:
what did you give it to eat after it's flush?

pics help. also what kind of growing medium and environment. they all play a part in the nutrient uptake.

I only gave it water during the flush on Friday, hoping to eliminate any build up in the soil, which is made up of Fox Farm Happy Frog, Ocean Forest and Coco Coir mix. It is mainly Happy Frog and Ocean Forest. I keep my grow tent between 80 and 74F and my led lights are over 2 feet above the canopy. Here are pictures of my leaves as of today and it seems to not be getting any better.

Oldguy71 · Apr 17, 2023

Damaged leaves won’t get better. Watch the new growth and for the problem to stop spreading. From what I can see of your plant it doesn’t look like it too terribly overfed. A small flush may have done the job. Wait for the soil to get very light before or trying another flush or watering again

barhoc11 · Apr 17, 2023

Oldguy71 said:
Damaged leaves won’t get better. Watch the new growth and for the problem to stop spreading. From what I can see of your plant it doesn’t look like it too terribly overfed. A small flush may have done the job. Wait for the soil to get very light before or trying another flush or watering again

Thanks but I should add that it seems to be spreading from bottom leaves to higher leaves now and already damaged leaves are getting worse. I know I was not watering properly before (didn't water to run off) so I am leaning towards some sort of nutrient lock out (guessing magnesium). I guess I am wondering if I could do a correct flush 3 days after the first one where I only watered with 1x the volume of the pot size?

CannaGranny · Apr 17, 2023

barhoc11 said:
Thanks but I should add that it seems to be spreading from bottom leaves to higher leaves now and already damaged leaves are getting worse. I know I was not watering properly before (didn't water to run off) so I am leaning towards some sort of nutrient lock out (guessing magnesium). I guess I am wondering if I could do a correct flush 3 days after the first one where I only watered with 1x the volume of the pot size?

Magnesium nitrogen and calcium are all mobile nutrients. If you are seeing this crawling then it’s not a lock out, it’s a deficiency. Which is actually good news. In the future should you actually experience a lock out then it is indeed three times the size of your pot.
What are you feeding? How old are these plants and why did you add coco to HF and OF?
Flushing them when it’s a deficiency only adds to your problem. You may want to consider a foilar feeding, which I cannot advise on until I know what you are currently feeding.

barhoc11 · Apr 17, 2023

CannaGranny said:
Magnesium nitrogen and calcium are all mobile nutrients. If you are seeing this crawling then it’s not a lock out, it’s a deficiency. Which is actually good news. In the future should you actually experience a lock out then it is indeed three times the size of your pot.
What are you feeding? How old are these plants and why did you add coco to HF and OF?
Flushing them when it’s a deficiency only adds to your problem. You may want to consider a foilar feeding, which I cannot advise on until I know what you are currently feeding.

I am using Fox Farms Grow Big and Big Bloom, along with Cal mag and Great White Mycorrhizae, all ph'd to low 6ph after mixing them together in aerated water. I added a little coco just to hold water better but it really isn't a large % of overall soil content. The plants are around 1.5 months old and seem like they have stopped growing over the past week when I noticed the leaf symptoms. I would frankly be shocked I was underfeeding them BUT like I mentioned before I was not watering properly (no runoff and only around 32oz of water twice a week) so I figured I had gradually built up salt content in the soil and led to a lockout.

Oldguy71 · Apr 17, 2023

You have to wait until the pot is dry to water again. Watering before that will be cause more problems. Let it ride man and evaluate again when it’s time to water. I wouldn’t add any more nutrients or foliar feed. I think your plant and soil have plenty.

barhoc11 · Apr 17, 2023

Oldguy71 said:
You have to wait until the pot is dry to water again. Watering before that will be cause more problems. Let it ride man and evaluate again when it’s time to water. I wouldn’t add any more nutrients or foliar feed. I think your plant and soil have plenty.

Thanks, that seems like the best path forward. Now, once I need to water again, would you recommend adding nutrients back in at 1/2 strength?

Oldguy71 · Apr 17, 2023

That’s a tough one. If your plants looking like the first flush did the job, I’d just use water. If it’s looking like you should give it more of a flush then the last gallon of your flush should be 1/2 strength nutes. Whole plant pics would help. From your pics your plant doesn’t look too bad. So when there’s too much nutrients in the soil the plants can’t take in nutrients in balanced amounts. When you correct the soil situation the plant starts to grow again even though they are still low on some elements. The 2-3 days they can look worse but once they get caught up it will start to look better.

