First time Grower

[Phillicini]

Hey peeps.. first grow and some lessons learned.. all was good up until a week ago..
Posted pic of this plant that what I thought was nutrient burn but I'm really not 100%?? Lower leaves look like they have a magnesium def.. yellow and moving upward.. I'm not overly aggressive with liquid nutrients but it happend rather quick.. outdoor in pro mix..

 

[az2000]

Posted pic of this plant that what I thought was nutrient burn but I'm really not 100%?? Lower leaves look like they have a magnesium def.. yellow and moving upward.. I'm not overly aggressive with liquid nutrients but it happend rather quick.. outdoor in pro mix..

What do you feed, how much? When you water/feed, do you pour enough for 10% runoff?

Looks like nutrient burn to me. I don't see mg def.

 

[Phillicini]

GH flora series..In 7 gallon fabric pots.. feed every other watering.. ppm 650, ph 6.5.. when I checked the run off this am ph 4.9??? And ppm around 350..

 

[az2000]

Which Pro-Mix is it? They make a few versions. Some have nutrients backed into the soil. Others are soilless (like Pro-Mix HP or BX).

I've used GH Flora Series in Pro-Mix HP (plus 25% perlite). I used the schedule named "GH 3-part Useless formula." (Google for it, it's on the growkind forum.). According to that, you're feeding a little light. But, that doesn't explain the burnt leaf tips. Unless you're using one of the Pro-Mix soils with nutrients built into it.

When was the last time you calibrated your TDS pen? (If you have a sub-gram scale, you can mix 1 gram of ordinary salt from the kitchen into 1 liter distilled water. That creates 1000ppm. Close enough for this kind of work. ).

PS: Seeing the larger photos, the plants look hungry. That fits your ppms. But, the burnt tips say something else.

 

[Aqua Man]

Which Pro-Mix is it? They make a few versions. Some have nutrients backed into the soil. Others are soilless (like Pro-Mix HP or BX).

I've used GH Flora Series in Pro-Mix HP (plus 25% perlite). I used the schedule named "GH 3-part Useless formula." (Google for it, it's on the growkind forum.). According to that, you're feeding a little light. But, that doesn't explain the burnt leaf tips. Unless you're using one of the Pro-Mix soils with nutrients built into it.

When was the last time you calibrated your TDS pen? (If you have a sub-gram scale, you can mix 1 gram of ordinary salt from the kitchen into 1 liter distilled water. That creates 1000ppm. Close enough for this kind of work. ).

PS: Seeing the larger photos, the plants look hungry. That fits your ppms. But, the burnt tips say something else.

Yeah hungry. Burnt tips look like it may have been previously over fed I don't see signs of that on the overall plant pics it looks like a different plant. Maybe the one in the back

 

[Phillicini]

The herb and garden organic one.. red bag with mycoactive stuff. water out of the tap here is 6.9 and 4ppm.. I think the nute burn was from a late feed In the am.. got hot quick.. not sure really.. each one drinks about a gallon almost every other day atm.. still have a month and bit of veg.. don't want to lose them now..

 

[visajoe1]

concur with her being hungry, its obvious when you see the whole plant. yellowing down low to steal nutrients for new growth, classic. overall light green look. feed her!

 

[az2000]

Pro-Mix Veg & Herb says it feeds 3 months. That sounds bad. But, the NPK is 0.30 - 0.05 - 0.10, That's not as bad as MiracleGro potting mix. (The N is as bad. But the PK is lower.).

I don't think GH Flora 3-part is optimal for soil (which has organic nutrients amended into it to me more of a soil than soilless; intended to have a microbiology.). It's for hydroponics, directly feeding the roots without the help of microbes. @Beachwalker says it worked fine for him. Maybe he can help.

If you're underfeeding, the soil ph (acidic) is puzzling. But, that could be a result of using (entirely) synthetic nutrients in soil (clobbering the microbes, and the organic material not being used.).

When you feed/water, how much runoff do you get?

 

[az2000]

concur with her being hungry, its obvious when you see the whole plant. yellowing down low to steal nutrients for new growth, classic. overall light green look. feed her!

What about the runoff ph 4.9? I don't think ph'ing runoff is very accurate. But, that's pretty low for soil deplete of nutrients.

The OP said the feeding is every other watering. Every watering would be better (instead of super-strong every other time).

 

[Phillicini]

Pro-Mix Veg & Herb says it feeds 3 months. That sounds bad. But, the NPK is 0.30 - 0.05 - 0.10, That's not as bad as MiracleGro potting mix. (The N is as bad. But the PK is lower.).

I don't think GH Flora 3-part is optimal for soil (which has organic nutrients amended into it to me more of a soil than soilless; intended to have a microbiology.). It's for hydroponics, directly feeding the roots without the help of microbes. @Beachwalker says it worked fine for him. Maybe he can help.

If you're underfeeding, the soil ph (acidic) is puzzling. But, that could be a result of using (entirely) synthetic nutrients in soil (clobbering the microbes, and the organic material not being used.).

When you feed/water, how much runoff do you get?

