The Silica Lie

Junk · Oct 22, 2016

Btw, this is how big those fan leaves are. So, you can understand what I mean by the plants "rigidity" abilities...those are darn big leaves to splay out flat. And my hands are not small (that sounds defensive lol).

So this shows the leaf size, but at this stage in the grow, I knew something wasn't at full tilt, bc my leaves normally don't look like this. The pic below this one, is the same plant, just a different top, and different angle. And it was firing on all cylinders at that point, which is how I also interpret the strong + phototropism. When everything is just right that's what they look like (genetics permitting).

The above is Grape OG, I don't want to give the wrong credit as to breeding so I'll leave it out till I'm certain.

But it's the biggest plant I've grown to date. I practically needed climbing rope to tie that sucker down.

robomont · Oct 22, 2016

im beginning to think my bag seed grape flavored is something like yall got.
my grape consistently is the biggest plant ive grown,straight up giants that finish early.

Komoshan · Dec 15, 2016

i hear about everyone only adding like 5ml per gallon. I've been using as ph up using mostly all organic nutes so if I only use protekt to raise from high 4's and 5's to 6.8 it takes me between 25-30ml, sometimes more if I am adding a little extra molasses. the people at the hydro store told me there is no negative effects from dosing large amounts of silica to plants, but it still makes me nervous.. how it seems that I'm getting much smaller ph swings from protekt compared to other poeple.

Natural · Dec 15, 2016

Komoshan said:
i hear about everyone only adding like 5ml per gallon. I've been using as ph up using mostly all organic nutes so if I only use protekt to raise from high 4's and 5's to 6.8 it takes me between 25-30ml, sometimes more if I am adding a little extra molasses. the people at the hydro store told me there is no negative effects from dosing large amounts of silica to plants, but it still makes me nervous.. how it seems that I'm getting much smaller ph swings from protekt compared to other poeple.

I did that at one point in time..just add sili like you would calmag and then ph up. Side by side I preferred the lesser sili and cutting it back mid flower. molasses and sili too late and too much made the flowers burn funny imho.

jammie · Dec 15, 2016

Most silica products also have lots of potassium. If this isn't factored in, it can cause calcium and magnesium lock out especially if your using a ph boost in flower

jammie · Dec 15, 2016

Damn autocorrect- that's supposed to be pk boosters

One drop · Dec 15, 2016

Seamaiden said:
Plants require silica to form sufficiently rigid cell walls. My own experience was that the plants were far better able to hold themselves up, and far better able to tolerate difficult conditions (rain, heat, cold, pests and disease). I try to get them their silica via the soil instead of having to foliar, but for indoors I'm happy to give via foliar. Doesn't take much, either, so it's a very cost effective form of prevention, health insurance.

All that said, it is VERY easy to overdo the Si. The 'if a little is good, then more must be better' ideology must be tossed out the window on this one.

I agree I'm lucky here in Australia I have a native tree I derive my silica from I cut 20 kg of its compound leaves structure soak for 1 week in water strain through a stocking and straight into the folia feed spray bottle and the good thing about it is my ph doesn't go up to much and it's free ....

ArcticOrange · Dec 15, 2016

Moses249 said:
So I been using silica in bloom and veg. Dynagro silica specifically. And having gone a couple of rounds with it I haven't seen any noticable difference in yield or overall plant vigor really. I have been reading up and it seems that silica may just be another bullshit thing people r trying to hawk on us. What say the farmers. Do most of you use silica and see significant difference or have had simliar expierience to me?

Potassium silicate is not very bioavailable for most plants and tends to gum up the soil. if you think silica isnt necessary for plants here is some reading.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2759229/

The form of silica used is very important. i use bioavailable horsetail extracted silica but others seem to like the osa products i believem

Pimples · Dec 15, 2016

Its not essential...really. People been growing dope for years without it. Damn fine herb too. That being said..silica is an additive ive used fer years. Not only does it make fer strong branches...pm resistance. ..and gives pests a hard time...it has consistently gave me improved crop yields over control plants without it. It can be over done. Used in heavy doses all through has madw final processed product less desirable.

