K.i.s.s Challenge, Don't Be Afraid!

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dan1989

dan1989

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Couldn't agree more. It just so happens I made an informed decision on my current grow. Budzilla mother in the works. Made a fair few mistakes with the strain last run and took everything I threw at her. Over watered, underwatered (smell reasons, couldn't open tent) topping, supercropping, defoliation, deficiencies. Hence why I'm using her for my first big grow.

But going back to nutes, I grow in coco and dutch pro hydro has all the right stuff, no cal deficIencies or anything like that. Used a few brands and was my favourite and seemed to have less issues, but not sure if that's more down to becoming a little more experienced or just dumb luck :D
 
Daikokuten

Daikokuten

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But going back to nutes, I grow in coco and dutch pro hydro has all the right stuff, no cal deficIencies or anything like that. Used a few brands and was my favourite and seemed to have less issues, but not sure if that's more down to becoming a little more experienced or just dumb luck :D
I like and use the gh trio, supernatural bloom hydro, and dyna-gro currently. Will probably stick to the supernatural when i run out of them. Has 8%ca and is really stable. 1 tsp. is [email protected] too. Love everything about it lol.
 
Dutchcity

Dutchcity

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I mix up a simple A+B from dry salts and supplement my Rez with some terra grow every week to keep beneficial microbes going. I adjust with 25% nitric acid and run an EC of 2.3 with a delta of 1.2-1.4
 
Thejoeybrown

Thejoeybrown

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Cns 17 one part base + silica. Done

Weekly compost tea with +life, ewc. Done

I also add bio cozyme and in flower mammoth p to my weekly tea.

Environment is astronomically more important than nutes. As long as you’re making available all the NPK and micronutrients the environment is where the work is done.
 
Daikokuten

Daikokuten

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Cns 17 one part base + silica. Done

Weekly compost tea with +life, ewc. Done

I also add bio cozyme and in flower mammoth p to my weekly tea.

Environment is astronomically more important than nutes. As long as you’re making available all the NPK and micronutrients the environment is where the work is done.
Is cns just a base nute or does it have anything else with it?
 
Thejoeybrown

Thejoeybrown

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Is cns just a base nute or does it have anything else with it?
It’s botanicare.
So you can use additives like hydroplex, sweet, liquid karma, etc. the cns 17 has a 1 part grow 1 part bloom and a 1 part Ripe. I run the grow for veg. The bloom until week 4 and ripe from then on. All 1 part + silica which more than anything is a ph adjuster. I figure out how much silica blast based on how much is needed to raise ph to 5.8.
I’ve been thinking of running just bloom for veg up til week 4 flower then switching to ripe.
Very cost effective simple and extremely stable. I add water to my res once a week and ph never fluctuates. With some additives it will obviously drop some and you need to adjust. Which is why I have gotten to just base + silica in my res. Literally does not move a point.
I use my tea as a way to “boost” flower production. I add mammoth p to my +life,biocozyme, and ewc tea and hand feed twice weekly in flower.
 
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Thejoeybrown

Thejoeybrown

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Is cns just a base nute or does it have anything else with it?
It has all the micros in the one part if that was the question. I literally never supplement cal mag. If it’s made available it should not need a lot to keep the cations in the coco full once they have been charged. Hence the avatar. Hahah. IMO
 
MIMedGrower

MIMedGrower

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Been using ocean forest with 25% added large perlite and pure Blend Pro Grow only for a couple of years.

Any good potting soil and base fertilizer can work as well. I do appreciate the benefits of seaweed and humic acid. I would likely add those if missing.

Just about all the rest of the products including myco in container gardens make very little difference if any. And are sold on myth and mis-direction.

We should remember our plant is an accumulator. It will take in unnecessary elements. Think about what the plant is doing for Chernobyl. Actually uptaking radioactive waste naturally.

I have gotten 24 oz dry top quality buds from 4 plants in 3 gallon final pots under a 600 hps this way. Considering 3 gallon or #3 nursery pots are actually about 2.4 gallons in volume that number is over 2 oz per gallon of soil. Can’t ask for much more than that from a single ended 600. As I learn and get better I seem to use less nutes for the same results too. And grow more potent flowers.