200-500ml.. around 10%ish..

 

[Phillicini]

What about the runoff ph 4.9? I don't think ph'ing runoff is very accurate. But, that's pretty low for soil deplete of nutrients.

The OP said the feeding is every other watering. Every watering would be better (instead of super-strong every other time).

That's kind of what I had in my mind from here on out.. after a big flush runoff ph around 5.5 with 87ppm.. gave a feeding at half strength right after.. soil is wet now.. not sure if I'll do the liquid feeds on the next one.. bottle says it can be used for hydro soil or coco.. but wasnt my first pick.. poorly planned but thats life as a spontaneous stone!! Thanks for the help,, keep a closer eye then usual..

 

[az2000]

I would feed each watering. There's no reason to do it every other.

The soil should be very dry when it's ready for water. Many growers decide if it's time to water by lifting the container. It should feel disturbingly light. I've never grown in 7gal containers. To illustrate with a 3gal: it will feel like lifting a gallon jug of water (after watering). When it's ready for watering, it will feel like a top-heavy can of beans. (New growers have a hard time imagining how dry the soil can become before wilting leaves occur. Even if wilting occur, the leaves will bounce back in 20 minutes. So, err on the side of dry.).

If you're watering too frequently, it can acidify the soil. You said they're drinking every other day? I have a super-light soil which dries in 2-3 days. It's hard for me to imagine your soil drying as quickly as mine. (Mine's heavy with perlite. It's hard for me to imagine a lighter soil. Yours might take 4?).

If it were me, I'd run down to Ace Hardware and buy MiracleGro "Tomato." It's a NPK ratio 1-1-1.2. I've grown a plant with it (fixing to grow another soon). 5/8 tsp/gal. (You can't burn the plant with even 1.2 tsp/gal.). It's not entirely synthetic. Get some Pennington Alaska Fish Emulsion. I can tell you how much to use (with how much "Tomato"). That would get the soil microbes going again. A pinch of sugar per gallon of water would help too (but, more isn't better. Just a pinch.).

That stuff's cheap. It's not like having to change religions (find a new multi-bottle "lineup," memorize the articles of faith). Just off-the-shelf stuff. (MiracleGro is the same company as Gen Hydro.).

Also, just because "they say" it works in soil, doesn't mean it should. Ask yourself why hydro growers don't put bat guano and fish emulsion in their reservoirs. :) It's two different things. (If you used Pro-Mix HP or BX, true soilless, the GH 3-part works fantastic. If you want to do that again, follow the "useless" schedule, but maybe 10% weaker. It works good.).

 

[Phillicini]

I would feed each watering. There's no reason to do it every other.

The soil should be very dry when it's ready for water. Many growers decide if it's time to water by lifting the container. It should feel disturbingly light. I've never grown in 7gal containers. To illustrate with a 3gal: it will feel like lifting a gallon jug of water (after watering). When it's ready for watering, it will feel like a top-heavy can of beans. (New growers have a hard time imagining how dry the soil can become before wilting leaves occur. Even if wilting occur, the leaves will bounce back in 20 minutes. So, err on the side of dry.).

If you're watering too frequently, it can acidify the soil. You said they're drinking every other day? I have a super-light soil which dries in 2-3 days. It's hard for me to imagine your soil drying as quickly as mine. (Mine's heavy with perlite. It's hard for me to imagine a lighter soil. Yours might take 4?).

If it were me, I'd run down to Ace Hardware and buy MiracleGro "Tomato." It's a NPK ratio 1-1-1.2. I've grown a plant with it (fixing to grow another soon). 5/8 tsp/gal. (You can't burn the plant with even 1.2 tsp/gal.). It's not entirely synthetic. Get some Pennington Alaska Fish Emulsion. I can tell you how much to use (with how much "Tomato"). That would get the soil microbes going again. A pinch of sugar per gallon of water would help too (but, more isn't better. Just a pinch.).

That stuff's cheap. It's not like having to change religions (find a new multi-bottle "lineup," memorize the articles of faith). Just off-the-shelf stuff. (MiracleGro is the same company as Gen Hydro.).

Also, just because "they say" it works in soil, doesn't mean it should. Ask yourself why hydro growers don't put bat guano and fish emulsion in their reservoirs. :) It's two different things. (If you used Pro-Mix HP or BX, true soilless, the GH 3-part works fantastic. If you want to do that again, follow the "useless" schedule, but maybe 10% weaker. It works good.).
[/QUOTE
I like the fish emulsion idea! Soil needs to dry up a bit, but ok to shift the feeding in another direction?(More soil friendly) I cant imagine replacing the GH would be a bad idea at this point!?

 

[az2000]

I cant imagine replacing the GH would be a bad idea at this point!?

In what way would that be a bad idea?

I don't know if I'd use fish emulsion *and* GH Flora 3-part. If synthetic/hydro nutes clobber the microbes, it might not be a good idea to add more organic material needing microbes. I guess it could help the microbes overcome the clobbering. But... it could also leave unprocessed organic matter in the soil to turn acidic. I don't know how that works. I'm just, if I were going to start adding organic nutrients, I'd stop using the hydro nutrients. Otherwise, I'd do hydro nutrients by themselves.