Pimples · Dec 15, 2016

Komoshan said:
i hear about everyone only adding like 5ml per gallon. I've been using as ph up using mostly all organic nutes so if I only use protekt to raise from high 4's and 5's to 6.8 it takes me between 25-30ml, sometimes more if I am adding a little extra molasses. the people at the hydro store told me there is no negative effects from dosing large amounts of silica to plants, but it still makes me nervous.. how it seems that I'm getting much smaller ph swings from protekt compared to other poeple.

25 to 30 ml per gallon? Thats a little too much bro. I would think anyways

NightsWatch · Dec 15, 2016

Pimples said:
Its not essential...really. People been growing dope for years without it. Damn fine herb too. That being said..silica is an additive ive used fer years. Not only does it make fer strong branches...pm resistance. ..and gives pests a hard time...it has consistently gave me improved crop yields over control plants without it. It can be over done. Used in heavy doses all through has madw final processed product less desirable.

All here say , If you think it helps your grow then by all means use it . lets not forget healthy plants get attacked by insects .
How many times have you heard plants are like humans in many ways ?
When we look at scientific data with people using silica in there diet it appears it didn't help much

But i am still waiting for someone to fork out the bill for lab tests on silica amounts on marijuana Dry leaf matter Content compared to non silica fed marijuana
One could pretty quick figure out if this is snake oil or not right
Yet these companies that claim it does help never have t shown test results but ,
They word there products carefully as in it may help it may do this etc.

Then when we really look at the Data or what companies are using there using different species all together as in rice and other higher silica content plants .
Again if silica is so good then why is there 37 percent of rice crops lost to insects each year , it should be a lot less

Personally the main problem people are facing is proper feeding techniques proper NPK see everyone tends to hammer there plants with to much Nitrogen which is like sending a tect to insects to attack because its food ..
For them ..

People claiming there seeing better results are only seeing it because there one more grow in on experience an like it or not your just getting better as a grower
And silica did very little if anything

Wouldn't it suck to spend all that money on silica and have same amounts in organic vs silica additions ?? i know i would be pissed spending shit load only to find out that the organic grown had same amount in dry leaf tests
Wouldn't you

Pimples · Dec 15, 2016

NightsWatch said:
All here say , If you think it helps your grow then by all means use it . lets not forget healthy plants get attacked by insects .
How many times have you heard plants are like humans in many ways ?
When we look at scientific data with people using silica in there diet it appears it didn't help much

But i am still waiting for someone to fork out the bill for lab tests on silica amounts on marijuana Dry leaf matter Content compared to non silica fed marijuana
One could pretty quick figure out if this is snake oil or not right
Yet these companies that claim it does help never have t shown test results but ,
They word there products carefully as in it may help it may do this etc.

Then when we really look at the Data or what companies are using there using different species all together as in rice and other higher silica content plants .
Again if silica is so good then why is there 37 percent of rice crops lost to insects each year , it should be a lot less

Personally the main problem people are facing is proper feeding techniques proper NPK see everyone tends to hammer there plants with to much Nitrogen which is like sending a tect to insects to attack because its food ..
For them ..

People claiming there seeing better results are only seeing it because there one more grow in on experience an like it or not your just getting better as a grower
And silica did very little if anything

Wouldn't it suck to spend all that money on silica and have same amounts in organic vs silica additions ?? i know i would be pissed spending shit load only to find out that the organic grown had same amount in dry leaf tests
Wouldn't you

good observation. I agree wholeheartedly. Newish growers just got better being growers. First nute brand they chose was just fine. But they being noobs (we all were there) fukt it up. Blamed it on the nutes and there ya go. Nutes and addies dont really mean much in the whole process really.

Pimples · Dec 15, 2016

But i must concur. With

Pimples · Dec 16, 2016

Pimples said:
But i must concur. With

Sorry...stoned and rambling. Carry on

Komoshan · Dec 16, 2016

Pimples said:
25 to 30 ml per gallon? Thats a little too much bro. I would think anyways

that's what i think and have thought and why i was asking the hydro store people. i even mentioned with super heavy feedings thatv thrown my ph way down i've added up to 50ml/gal. they said it was fine but I wanted some other opinions. the overfeeding potassium thing makes sense. does it slowly lock out cal/mg or i might be having a different issue since it has been over a month of those heavy feedings. nothing came up until i spilled most of the small bottle i had left and started mixing with phup. when i went back to the hydro store the guy was saying mixing protekt and phup forms some sort of chemical reaction that poisons the plants. he might just be talking about directly mixing them together rather than letting the silica absorb into water first. but either way if thats true even more reason for me to stay away from that ph up stuff.
I've been wanting a good replacement for silica as a ph up so i wouldn't be hyper dosing. i had heard of earth juice's natural phup but also heard it was basically the same thing as potassium silicate. so the only natural phup besides baking soda i've come across has been rhizo from canna.