I agree with @Thejoeybrown that environment is the biggest factor. And I would like to add that knowing how to read the plants and manage their medium so they can reach their potential is also key.

Many disagree but I feel the order of importance is Environment-Grower-genetics.

I come to that conclusion because the same cuttings in different hands and rooms can look and feel very different.

Sorry for the long stoned rant. Lol
 
stiffneck

stiffneck

1,463
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Been using ocean forest with 25% added large perlite and pure Blend Pro Grow only for a couple of years.

Any good potting soil and base fertilizer can work as well. I do appreciate the benefits of seaweed and humic acid. I would likely add those if missing.

Just about all the rest of the products including myco in container gardens make very little difference if any. And are sold on myth and mis-direction.

We should remember our plant is an accumulator. It will take in unnecessary elements. Think about what the plant is doing for Chernobyl. Actually uptaking radioactive waste naturally.

I have gotten 24 oz dry top quality buds from 4 plants in 3 gallon final pots under a 600 hps this way. Considering 3 gallon or #3 nursery pots are actually about 2.4 gallons in volume that number is over 2 oz per gallon of soil. Can’t ask for much more than that from a single ended 600. As I learn and get better I seem to use less nutes for the same results too. And grow more potent flowers.

I agree with @Thejoeybrown that environment is the biggest factor. And I would like to add that knowing how to read the plants and manage their medium so they can reach their potential is also key.

Many disagree but I feel the order of importance is Environment-Grower-genetics.

I come to that conclusion because the same cuttings in different hands and rooms can look and feel very different.

Sorry for the long stoned rant. Lol
Makes sense to me.

Just a little attention. Just a little.
Too much they get needy...
To little they get belligerent.
 
Daikokuten

Daikokuten

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Been using ocean forest with 25% added large perlite and pure Blend Pro Grow only for a couple of years.

Any good potting soil and base fertilizer can work as well. I do appreciate the benefits of seaweed and humic acid. I would likely add those if missing.

Just about all the rest of the products including myco in container gardens make very little difference if any. And are sold on myth and mis-direction.

We should remember our plant is an accumulator. It will take in unnecessary elements. Think about what the plant is doing for Chernobyl. Actually uptaking radioactive waste naturally.

I have gotten 24 oz dry top quality buds from 4 plants in 3 gallon final pots under a 600 hps this way. Considering 3 gallon or #3 nursery pots are actually about 2.4 gallons in volume that number is over 2 oz per gallon of soil. Can’t ask for much more than that from a single ended 600. As I learn and get better I seem to use less nutes for the same results too. And grow more potent flowers.

I agree with @Thejoeybrown that environment is the biggest factor. And I would like to add that knowing how to read the plants and manage their medium so they can reach their potential is also key.

Many disagree but I feel the order of importance is Environment-Grower-genetics.

I come to that conclusion because the same cuttings in different hands and rooms can look and feel very different.

Sorry for the long stoned rant. Lol
Myco isn't a myth. I've done countless side by sides in all different mediums with different myco products and proven myco products have almost doubled the root mass vs without. I have seen this personally and you will too If you test a proven product. I want to ask how long you've been growing because cuts should not differ much from room to room and don't in my years of growing. If cuts are varying significantly, the grower sample is messed up and one or more of the growers are doing something or things drastically wrong. I've grown some of my cuts in different countries in the ground (south Africa, uk, canada,us) and they are always on point for whatever they're in. Never do they look or yield or grow or behave like different plants. I think you way undervalue genetics. You can't grow meh genetics into high end gear. You'll never grow a 17% cut that was properly grown to 26%thc, it doesn't happen. Back to additives quickly, i agree most do nothing and a lot of my side by sides prove that. However, there is a short list of proven additives that have been proven in studies and side by sides. Personally, ill test anything and have never used a new product without side by siding it. That said, almost every product doesn't test with significant differences beyond the fact that most contain kelp and humic lol. It's almost funny how every an product has kelp, humic, amino acids, etc. I've only found 3 of their products that i would say are worthwhile and i think the rest are untested ag products that get an anecdotal myth following like when people thought guano was magic. Anyways, retest myco and bacteria because they work. Og biowar root and nute, great white, mykos and azos, and voodoo juice all tested positively for me.
 
