Had honeycomb, then it changed.

PuregenetiKs · Oct 16, 2013

Hey all. I am making my third batch of wax. My first two came out awesome, I had two really nice honeycomb cookies, and it was straight fire, unmatched as of yet as far as quality. Right now I have a 45g patty I am working in the vacuum. I am on day 3 of messing with it. I keep the oil around 115F when purging. 3 gallon vac it pro, and a 2 stage 6cfm vacuum.

So I hit a real nice honeycomb cookie in a pretty short amount of time, I am kicking myself for not pulling it then. I wanted to purge for as long as possible to ensure quality. At night when I go to bed I turn off the heat, close the vacuum valve keeping the chamber under vacuum, and kill the pump.

When I went to bed I had a picture perfect honeycomb, but when I woke up the top was glazed and "wet" looking. It had transformed. I then worked it all day and could not get it to honeycomb and get the dry look. Right now it looks like a taffy or caramel.

The only thing I can think of is me storing it overnight under vacuum at room temp is what screwed it? My first two batched I did the same thing but they came out awesome.

Any advice or insight? Pretty irritated I really favor the honeycomb texture.

PuregenetiKs · Oct 16, 2013

Right now it reminds me of bubble hash. You can roll it up in a ball, stretch it out, looks clean as hell when you rip it is like cutting into some bubble hash.

germinator · Oct 16, 2013

Sorry to hear this ......Possible oil back flow from connected pump...... Was the vac pro still under pressure when you returned? Also....Was any oil staining present on parchment or bottom materials? Too much heat makes it gooey too.

PuregenetiKs · Oct 16, 2013

No the pressure was down to like -10, normally it keeps pressure throughout the night. There was no staining, however it is a clear oil. Even with the loss of vacuum the shutoff valve was in the closed position so nothing could have passed. The temps of the wax never got over 130f, but I shoot for like 115. Oil backflow is something I feared. I am not to educated on it but I am very careful to utilize the shutoff valve on the vac it pro when doing anything. The only time it is on is when the vacuum is on. Oil is exactly what I was thinking, I just don't know when or how it could have happened, I have only heard very little on that subject. Are there any other explanations for this consistency change? I will never leave anything in the vacuum overnight again....

Why does backflow happen? How can it be prevented? I don't want to write it off as that yet, but it is something that scares me.

The morning I came to discover the vacuum was not holding and the consistency had changed the patty was not under the valve, so if oil flowed in I would have seen it on the parchment paper.

PuregenetiKs · Oct 16, 2013

Ok I am going to say yes, oil back flow. I found micro specs of clear oil where my release valve air comes in. Why is oil back flowing? The oil is at the max line, not over just at it. How can this be prevented? I have had the pump on the counter next to the vacuum, now I am leaving it on the floor. When you turn the pump on, you can visibly see oil in the line returning to the vacuum. Not a ton, but it is there. That's sucks, 49g of katsu bubba kush wax. I had a perfect honey comb, now I am just going to take it outside and torch it for fun...

What do I do to not have this happen again?

Did I maybe release the vacuum with the valve open? I was extra careful and can't think of a time where I messed it up.

Graywolf · Oct 17, 2013

I've inadvertently backflowed oil from the pump into my lines and chamber, by forgetting to close the valve, before shutting off the pump. I've never had that problem, when I close the valve.

You can also install a cold trap between your pump and chamber. It will catch everything going both ways.

PuregenetiKs · Oct 17, 2013

Graywolf thanks for the reply, and opening my eyes to a cold trap. I was wondering if there was something I could install to prevent this. Is there a cold trap you could recommend for this application? I see a lot of different types.

Graywolf · Oct 18, 2013

PuregenetiKs said:
Graywolf thanks for the reply, and opening my eyes to a cold trap. I was wondering if there was something I could install to prevent this. Is there a cold trap you could recommend for this application? I see a lot of different types.

I made ours to also catch alcohol during cold boiling, which is more elaborate, but have also used my original Mk III butane tank for one, and it works well. Just set it in an ice bath.

Here is how to build the tank, which shows all is required, is a capture chamber, with a dip tube inlet and a vapor outlet in the lid.

PuregenetiKs · Oct 19, 2013

Graywolf that is very impressive and informative, and thank you for sharing. However, I am not a DIY type guy and would rather purchase something ready to go. Is there a brand or model you could recommend that is readily available?

Graywolf · Oct 20, 2013

PuregenetiKs said:
Graywolf that is very impressive and informative, and thank you for sharing. However, I am not a DIY type guy and would rather purchase something ready to go. Is there a brand or model you could recommend that is readily available?

Sorry to say that most of my vacuum experience is for considerably larger units, and I haven't researched commercial cold trap availability for smaller systems, because I've always just made my own. A habit got into developing new processes in industry, when no suitable equipment was available,

Here is a nice one from Cole Palmer http://www.coleparmer.com/buy/produ...old-trap-1-2-od-straight-tube-connection.html that should work. It costs about three times what it takes to make the Mk III tank above, but should not only protect your chamber from back flow, but your pump from solvent vapors as well.

germinator · Oct 20, 2013

As always tyvm for all you do/done.

Kcar · Oct 20, 2013

Wouldn't a one-way check valve like this http://www.amazon.com/Viair-92831-N...=1382310195&sr=8-3&keywords=One+Way+Air+Valve
Work? Only $6

PuregenetiKs · Oct 21, 2013

Graywolf, thank you. That is an expensive ass piece of equipment. But when you are wasting huge pieces of honeycomb it is justified. A cheaper option would be awesome, I am a little sticker shocked and that is VERY hard to do. Kcar if it is as simple as a check valve that would be sweet! I don't mind dropping a few hundred but damn 1K?

Graywolf · Oct 22, 2013

Depending on the check valve, you will have some pressure losses, so I use a full port ball valve instead. You do have to remember to close it before shutting off the pump, and starting the pump before opening the valve, where a check would be more automatic.

Had honeycomb, then it changed.

Had honeycomb, then it changed.

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