Pimples · Dec 18, 2016

Komoshan said:
that's what i think and have thought and why i was asking the hydro store people. i even mentioned with super heavy feedings thatv thrown my ph way down i've added up to 50ml/gal. they said it was fine but I wanted some other opinions. the overfeeding potassium thing makes sense. does it slowly lock out cal/mg or i might be having a different issue since it has been over a month of those heavy feedings. nothing came up until i spilled most of the small bottle i had left and started mixing with phup. when i went back to the hydro store the guy was saying mixing protekt and phup forms some sort of chemical reaction that poisons the plants. he might just be talking about directly mixing them together rather than letting the silica absorb into water first. but either way if thats true even more reason for me to stay away from that ph up stuff.
I've been wanting a good replacement for silica as a ph up so i wouldn't be hyper dosing. i had heard of earth juice's natural phup but also heard it was basically the same thing as potassium silicate. so the only natural phup besides baking soda i've come across has been rhizo from canna.

Something doesnt sound right. With my brand of choice which is Silicate from Europonic/HDI i use one ml. per gallon. Its plenty. What is your start water tds/ec and pH before adding anything? What brand and model is your pH meter? Is it a 2 point calibration? And hydro store workers saying the amount of potassium silicate your adding is fine? Start shopping at a different store. Because the amount your adding is ridiculous and not fine....at all.

Pimples · Dec 18, 2016

If your having problems plant wise...its DEFINITELY related to 25 - 50 ml. of potassium silicate per gallon. I can damn near guarantee you this. With DG Protekt...2 to 4 ml. per gallon is more than enough. You prolly got pH meter problems. Them things arw finicky.

Pimples · Dec 18, 2016

Komoshan said:
i hear about everyone only adding like 5ml per gallon. I've been using as ph up using mostly all organic nutes so if I only use protekt to raise from high 4's and 5's to 6.8 it takes me between 25-30ml, sometimes more if I am adding a little extra molasses. the people at the hydro store told me there is no negative effects from dosing large amounts of silica to plants, but it still makes me nervous.. how it seems that I'm getting much smaller ph swings from protekt compared to other poeple.

Oh...and just a suggestion...ditch the mostly organic nutes (bottles? ) till you figure out just exactly what your doing.

xenon730 · Dec 23, 2016

NightsWatch said:
All here say , If you think it helps your grow then by all means use it . lets not forget healthy plants get attacked by insects .
How many times have you heard plants are like humans in many ways ?
When we look at scientific data with people using silica in there diet it appears it didn't help much

But i am still waiting for someone to fork out the bill for lab tests on silica amounts on marijuana Dry leaf matter Content compared to non silica fed marijuana
One could pretty quick figure out if this is snake oil or not right
Yet these companies that claim it does help never have t shown test results but ,
They word there products carefully as in it may help it may do this etc.

Then when we really look at the Data or what companies are using there using different species all together as in rice and other higher silica content plants .
Again if silica is so good then why is there 37 percent of rice crops lost to insects each year , it should be a lot less

Personally the main problem people are facing is proper feeding techniques proper NPK see everyone tends to hammer there plants with to much Nitrogen which is like sending a tect to insects to attack because its food ..
For them ..

People claiming there seeing better results are only seeing it because there one more grow in on experience an like it or not your just getting better as a grower
And silica did very little if anything

Wouldn't it suck to spend all that money on silica and have same amounts in organic vs silica additions ?? i know i would be pissed spending shit load only to find out that the organic grown had same amount in dry leaf tests
Wouldn't you

I use it strictly to make stems stronger from weeks 1-4/5 and that saves this particular cut from needing to have every bud propped or hung. without the use of it, the buds droop and fall. i have tested this explicitly side by side. is that not enough to say it's not snake oil? I do agree with you mostly though. It is NOT essential and likely doesn't do much for quality or yield necessarily but it does do noticeable things.

Gardenguy2.0 · Dec 30, 2016

Hey @Junk where you at brotha??

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