Daikokuten

Daikokuten

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It has all the micros in the one part if that was the question. I literally never supplement cal mag. If it’s made available it should not need a lot to keep the cations in the coco full once they have been charged. Hence the avatar. Hahah. IMO
I'm just interested in one parts currently. It's already what i use(1parts not cns) but i don't use one with additives in it. I've made my own powder booster before and i think if i found a stable one part with kelp, humic, and silica i would use it. I mean all i do now when not using up random products for tests or whatever, is just use a 1part powder and powder si, kelp, and humic. Surely someone could just combine them. Id like a 1part with like 15more ppm per mg per mix too.
 
MIMedGrower

MIMedGrower

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Myco isn't a myth. I've done countless side by sides in all different mediums with different myco products and proven myco products have almost doubled the root mass vs without. I have seen this personally and you will too If you test a proven product. I want to ask how long you've been growing because cuts should not differ much from room to room and don't in my years of growing. If cuts are varying significantly, the grower sample is messed up and one or more of the growers are doing something or things drastically wrong. I've grown some of my cuts in different countries in the ground (south Africa, uk, canada,us) and they are always on point for whatever they're in. Never do they look or yield or grow or behave like different plants. I think you way undervalue genetics. You can't grow meh genetics into high end gear. You'll never grow a 17% cut that was properly grown to 26%thc, it doesn't happen. Back to additives quickly, i agree most do nothing and a lot of my side by sides prove that. However, there is a short list of proven additives that have been proven in studies and side by sides. Personally, ill test anything and have never used a new product without side by siding it. That said, almost every product doesn't test with significant differences beyond the fact that most contain kelp and humic lol. It's almost funny how every an product has kelp, humic, amino acids, etc. I've only found 3 of their products that i would say are worthwhile and i think the rest are untested ag products that get an anecdotal myth following like when people thought guano was magic. Anyways, retest myco and bacteria because they work. Og biowar root and nute, great white, mykos and azos, and voodoo juice all tested positively for me.


I should have specified using myco in a good soil. All my healthy plants develop myco with no inoculation. I think I posted a pic here of it. That goes for all the micro life. If the conditions are right they appear naturally.

My side by sides were with pre inoculated soil (happy frog, pro mix and potters gold) and ocean forest which just has more organic matter than happy frog but no inoculation.


What medium did you do your side by sides in? Neutral mediums would be different I think. But I have not done full hydro. Only a hybrid soil grow.

Also I meant different rooms and Growers. I am not arguing that you personally would see a difference in an established cut. Especially one you have dialed in.

But it could grow differently in my room with me growing it.

Other than that I agree with what you said.

And I have been growing a perpetual garden with a harvest every week to 10 days for four years now. And I spent about 4 years studying and 2 working with my first caregiver before I started my own garden.

I also have a long history working with big Growers since 1983. But I never grew myself then.
 
OldSmokie76

OldSmokie76

1,110
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Super Soil mix I made. No commercial bagged soil mixes. Tap water. Mykos in soil. Supplemented with NFTG nutes once a week 1/2 strength. Four plants 3gal containers. Currently 4wks and counting. 1000w HPS 5x5 tent. Day75°/Night60°. Rh ranges from 25%-40% depending on current light cycle. Oh, wtf is pH and ppm? Lol. Never pay much attention to that. Well balanced soil should rarely exhibit pH fluctuations and I don't drown the girls in nutes. Less is better and a properly prepared soil mix is key. Soil is forgiving. Nature started doing this millennia ago. Stick to the basics. Soil grown smells and tastes soooo much better too.
 
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Daikokuten

Daikokuten

342
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I should have specified using myco in a good soil. All my healthy plants develop myco with no inoculation. I think I posted a pic here of it. That goes for all the micro life. If the conditions are right they appear naturally.