Also I’m going to defer to cannagranny on the foliar feeding.
It’ll come around soon

Mothman · Apr 17, 2023

Did you happen to measure how much water ran out when you did the mini flush?

freezeland2 · Apr 17, 2023

barhoc11 said:
I noticed what I think is nutrient lockout going on in my indoor grow and 'flushed' with about 2 gallons of water per 3 gallon potted plant. It doesn't seem to have helped AND I realized I was supposed to flush with 3x the size of the pot? Would that mean 9 gallons of ph water per 3 gallon pot?

If I didn't flush properly and need to do it with 3x the water to pot ratio, when can I do a proper flush? It has been 3 days and pots have dried out somewhat... can I do a proper flush now?

What did you expect to see as a result of your flushing? Damaged leaves will not return to normal. You need to watch the new growth to see if damage is still occurring.

barhoc11 · Apr 17, 2023

Mothman said:
Did you happen to measure how much water ran out when you did the mini flush?

I did a few plants at once but I would estimate .5 to .75 gallons ran off per plant.

barhoc11 · Apr 17, 2023

freezeland2 said:
What did you expect to see as a result of your flushing? Damaged leaves will not return to normal. You need to watch the new growth to see if damage is still occurring.

I was hoping the damage wouldn't spread and I would see my plants start growing again. I know its only been 3 days since I flushed but I am still seeing continued leaf damage and no real growth in height.

MIGrampaUSA · Apr 17, 2023

@barhoc11 you're in good hands with @CannaGranny and @freezeland2 and the others helping you out. The leaf issues you're seeing look to me like watering too frequently.

I'm sure you were doing this at the time when you weren't watering them enough per watering cycle. Those issues seem to go hand in hand. They are all pretty normal "lessons we learn" early on in when we start growing. The good news is if you fix the watering issue (water until run-off, allow the soil to dry back before watering again), you'll be fine in the end ... Consider purchasing an inexpensive moisture meter to help determine when its time to water again.

+1 more on "never add coco to soil"

freezeland2 · Apr 17, 2023

barhoc11 said:
I was hoping the damage wouldn't spread and I would see my plants start growing again. I know its only been 3 days since I flushed but I am still seeing continued leaf damage and no real growth in height.

The thing about soil is you are always behind the problem when one occurs. You can’t get fast results because of the nature of the medium. So when you chase an issue it’s been there for a week or longer and it takes that long to recover from it. Growing in hydroponics has a definite advantage in that regard because nutrient correction is immediately uptaken by the plant.

barhoc11 · Apr 17, 2023

freezeland2 said:
The thing about soil is you are always behind the problem when one occurs. You can’t get fast results because of the nature of the medium. So when you chase an issue it’s been there for a week or longer and it takes that long to recover from it. Growing in hydroponics has a definite advantage in that regard because nutrient correction is immediately uptaken by the plant.

I figured things were on a lag so thanks for confirming. Plan is to let things dry out a bit and hopefully see the plants perk back up, then water and feed. Thanks so much!

growsince79 · Apr 17, 2023

MIGrampaUSA said:
@barhoc11 you're in good hands with @CannaGranny and @freezeland2 and the others helping you out. The leaf issues you're seeing look to me like watering too frequently.

I'm sure you were doing this at the time when you weren't watering them enough per watering cycle. Those issues seem to go hand in hand. They are all pretty normal "lessons we learn" early on in when we start growing. The good news is if you fix the watering issue (water until run-off, allow the soil to dry back before watering again), you'll be fine in the end ... Consider purchasing an inexpensive moisture meter to help determine when its time to water again.

+1 more on "never add coco to soil"

I mix coco and soil all the time without issue. The big companies even do it for you now-cocoloco and promix hpcc both work good.

MIGrampaUSA · Apr 17, 2023

growsince79 said:
I mix coco and soil all the time without issue. The big companies even do it for you now-cocoloco and promix hpcc both work good.

You're also the guy who has enough experience to "break all the rules" and still have a good crop in the end. Not everyone has that ability...

For the newer grower, keeping things simple is the safest route. The big companies have a research and development team. They make these mixes with specific goals in mind.

It's not that they don't mix ... it's just too easy for a newb to mess it up.

CannaGranny · Apr 17, 2023

growsince79 said:
I mix coco and soil all the time without issue. The big companies even do it for you now-cocoloco and promix hpcc both work good.

You also know when your mix is too loamy and how to properly water it I know..I have seen your beauties.

Didn't Flush Enough - When Can I Flush Agian?

Didn't Flush Enough - When Can I Flush Agian?

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