If it were me, I'd feed a soil nutrient. I'd use Grow More - Sea Grow. (There's also Jack's Classic.). But, that can take some time to locate, or have delivered. MG "Tomato" is at your local hardware store. It works fine. Might not be the best. But, it should be far better for soil than hydro nutes. I'd feel safer using fish emulsion with that.

 

[Aqua Man]

They should not affect microbes. What will is the ph if you let the nutrients build up.

 

[Phillicini]

In what way would that be a bad idea?

I don't know if I'd use fish emulsion *and* GH Flora 3-part. If synthetic/hydro nutes clobber the microbes, it might not be a good idea to add more organic material needing microbes. I guess it could help the microbes overcome the clobbering. But... it could also leave unprocessed organic matter in the soil to turn acidic. I don't know how that works. I'm just, if I were going to start adding organic nutrients, I'd stop using the hydro nutrients. Otherwise, I'd do hydro nutrients by themselves.

If it were me, I'd feed a soil nutrient. I'd use Grow More - Sea Grow. (There's also Jack's Classic.). But, that can take some time to locate, or have delivered. MG "Tomato" is at your local hardware store. It works fine. Might not be the best. But, it should be far better for soil than hydro nutes. I'd feel safer using fish emulsion with that.

Thing that I'm wondering is the nitrogen seems HIGH for flowering with MG?? I was worried about a really late harvest but I think I'll be lucky to make it that far.. it's not liking something though.. seems odd everything was good for 2.5 months and all sorts of conflicting symptoms.. part of the curve I guess..

 

[az2000]

Thing that I'm wondering is the nitrogen seems HIGH for flowering with MG?? I was worried about a really late harvest but I think I'll be lucky to make it that far.. it's not liking something though.. seems odd everything was good for 2.5 months and all sorts of conflicting symptoms.. part of the curve I guess..

It's a 1-1-1.2 ratio. Cannabis flowers fine with that. But, you could buy the MiracleGrow "Bloom Booster" product and mix the two to adjust your NPK ratio. I can tell you how to do it. (I grew "Tomato" from veg to flower. But, I thought about mixing to get custom NPK ratios in flower. The "All Purpose" product is 3-1-2, if I recall correctly. I was thinking about mixing that in during veg to get a higher ratio in veg, like 2-1-1.5. If you used "Bloom Booster" and "Tomato" in flower, you can get scale the ratio from 1-1.2-1.4 to 1-2-2 in late flower. I didn't do that because I thought it would be useful to show how cheaply a cannabis plant can be grown.).

Honestly, I don't think these ratio do much. It wouldn't hurt to grow one at 1-1-1.2 ("Tomato") and see how it looks. Then you'd have something to compare to if/when you want to boost P in flower. Or, I can tell you how to mix it to get the right ratio, and strength. (I have a spreadsheet. I can give it to you; you can do it too.).

Or, you can use the GH bottles. I just don't think that's the healthiest way to grow in soil. If you do use those, I wouldn't add organic nutrients. (Unless someone's done it and can say it's wonderful. I wouldn't expect it to be.).

 

[Phillicini]

It's a 1-1-1.2 ratio. Cannabis flowers fine with that. But, you could buy the MiracleGrow "Bloom Booster" product and mix the two to adjust your NPK ratio. I can tell you how to do it. (I grew "Tomato" from veg to flower. But, I thought about mixing to get custom NPK ratios in flower. The "All Purpose" product is 3-1-2, if I recall correctly. I was thinking about mixing that in during veg to get a higher ratio in veg, like 2-1-1.5. If you used "Bloom Booster" and "Tomato" in flower, you can get scale the ratio from 1-1.2-1.4 to 1-2-2 in late flower. I didn't do that because I thought it would be useful to show how cheaply a cannabis plant can be grown.).

Honestly, I don't think these ratio do much. It wouldn't hurt to grow one at 1-1-1.2 ("Tomato") and see how it looks. Then you'd have something to compare to if/when you want to boost P in flower. Or, I can tell you how to mix it to get the right ratio, and strength. (I have a spreadsheet. I can give it to you; you can do it too.).

Or, you can use the GH bottles. I just don't think that's the healthiest way to grow in soil. If you do use those, I wouldn't add organic nutrients. (Unless someone's done it and can say it's wonderful. I wouldn't expect it to be.).

Weird.. the stuff I'm seeing is like 24-16-16.. maybe I'm not looking right..

 

[Phillicini]

This stuff??

 

[az2000]

Weird.. the stuff I'm seeing is like 24-16-16.. maybe I'm not looking right..

What stuff are you seeing?

24-16-16 is the "percentage of weight." If the product weighs 1 kg, it contains 240g N, 160g P (as P2O5), 160g K (as K2O). That's useful for price comparison. How much minerals your money is buying.

But, there's also a ratio involved. An easier way to compare fertilizers (their suitability) is to reduce those "strength" numbers down to a ratio. So, your example is 1.5-1-1. That's a good veg ratio.