My side by sides were with pre inoculated soil (happy frog, pro mix and potters gold) and ocean forest which just has more organic matter than happy frog but no inoculation.


What medium did you do your side by sides in? Neutral mediums would be different I think. But I have not done full hydro. Only a hybrid soil grow.

Also I meant different rooms and Growers. I am not arguing that you personally would see a difference in an established cut. Especially one you have dialed in.

But it could grow differently in my room with me growing it.

Other than that I agree with what you said.

And I have been growing a perpetual garden with a harvest every week to 10 days for four years now. And I spent about 4 years studying and 2 working with my first caregiver before I started my own garden.

I also have a long history working with big Growers since 1983. But I never grew myself then.
I use just nutrients and just nutrients with silica as my first controls. I have to prove the product is actually something other than whatever salt is making its npk. This would be in peat, coco, and dwc. Now i don't do as much anymore. The last hot product i did a side by side of was terpinator with dynagro grow. I normally run some combination of lights and mediums so i tend to test right away in peat and coco multiple times. Usually i would at least 6 plants per test, with varying dosages if required. This isn't a perfect setup for this but i tend to repeat results that aren't clear cut and trust the results i got/get within reason. I mean you have to worry about product consistency and a million other variables so yeah, I'm sure something could sneak by but the shit that works tends to be noticeable. Hard too is judging final product. I will say Im harsh on products that i think might have worked but can't prove. A lot of people's sworn by products fall under these. But, back to your post a bit, i have to test without inoculated mediums and such because they also lie about the products ingredients or could be. I will say this; If you use silica, kelp, humic, and any sugar from molasses to straight glucose, 80% of these products are only effective by those ingredients, mostly kelp. Everything has kelp. I don't think I'd notice almost any if i just tested them on regular finishers. Anyways, the ingredients list of these is all from the same list nowadays. Amino acids, b1, kelp, humic, fulvic, yucca, microbes, sugars, silica, all b vitamins, fish emulsion, whey powder, yeast extract, any random plant extracts from cranberry to birch trees, different forms of potassium and phosphorous, ascorbic acid, citric acid, chitin or chitinase, enzymes, polysaccarhides, any common or uncommon hormones, any known pgrs like bap6, tria, etc. That's what i came up with quick but big bud, liquid karma, all the gh supplements, all the foxfarm supplements, thrive alive, golden tree, and pretty much every other booster comes from that list. I've tested about 75% of those as best i could get an isolate and have some sitting around still. One day, ill finish but most aren't very exciting regardless of all the hype. I've done terpinator, canna boost, resinator, recharge, liquid karma, almost all the advanced stuff, all the original us canna stuff, all the common gh and botanicare stuff, and of all of those resinator was the only one that really got my attention but not necessarily in a good way, It just sped up flowering on 9 different cuts by at least a week. My 8 week granola cut i cut at 44 but it was done at 40 just didn't feel right. I'm out of bud now so that'll end it, back to reality for a bit.
 
Daikokuten

Daikokuten

342
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Super Soil mix I made. No commercial bagged soil mixes. Tap water. Mykos in soil. Supplemented with NFTG nutes once a week 1/2 strength. Four plants 3gal containers. Currently 4wks and counting. 1000w HPS 5x5 tent. Day75°/Night60°. Rh ranges from 25%-40% depending on current light cycle. Oh, wtf is pH and ppm? Lol. Never pay much attention to that. Well balanced soil should rarely exhibit pH fluctuations and I don't drown the girls in nutes. Less is better and a properly prepared soil mix is key. Soil is forgiving. Nature started doing this millennia ago. Stick to the basics. Soil grown smells and tastes soooo much better too.
With soil you can get away without phing if you're a good gardener. I'm sure any grandma could grow some funk with just her on hand amendments, compost, and some 20-20-20. If you have any interest in trying other methods of growing you should get a ph and ppm pen and start using them, just for the knowledge and experience. They're required for any sort of hydroponic or soilless medium. They're crucial in any true hydro setup. They just tell you the ph of your solution and the conductivity, which when using nonorganic nutrients is a good measure of nutrient concentration. Very accurate with salts, crucial to nutrient availability in hydro and soilless.
 
OldSmokie76

OldSmokie76

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With soil you can get away without phing if you're a good gardener. I'm sure any grandma could grow some funk with just her on hand amendments, compost, and some 20-20-20. If you have any interest in trying other methods of growing you should get a ph and ppm pen and start using them, just for the knowledge and experience. They're required for any sort of hydroponic or soilless medium. They're crucial in any true hydro setup. They just tell you the ph of your solution and the conductivity, which when using nonorganic nutrients is a good measure of nutrient concentration. Very accurate with salts, crucial to nutrient availability in hydro and soilless.
Yeah, I suppose any Grandma out there could grow some funk. I'm well aware of the purpose and need of pH and ppm for more complicated cultivation methods. Not extensively knowledgeable, but I understand it. I was just trying to describe how minimal efforts can produce great results using the ironic comment about ph. I mean, this thread did start out all about simplicity. Lol. Now we're all like, experiments and science and shit. Haha. I'm not knocking anybody's efforts and experience here. IMO, generally speaking, soil would be about the most effortless method to grow anything. Hydro has many variables to attend to and I feel like hydro is just an exotic method. For cost and simplicity, soil medium. And not trying to start a debate, but I don't think I'd ever focus on non organic nutrients. K.I.S.S.
 
Daikokuten

Daikokuten

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Yeah, I suppose any Grandma out there could grow some funk. I'm well aware of the purpose and need of pH and ppm for more complicated cultivation methods. Not extensively knowledgeable, but I understand it. I was just trying to describe how minimal efforts can produce great results using the ironic comment about ph. I mean, this thread did start out all about simplicity. Lol. Now we're all like, experiments and science and shit. Haha. I'm not knocking anybody's efforts and experience here. IMO, generally speaking, soil would be about the most effortless method to grow anything. Hydro has many variables to attend to and I feel like hydro is just an exotic method. For cost and simplicity, soil medium. And not trying to start a debate, but I don't think I'd ever focus on non organic nutrients. K.I.S.S.
I think you feel I'm downplaying you and grandma gardeners when i feel I'm doing the opposite. Different doesn't mean less skilled to me, just different. Also doesn't mean better or worse. Just because i say less yield or whatever doesn't mean I'm calling it worse. Everyone has different wants and needs and anyone producing quality anything is talented to me and i admire any talent. I might be coming off like a hydro snob but that's not my intention.
 
GT21

GT21

I like soup
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Myco isn't a myth. I've done countless side by sides in all different mediums with different myco products and proven myco products have almost doubled the root mass vs without. I have seen this personally and you will too If you test a proven product. I want to ask how long you've been growing because cuts should not differ much from room to room and don't in my years of growing. If cuts are varying significantly, the grower sample is messed up and one or more of the growers are doing something or things drastically wrong. I've grown some of my cuts in different countries in the ground (south Africa, uk, canada,us) and they are always on point for whatever they're in. Never do they look or yield or grow or behave like different plants. I think you way undervalue genetics. You can't grow meh genetics into high end gear. You'll never grow a 17% cut that was properly grown to 26%thc, it doesn't happen. Back to additives quickly, i agree most do nothing and a lot of my side by sides prove that. However, there is a short list of proven additives that have been proven in studies and side by sides. Personally, ill test anything and have never used a new product without side by siding it. That said, almost every product doesn't test with significant differences beyond the fact that most contain kelp and humic lol. It's almost funny how every an product has kelp, humic, amino acids, etc. I've only found 3 of their products that i would say are worthwhile and i think the rest are untested ag products that get an anecdotal myth following like when people thought guano was magic. Anyways, retest myco and bacteria because they work. Og biowar root and nute, great white, mykos and azos, and voodoo juice all tested positively for me.
Mycor is a huge sales gimmick... The more fuckin chloramine in the water... The more it kills mycor... The more you need to add....thank your city water for buying mycor
 
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